Ok, so I'm wanting to get a decent handgun, mainly for range shooting purposes. Eventually, i'll prolly get a concealed weapon permit.

What's the best 9mm pistol I can get for around $300? I'm looking at the Ruger KP-95 at the moment. Any exerience with this gun?

[Edited on December 26, 2005 at 2:17 PM. Reason : btw, I have a p-89 right now...just mainly need suggestions on the KP95]

12/26/2005 2:12:47 PM

used SIG P226/P228 from Lawmen's Supply

12/26/2005 2:29:44 PM

Go to a range and rent some guns. No one here is going to be able to tell you what YOU like or dislike in a gun.

12/26/2005 3:13:02 PM

i personally don't like the ruger...my buddy had a brand new one i got to shoot, but i feel like it is too "loose" of a gun...not the accuracy or weight i was looking to have.

12/26/2005 3:23:26 PM

now I can be like a rapper!

12/26/2005 3:26:34 PM

^wtf are you talkin about? I already have a 9mm...not tryin to fit any images here or stereotypes, i just wanted to see what people have to say about the kp-95

12/26/2005 3:47:01 PM

hey i got some advice

DONT SHOOT MY ASS!

[Edited on December 26, 2005 at 5:02 PM. Reason : .]

12/26/2005 5:02:31 PM

you better hang out w/ me then...it's boring as shit here at home...i might have to shoot you just for fun.

12/26/2005 5:12:09 PM

came back to raleigh yesterday

and its fucking dead here too

[Edited on December 26, 2005 at 5:33 PM. Reason : didnt wanna stay with the rents any longer than i had to]

12/26/2005 5:32:54 PM

make sure you talk about your new gun in your next rap song.

12/26/2005 6:52:06 PM

^mos def

12/26/2005 7:39:50 PM

Glock... ugly as sin, but functional as hell. The form is in the function. I have a Glock 22, the .40 cal. I think the 9mm is the 19. Go for the extra knock-down of the .40 or the .45 especially if you have bigger hands. I have very small hands but can still handle the .40. The recoil is not bad, but I do hear the 9mm shoots very nicely and might be better for faster match-shooting.



[Edited on December 26, 2005 at 9:36 PM. Reason : pic]

12/26/2005 9:09:24 PM

as in all of these threads, I'm going to recommend the same gun I have, the HK USP .40 compact

carry on

12/26/2005 9:15:20 PM

Quote :

"Go for the extra knock-down of the .40 or the .45 especially if you have bigger hands."

You can't knock someone down with a pistol unless you whip them with it. Go with what is comfortable to you.

12/26/2005 9:51:41 PM

^Take a .40 in the chest w/o getting "knocked down" see: ft/lbs. of bullet. Vest or not it will floor your ass and you won't get up. 9mm is a fine weapon, and is unquestionably deadly, but it lacks the ft/lbs I like; a matter of tastes I suppose.

12/26/2005 11:31:13 PM

Don't.

12/26/2005 11:46:54 PM

i really like the way a 9mm feels...i've been shooting for years...

and also, it's just convenient as far as ammo goes...i already have one 9mm...and my friend shoots 9mm's as well

12/26/2005 11:48:49 PM

Quote :

"Take a .40 in the chest w/o getting "knocked down" see: ft/lbs. of bullet. Vest or not it will floor your ass and you won't get up. 9mm is a fine weapon, and is unquestionably deadly, but it lacks the ft/lbs I like; a matter of tastes I suppose."

9mm +P is going to have muzzle energy not far from .45ACP

[Edited on December 27, 2005 at 12:20 AM. Reason : I take that back. 9mm has more muzzle energy than .45ACP apparently]

12/27/2005 12:12:57 AM

the Glock 19 (9mm) is a nice gun...a buddy of mine has one...
he also just bought a Springfield XD .40

both are very nice guns, and similar in appearance...however the Springfield has a number of additional "safety" features...
the glock essentially has no safety features, still an awesome gun

12/27/2005 12:30:52 AM

a glock has safety features

it just has no external safety besides that little trigger safety

lack of safety is no reason not to get a Glock





a double action trigger (not exactly, but for lack of a better description) is, though, in my book

actually, a DA pistol is ok for self defense/tactical employment, but i hate them at the range

12/27/2005 12:35:55 AM

well that's what i meant.. besides the trigger safety...
the springfield has an indicator on the back that shows if a round is chambered..
it also has a mechanism on he back of the grip that has to be pressed in order for the trigger to be pulled...
but yeah, glocks are VERY dependable.
and i'd buy one regardless, but some people actually care about external safeties...

[Edited on December 27, 2005 at 12:40 AM. Reason : yep]

12/27/2005 12:37:46 AM

i don't know why they do

no revolvers have them

most DA autoloaders don't

it's mostly just SA-only pistols (which are a minority, anyway) with a few exceptions like Berettas (which are overpriced and something i would never consider buying)


hell, would feel at LEAST as comfortable with my old SIG P226 as i would with my 1911 cocked and locked

12/27/2005 12:46:10 AM

Quote :

"the springfield has an indicator on the back that shows if a round is chambered.."

I hate this "safety" feature. It promotes laziness on the owner's part by providing a false sense of security. Using a loaded chamber indicator is breaking one of the fundamental rules of gun safety.

Quote :

"it also has a mechanism on he back of the grip that has to be pressed in order for the trigger to be pulled..."

Grip safety fyi

12/27/2005 12:49:24 AM

i'm not saying it is a better gun b/c it has the safety stuff. just some differences between the 2, b/c they are both very dependable guns...

12/27/2005 12:51:05 AM

yeah, i never even look at that stupid loaded chamber indicator

i don't even know where it's at, to tell you the truth, on either my 1911 or an M-9 Beretta (Beretta 92FS), and i've shot both of those weapons a lot

i don't think my SIG had one. if it did, i never noticed it over several thousand rounds.

12/27/2005 12:51:42 AM

Quote :

"used SIG P226/P228 from Lawmen's Supply"

i second this

12/27/2005 12:18:49 PM

the loaded chamber indicators are a result of some law that i think was passed in delaware maybe, even new glocks have them now. my new model 23 (.40 S&W compact) has it right behind the ejector port although its still easier to tell by pulling the slide back.As far as external safetys go the number one safety in my book is your trigger finger, you dont want the gun to fire dont put your finger on the trigger

12/27/2005 1:01:31 PM

Went to the range today and rented a SIG P239...shot 3 boxes through it...sweetass gun.

[Edited on December 27, 2005 at 2:23 PM. Reason : .]

12/27/2005 2:00:45 PM

lawmen's doesnt have a very good selection of sig 226's, personal defense had a few but not many, is there any other suggestions for a place to look?

12/27/2005 5:29:28 PM

young guns in apex

12/27/2005 5:53:58 PM

Quote :

"place to look?"

look at them at Davis, but buy from someone else

12/27/2005 6:35:22 PM

Just become a Sig Armorer and then you can save money

12/27/2005 6:43:08 PM

Davi's does not currently have any Sigs...
the guy said they had some kind of disagreement or argument with Sig and they aren't selling them anymore..
however he did say they are working on it and should have them sometime later..

but yeah, Look at Davi's, but don't buy...their guns are overpriced... my buddy compared prices for his new Glock at Davi's and PDHSC and Davi's was almost $100 MORE.

12/27/2005 8:03:49 PM

blahhh blahhh blahhh is all i am hearing. buy a sig and you will own a weapon that will make you smile when you shoot your friends glocks, hk's and smith's because you will think they are total schmucks for not buying a sig. fit, form, and function with a sig is unbeatable.

12/27/2005 8:22:59 PM

If you already have a P-89 don't waste your money on a KP-95. It's almost exactly the same.

I'll stick with the other suggestions of getting a police trade-in Sig.

Quote :

"I have a Glock 22, the .40 cal. I think the 9mm is the 19. Go for the extra knock-down of the .40 or the .45 especially if you have bigger hands. I have very small hands but can still handle the .40."

The 22 and 17 are both the same size. If your hand fits a 22 it will fit a 17/19 the same.

As far as the "knockdown power" you're talking about, here are some Speer Gold Dot figures:
-9mm, 124gr: 1150fps/364ft-lbs
-9mm, 124gr +P: 1220/410
-40S&W, 180gr: 1025/420
-45ACP, 230gr (5" barrel mind you): 890/405

You don't start knocking human sized things down until you're shooting 12ga slugs or 458 Winmags, haven't you seen that Mythbusters episode? If you shoot someone in the chest with anything bigger than a 32ACP they're most likely going down. You don't really think 10 fpe or 0.05" more surface area (expanded radius actually) will really change anything do you?



Loaded chamber indicators are pretty stupid, you should know if your chamber is loaded or not.

Quote :

"Went to the range today and rented a SIG P239...shot 3 boxes through it...sweetass gun."

Oooh, that'd be a great gun for concealed carry. The 239 is much thinner than a 228/226 because it doesn't have that dang decocker hump. Skip the P95 and save up for the 239.

If i was gonna buy a new gun I'd get it from PDHSC. Have them quote you a price for special orders if they don't have it in stock. I've bought a few firearms from them and they're good to deal with and have the best prices in Raleigh.
If yall don't mind the drive, there's Mace Sports in Mebane, about 50 min west on I40 (exit 157, turn right, then left). They have a pretty decent selection and prices on par with PDHSC.

[Edited on December 27, 2005 at 8:26 PM. Reason : I got stone's 228 and with 6k+ rounds it's still as smooth and accurate as ever.]

12/27/2005 8:23:39 PM

^ glad to hear it man! i bought another. i also aquired a p210

can you hit up the balistics on .357sig? i am carrying that now instead of my .45. i am curious the diffrence. i know the .357 should theoreticly have move energy but how much?

12/27/2005 8:39:12 PM

Yall are some straight up Sig lovin fools

Whenever one of you's think's you can shoot that Sig, Ill show you what a Glock can do
Now im going back To Glocktalk where us Glockaholics are respected

12/27/2005 8:50:58 PM

^^The 125gr Speer Gold Dot in 357Sig hauls butt at 1375fps/525ft-lbs out of a 4in barrel.
Only 75fps away from catching the 125gr 357Mag.

Which version 210 did you get?

^I've put about 500 rounds through a G17 and G19 and can't hit crap. Just can't get used to that weird grip angle and squishy trigger
I'll stay over at sigforum.com

12/27/2005 9:49:03 PM

I'm surprised and was apparently wrong about the "knock-down" thing. I apologize. Here, .40 is the largest cal. The Man is allowed to carry.

I still stand by Glock. When the Isrealis demanded a gun that wouldn't misfire in 30k rounds, Glock delivered. And it doesn't have to be cleaned every time you glance at it... although I do all my guns.

^I got good enough with my G22 fairly quickly, but I don't have much experience with other handguns... I couldn't hit the broad side of a barn at first. But I can make the kill shot at a reasonable range. I'm told that most handgun battles occur at a range of 4 feet or less.

[Edited on December 27, 2005 at 10:10 PM. Reason : Aim]

12/27/2005 10:06:49 PM

When buying a handgun, it's a good idea to bring another gun with you to show you're responsible.
The bigger the better, too!

12/27/2005 10:10:34 PM

Thankfully, my dick and most of my guns are long enough to hunt with legally in NC.

12/27/2005 10:13:33 PM

210-6 is what i got. it was a hell of a deal. i also got the .22 conversion with it.

i dislike the feel of glocks. i dont care what you do to the trigger is still creeps and isnt crisp. i also find glocks to be picky about ammo. i had a 22, 23, and a 17 and didnt like any of them.

12/27/2005 10:18:39 PM

Quote :

"used SIG P226/P228 from Lawmen's Supply"

Is that really within the $300 range?

1/23/2006 8:51:37 PM

Quote :

"Is that really within the $300 range? "

No, it's in the $325-350 price range.
A small step up in price for a large step up in quality.

1/23/2006 9:11:23 PM

people either love glocks or hate them, i love them. i own three. one 9mm and 2 .45s. they are dependable, accurate and easy to maintain.

1/23/2006 10:27:40 PM

what's up with a taurus .45 only costing $270? i never realized they were that cheap.

1/23/2006 10:34:22 PM

Quote :

"what's up with a taurus .45 only costing $270? i never realized they were that cheap."

The fit and finish isn't as nice as more expensive guns and they can't charge you extra for their name. That's basically why they cost less.
The reliability is relatively hit or miss compared to other brands, but overall they are good.
If you're looking at Taurus autos, newer is better because they've worked the bugs out.
If you're talking about Taurus revolvers, the ones made in the mid to late 90's can have some quality issues.

Their Beretta 9X clones are cheap cause they're made on old Berretta equipment, so the customer doesn't have to eat the high initial investment costs. Those clones aren't bad BTW.

It doesn't cost much to produce a quality gun. Just look at the Ruger pistols and Savage rifles. You really do pay for a name. A $700 USP doesn't have any more quality than a $550 Sig and a $900 Colt 1911 isn't any better than the equivalent Springfield.

1/23/2006 11:13:38 PM

guns dont kill people

1/23/2006 11:16:53 PM

^that's right

ngz do.

1/24/2006 12:03:23 AM

set 'em up

1/24/2006 10:36:44 AM