Quote :

"Are you saying that anyone who recognizes that Ron Paul: 1. (while having a lot of good ideas) is a little nutty"

I don't get where the "nuttiness" comes in. This is what most Americans say about Ron Paul. That's because they've been conditioned to expect a certain appearance, speaking style, and constant stream of bullshit from those running for office. For a guy like Ron Paul to just make these statements that call the past century of U.S. policy into question is pretty radical, but it's not nutty - it's just not what you're used to hearing.

It's what the U.S. needs to hear, though. Yeah, you'd rather vote for another asshole with a thousand dollar haircut that talks a mean game but doesn't actually do anything. You and a lot of other people don't want to hear the truth, because the truth fucking sucks. The U.S. government is broke. The U.S. government is a violent, tyrannical group of people. They throw innocent people in jail, they destroy societies, they steal your money, and then they convince you and countless others that it's all for their own good.

6/19/2012 12:27:30 AM

This just in: I've been a registered libertarian for 6 years.

6/19/2012 9:57:19 AM

What's hilarious is how most Ron Paul supporters would have their fat asses strapped to the hood of a marauder's big rig as it terrorizes the Road Warrior hellscape should they get the fantasy version of clan-based society that they thought sounded cool when some guy explained it on some forum after reading their first book of anarchist theory.

libertarians are one thing, but it seems like the hardcore ron paul people always end up descending into anarcho-capitalist theroy, because it's fantastic and exciting, like discovering the Silmarillion.

[Edited on June 19, 2012 at 11:21 AM. Reason : x]

6/19/2012 11:19:23 AM

Still trolling after all these years. Is your life so shallow that you get your jollies attempting to rile up libertarians on a college message board? You don't bother to learn anything about the people you attack, but that's on purpose. It's easier for you to fashion a caricature and beat up on that. It doesn't require thought. It's effortless.

If libertarians and anarcho-capitalists are fat, lazy neckbeards wearing cargo shorts, sandals with socks, and Pink Floyd t-shirts that haven't been washed in a year, then you can afford to be intellectually lazy. If the people representing these ideas are maladjusted, forever alone man-children, the ideas themselves don't even need to be refuted. Clearly, the ideas are just an extension of a naive and overly-idealistic mindset and can be dismissed on those grounds alone.

What if reality paints a different picture? What if some (or even many) of these anarcho-capitalists are well dressed and in shape? What if they're well read and educated? What if they are socially adroit, fully capable of navigating hierarchy and building relationships founded on integrity? Well, then you have to engage in a very different and challenging discussion.

6/19/2012 12:21:39 PM

Now you're just throwing out crazy hypotheticals.

6/19/2012 12:35:18 PM

i do it because someone always feels the need to respond defensively about how anarchism is TOTALLY LEGIT AND WELL THOUGHT OUT AND WITH HISTORICAL MERIT.

do you ever wonder if you're wasting your time?

and there are book smart people that think 9/11 was an inside job. don't give yourself too much credit.

I'm ready to hear about the historical success of your movement.

reality says you have nothing to go off of except some abstract theories that never worked.

and stop conflating libertarianism with anarchism. one has a legit argument about the role of government, the other is as idealistic of its portrayal of humans as Marxism is of class theory and humans.

and ron paul needs some better supporters than jesse ventura and genie sex pizza boy.

[Edited on June 19, 2012 at 1:49 PM. Reason : zap]

6/19/2012 1:38:35 PM

If HOOPS MALONE's knowledge of Ron Paul was measured in rainfall, the scale would read "severe drought".

6/19/2012 4:21:24 PM

Bulldog

6/20/2012 1:38:50 AM

Quote :

"like discovering the Silmarillion"

whoa, cool

6/20/2012 7:59:02 AM

Quote :

"and stop conflating libertarianism with anarchism. one has a legit argument about the role of government, the other is as idealistic of its portrayal of humans as Marxism is of class theory and humans."

It's more idealistic. Marxists at least advocate that some degree of group self-reflection is necessary to correct for the shortcomings of individual human nature. Anarcho-Capitalists believe that humans are perfectly rational and fine-tuned to operate in a limitless, unrestricted free market with no interactions between each other aside from buying or not buying something, and this system will work until the end of time in all circumstances and scenarios because A=A.

6/20/2012 12:25:00 PM

Double take

6/20/2012 1:15:32 PM

Quote :

"do you ever wonder if you're wasting your time?"

I'm not wasting my time. I'm not politically active. I have better things to do that true to nudge the political process in one direction or another. Political approaches to moral problems within society are temporary solutions at best.

I'd like to have a civil discussion. One where we may disagree, and we agree that the other is allowed to disagree. Guess what, though? That discussion can't happen. We might disagree, and then you say that I deserve to be put in jail or murdered for disagreeing. Oh, I'm allowed to disagree, but I'm not actually allowed to act on it? Great, that's meaningless.

I could argue that the free market is better or more efficient or whatever, and I have, but it's ultimately pointless and it won't change your mind. What really matters is morality. The initiation of force is wrong. It doesn't matter whether you initiate it or a government agent initiates it. If we can't agree on that, there isn't much else to say.

[Edited on June 20, 2012 at 2:05 PM. Reason : ]

6/20/2012 2:02:31 PM

I've noticed that most libertarians I meet; work out consistently, generally have great health, and are rather productive members of society.

Definitely anecdotal, but it keeps popping up.

Any guesses why?

[Edited on June 20, 2012 at 2:14 PM. Reason : ;]

6/20/2012 2:14:30 PM

that's not been my anecdotal experience at all. the ones i've met are overweight.

6/20/2012 2:21:55 PM

The few I've met have relied on tax money to get where they are and are oblivious to it.

And other than FICA and State taxes, they generally don't make enough to actually pay income tax in the first place, yet bitch about their tax money being wasted.

[Edited on June 20, 2012 at 2:44 PM. Reason : ]

6/20/2012 2:44:03 PM

Quote :

"And other than FICA and State taxes, they generally don't make enough to actually pay income tax in the first place, yet bitch about their tax money being wasted."

People don't pay sales tax, property tax, phone line taxes, gas tax, utility taxes?

6/21/2012 12:30:50 PM

None of that is federal tax, you fucking dunce.

Oh, excuse me, phone line excise tax - I'm sorry that < $3 of your cash is feeding welfare queens

[Edited on June 21, 2012 at 1:46 PM. Reason : ]

6/21/2012 1:45:02 PM

Since when did we limit the scope of taxes to federal taxes only? I don't appreciate being called a dunce by someone who changes the rules to suit himself.

6/21/2012 1:50:13 PM

No one's changing the rules - you're ignoring them.

You can't give states more power, which you've said on several occasions that you're cool with, without funding them.

[Edited on June 21, 2012 at 1:52 PM. Reason : ]

6/21/2012 1:52:02 PM

what in the living fuck are you talking about??

6/21/2012 1:53:55 PM

God damn, you're even more fucking stupid than I thought.

6/21/2012 1:54:25 PM

You really should put the crackpipe down. Your incoherent thought process has me worried about you.

6/21/2012 1:56:01 PM

First this was said

Quote :

"And other than FICA and State taxes,"

then genius said

Quote :

"People don't pay sales tax, property tax, phone line taxes, gas tax, utility taxes?"

correct me if i'm wrong, but aren't the majority of those state taxes?

6/21/2012 1:57:58 PM

It's no surprise to me that the king of incoherent horseshit has trouble understanding a basic point.

Of course, GxB has never made a legitimate argument and is completely incapable of rational thought, so I should have expected it.

[Edited on June 21, 2012 at 2:00 PM. Reason : ]

6/21/2012 1:59:27 PM

Quote :

"yet bitch about their tax money being wasted"

You left out the only part of the whole post that I was specifically addressing.

6/21/2012 1:59:42 PM

You weren't specifically addressing that

and even if you were, it's irrelevant.

6/21/2012 2:01:21 PM

Riddle me this:
If the federal government isn't taking tax money from the citizens,
yet the government keeps spending taxpayer money,
then where is the federal government getting its money?

6/21/2012 2:04:39 PM

Riddle me this: Stay on topic you moron.

Nothing in the inane and overly self confident drivel you have spewed thus far is relevant to comment you bitched about in the first place.

6/21/2012 2:07:46 PM

You haven't even established a topic yet you want me to stay on topic?
I established the topic, but you insisted on changing it.

You're so butthurt, its comical.

6/21/2012 2:15:41 PM

you apparently don't realize it genius, but you're pretty comical yourself

6/21/2012 2:17:28 PM

And you're pretty predicable with the sides you choose in any argument that has my name in it. The surprise factor that you're not on my side is null and moot.

6/21/2012 2:19:01 PM

Me: These certain people I know don't even pay income(FEDERAL) taxes yet bitch about the fed wasting all their tax money
You: ZOMG, PEOPLE DON'T PAY SALES TAX?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!
Me: I said federal, you fucking idiot
You: (Who the hell knows what you said after that - Can we get a translator?)

[Edited on June 21, 2012 at 2:20 PM. Reason : ]

6/21/2012 2:19:15 PM

Who's money is the Federal government spending?

6/21/2012 2:21:27 PM

At any fucking point did I say that NO ONE pays federal taxes?

How dense are you, dude?

The statement was, in essence, it's ironic for someone that DOESN'T pay income taxes to bitch about THEIR money being wasted

[Edited on June 21, 2012 at 2:23 PM. Reason : ]

6/21/2012 2:22:57 PM

Who's money is the Federal government spending?

6/21/2012 2:23:33 PM

At any fucking point did I say that NO ONE pays federal taxes?

How dense are you, dude?

The statement was, in essence, it's ironic for someone that DOESN'T pay income taxes to bitch about THEIR money being wasted

6/21/2012 2:24:14 PM

Who's money is the Federal government spending?

6/21/2012 2:25:37 PM

At any fucking point did I say that NO ONE pays federal taxes?

How dense are you, dude?

The statement was, in essence, it's ironic for someone that DOESN'T pay income taxes to bitch about THEIR money being wasted

6/21/2012 2:25:48 PM

I rest my case.

6/21/2012 2:27:40 PM

lol, you have yet to make one.

Shouldn't you be busy getting reamed by vendors and selling shit pizza?

6/21/2012 2:28:45 PM

Has anyone on this board ever agreed with Genie Sex Boy? Has he seriously deluded himself into believing he's right in the face of all that opposition on everything he posts?

6/21/2012 2:51:42 PM

I don't believe I'm right.

I know I'm right.

6/21/2012 2:54:50 PM

further proof that you're totally delusional

6/21/2012 2:56:36 PM

Quote :

"The statement was, in essence, it's ironic for someone that DOESN'T pay income taxes to bitch about THEIR money being wasted "

If it's actually a situation where someone is bitching about their tax money (collected in the form of federal income tax) being wasted, yet they don't pay taxes, yes, that's stupid.

If the libertarians you've happened to meet have all been low wage earners, that probably says more about the kind of people you hang out than libertarians as a whole. You're going to be hard pressed to find an entrepreneur or business owner that doesn't have a libertarian streak.

There are people that see opportunities and try to capitalize on them. They take risks and make society great. There are other people that feel entitled and expect everything to fall into their lap. They do enough to get by and whine about how "capitalism" requires you to work hard, then they'll bitch about privilege and bootstraps while having been born into the richest 1% in the world and having squandered their potential.

Be a value creator, not a value taker. If you're whining about how society sucks yet you're not doing anything to improve yourself as an individual, then you're not in a position to complain. You're not entitled to shit. Not an education, not food, not water, not anything except your own body and what you create. The universe doesn't owe you anything. Society doesn't owe you anything.

6/21/2012 3:00:26 PM

^ Now THAT is a legitimate post. While I don't agree with your philosophy, at least you make a respectable point.

Will you tutor GxB?

[Edited on June 21, 2012 at 3:11 PM. Reason : ]

6/21/2012 3:10:34 PM

Quote :

"If you're whining about how society sucks yet you're not doing anything to improve yourself as an individual, then you're not in a position to complain. You're not entitled to shit. Not an education, not food, not water, not anything except your own body and what you create. The universe doesn't owe you anything. Society doesn't owe you anything."

who are you talking to? anybody specifically on this board?

6/21/2012 3:12:02 PM

I don't think he's directing it at anyone in particular

6/21/2012 3:13:08 PM

jaZon, stop whiteknighting him all because you hate me and I was right.

6/21/2012 3:18:02 PM

It's not even white knighting. And you couldn't have been right about anything because you have yet to even make a fucking point.

6/21/2012 3:20:48 PM

Quote :

"You're going to be hard pressed to find an entrepreneur or business owner that doesn't have a libertarian streak. "

and? The same can be said of Neo-confederates or Neo-nazis.

Quote :

"Society doesn't owe you anything"

What about life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness?

6/21/2012 3:21:46 PM