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 Message Boards » » Kevin Keatts Credibility Watch Page 1 ... 20 21 22 23 [24] 25, Prev Next  
hey now
Indianapolis Jones
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Lmao

2/16/2020 8:01:44 PM

horosho
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let the season play out we still have a whole win left on the schedule.

2/16/2020 8:09:09 PM

TreeTwista10
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Gottfried would've won that game

2/16/2020 8:12:33 PM

hey now
Indianapolis Jones
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FWIW one can feel like Keatts is doing a poor job motivating his best players and had less than ideal roster management —-while at the same time not wanting him fired and thinking the future can still be bright.

[Edited on February 16, 2020 at 9:41 PM. Reason : K]

2/16/2020 9:41:12 PM

natureboy
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If he could get 2 or 3 guys that could hit 3’s his offense would probably work. Unfortunately we have maybe Bryce that is a halfway decent 3 point shooter and no one else.

2/16/2020 10:27:47 PM

justinh524
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I think the roster management is due in part to a lot of bad luck. I mean the best player in his first real class (saddiq bey) decommited after signing for no reason and then another guy quit after 1 game. Throw in the bad luck of Seabron not qualifying and Lecque going pro and it's amazing we actually have a team at all.

2/16/2020 11:16:25 PM

tower
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Quote :
"If he could get 2 or 3 guys that could hit 3’s his offense would probably work. Unfortunately we have maybe Bryce that is a halfway decent 3 point shooter and no one else."


Wow it's almost like when I bitched for three years about a guy running an offense that has been successful with players who can shoot 3s and dont the turn the ball over recruiting a shitload of guards that cant shoot and cough the ball up like its their job I was on to something

2/17/2020 2:12:17 AM

Maverick1024
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Other than Bates, who in the rotation has a reputation as a bad shooter?

Beverly and Andree were supposedly lethal shooters when they signed. Daniels was supposedly a great 3pt shooter when he transferred. Markell and Bryce have been respectable shooters their whole career. All of Hellums recruiting bios said he was a quality shooter from deep. Even Funderburke can hit from out there.

It's just for whatever reason, they aren't hitting them this year. Maybe it's just bad luck. Maybe Keatts is wearing them down in practice too much. Maybe teams are learning how to stifle our offense and we aren't getting consistently good looks. Who knows

2/17/2020 11:37:32 AM

dmspack
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Daniels only attempted 35 3s in his first year at Utah...and he did hit 40% of those, which is a really good % but a pretty small sample size. he attempted 119 3s last year and has attempted 68 this year. he averaged 27 mins/game at Utah and was attempting 1.2 3PA/game. my point in that is...he was clearly a capable shooter. but he's probably just shooting too many 3s now (especially last year) for somebody that isn't a dead-eye shooter. and if he was a dead-eye 3PT shooter, he probably would've attempted more than 1.2/game at Utah. i don't recall what his reputation was as a 3PT shooter when he transferred in, but him attempting 1.2/game led me to think he was a capable shooter but not a great shooter.

as a freshman, Bryce shot 43% on only 30 attempts at UNCW. as a sophomore, he shot 33% on 127 attempts at UNCW. and last year at State he shot 34.5% on 110 attempts and 35% this year on 62 attempts so far. so i'd say his percentages (and attempts/game) has stayed fairly consistent from his sophomore year at UNCW. not like he's gotten way worse, in fact his percentage is slightly up at State.

Quote :
"Even Funderburke can hit from out there."


he's 10/41 in his career and 3/15 this year. him shooting a 3 is generally a bad shot.

[Edited on February 17, 2020 at 12:21 PM. Reason : f]

2/17/2020 12:15:05 PM

Maverick1024
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Good stuff. Didn't know about Daniels' small sample size, I just remember seeing his high 3pt % coming in. A few commentators last year mentioned him being a good 3pt shooter at Utah, but I'm guessing they just looked at his % instead of the full picture too.

Either way, I'm hoping Cam Hayes, Josh Hall, etc can shoot. That's the only way Keatts offense is going to click. (Haven't looked into their recruiting enough to know if they can shoot.)

2/17/2020 12:51:41 PM

rwoody
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It's really just Markell and Andree that have disappointed from 3 this season. And Andree came from a pretty low conference, have to expect his percentages to go down SOME in ACC play. His injuries haven't helped.

Really, if we replaced this year's Markell with last year's Markell with no other changes, we'd prob have a few more wins. Plays like that spin move last night make his otherwise no show that much more disappointing.

Oh and it's been awhile but I don't remember Hellems being known as a shooter. Tower can be annoying but he is right that KK either doesn't pursue or doesn't land known shooters. None of next years recruits are really shooters. Not to say they can't develop and improve but they aren't now.


[Edited on February 17, 2020 at 12:56 PM. Reason : E]

2/17/2020 12:54:09 PM

dmspack
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Markell has been the real head scratcher. FT % is down 16% from last year. 3Pt% is down 17% from last year. Overall FG% is down 9% from last year. Turnovers are up but his minutes are also up, so that may not be such a significant change.

2/17/2020 1:55:50 PM

rwoody
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Per possession and minute, his TO's are stable with assists and steals up a little in conference play.

2/17/2020 2:08:49 PM

tower
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Quote :
"Beverly and Andree were supposedly lethal shooters when they signed."


Rank 300+ 5'10 unathletic recruit and the 4th best player on Lehigh

Quote :
"Daniels was supposedly a great 3pt shooter when he transferred. Markell and Bryce have been respectable shooters their whole career."


Daniels and Bryce already covered, in a vacuum either are fine. Both of them together is probably a bit redundant. Markell was a bad shooter his freshman year and has never been a particularly good FT shooter for a guard. This year is unfortunate and unexpected, but his numbers last year were probably outliers in the opposite direction

Quote :
"All of Hellums recruiting bios said he was a quality shooter from deep."


Mediocre swingman recruit, idk if you can say his results are below expectation. Maybe he should be closer to 34-35% since most of his shots are wide ass open, I guess

Quote :
"Even Funderburke can hit from out there."


He's a good shooter for a center but the delusions about him being a capable 4 in our system have hopefully been shattered this season

This is ignoring the failures no longer on the roster - what the fuck was the point of Lavar Batts and Blake Harris

2/18/2020 6:54:56 PM

dmspack
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Quote :
" This is ignoring the failures no longer on the roster - what the fuck was the point of Lavar Batts and Blake Harris"


The reason for Lavar Batts was that KK inherited a roster with one PG. Blake Harris is one I don’t have an answer for.

Quote :
" 4th best player on Lehigh"


Andree was a 42% 3pt shooter last year on 6 attempts/game. Nobody expected him to be anything more than a shooter. Regardless of where he ranked on Lehigh’s roster last year, his shooting numbers speak for themselves. He was brought in to be a reliable shooter, something he was for his entire career. And he’s been a total disappointment obviously.

2/18/2020 7:28:24 PM

justinh524
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Batts was a disappoinment, but he was the best Keatts could do coming into the shitpile Gottfried left him. Also, he was a top 100 recruit and #1 in NC, so he just didn't pan out. Mainly because it turns out he's a SG in a PG body who can't shoot 3s. Still think him staying would have been better for the program than replacing him with Harris, as in I think Batts could actually be a bench player in the ACC. Guess he wanted to start though.

2/18/2020 8:07:04 PM

dmspack
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I agree with^

2/18/2020 8:37:20 PM

jocristian
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I’m not saying I want Keatts fired just yet but if there were a way to snag Beilein somehow, I’d give Keatts a ride to the airport.

2/18/2020 8:38:25 PM

TreeTwista10
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"Mainly because it turns out he's a SG in a PG body who can't shoot 3s."


If only scouts could deduce those things beforehand...

2/18/2020 8:50:49 PM

justinh524
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You mean like how #1 PG in the country Cole Anthony is a terribly inefficient offensive player?

2/18/2020 11:09:38 PM

TreeTwista10
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i'm the choir that you're preaching to, fyi

2/18/2020 11:11:59 PM

justinh524
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Choirs are full of sinners who are going to burn in hayull

2/18/2020 11:53:05 PM

tower
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Quote :
". Regardless of where he ranked on Lehigh’s roster last year, his shooting numbers speak for themselves."


Also the 4th best shooter on Lehigh, which was the best 3 point shooting team in the nation last year.

Certainly that means he has some capability, but given that Lehigh still sucked fucking ass his entire career it's not a real surprise that he wouldn't translate well to the ACC and that his numbers probably had something to do with a gimmick offense

2/19/2020 12:32:40 AM

tower
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Quote :
"The reason for Lavar Batts was that KK inherited a roster with one PG. Blake Harris is one I don’t have an answer for."


From what I recall, there were three point guards available when Keatts was hired. Harris was the guy he wanted first. Then he whiffed on him because he's a shitty recruiter (boy did we get some false advertising there) and fell back to Batts. The third guy? A decommit from Georgetown named Tremont Waters

2/19/2020 12:36:09 AM

rwoody
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It's not exactly shocking that there was a drop off in recruiting from the guy paying players to come here, but this year's class has 2-3 players.

The trick will be to keep them on campus

Also as for Markell, weird that you think the 230 3pa from the last two years were an "outlier" vs the 48 3pa from his freshman year.

[Edited on February 19, 2020 at 8:23 AM. Reason : E]

2/19/2020 8:18:12 AM

Jeepin4x4
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Quote :
"I’m not saying I want Keatts fired just yet but if there were a way to snag Beilein somehow, I’d give Keatts a ride to the airport."

2/19/2020 8:39:30 AM

justinh524
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Quote :
"his numbers probably had something to do with a gimmick offense"


Lol yes a gimmick offense made him an accurate 3 point shooter. Much more likely that a deeper 3 point line and bigger, better defenders are more of the reason for his decline than a "gimmick offense".

And Beverly has NEVER been an elite 3 point shooter in his career here. He was pretty good as a freshman, and has been just ok since then. He's got a reputation of being some sort of assassin, but he's still a career 36% shooter (which is exactly what he's shooting this year.)

2/19/2020 8:45:45 AM

HCH
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I wouldn't be so enthusiastic to dump KK for Beilein. His offenses are pretty painful, and do we really want to win if it means suffering through a boring offense?

And then I remember that we haven't won anything in 30 years. So lets get him, Herb, Tony Bennett and dig up Pete Carrill.

[Edited on February 19, 2020 at 9:21 AM. Reason : ^^]

2/19/2020 9:21:46 AM

marko
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FIRE HERB

2/19/2020 9:27:55 AM

dmspack
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This is completely unrealistic hypothetical but fuck it.

Winning games trumps anything about “boring style”. Beilein has won 2 B1G tourney titles, 2 B1G reg season titles, been to 2 NCAA title games...in 12 seasons at UM. That’s more than we’ve accomplished in 30+ years. I realize this type of conversation always circles back to Herb and how fans hated his style. And again it’s all a silly hypothetical...but I feel like you’d be crazy to turn down a coach with Beilein’s track record because you don’t like the style of play.

2/19/2020 9:50:37 AM

Bullet
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Quote :
"Then he whiffed on him because he's a shitty recruiter (boy did we get some false advertising there)"


We have a top10 (top5?) class coming in next year
(tower is a clown)

2/19/2020 9:54:03 AM

ActionPants
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I would gladly win every game 2-0 as long as we won

2/19/2020 11:00:32 AM

justinh524
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Quote :
"do we really want to win if it means suffering through a boring offense?"


yes.

also lol at you people who thought herb's offenses were boring.

2/19/2020 11:03:17 AM

synapse
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They were.

2/19/2020 11:30:21 AM

justinh524
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No, Sidney Lowe's offense was boring.

[Edited on February 19, 2020 at 12:22 PM. Reason : Because it didn't exist]

2/19/2020 12:22:03 PM

synapse
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Both can be true at the same time

2/19/2020 12:38:26 PM

jocristian
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Not rehash crap that has been beaten to death on this website and everywhere else. I don't think Herb was a good enough coach for his players to run his offense consistently (yikes to those scoring droughts!), but when it was running, it was a thing of beauty. He failed here primarily because of his milquetoast personality and inability to win against Duke/Carolina ever.

Beilein's offense was similar, but he was/is a much better coach. His personality would be perfect for winning here too IMO. Beilein>>>>>>>> Herb. It's not even close.

2/19/2020 12:45:47 PM

justinh524
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Quote :
"milquetoast personality"


herb was and is goddamn hilarious. He didn't wear clownshoes or bang coeds so I guess he's too boring to be successful.

2/19/2020 3:15:42 PM

rwoody
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Who wears clown shoes

2/19/2020 3:44:54 PM

marko
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Chuck

2/19/2020 4:00:47 PM

Maverick1024
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Quote :
"No, Sidney Lowe's offense was boring."


Yeah, for the most part. But that first year when he had Atsur running the pick-and-roll with Costner, it looked damn near unstoppable at times. Then Atsur graduated and Costner got shitty and it all fell apart

2/19/2020 4:50:16 PM

dmspack
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Lowe never had a good PG after that. Javi, Farnold Degand, Marques Johnson, Julius Mays...one season of freshman Harrow. If he had been able to replace Atsur with a more capable PG he might’ve lasted longer and been not a total disaster. But as it was....yeah, total disaster. Y’all remember in his first season when Atsur got hurt and Gavin Grant had to run the point? Hoo boy that was an adventure. We had something like 30 (30!!) turnovers vs Cinci that year.

And to be clear, I’m not saying Lowe would’ve been a great success if he better PGs. But i don’t think it would’ve gone off the rails so fast.

2/19/2020 6:07:37 PM

jocristian
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Quote :
"herb was and is goddamn hilarious"


Bruh. I’m sure he is a great and hilarious dude in person. Are you really trying to argue that Herb didn’t come across as boring af in the media and this perception wasn’t a big part (whether fair or not) of what led to the fan base getting frustrated with him?

Beilein is a pipe dream but my point is only that he is a far better coach and wouldn’t have the personality perception issues that plagued Herb.

^yeah I agree 100%.

[Edited on February 19, 2020 at 6:40 PM. Reason : D]

2/19/2020 6:38:51 PM

dmspack
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Day tight compartments, chopping wood, etc. Yeah Herb was a boring/dry dude. Doesn’t mean he couldn’t be funny (see TOB). But yeah. Beilein is also just a better coach than Herb.

2/19/2020 6:55:57 PM

packboozie
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The officiating sucks but make some goddamm adjustments

Play zone for fuck's sake. They've hit 1 three.

2/25/2020 9:59:58 PM

jocristian
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I don’t care if we have played a second of zone in practice this season. Every high schooler in the country can play a basic 2-3 zone for a few possessions to get some stops against one of the worst outside shooting teams.

2/25/2020 10:49:29 PM

dmspack
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We’ve gone zone very briefly a couple times this year. So he has shown the ability to do it...but yeah, this feels like a game where it could be helpful.

2/25/2020 11:03:54 PM

tower
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2/25/2020 11:08:32 PM

dmspack
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Is that Anthony Grant at Bama?

2/25/2020 11:10:19 PM

jocristian
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Not gonna last long around here if he keeps getting his ass handed to him by Roy.

2/25/2020 11:15:59 PM

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