it begins.

http://www.indianexpress.com/print.php?content_id=81858

Quote :

"Samsung plans to unveil a new notebook PC that uses powerful memory chips instead of a hard-disk drive. The chips can make the device 10 to 15 per cent lighter than current models and 30 per cent faster — and it will have 40 gigabytes of storage, putting it in the same league as conventional hard-disk drives."

if not 100% flash - hybrid works too:

http://news.com.com/Samsung+hybrid+hard+drive+works+while+it+sleeps/2100-1041_3-5683836.html

Quote :

"SEATTLE--Microsoft and Samsung showed off a prototype hard drive Monday that can record data while idling, a twist that has the potential to significantly cut power consumption in notebooks. The trick is that the hard drive contains a 1Gb flash memory chip from Samsung's OneNAND family. Incoming data is directly recorded to the chip. When the chip is about full, the hard drive wakes up, takes the data, records it and goes back into idle. Typically, hard drives rotate. Hard drive motors, along with LCD screens, are two of the largest consumers of power inside a laptop. In the hybrid, the drive rarely spins. In the prototype hybrid being shown off Monday at the Windows Hardware Engineering Conference, the drive spins only about 30 to 45 seconds every half hour, said Ivan Greenberg, director of strategic marketing for Samsung Semiconductor. The goal is to get it to 30 to 45 seconds for an hour."

1 GB of cache isn't bad.

1/24/2006 10:06:22 AM

pretty hot

1/24/2006 10:07:52 AM

yeah that is cool

1/24/2006 10:15:04 AM

that's awesome, because the more flash they use, the cheaper it'll get

1/24/2006 10:19:05 AM

Windows Vista is going to support this Hybrid HD idea using a USB key for the cache to work with existing hard drives

1/24/2006 10:40:06 AM

no mention of the current limit of read/write cycles for the flash. That could be a pretty limiting factor. Instead of your laptop HDD mechanics giving out after a couple years, your Flash Drive could hit its physical limit of r/w cycles and stop working....
I assume for a Flash drive to go to market, it would have to have a demonstrated capability of 4-5+ years of "typical use" before going bad, but I don't know how they calculate that..... I also assume the reading/writing will be highly optimized to save cycles on each cell

1/24/2006 10:46:42 AM

Quote :

"Windows Vista is going to support this Hybrid HD idea using a USB key for the cache to work with existing hard drives "

I'll let you know how it works come Feburary.

1/24/2006 10:53:29 AM

^^that's what i was thinking. NAND flash memory can write between 50k and 5 million times or something. seems like a lot, but depending on the application, this might not be very long. especially if it is being used as the cache.

1/24/2006 11:23:21 AM

I see these things on cell phones before computers if they are small enough.

1/24/2006 12:35:58 PM

well i mena, that wouldn't be quite as revolutionary. alot of phones already use flash memory, so this would just mean more capacity. replacing moving parts with faster, non-moving flash memory would be a huge boon to computers. somewhre in the middle would be using them in media players that previously used hard drives, lessening the possibility of hearing that awful churning and clicking of an ipod hard drive on the fritz

[Edited on January 24, 2006 at 1:05 PM. Reason : .]

1/24/2006 1:05:09 PM

I think there was a thread on that E drive thing where you put 4 dimms on this card and it turned into a solid-state drive.

shit what the fuck was it called?

[Edited on January 24, 2006 at 1:20 PM. Reason : .]

1/24/2006 1:17:29 PM

iram

1/24/2006 1:38:34 PM

thanks!

Ordered one.

Now just need to put the ram in it

Wonder if it'll work with vista.

Edit: Shit, just noticed it only works with gigabyte boards.

Cancel order ... damnit

[Edited on January 24, 2006 at 2:04 PM. Reason : .]

1/24/2006 1:58:46 PM

^ have you ever beta-tested an OS before?

1/24/2006 2:08:06 PM

tres cool

1/24/2006 2:34:25 PM

eraser,

the "beta" test I'm doing is on the production release of Vista. The purpose of the test is to "break in" the support staff in India and get a basic knowledge base started so when the product hits the shelves, MS Support isn't charging out the ass for support and seeing shit for the first time.

That being said, this will "probably" work, but I'm not putting any money down until the memory size gets bigger. I want to put XP and BF2 on it at the same time.

1/24/2006 2:57:34 PM

Quote :

"I see these things on cell phones before computers if they are small enough."

as DG said, you're really missing the point, as well as the big-picture. Yeah, everyone knows that Flash is a logical fit for cell phones and gadgets. That's why it's already there. But there never were hard drives on cell phones, nor a reason for a large capacity.

But with laptops, hard drives have been a major weak point for years. 1) They are considerably smaller (in capacity) than their desktop counterparts making it difficult until recently to use a laptop as a "desktop replacement" if you have media and stuff. 2) they use a ton of power, relatively, in a laptop, draining the all too precious battery. 3) They are fragile and subject to failure, especially considering laptops are supposed to be mobile and, hopefully, durable.

When we can use Flash drives that equal the capacity of a moderate laptop, the benefits will be huge. Lighter overall, significant power saving, faster access to data, faster boot up (getting closer to the mythical 'zero-boot time' PC - also useful for desktops).

And yes, they will be "small enough". Notice that the article notes the 4GB iPod Nano uses 16 2Gb chips - you see how small the nano is? Now if you look at the numerous Nano dissection articles, you'll see that there are actually only 2 Flash chips in a 4GB Nano (and 1 in a 2GB). So the article mis-states that there are 16 2Gb chips - it should actually say there are 16 2Gb die, 8 2Gb die in each chip, to make 2 2GB chips. Assuming they are correct that Apple uses the 2Gb dies, then Samsung is doing a hell of a job at successfully stacking 8 die in one chip. If they can get their 8-high stacking (or side-by-side, however they do it - the chips are quite large, so the dies are likely tiled in there someone before stacking) to work with the newer 16Gb chips (or even quad-stacking), then they would have up to 16GB per chip. Put just 4 Flash chips of that capacity in one laptop and you have the equivalent of 64GB hard drive that weighs maybe 30-40 grams and has a surface area of around 24cm^2 (minus the drive interface and circutry). Shit, if they go for chip stacking and mount 2 double-stacked chips on both sides of the PCB you have a 64GB drive in about a 1/4 of the volume of an iPod Shuffle.

1/24/2006 3:12:11 PM

^^ I can understand that. Beta OSes of any type usually have a lot of cool features that don't exactly work but they are fun to play with at least.

One of my favorite moments during the Windows 98 beta:

http://www.cnn.com/TECH/computing/9804/20/gates.comdex/gates.30.240.mov

Watching that makes my day better.

[Edited on January 24, 2006 at 3:15 PM. Reason : to Maugan]

1/24/2006 3:15:36 PM

Quote :

"you're really missing the point, as well as the big-picture. Yeah, everyone knows that Flash is a logical fit for cell phones and gadgets. That's why it's already there. But there never were hard drives on cell phones, nor a reason for a large capacity. "

Haven't read the full article(s) ... at work still, sorry.

I can see plenty of uses on cell phones for larger capacity hard drives ... the most immediate being storing phone books on them. In the future, I can see treating a normal cell phone similar to a Treo, everything voice activated and talk-to-text. Also, lets not forgot the side of the consumer market who will really enjoy having more MP3's and videos on their cell phone....

1/24/2006 5:15:20 PM