Quote :

"I lived in Cameron Court for 2 years and never had any problems."

I live in the same area, and I've not had any "problems", but there are homeless people around. I've never had anyone beg for money or approach me. That isn't to say that no begging/harassing goes on around there, but it probably depends on who you are. Maybe big dudes with sour looks on their face are less likely to be harassed than girls.

[Edited on April 10, 2013 at 8:15 PM. Reason : ]

4/10/2013 8:11:46 PM

I also live on Hargett St. behind trophy. The "homeless" problem stems from the Wake County support center located by the railroad tracks at the end of Hargett. I would bet most of the reports/problems stem from day time activities. I have never had a huge problem with anyone, its usually just annoyance, noise, and begging. They tend to get in fights with each other, and one time a crazy homeless gentleman got hold of a trumpet and walked up and down our street blasting a tune for about an hour @ 6:00am.

If you spend time at trophy after dark, I doubt there is any problem. I also agree with the others, they do not seem to drift up to Cameron Court, and most often stay on the other side of Morgan.

4/11/2013 7:30:46 AM

Quote :

"just driving down Morgan I see homeless people."

Maybe I'm not paying close attention, but in the 10-15 years that I've been driving down Morgan Street I've never seen a homeless person.


On an unrelated note, Cowfish opens on April 15th

[Edited on April 11, 2013 at 8:52 AM. Reason : k]

4/11/2013 8:45:18 AM

Awesome news!!

New 11-story office building to go up in downtown Raleigh

http://www.bizjournals.com/triangle/news/2013/04/10/new-office-building-to-go-up-in.html

Although: some will be disappointed that the original plan for 15/21 story buildings is being scrapped.

I assume this will cover 1/2 the parcel and they will have 1/2 left to develop in the future.

[Edited on April 11, 2013 at 9:16 AM. Reason : .]

4/11/2013 9:14:46 AM

any new building is better than what's been there for the past few years, i too with we had 21 story building though

how many stories are the other buildings downtown?

4/11/2013 9:25:21 AM

I want some 100-story buildings, get this place looking like a real city

4/11/2013 9:30:11 AM

How does a 100 story building enrich your experience in the city unless you personally are living or working in that building?

Not real cities:







Huge skyscrapers are just vertical sprawl. I'd rather have a bunch of new 5 or 6-story buildings that add street-level retail, fill in gaps in development and get more eyes on the street than one 50 story building.

[Edited on April 11, 2013 at 10:04 AM. Reason : .]

4/11/2013 10:02:38 AM

all 3 of those are really poor goals for our urban center

and also i think he was being sarcastic.


List of tallest buildings in Raleigh:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_tallest_buildings_in_Raleigh,_North_Carolina

[Edited on April 11, 2013 at 10:05 AM. Reason : .]

4/11/2013 10:05:17 AM

Quote :

"any new building is better than what's been there for the past few years, i too with we had 21 story building though how many stories are the other buildings downtown?"

I agree, its much better than the hole in the ground (cemented over parking deck) that currently exists.

I think the main argument is that 11 stories won't add to the skyline at all. Raleigh has a huge Napoleon complex when it comes to skyline size/girth, so I think people get instantly frustrated when things come out smaller than planned. Also, there are no other parcels on Fayetteville St. that could be developed into a tower w/o knocking over an existing building, so people see this as extremely important square footage for our city's future.

4/11/2013 10:08:34 AM

^^Maybe, but there is a weird fascination with skyscrapers that I see on all of the Raleigh-related discussion forums and I don't really get it. Everyone gets furious when a 20 story project ends up becoming a 10 story one but no one can ever explain to me why other than that it won't look as impressive when they are driving in on South Saunders or McDowell.

^Same thing. People care more about the postcard image of downtown than the actual street level experience.

Not that I'm against skyscrapers, but I don't think they add much more value than a mid-rise and in my experience the best parts of pretty much every city in the world that I have ever visited are the mid-rise neighborhoods.

[Edited on April 11, 2013 at 10:14 AM. Reason : Respectable skyline]

4/11/2013 10:09:57 AM

Quote :

"How does a 100 story building enrich your experience in the city unless you personally are living or working in that building? Not real cities:"

You picked 3 horrible examples.

A few more tall buildings for Raleigh would be nice I think, with around one that is 60-70 stories as a centerpiece. It would make the skyline much more respectable. Remember of course, that all that added retail/residential/commercial space would wreck havoc on the traffic/parking situation downtown.

4/11/2013 10:11:27 AM

I don't agree with Richard Florida on a lot of things, but this is an article I've always liked: http://www.theatlanticcities.com/neighborhoods/2012/05/limits-density/2005/. There are plenty of counter-arguments to it, but I generally agree with most of his points. I don't really want to limit height, though, just to get people to recognize that it isn't everything.

Skylines are something nice to look at from the suburbs. How many times do you actually notice the Manhattan skyline while you are standing in midtown? Once you are actually inside the city, which is what I care about more, the skyline becomes irrelevant and what matters more is street-level activity, continuous building frontages and a vibrant pedestrian environment. That isn't to say that skyscrapers can't help in that area, but they don't do it any better than mid-rise and often do it worse.

Downtown Raleigh is much more vibrant and interesting than many cities that have far grander skylines, which is not to say that the lack of a tall skyline is the cause of the success, but that the skyline is irrelevant to how dense and vibrant a downtown can be.

4/11/2013 10:34:57 AM

I have to agree there. Not saying that I don't enjoy skylines or that it has to be one or the other, but the skyline has a much smaller impact on enjoying a city than the street-level development.

Greenville, SC has a terrible, non-existent skyline but it's downtown beats the pants off of a lot of cities with much better skylines.

Big buildings are cool too, and when you can develop the ground-floor with restaurants, retail, etc. and fill the upper floors with business tenants it can be great, but taller buildings aren't necessarily any better for the downtown development unless there is a fear you are running out of supply for urban office space with a perceived incoming big increase in demand or something.

[Edited on April 11, 2013 at 10:58 AM. Reason : ]

4/11/2013 10:42:15 AM

I think it would be more effective to add 20 5 story buildings to the downtown area than 1 100 story building, but that 100 floor building would be awefully badass.

4/11/2013 10:47:28 AM

Wow sorry just joking, I didn't mean to derail the whole conversation.

I would like some more skyscrapers to improve the skyline, but real talk more than anything I would just like to see more desirable downtown retail and a few more good restaurants (I know people go to Raleigh Times/Ashley Christensen's places but I never hear people clamoring about Bolt/Sono/anything on Fayetteville these days). Move out the Taz's and put in some more unique boutique stores like that Deco place that opened up. The Raleigh Museum is surprisingly nice inside too; things like that and the CAM have gotten me downtown more than I ever went at State too.

I would also like to see some of the government buildings get redone and moved to the upper floors of buildings with mixed-use retail/dining, if only to have a few more places to get lunch if you work on Jones St. and are in a hurry.

But yeah what goes in the buildings is more important than the size of the buildings.

4/11/2013 10:59:21 AM

I don't think you derailed it, you enriched it. It started a good conversation, plus I just needed an excuse to get on my soap box.

The government buildings are definitely an issue, and unfortunately from what I can tell state government has little interest in being a real part of the downtown Raleigh community (especially these days). It sounds as though it's like pulling teeth trying to work with state gov on anything that has to do with improving their property to enrich downtown.

BTW I think places like Taz's play an important role for downtown residents, especially without a grocery store within walking distance. Little convenience stores like that can kind of act as a band-aid for certain items that are needed in between trips to the grocery store. I know when I lived in Cameron Court I used the one across the street a lot, and there is one near where I live here in New Jersey that I use frequently as well (though not as necessary anymore now that there is an epic new downtown grocery store here; it's amazing).

On a different note, take this survey the city just posted: https://qtrial.qualtrics.com/SE/?SID=SV_1CjoawfRGvvPCFn

Quote :

"If you had $100 to spend on transportation improvements, how would you spend it? You can spend it on one thing or spread it around. Be sure your total equals $100."

My responses:

0 Widening existing streets
0 Constructing new streets or extending existing streets
5 Repaving streets
0 Installing new or upgrading existing traffic signals
20 Adding new bus routes and circulators or increasing frequency on existing bus routes
10 Upgrading or installing new transit amenities
20 Constructing fixed-route transit systems (light rail, commuter rail, bus rapid transit, streetcars)
10 Improving intersection safety
10 Constructing new sidewalks
15 Installing new bicycle facilities
10 Constructing streetscape projects
0 Other


[Edited on April 11, 2013 at 11:20 AM. Reason : .]

4/11/2013 11:11:39 AM

I came to post the same thing about Taz's, urban living requires nearby shops like them.

4/11/2013 11:19:47 AM

...

[Edited on April 11, 2013 at 11:29 AM. Reason : ]

4/11/2013 11:22:25 AM

Quote :

"I don't agree with Richard Florida on a lot of things, but this is an article I've always liked: http://www.theatlanticcities.com/neighborhoods/2012/05/limits-density/2005/. There are plenty of counter-arguments to it, but I generally agree with most of his points. I don't really want to limit height, though, just to get people to recognize that it isn't everything. Skylines are something nice to look at from the suburbs. How many times do you actually notice the Manhattan skyline while you are standing in midtown? Once you are actually inside the city, which is what I care about more, the skyline becomes irrelevant and what matters more is street-level activity, continuous building frontages and a vibrant pedestrian environment. That isn't to say that skyscrapers can't help in that area, but they don't do it any better than mid-rise and often do it worse. Downtown Raleigh is much more vibrant and interesting than many cities that have far grander skylines, which is not to say that the lack of a tall skyline is the cause of the success, but that the skyline is irrelevant to how dense and vibrant a downtown can be."

I agree with most of this. However, when I lived in NY and was walking around Manhattan I would look up at the tall buildings all the time. I guess it's architectural admiration but I definitely loved looking at them all the time. And I doubt I'm alone.

[Edited on April 11, 2013 at 12:18 PM. Reason : nice link]

4/11/2013 12:14:43 PM

Hey I like love architectural side and I really do like big, architectural buildings (I love Chicago for this reason). For me, it's a matter of reality and impact on the downtown area though. Skyscrapers can be awesome, but I don't know that they are really the right choice trying to grow Raleigh right now. Smaller buildings can still serve the purpose for business growth and have a big impact on the street-level quality for residents and pedestrian traffic.

4/11/2013 12:20:31 PM

While I agree that after a certain point the negatives start to outweigh the positives, I would say more large buildings downtown could certainly help with the urban atmosphere. You can tell how small of a city Raleigh is by going out downtown on a weekday to any random bar. With a few exceptions (Flying Saucer, Raleigh Times, etc) most other bars are practically abandoned.

4/11/2013 12:30:58 PM

That issue is going to be solved more by projects like the mid-rise apartment and condo buildings springing up around the Glenwood South area. Those projects are going relatively unnoticed, but I think collectively they are going to have some of the biggest impacts on downtown. Boosting the residential population is critical.

There are 139 residential units in PNC Plaza ($136 million), and 17,000 square feet of ground floor retail.
The 425 N. Boylan project ($35 million) has 250 residential units and 13,100 square feet of ground floor retail.

It's an apples to oranges comparison obviously, but that extra $100 million is going toward height and office space. Office space is a very important thing, of course, but if most employees are commuting in from the suburbs (as I would suspect they are) that isn't doing much to induce around the clock activity. It's a main reason why downtown used to be a total dead zone after 5 PM during the week.

[Edited on April 11, 2013 at 1:10 PM. Reason : .]

4/11/2013 1:00:08 PM

Quote :

"While I agree that after a certain point the negatives start to outweigh the positives, I would say more large buildings downtown could certainly help with the urban atmosphere. You can tell how small of a city Raleigh is by going out downtown on a weekday to any random bar. With a few exceptions (Flying Saucer, Raleigh Times, etc) most other bars are practically abandoned."

That's sort of my issue with the Taz's(es) - it doesn't really feel like anybody lives downtown. Even at First Friday, aside from a couple streets, much of downtown is dead at 10:30 even on a Friday night (the first warm Friday night of the year, no less). I agree that convenience stores are important for people living downtown, to me it feels like the residential population isn't there and Taz's in particular has kind of a general sketchy atmosphere. However I admit I don't actually know how many people live downtown and I could be totally wrong about the residential density.

4/11/2013 1:20:36 PM

A lot of cities can feel that way, though. I've walked from 10th St in Manhattan to 32nd St after concerts at night during the week and aside from the typical activity centers I can go multiple blocks without hardly seeing anyone.

4/11/2013 1:22:23 PM

Yeah, fair enough. I haven't spent a lot of time in big cities aside from DC, but there always seemed to be a lot of bustle there, even during the week. On the other hand I know exactly what you're saying about Manhattan; a couple years ago I walked from Bowery to E 10th one weeknight and it was a ghost town.

I guess I would imagine Raleigh downtown resembling downtown Atlanta in 10-15 years or so as any city, since there's already so much sprawl here already. It'll be interesting to see how things change as more people move into the newer condo developments.

4/11/2013 1:33:34 PM

Quote :

"You can tell how small of a city Raleigh is by going out downtown on a weekday to any random bar."

This will continue to be one of Raleigh's growing pains and it's related to a lack of a permanent downtown population. Strictly office buildings absolutely don't help this; they're great during the day to entice activity but after 5pm (ish) most of them sit purely idle. Even with taller buildings there is still a tendency to segregate uses like this, in reality there is no reason not to include residential and commercial uses within the same 10-20 story building.

Truly great cities have great day AND night life.

4/11/2013 1:51:51 PM

night life breeds drinking and dancing, and the bible doesn't allow for those things.

4/11/2013 2:45:10 PM

I'm pretty sure Jesus turned some water into wine in order to keep a wedding reception hopping. He sounds like a fan of night life to me.

4/11/2013 3:21:27 PM

He would probably open a brewery downtown. So... We have like a dozen Jesuses (Jesusii?) basically.

4/11/2013 4:20:03 PM

Quote :

"You can tell how small of a city Raleigh is by going out downtown on a weekday to any random bar."

I live downtown, and this is pure bullshit. Especially when the weather is good. Downtown is packed, most all of the time. We go out to dinner regularly on the weekdays, for sushi, seaboard station, f-ville st., etc. and often have to wait for a table. This may have been true 2 or 3 years ago when the economy was bad but simply isn't the case anymore. Not to mention the 5,000+ new residents in all of these condo projects.

4/11/2013 4:44:43 PM

Quote :

"Want to see a rendering of the new Raleigh downtown building at Charter Square? http://t.co/KvfcjpdSkj @RaleighWake @DowntownRaleigh"

http://t.co/KvfcjpdSkj

4/11/2013 4:50:51 PM

I like it

I've started reading SCF more lately, and wow... some people haaate the homeless in Raleigh

4/12/2013 8:20:05 AM

What is SCF?

[Edited on April 12, 2013 at 8:58 AM. Reason : Oh SeeClickFix, nevermind]

4/12/2013 8:57:58 AM

http://www.seeclickfix.com/raleigh

Quote :

" Homeless in woods ? Open When will COR crack down on homeless people ?"

4/12/2013 10:24:48 AM

Case in point to what I was talking about yesterday; read the comments here lol: http://dtraleigh.com/2013/04/rendering-of-the-new-charter-square-tower-via-twitter/

4/12/2013 1:53:48 PM

Quote :

"And finally, back in early February we told you that we had heard rumors of a new French bistro and event space being created by Christensen. Well a tweet this week pretty much confirmed that that is indeed in the works referring to the space on Salisbury Street as "our next project." As always, we'll continue to monitor it."

FROM: http://trianglefoodguy.blogspot.com/

4/12/2013 1:54:46 PM

So is this replacing what was supposed to be "The Edison" some years back? Or is that on a different still-vacant lot?

4/12/2013 3:55:09 PM

Different project and lot

4/12/2013 3:58:09 PM

^^different, its up across from the Marriott, adjacent to where the ice skating rink was

4/12/2013 5:18:03 PM

peace college in talks to buy seaboard station?

http://www.mordecaicac.org/news/peaceuniversityandseaboard

4/15/2013 1:43:16 PM

whattt? they just built that whole new strip and some new businesses moved in. i tried to go there this weekend and could not find a parking space in the entire seaboard station, it was a total clusterf$&%$

so i just read the article. it would really suck if seaboard was turned into dorms. they have some great businesses over there (i love that ace hardware). very nice shopping centerwithin a few blocks from downtwon.

[Edited on April 15, 2013 at 2:00 PM. Reason : ]

4/15/2013 1:45:51 PM

That doesn't say anything about what their intentions are for the property. I can't imagine they would want to purchase the property just to close all the businesses and level everything. I don't think the city would be too thrilled about that either. If they want to integrate it with their campus maybe it could end up with a more urban feel rather than the suburban style strip mall it currently is.

4/15/2013 2:04:36 PM

i would assume that they want to buy it to promote development and investment near their campus and as an investment

4/15/2013 2:06:23 PM

This is from New Raleigh's FB page

Quote :

"HELP SAVE SEABOARD STATION!!! This is an urgent request for your support! There is trouble brewing for The Shops at Seaboard Station! We need the help of our community and our wonderful patrons. What has happened, the owners of The Shops at Seaboard Station have been under Chapter 11 of the US Bankruptcy Code for the last 13 months working on a corporate restructure plan. The majority lender, Regions Bank, is trying to (1) move the proceedings to Chapter 7 to force the court to order immediate liquidation of the property or (2) dismiss the Bankruptcy and take possession of the property whereupon they will sell to William Peace University . iAttorneys for the University have been diligently working to make this happen and Regions Bank is all too willing for this to come about. This will have a far reaching impact to the downtown area and the City of Raleigh at large. There are vibrant businesses that employ approximately 200 workers in and around this center not to mention ancillary services. In addition, the loss of revenue to the City and Wake County from lost sales & use and business property tax revenues is incalculable. In exchange, there would be more dorms, activity fields & parking for additional students that historically spend little money in our fine city. The impact to the downtown re-development efforts would be catastrophic and the substitution of a larger campus could permanently halt development in this area. William Peace University (formerly Peace College ) has demonstrated the spirit of little concern for the community through the closing of Franklin Street in the past and there is little to suspect that things will be different with the planned purchase. One needs to look no further than the neighborhoods that surround the college to get this impression."

4/15/2013 2:13:11 PM

Well shit

4/15/2013 2:26:58 PM

New Raleigh doesn't know Peace's intentions any more than you or I

4/15/2013 2:30:53 PM

They might, seeing as I knew nothing about this before right now. They may have been following it, seen docs about it, heard statements by the bank, attorneys, the university, etc. Maybe not. Hopefully they're just speculating.

4/15/2013 2:33:24 PM

To clarify, the post above ("HELP SAVE SEABOARD STATION!!!") was written by Ace Hardware.

https://www.facebook.com/seaboard.acehardware/posts/10151310846121734:0

Quote :

"The tenants here are not reluctant for the story to go public because we all know that if Peace acquires this property, they will let the leases expire and develop the property through attrition. Peace has no intention of being long term landlords here, only long enough until the center is empty. There are other parties interested in part or all of the property, but the attorneys for Regions Bank and Georgia Capital have been negotiating with Peace almost exclusively, and to the contrary of, typical bankruptcy proceedings, so the current owners have little control over who will purchase the center if it comes to liquidation. Peace attorneys have stated in court that Peace is ready, willing and able to purchase the whole track for student parking, activity fields and dorms."

[Edited on April 15, 2013 at 2:36 PM. Reason : .]

4/15/2013 2:36:00 PM

Quote :

"whattt? they just built that whole new strip and some new businesses moved in."

That part belongs to York. Seaboard Station in this conversation is just the buildings that Tyler's and Phydeaux are in as well as the back building where Seaboard Wine and Ace Hardware are.

4/15/2013 2:42:46 PM

Quote :

"To clarify, the post above ("HELP SAVE SEABOARD STATION!!!") was written by Ace Hardware."

oops, my bad.

^I see. Is Logan's part of Seaboard?

[Edited on April 15, 2013 at 2:44 PM. Reason : ]

4/15/2013 2:43:46 PM