User not logged in - login - register
Home Calendar Books School Tool Photo Gallery Message Boards Users Statistics Advertise Site Info
go to bottom | |
 Message Boards » » 2017 World Baseball Classic Page [1]  
Flyin Ryan
All American
7361 Posts
user info
edit post

Starts now in Seoul, South Korea. A pool in Tokyo starts tomorrow. The two North American pools in Miami and Guadalajara start Friday.



Pool A: Tokyo Dome - Tokyo, Japan

Teams: Japan, Cuba, China, Australia



Pool B: Gocheok Dome - Seoul, South Korea

Teams: South Korea, Israel, Taiwan, Netherlands (includes Aruba and Curacao)



Pool C: Marlins Park - Miami, USA

Teams: USA, Dominican Republic, Canada, Colombia



Pool D: Estadio Charros de Jalisco - Guadalajara, Mexico

Teams: Mexico, Italy, Puerto Rico, Venezuela



Previous Finals:

2006 - Japan defeated Cuba
2009 - Japan defeated South Korea
2013 - Dominican Republic defeated Puerto Rico

Pre-tournament thoughts/going expectations:

-this is the weakest Cuban team since before the country went communist as they've been completely unable to hold the tide against defections to the U.S., they've spent a lot of time before this tournament in the Far East just playing games to make them a team that can play crisp together
-think Pool D is the strongest pool top-to-bottom
-Israel and Italy are transplant heavy, although in Israel's case they didn't get near the commitment from eligible MLB players they thought they'd get
-think the U.S. actually has a good shot at this, other than them, hard to know based on rosters, but Japan, South Korea, the Dominicans, maybe Puerto Rico
-I kind of wish the Canadians would get drawn with someone else 1st round, sure they do too
-the Dutch made the final 4 back in 2013, it was such an important step for the game in that country they were able to build a $15 million, 30000-seat stadium in the country, they could go out 1st round this time but the Taiwanese team are beset by political problems as far as team selection
-Aussies, you better beat China

3/6/2017 6:02:48 AM

ssclark
Black and Proud
13812 Posts
user info
edit post

Games on espn??

3/6/2017 10:09:50 AM

hey now
Indianapolis Jones
14286 Posts
user info
edit post

No injuries please.


Did I read the Mets have something like 13-14 players participating?

3/6/2017 10:21:50 AM

bdmazur
California Dreamin'
12722 Posts
user info
edit post

Fantastic headlines coming in.

Quote :
"Team Israel -- and its mascot, Mensch on a Bench -- is the Jamaican bobsled team of the WBC"


Quote :
"Israel's offensive attack looks legit after 2nd straight upset in WBC"


The last team in is looking ready to advance.

Quote :
"Of the 16 nations represented in this year's WBC, Israel was the very last one in and is the only participant not currently among the top 20 in the world rankings. (It's No. 41, just behind baseball powerhouses such as Poland and the Ukraine.)"


Quote :
"If you aren't familiar with Team Israel, it's essentially the Mighty Ducks, Hickory High and the Jamaican bobsled team all rolled into one. In other words, it's straight out of Central Casting for the role of "underdog team that stands absolutely no chance of winning but somehow goes on to win it all." "


[Edited on March 7, 2017 at 5:15 PM. Reason : -]

3/7/2017 5:12:45 PM

bdmazur
California Dreamin'
12722 Posts
user info
edit post

Team Israel, 3-0! Moving on to Tokyo!

3/9/2017 1:30:25 AM

TreeTwista10
Jimmy Mack
135988 Posts
user info
edit post

If a tree falls in a forest and no one is around to hear it, does it make a sound?

3/9/2017 2:35:15 AM

Flyin Ryan
All American
7361 Posts
user info
edit post

^ I'll watch more games of this than the MLB regular season probably.

3/9/2017 8:26:16 AM

rflong
All American
11438 Posts
user info
edit post

I'll follow the US team to see if we can actually perform in this thing. Once the US is out, so am I.

3/9/2017 8:45:37 AM

bdmazur
California Dreamin'
12722 Posts
user info
edit post

I don't like the format of teams from the same poll moving into the same pool in the next round. It means of the 6 games played in each round 2 pool, 1/3 of them will be repeats of the previous round. Would be better if winners of A and B played the runners-up of C and D.

3/9/2017 6:54:34 PM

Flyin Ryan
All American
7361 Posts
user info
edit post

Raucous crowd of Dominicans last night in Miami watching the Republic beat Canada 9-2. Their game vs. The U.S. Saturday should be a fun one.

Team USA open vs. Colombia tonight at 6pm on MLB Network.

The 2nd round Tokyo pool will be Japan, Cuba, the Netherlands, and Israel. China and Taiwan have been relegated to qualifiers next time around.

[Edited on March 10, 2017 at 8:18 AM. Reason : .]

3/10/2017 8:13:44 AM

bdmazur
California Dreamin'
12722 Posts
user info
edit post

^How is it decided who is in next time and who has to qualify? And how do they decide who even gets to play in the qualifier round?

3/10/2017 1:34:26 PM

Flyin Ryan
All American
7361 Posts
user info
edit post

Last place in the first-round pools. So for this time , the teams required to qualify were Australia, Mexico, Spain, and Brazil. Australia and Mexico killed their groups, Spain's group was won by Colombia, and Brazil's group was won by Israel.

If you're a team at a better level than those outside the WBC, like Taiwan or Mexico, it's not the worst thing in the world because you can host some games at home and take a scouting look at some of your younger up-and-coming players.

3/10/2017 1:45:11 PM

bdmazur
California Dreamin'
12722 Posts
user info
edit post

So how did Israel, ranked 41st in the world, get invited to a qualifier? (Not that I'm complaining, obviously)

3/10/2017 4:06:02 PM

thegoodlife3
All American
32430 Posts
user info
edit post

https://theringer.com/americans-are-dominating-the-wbc-but-they-dont-play-for-the-u-s-e12243b29465

3/10/2017 4:16:00 PM

bdmazur
California Dreamin'
12722 Posts
user info
edit post

^A lot of us are calling them Team American Jews. I'm loving the "not good enough to play for Team USA but look how great they're doing anyway" story.

But ultimately I think this leads to increased popularity for the sport in Israel and next time around there will be more actual Israeli athletes. Same thing happened for basketball when Maccabi Tel Aviv won 3 Euro Championships in 5 years in the early 2000s.

3/10/2017 4:28:56 PM

Flyin Ryan
All American
7361 Posts
user info
edit post

I think the team has one legitimate Israeli player, the very Jewish name of Shlomo Lipetz. He's tried/trying to get a baseball system in Israel going.

That said, nice and all for them to make the 2nd round, but I'd consider it embarrassing if they somehow finished 2nd to make it to the semifinals. I think players to be on national teams should have some actual connection to a country to play for it, like born there, grew up there, learned the sport in their system, lived there as an adult for a pretty long time. There's only 2 teams in this tournament that are egregiously bad, Italy and Israel.

Chris Archer perfect through 3 vs. Colombia.

[Edited on March 10, 2017 at 6:46 PM. Reason : .]

3/10/2017 6:32:06 PM

Flyin Ryan
All American
7361 Posts
user info
edit post

Off the backs of good pitching, we're in extra innings. U.S. about to come to bat in the bottom of the 10th tied at 2.

U.S. had a perfect game through 4 2/3rds.Colombia had a no-hitter through 5 and 2/3rds.

3/10/2017 9:17:10 PM

rflong
All American
11438 Posts
user info
edit post

Woot. Nice win for the US.

3/10/2017 9:34:49 PM

Maverick1024
All American
4696 Posts
user info
edit post

Would have liked to see Archer go a little deeper, but definitely understand the pitch count. That guy's slider is filthy.

Jose Quintana is such a likable guy. Almost found myself pulling for him over the USA at times. He was carving us up.

Anyway, good win i guess -- even though it was basically Quintana and a bunch of minor leaguers. Onto DR

3/10/2017 11:23:02 PM

bdmazur
California Dreamin'
12722 Posts
user info
edit post

Israel has already proven they can handle Netherlands. If they can do it again and squeeze out just one win between Japan and Cuba they're in. I don't think it would be an embarrassment at all.

I get Israel's rules, but I don't really understand Italy's. If your name ends in a vowel, do you qualify?

3/11/2017 1:39:16 AM

Flyin Ryan
All American
7361 Posts
user info
edit post

^ I find the notion of Saudi Arabia having a baseball team (they don't) because of all those American oil workers' sons in Dhahran making the Little League World Series every year more legitimate than what has been produced by the Israeli baseball system. Those kids at least lived there.

3/11/2017 1:24:21 PM

bdmazur
California Dreamin'
12722 Posts
user info
edit post

This is what MLB wants, to raise the interest in the game across the world. Israel was never going to produce baseball players until an Israeli team gained popularity. This is how it had to happen. It also means American players who want to participate still can after the USA roster is full. A disproportionate number of talented American players want to participate, so if another country has trouble filling a competitive roster why keep them out? Otherwise there would only be 4 or so worthwhile contenders and the opening round would be pointless.

3/11/2017 5:11:08 PM

justinh524
Suspended
14668 Posts
user info
edit post

Why doesn't Botswana have a team made up of minor leaguers?

3/11/2017 5:46:21 PM

Flyin Ryan
All American
7361 Posts
user info
edit post

A lot more Dominican fans than American fans in Miami.

Should be a fun game.

3/11/2017 6:52:23 PM

Flyin Ryan
All American
7361 Posts
user info
edit post

after Top of the 6th, U.S. was up 5-0

then the Dominicans got 2 in the bottom of the 6th, 1 in the 7th, and with Miller on in the 8th, he hit a batter, then a tough infield hit that could not get the out at 2nd, then a 3-run homer followed by a solo shot, Americans lose 7-5

Heckuva comeback, but the bullpen let the U.S. down.

Quote :
"This is what MLB wants, to raise the interest in the game across the world. Israel was never going to produce baseball players until an Israeli team gained popularity. This is how it had to happen."


4 games in a tournament every 4 years? Israel Baseball don't even play in low-level European baseball tournaments, and if they did, they'd get destroyed because none of these players are playing in those.

Major League Baseball's commitment in contrast in Australia is far superior where they have made infrastructure commitments to the game there and are part-owners of the Australian Baseball League. I see this in other sports I watch where they talk about a big performance in the world championship. In the 2013 Rugby League World Cup, not the mainstream rugby union you normally think of, but the Australian/Northern England-dominated rugby code, the U.S. actually made the quarterfinals with a bunch of Australians and Englishmen. It's done nothing for the game of rugby league in this country compared to the domestic league that was already here and had none of their players selected.

Don't confuse flashes in the pan for development.

[Edited on March 11, 2017 at 10:39 PM. Reason : /]

3/11/2017 10:32:58 PM

rflong
All American
11438 Posts
user info
edit post

Damn tar hole Andrew Miller had to choke it up last night.

3/12/2017 8:27:20 AM

bdmazur
California Dreamin'
12722 Posts
user info
edit post

Quote :
"Don't confuse flashes in the pan for development."


Since only 2 of the players have actual Israeli heritage I don't see how one could, it's not really their flash. But increased interest leads to increased funding which does pave the way to development.

I don't think American rugby is a fair comparison because NFL culture will never provide room for it as a major sport. A better analogy would be American interest in soccer which was dismal until the USA vs Mexico game in 2002. MLS was circling the drain and it's arguable that the excitement of that one game saved the league.

3/12/2017 11:12:44 PM

Maverick1024
All American
4696 Posts
user info
edit post

^^I had forgotten Andrew Miller went to UNC. That explains why I don't like him.

Hopefully Turner and Rodon are playing in the WBC in four years.

3/13/2017 12:25:58 AM

Flyin Ryan
All American
7361 Posts
user info
edit post

^^ I've been playing rugby for 8 years and have seen high school clubs in that time sprout up from zero to we have two divisions in a state.

I also wrote an article on the subject back in 2013.

http://rugbywrapup.com/2013/12/usa-tomahawks-ignore-homegrown-rugby-talent/

Quote :
"FORT WAYNE, IN – The Rugby League World Cup just finished in England and while League is not as popular as Union on a worldwide basis, it does have its heartlands in Australia, New Zealand, England, and some Pacific Island countries.

The RLWC expanded to 12 teams from its last tournament in 2008, and this expansion allowed for the American national team, the USA Tomahawks, a great chance to qualify. The qualifier was held two years ago in of all places a minor league baseball stadium in Newark, New Jersey and the schedule gave the Tomahawks the maximum time between their games in comparison to their two opponents who each had to play on consecutive match-days. The Americans seized the home-field advantage and defeated a poorly put together South African outfit and a game Jamaican side to take the spot. The traditionally more competitive Canadians were not invited by the RLWC organizers.

This was the single greatest achievement in the history of American Rugby League. However, the entire process up to that qualifier and since has been fraught with political infighting. Of the roughly dozen or so rugby league clubs in the country that can fulfill a season-long match schedule and can field a full team without getting volunteers from their opponents, they split into two leagues over disagreement from some clubs on the running of the league and its ownership.

This disagreement extended to players on the National Team, which was run by the same people that established the American National Rugby League (AMNRL). The AMNRL stated it would not pick any players from clubs in the start-up rebel league, the USA Rugby League (USARL), and used that threat to encourage player movement to the Tomahawks-affiliated AMNRL. Moreover, it was fine for the Tomahawks to pick players from other countries, players that were not even affiliated to a rugby league club domestically or played domestic rugby union, just as long as they did not play for a USARL club.

Arguably from a neutral point of view, the USARL had more of the better domestic players, due to having more of the strongest clubs. Internationals playing under this selection policy resulted in poor results for the Tomahawks in games against Canada and Ireland and robbed some of our best domestic players of a chance to develop their skills for the upcoming RLWC.

The problem is that all of these players are as amateur as the rugby union players you find in the USA… and probably more so for most of them. So just moving to another city -considering family and a job – just for the sake of rugby, is out of the question for most.

The most recent scandal in American Rugby League again touched on player selection in the immediate run-up to this World Cup. This time it was not a league civil war, however. It was over the fact that almost all of the players selected were Australians and Englishmen with minimal ties to the United States making up the large majority of the roster. When you consider that one reason flaunted in domestic players’ faces to choose the AMNRL was that playing in the USARL meant banishment from Tomahawks selection, you can see how a domestic top-end player could feel shafted.

For the “results first” people, the selection is justified by the Americans’ victory over the French in a warmup and then the Cook Islands and Wales. The argument comes down to “The Australians and Englishmen are better.” Once you take the point of view that all that matters is results, it’s a very slippery slope because when you take that tack, [B]why would rugby league in this country even bother trying to generate interest or participation in the game domestically, if they can always get a bunch of Australians and Englishmen?[/B] There’s no money in putting time and effort into domestic rugby league at this point: you’re doing God’s work for no financial reward.

How does all this help U.S. Rugby League grow? Comparing League to Union in The States, American domestic rugby union is many years ahead of rugby league in terms of grassroots development. Then there’s the issue of American Rugby League post-RWLC. What does U.S. rugby league do in 2014, 2015, 2016? This RLWC was either not being broadcast in the U.S. or was on a channel that no one knows they get.

What is for certain is that for future internationals, you just pissed-off the best rugby league players in this country. This is no slight against the players on the team but if you asked them what state they were from, they would answer “New South Wales.” They gave an honest effort, performed well and beyond expectations and they likely see this as an opportunity to play fun rugby without the pressure that comes with their regular rugby job. I doubt there’s a lot of money in playing for the Tomahawks in the RLWC. But do you expect these guys to fly from Sydney to play against Jamaica in Newark next year for no pay? These are the questions that these selections must bring into context and find answers for.

I don’t believe in quota systems though. If anything, this is more an indictment on how loose the eligibility rules of the Rugby League International Federation are. The reason for the loose eligibility is to show “other people play this game too” by putting in some ringers, hoping it will generate greater interest in the game elsewhere. If they want to grow American Rugby League, Americans are not going to cheer for Australian rugby leaguers representing us, for the same reason Australians are not going to cheer for American baseballers representing Australia, see the World Baseball Classic.

Major League Baseball are part owners of the Australian Baseball League, the 2014 baseball season is opening with a doubleheader at the Sydney Cricket Ground, and Major League Baseball wants to develop Australian fan interest in the sport as well as Australian baseball talent. To tie this into American Rugby Union, the Eagles also have a few guys that are Americans by convenience. There’s the crew of American Samoans who only recently have been able to choose to represent that territory in international play.

If our team goes out and lose to the England Saxons 87-8 as happened a few years ago, it’s a sign we’re doing a bad job and we need to improve so we can produce a sustainable assembly line of quality international rugby players in this country, not a sign we need to comb through English 2nd Division rosters."


Post-RLWC, the AMNRL was dissolved and had their control of the national team stripped away by the international authorities of the game.

3/14/2017 7:58:32 PM

Flyin Ryan
All American
7361 Posts
user info
edit post

Japan and the Netherlands made it over from Asia to be in the Final Four in Los Angeles. Japanese so far a perfect 6-0.

The San Diego 2nd round pool has thus far gone like this:

Puerto Rico def. Dominican Republic 3-1
United States def. Venezuela 4-2
Dominican Republic def. Venezuela 3-0

U.S. and Puerto Rico play tonight at 10pm Eastern with the winner sitting pretty at 2-0.

1st in the pool will play the Dutch, runner-up gets the Japanese.

3/17/2017 10:58:57 AM

Flyin Ryan
All American
7361 Posts
user info
edit post

U.S. eliminated the Dominican Republic 6-3 the other night to advance to the semifinals. They play Japan at 9pm tomorrow night.

Right now the Puerto Ricans are up 3-2 on the Dutch in the 3rd.

3/20/2017 10:15:22 PM

velez75
All American
606 Posts
user info
edit post

Wooooo Puerto Rico!!!

That is all.

3/21/2017 11:43:06 AM

bdmazur
California Dreamin'
12722 Posts
user info
edit post

By the WBC eligibility rules, anyone who can play for Puerto Rico can also play for USA, right? So if PR wins the whole thing, America still wins.

3/21/2017 6:22:37 PM

justinh524
Suspended
14668 Posts
user info
edit post

my understanding of WBC rules are that if you want to play for any country, they can't stop you.

3/21/2017 8:15:28 PM

rflong
All American
11438 Posts
user info
edit post

US beat Japan so its PR vs US for the title. We win either way! Trump can probably just order PR to forfeit and take credit for winning it.

Honestly though the players on the US team do seem to care and are playing well/hard and its good to see. No reason why we shouldn't win this thing with regularity even without most of our best players.

3/22/2017 6:02:26 AM

Flyin Ryan
All American
7361 Posts
user info
edit post

If the U.S. do win tonight, Adam Jones should be tournament MVP.

Game started a few minutes ago. Seth Lugo starting for Puerto Rico. Christian Yelich had some great baserunning to turn a single into a double.

[Edited on March 22, 2017 at 9:30 PM. Reason : .]

3/22/2017 9:29:44 PM

Flyin Ryan
All American
7361 Posts
user info
edit post

2-run Homer Ian Kinsler in the top of the 3rd. 2-0 USA.

3/22/2017 10:07:43 PM

scotieb24
I GOT NOTHING
9131 Posts
user info
edit post

Good stuff. My son is just starting baseball so I was doing a lot of teaching tonight. Wife just made me put him in bed.

We got a few USA!USA! Chants in first though

3/22/2017 11:06:01 PM

bdmazur
California Dreamin'
12722 Posts
user info
edit post

This is why 1-game championships make no sense in baseball.

3/23/2017 12:28:02 AM

 Message Boards » Sports Talk » 2017 World Baseball Classic Page [1]  
go to top | |
Admin Options : move topic | lock topic

© 2017 by The Wolf Web - All Rights Reserved.
The material located at this site is not endorsed, sponsored or provided by or on behalf of North Carolina State University.
Powered by CrazyWeb v2.37 - our disclaimer.