http://knol.google.com/k/why-are-europeans-white-e1#





I thought this was interesting. I thought I had an idea of why skin colors vary by geographic location, but this article explains it in much greater detail.

12/24/2009 2:10:01 PM

Racist

12/24/2009 2:14:27 PM

that’s a pretty interesting article.

12/24/2009 2:30:01 PM

lattitude isn't the sole determining factor in this. Theres also, climate, continenetal drift and migration, ya know?

Go to nw europe and see how many days of sun they get then take the short trip across the med sea and see how many days of sunshine they get. Even if the radiation is similar it doesn't contribute to pigmentation if its blocked out by clouds half the year.

12/24/2009 2:40:38 PM

Did you actually read the article? It's a lot more than latitude. It's also elevation, diet, exposure to sunlight, proximity to warm currents.

12/24/2009 2:46:43 PM

.... who exactly are you rolling your eyes at? It's not like d357r0y3r just pulled out a map and started filling in skin colors by latitude

12/24/2009 2:47:00 PM

i hadn't read the article but it had already explained the stuff I said.

The reason I didn't read the article is because the thread was mistitlted as a question.

should have been

"WHY EUROPEANS ARE WHITE"

instead of

"WHY ARE EUROPEANS WHITE?"

12/24/2009 2:49:33 PM

those little dark pockets in britain are pretty interesting, england/wales was originally colonized by iberian celts I believe and looks like somehow those regions have kept themselves isolated genetically

that explains why catherine zeta jones looks like she's from spain

12/24/2009 3:29:45 PM

She's English?!?!?!

12/24/2009 4:11:44 PM

Haven't read but I have always assumed it was due to the lower amount of sunlight and vitamin absorption, and darker skin was for protection against more direct sun rays. Also things like genetic isolation, migration and such played in too.

12/24/2009 4:37:58 PM

So we can also conclude that these factors also make people smarter.

12/24/2009 5:22:54 PM

Quote :

"So we can also conclude that these factors also make people smarter. "

I think it is possible that the environmental factors of northern europe could have favored males via mate selection that can utilize their intelligence in order to survive the harsh winters and limited resources. Whereas factors in sub-saharan African could favor faster or taller males. Would anyone argue that native africans do NOT tend to sprint faster and jump higher than native people from europe ON AVERAGE.

12/24/2009 6:44:59 PM

Quote :

"She's English?!?!?! "

well welsh and I think her family has a deep history in the area so she's not a recent immigrant or anything

12/24/2009 6:49:00 PM

Quote :

" Would anyone argue that native africans do NOT tend to sprint faster and jump higher than native people from europe ON AVERAGE. "

Considering no survey has ever been done, and I know some really slow africans, i don’t see how you have reached your conclusions except by interpreting a few anecdotes as fact.

12/24/2009 8:28:48 PM

Have you watched Olympic sprinting or the NBA lately? It's not exactly scientific, but it sure seems like when men are at peak physical condition, black dudes have a big edge in terms of power over say, whites and asians.

[Edited on December 24, 2009 at 8:50 PM. Reason : ]

12/24/2009 8:48:54 PM

I don't think you need to be very scientific when 10% of the general population is black and 80% of the NBA population is black. I'm not sayin...I'm just sayin.

12/24/2009 9:40:51 PM

raicist!

12/24/2009 9:51:07 PM

Africans? No they probably aren't all that much more athletic than Europeans. Now, black descendants of slaves in America? Definitely. That's what 20 generations of selective breeding for strength and athleticism will do.

12/24/2009 10:14:09 PM

Quote :

"I don't think you need to be very scientific when 10% of the general population is black and 80% of the NBA population is black. I'm not sayin...I'm just sayin."

Yeah, but this has only been the case since the civil rights era, before then they were all white.

And 100% of hockey players i've seen are white, the majority of soccer players i've seen have been some kind of hispanic.

In the absence of any other information, the correlation seems more like it's an American cultural thing more than anything else.

12/24/2009 11:57:10 PM

There's also the argument that african americans went through a fairly warped period of natural selection (for lack of a better term). During the slave trade, ~5% died in African ports, 10%+ died from hardship during the boat ride over, and a debated number more died as a direct result of labor as slaves. In addition, there was the forced mating of slaves by owners, though I have no idea how prevalent that was. The entire process favored physically tough people.

12/25/2009 12:11:37 AM

nm

[Edited on December 25, 2009 at 12:26 AM. Reason : read]

12/25/2009 12:25:23 AM

Quote :

"There's also the argument that african americans went through a fairly warped period of natural selection (for lack of a better term). During the slave trade, ~5% died in African ports, 10%+ died from hardship during the boat ride over, and a debated number more died as a direct result of labor as slaves. In addition, there was the forced mating of slaves by owners, though I have no idea how prevalent that was. The entire process favored physically tough people."

Then it also favored intellectually stupid people as well right? You needed your slaves stupid so they wouldn't plot against you and organize large scale revolts....

Almost everything you listed wouldn't lead to stronger people, but rather a people more resistant to disease, which African Americans are anything but. Nor did most work on a plantation require a lot of raw physical strength. Mexicans are our new slaves in all but name right? They do a lot of the same physical work on large farms that slaves did (probably more efficiently too) and they are anything but large and powerful.

Why is the NBA loaded with Blacks? Probably because its by far the easiest major sport to play as an urban youth. No fields or expensive equipment required.

12/25/2009 2:31:59 AM

Quote :

"Mexicans are our new slaves in all but name right? They do a lot of the same physical work on large farms that slaves did (probably more efficiently too) and they are anything but large and powerful."

I lol'd. I think I'm racist.

Quote :

"Why is the NBA loaded with Blacks? Probably because its by far the easiest major sport to play as an urban youth. No fields or expensive equipment required."

Yeah.

12/25/2009 12:06:29 PM

Quote :

"Why is the NBA loaded with Blacks? Probably because its by far the easiest major sport to play as an urban youth. No fields or expensive equipment required."

Maybe you should pay more fucking attention during the Olympics. The racing events and jumping events even looking at the world records are definitly unproportionally favor the African countries or those that have people of african descent participating. The winner of the NY marathon for the last couple years has been some dude from Kenya or something. Yeah you have Welker for the Pats but it is hard to deny that the best RBs, WRs, and corners are the african american players that are the fastest and most agile in the football field. This is not a case of Football being the "easiest" sport to play for urban youth. Even for traditionally white sports like tennis and golf; you have break out african performers that have in recent year dominated. Venus and Serena in tennis and Tiger (though 1/2 black) in golf.

Quote :

", the majority of soccer players i've seen have been some kind of hispanic"

You do not watch enough soccer do you?

[Edited on December 25, 2009 at 3:37 PM. Reason : l]

12/25/2009 3:35:58 PM

someone post the sicilians scene from true romance...

12/25/2009 3:54:24 PM

unreal that people don't understand the fact that mental state is not passed on to the next generation. wow.

Quote :

"Then it also favored intellectually stupid people as well right? You needed your slaves stupid so they wouldn't plot against you and organize large scale revolts...."

First of all if the slaves couldn't read but that doesn't mean they were intellectually stupid, and even if they were, knowledge or any other mental characteristics are not passed from generation to generation. Pigment is.

Quote :

"Almost everything you listed wouldn't lead to stronger people, but rather a people more resistant to disease"

You coudln't be more wrong. All of that weeds out physically inferior genes "survival of the fittest". However, an acute breeding population with things approaching inbreeding create a group of people that are most vulnerable to disease.

In general, the less genes two parents have in common, the more resistant to disease the child will be.

Quote :

"Mexicans are our new slaves in all but name right? They do a lot of the same physical work on large farms that slaves did (probably more efficiently too) and they are anything but large and powerful.""

Really? mexicans pick cotton from sunup to sundown?

Quote :

"I think it is possible that the environmental factors of northern europe could have favored males via mate selection that can utilize their intelligence in order to survive the harsh winters and limited resources"

somebody needs to take a biology course


[Edited on December 25, 2009 at 9:57 PM. Reason : slaves were smart enough to trick masters and escape CONSTANTLY]

12/25/2009 9:53:13 PM

Dude, northern Europeans are huge. Watch world's strongest man sometime.

12/25/2009 10:06:38 PM

Quote :

"Really? mexicans pick cotton from sunup to sundown?"

yes, yes they do.

12/25/2009 11:06:21 PM

^^^ please take off your liberal blinders.

Quote :

"First of all if the slaves couldn't read but that doesn't mean they were intellectually stupid, and even if they were, knowledge or any other mental characteristics are not passed from generation to generation. Pigment is. "

I was drawing a hypothesis on a potential statistical mean and variation difference between two ethnicities. Not drawing sweeping generalizations that apply to every individual. I guess it would be racist to draw attention to the fact that asian people are lactose intolerant. Also, racist to point out that native americans tend to be stronger than your average american since they are the descendants of peoples who had to fight off disease and europeans for the last 500 years. A German Shepard and a poodle of are the same species! One of these though I know I would pick to be my K9 if I were a cop.......

An individual at my company is african american, an ivy league grad, and one of the directors of the company. My post is no way shape or form that one race is better than another. Theoretically though I do not see why it is unreasonable, taboo, or racist to hypothesize that each demographic population has certain strengths and weaknesses that enabled them to excel in each's characteristic environment.

Do some research on peoples from certain polynesian islands. While it is not impossible that someone from there could be a NBA star, these people over millenia become a people of "shorter" due to factors relating to living on an island with minimal food.

[Edited on December 25, 2009 at 11:14 PM. Reason : j]

[Edited on December 25, 2009 at 11:15 PM. Reason : h]

12/25/2009 11:09:57 PM

^^^^ you should have learned that 'survival of the fittest" is not synonymous with natural selection in a basic biology course.

12/25/2009 11:54:57 PM

All of the things you just said in this post are fine and they are all PHYSICAL CHARACTERISTICS. In your other post you not only mentioned the possibility but suggested the likelihood that mental state is passed down to offspring which is complete nonsense.

12/25/2009 11:55:53 PM

Quote :

"All of the things you just said in this post are fine and they are all PHYSICAL CHARACTERISTICS. In your other post you not only mentioned the possibility but suggested the likelihood that mental state is passed down to offspring which is complete nonsense."

Intelligence is a "PHYSICAL CHARACTERISTIC." Both genes and environment play a role no doubt, much like strength or endurance.

12/26/2009 3:50:50 AM

This thread when to shit quickly.


I, however, did enjoy the original article and the article linked in the comments about how it was atmospheric patterns and not the gulf stream which are likely the cause of Europe's mild climate.


thanks d357r0y3r

12/26/2009 8:16:42 AM

^don't confuse temperature with solar radiation. the gulf stream increases the temperature but brings mositure which leads to an decrease in solar radiation (clouds and rain) which gives a net effect of lighter skin.

Warmer temperatures at the same latitude would not, alone, change skin color.

^^
you are in dire need of some education

[Edited on December 26, 2009 at 6:51 PM. Reason : ignorant people on this board]

12/26/2009 6:50:06 PM

Quote :

"Intelligence is a "PHYSICAL CHARACTERISTIC." Both genes and environment play a role no doubt, much like strength or endurance. "

lol... wut?

12/26/2009 7:07:13 PM

It's hilarious that white people who argue that white people are smarter are the perfect counterexamples

HUR you're a motherfucking idiot

[Edited on December 26, 2009 at 8:06 PM. Reason : .]

12/26/2009 8:06:18 PM

John Deere is our new slave in all but name right?

12/26/2009 9:36:42 PM

Quote :

"don't confuse temperature with solar radiation. the gulf stream increases the temperature but brings mositure which leads to an decrease in solar radiation (clouds and rain) which gives a net effect of lighter skin. "

I do not see how this is relevant to the post your are responding too.

Quote :

"It's hilarious that white people who argue that white people are smarter are the perfect counterexamples HUR you're a motherfucking idiot "

Omg someone said something that could be considered controversial by drawing a theoretical hypothesis that peoples from different regions of the world may as a whole have different strengths and weaknesses. I hope some asian dude sues the next movie that stereotypes them as having a small penis. No one is saying that white people are smarter. Purely statistically asians in the US are the smartest. This though has to do with socioeconomic and parenting differences. On the grand scheme of thing though there still may be some genetic delta, no matter how small, when comparing demographics. Last time I checked all the women siring Wilt Chamberlins countless illegitmate children did not choose to mate with him for his outstanding academics. Like it or not even if some of his mistresses are hispanic, asian, or white; Wilt is passing superior athletic genes not natural intelligence.

On that note though I think the natural delta is small enough, barring the fact that my children will likely not be NFL athletes, most of everything else is environmental. Any intelligent difference between demographics is nearly or can nearly be masked by social-environmental factors such as parenting, peers, society, and education.

mambagrl is either a troll or really should not be teaching.




[Edited on December 26, 2009 at 10:00 PM. Reason : l]

12/26/2009 9:49:45 PM

Quote :

"All of the things you just said in this post are fine and they are all PHYSICAL CHARACTERISTICS. In your other post you not only mentioned the possibility but suggested the likelihood that mental state is passed down to offspring which is complete nonsense."

huh? there is certainly a genetic aspect to intelligence (referring to IQ), I don't think many people would deny that, on the other hand nutrition and development play a role in having the brain fully mature which is why it's hard to trust iq averages for third world countries

the best data people can actually study are the ones observed within the same country like the US and some of the differences do appear to be valid

12/26/2009 10:15:42 PM

ZOMG jprince11 is racist!!!!!!!!

12/26/2009 10:28:17 PM

Quote :

"someone post the sicilians scene from true romance..."

12/26/2009 11:14:46 PM

Quote :

"you are in dire need of some education"

Right... please explain how intelligence isn't a physical characteristic. Is the brain not physical, and is it not what determines intelligence? Unless you are implying the brain doesn't determine intelligence, or that the brain isn't a phenotypic expression of certain genes.

The point is, if you argue that Blacks are superior physically by pointing to professional sports, then you can argue Whites/Asians are superior intellectually by pointing to elite academics.

12/27/2009 10:16:04 AM

meh, nature vs nurture, blah blah blah

12/27/2009 10:29:51 AM

i gots a big brain

thats gotta means imza smart

12/27/2009 11:28:30 AM

for those of you saying that certain social groups do not breed for higher intelligence:

http://www.jweekly.com/article/full/26214/ashkenazi-genetics-link-high-iq-and-disease/

[note: there are better articles out there about this specific trait, but this is the first one i found]

12/27/2009 12:59:58 PM

Quote :

"The point is, if you argue that Blacks are superior physically by pointing to professional sports, then you can argue Whites/Asians are superior intellectually by pointing to elite academics. "

To claim otherwise is asserting that [insert race here] thinks they are a superior breed over european americans. RACIST!

[Edited on December 27, 2009 at 1:02 PM. Reason : l]

[Edited on December 27, 2009 at 1:03 PM. Reason : l]

12/27/2009 1:00:03 PM

If I work out everday and get very strong, those genes are passed on to my children but if I learn how to speak 7 languages, the only way they can be passed down to my children is if they grow up around me speaking them but they will still have to learn them again and have no advantage from my intelligence.

Even if my children are separated from me they will still have inherited strength and athletic ability.

Quote :

"The point is, if you argue that Blacks are superior physically by pointing to professional sports, then you can argue Whites/Asians are superior intellectually by pointing to elite academics."

Academics are not a measure of intelligence. They are a social measure of education parenting and environment.

Blacks aren't naturally more athletic than whites, it just happen that whites killed off all of the weak slaves and had the strong ones do work for them for hundreds of years while whites sat around.

12/27/2009 10:31:12 PM

Quote :

"If I work out everday and get very strong, those genes are passed on to my children"

okay i know you're a troll, but: no, they're not.

12/27/2009 10:45:34 PM

Quote :

"If I work out everday and get very strong, those genes are passed on to my children"

AHAHAHAHAHAHA
Back in 7th grade biology, practically the very first thing taught in the chapters on genetics and evolution was that your statement is completely incorrect.

Also, I love the way you're unable to separate crystallized knowledge from intellectual ability. It's funny.

12/27/2009 11:16:35 PM

I'm afraid if I post in this thread, my IQ will drop and I'll pass it on to my children.

12/27/2009 11:38:33 PM