wasn't sure if this was discussed or not

but it's a big deal down there in washington, hyde, tyrell counties

I personally am opposed to it for various reasons
1)I don't like govt taking peoples land
2)it's not safe for our servicemen and women to pilot through thousands of migrating waterfowl
(there are enough lawn darts down east already without putting a landing field there)
3)I don't like the government destroying wildlife preserves when the field can be built elsewhere

http://www.northcarolinasportsman.com/printer_friendly.php?id=116

http://www.newsobserver.com/159/story/375989.html

http://www.newsobserver.com/159/story/280949.html

[Edited on June 21, 2006 at 2:32 PM. Reason : s]

6/21/2006 2:17:04 PM

<sigh>

NOT IN MY BACKYARD!!!!!

they have to train somewhere, people

6/21/2006 2:39:34 PM

yeah I know they have to train

but have you ever seen all the waterfowl over mattamuskeet?

thats not exactly safe for a plane

6/21/2006 2:43:26 PM

THEY COULD BE TURRIST DUCKS

6/21/2006 3:10:25 PM

they got bombs on their wings!!!!!!!!!11111111111111111111111

6/21/2006 3:12:00 PM

Quote :

"The Navy’s highest officials, however, have said they still are focused on the Beaufort-Washington site and are basically ignoring 4th Circuit Court of Appeals rulings and a federal judge's decisions ordering the service branch to seek a less-controversial site for the landing strip. "

it's nice to see that nobody is immune to the law.

6/21/2006 3:36:09 PM

if va beach city commissioners would get their stuff together, this air field can stay at oceana, and everyone will benefit

6/21/2006 4:40:57 PM

Except that a lot of people in VA Beach want Oceana gone.

People always bitch about the sound of the jets, etc.

This field has to go somewhere and if the choice is between Va Beach where there is some wealth, aka political clout, and eastern NC where people are largely uneducated and poor, well, the airfield will be here in NC.

I don't agree with it because some of the people in the discussed areas in NC have had family farms there for generations.

6/21/2006 6:06:10 PM

Quote :

"This field has to go somewhere and if the choice is between Va Beach where there is some wealth, aka political clout, and eastern NC where people are largely uneducated and poor, well, the airfield will be here in NC."

If this is true, I find it hypocritical that a town and region that has benefited tremendously from the defense industry is putting the boot to the the local airfield.

6/21/2006 6:46:47 PM

Oceana had the best bowling alley in the City... between that and the women, it almost makes me miss my hometown...

almost

6/21/2006 7:07:41 PM

Always with the NIMBY

6/21/2006 8:13:42 PM

Quote :

"Except that a lot of people in VA Beach want Oceana gone. People always bitch about the sound of the jets, etc. This field has to go somewhere and if the choice is between Va Beach where there is some wealth, aka political clout, and eastern NC where people are largely uneducated and poor, well, the airfield will be here in NC. I don't agree with it because some of the people in the discussed areas in NC have had family farms there for generations. "

The problem I find with this is that the airfield was there first. The Navy warned Va beach that they were developing wayyy too close to their crash zone, and Va beach commissioners basically ignored them. The people that are complaining about the noise of jets and whatnot have only va beach to blame for their predicament. If oceana does leave, it will be a huge mistake for va beach's economy. I totally 100% agree with you though about not putting it in nc, because of the fact that those farms have been with those families much longer than the Navy was ever formed. Keep Oceana where it is, tell the people to stfu, and we can all live in peace

6/21/2006 8:28:41 PM

I think some of ya'll are misunderstanding what the OLF is. It is not going to be the Master Jet Base, that is still going to be Oceana. The OLF is simply a training field in a rural area that the pilots can practice carrier landings and stuff without endangering all the houses and so forth that you have encroaching on Oceana.

So basically, the OLF is not going to be anybody working there. Folks are not going to be moving out there. The jets will still be based in Oceana NAS and just fly to the OLF and do touch and goes and so forth where they do not have all the houses and people to worry about endangering. This is just a support field for the master jet base.

[Edited on June 22, 2006 at 11:16 AM. Reason : ]

6/22/2006 11:15:48 AM

i don't see why they can't improve fentress, it's been doing the job of a touch and go air field for a long time. Dang retirees wanting it to be quiet when they moved in next to an active military base/airfield.

6/22/2006 11:49:56 AM

Every time someone calls us with a noise complaint, I always remind them "You ever wonder why your house is tens of thousands of dollars cheaper than a similar house in Cary?"--Click.

[Edited on June 22, 2006 at 12:04 PM. Reason : .]

6/22/2006 12:04:28 PM

They can already use Fentress. Virginia Beach wants to have all the economic development from the squadrons but don't want the noise. We offered to host the squadrons at Cherry Point, but Sen. Mark Warner and the Virginia contingent got them stationed there. They want all the good parts and none of the bad. Too me that sounds like a rather dickhead move.

Also given the fact that the location along a prime migratory bird route means that the field will be ununsable for training for over half the year due to the extreme bird strike risk outside of Pocosin Lakes National Wildlife Refuge. This is nothing but idiot congressmen pushing uneeded excess military spending on a wasteful undeeded project to satisfy real estate developers and other unscrupulous characters. If Virginia doesn't want the squadrons, then Cherry Point would love to have them. You can't have it both ways.

6/22/2006 12:06:15 PM

^
small correction: John Warner is the Republican Senator from VA. Mark Warner is the Democrat Governor.

It does make me chuckle that the Virginia Beach City Council actually thinks they'll be able to use the land Oceana now occupies if it's shut down though. The federal government will never give that land up -- and even if they did, the EPA will never let normal developments go up there w/o spending some massive $$$ on environmental cleanup.

Municipal officials can be profoundly arrogant, it's quite entertaining... 

6/22/2006 12:14:16 PM

oops thats what I meant John Warner. hehe

I wrote a 30 page paper on this that was supposed to become my Masters thesis, but it fell through. I might have it still sitting around.

6/22/2006 12:22:38 PM

So one group of people that knowingly moved to an area where there was preexisting jet noise now want it gone just so the jet noise can be imposed on people that knowingly moved to an area where there was no preexisting jet noise.

Yeah, sounds about par for the course.

6/23/2006 8:41:33 AM

I was one of the interns with the US Attorney's Office for a long time on this case.... you wouldn't believe the amount of work (ie: expenses) that also surrounded this on the litigation end of things either... this case used to drive me NUTS!

7/2/2006 11:34:10 PM

bttt by request

2/27/2007 8:51:30 PM

for anyone who doesnt know, the navy released a "new" environmental impact statement. doesnt take anything into account.
the lt gov and governor have finally said something about this.

even if the navy decides to go ahead this will be in court again.
and everything pwrstrkdf250 said in the first post is still a valid reason to oppose it.

2/27/2007 9:27:45 PM

NC wanted those squadrons... we would have gladly accepted them at Cherry Point, But Sen. John Warner of VA wanted those squadrons in VA Beach so they could have the economic development associated with it.

This field is nothing but a half a billion dollar waste of money to appease real estate agents and developers in VA Beach that sell to a market that encroached the existing outlying landing field, Fentress Field. The Washington County site is almost useless half the year because of birds. VA gets all the economic benefits and NC gets all the negative externalities (noise, pollution, decline of tax base).

Its wasteful government spending, driven by economic and economic racism. The Navy admits by its own inventory that there is no need for as new field.

2/27/2007 9:33:59 PM

The fact that every politician in North Carolina isnt working their ass off to oppose this is absurd.

2/27/2007 9:43:13 PM

Quote :

"I personally am opposed to it for various reasons 1)I don't like govt taking peoples land 2)it's not safe for our servicemen and women to pilot through thousands of migrating waterfowl (there are enough lawn darts down east already without putting a landing field there) 3)I don't like the government destroying wildlife preserves when the field can be built elsewhere "

I'm from Washington County and practically no one wants the OLF there, except one or two of the county commissioners. If they do end up going through with this, a lot of people will have to move and be out of a job, seeing as how most of the land they are trying to get is farmland. Obviously farming is HUGE in our area. I don't think it's right to build one here when the people that moved near Oceana knew what they were getting into when they moved there.

2/27/2007 9:49:22 PM

the whole envirnonmental thing with the birds makes it absurd, everyone is just slapping the navy in the face telling them this but they are too god damn stupid to listen, and I like that comic, Burr and Dole are nothing but tools of the republican party, I dont think either one of them has EVER voted out of party lines or opposed anything that could even be closely considered conservative. The whole situation is frustrating.

2/27/2007 9:56:50 PM

thats the point though, no matter what party you belong to there are reasons to oppose this. some of the most outspoken critics early on were CSE, which is about as libertarian as any group of Republicans gets. Then the biggest congressman behind the opposition is Butterfield, who is a pretty standard liberal democrat.

2/27/2007 10:00:22 PM

The environmental thing with the birds is an entirely NIMBY slag. I bet those people get up in the morning and say "these birds are too damn loud".

I'm from Havelock, my house lines up perfectly with one of the runways for MCAS Cherry Point. And nothing is better than your house shaking cause the pilot of a C-5 up above realizes he's short on final and hits the throttle. Seriously though, I can care less cause after awhile I got used to it. I just stop talking when a Harrier goes over and then start talking where I left off 5 seconds before without even realizing it sometimes.

[Edited on February 27, 2007 at 10:25 PM. Reason : .]

2/27/2007 10:23:05 PM

it is crazy loud though. but im moving out near oceana so who cares.

2/27/2007 10:50:24 PM

yea, the birds are a nimby excuse for ordinary people, but what about the nature conservancy and bird loving groups, environmentalists, etc; not to mention I believe the birds in question are endangered, maybe im wrong.

2/27/2007 11:46:48 PM

New Navy Study Has Changed Nothing in OLF Battle
http://www.wral.com/news/local/story/1215681/


Navy’s SEIS Release Admits Birds in the Way
http://www.northcarolinasportsman.com/details.php?id=377

about the bird thing, do you people know how much a swan weighs?

There are hundreds of thousands of LARGE waterfowl in the area, everyone of them a potential disaster with a jet

2/28/2007 8:42:05 AM

One reason they want Washington county is because its not populated. They want it to be dark where the pilots are landing with no markers such as lights to help guide the planes. If they want to move the base to NC that would be a good thing for that Area. Like betsy said there isn't much there but farm land. I think its wrong that we get stuck with the noise and no benifit. I live in between Washington and VA Beach I don't want to hear more planes. North eastern NC might be poor but damn it we are people too. The damn landfill if Camden county's own fault they want the trash for some economic growth in there county.

2/28/2007 9:04:42 AM

Quote :

"Like betsy said there isn't much there but farm land."

That farmland is also people's livelihood... their entire life. It's not fair to them to take that from them just because the people in VA Beach don't want it anymore. Yes, the area is definitely not very populated, but there are reasons...

1- family farms - lots are HUGE 5,000 acres plus
2- state parks around the two lakes
3- refuges

those alone take up lots of land in the tri-county area. not saying these are the only reasons not many people live there but it's certainly part of it.

2/28/2007 9:23:36 AM

Betsy I am not saying they should take it. I am against it. If they do want to put a landing strip there then they should move the whole base and squadren down there. Yeah it will suck to loose the farm land but those people cna be trainned for all the new jobs that will be needed with the population boom that would come. They will not do that so I don't think you have to worry with that. I know little old Creswell can't handle the noise. Yall can fight it as hard as you want to. Eventually if the government wants it bad enough they will just take it. That's why they are the government. They are here to screw you over.

2/28/2007 9:31:09 AM

who cares about the noise and its effects on the birds.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sT9LwfK8MZ8

2/28/2007 10:45:41 AM

exactly


there are already enough potential lawn darts down east


quit blowing our taxmoney, endangering our pilots, endangering our residents, endangering our wildlife for this bullshit

2/28/2007 1:31:38 PM

The Navy could solve this if they moved the super hornet squadrons to NC. We already have an existing underutilized OLF (Atlantic Field) in the area that could be used as well. To hell with Virginia! The people down east would love to have these squadrons.

http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/facility/atlantic-olf.htm

2/28/2007 1:36:35 PM

yep


and yeah, there is an OLF on bogue banks that they already use (sometimes, I've yet to see major activity there and I am next to it almost every weekend in the summer)

2/28/2007 1:40:20 PM

Quote :

"The Navy could solve this if they moved the super hornet squadrons to NC. We already have an existing underutilized OLF (Atlantic Field) in the area that could be used as well. To hell with Virginia! The people down east would love to have these squadrons."

The area and the base can't handle them. When those original plans came to the fore some years ago, the businesses were the main ones pushing for the squadrons to come, the Cherry Point military leadership was not.

Besides, Morehead City and New Bern are becoming heavily infiltrated with carpetbaggers and I wonder what those new residents will think. It is a very rapidly changing area as far as demographics and these new (northeastern) residents are affecting the area already. Atlantic Beach (the city) residents, for example, are pushing for Atlantic Beach to become a private beach and have no public access, something which I find unthinkable.

[Edited on February 28, 2007 at 2:22 PM. Reason : .]

2/28/2007 2:21:36 PM

private beach in nc? fuck those people

2/28/2007 3:07:19 PM

Sounds like your typical country ass arguments - "he's a liar" "admiral #6" blah blah blah. I delt with the same kind of shit on grassroot political issues such as highway widening and historical districts growing up near Greensboro. Country ass people are afraid of the government and change, plain and simple. They don't care if it is for their own benefit, the benefit of the military, or whatever. I'd bet a good bit of these people are of the yellow-ribbon-on-car variety...they support our troops until it impacts them.

I lived in the flight path of oceana (right under the final turn from a northern approach) for 2 1/2 years - it really isn't a big deal at all. Just don't talk on the phone outside when they're coming in.

2/28/2007 3:29:25 PM

you're pretty wrong and making assumptions


so you think it's safe for our multi-million dollar pilots to fly multi-million dollar aircraft (that the tax payers paid to train and build) through an area thats always been noted as the premeire waterfowl location on the east coast?

I don't want our pilots crashing for no reason and I damn sure don't want jets falling on someones head because the Navy was dead set on appeasing the Virginia Beach populace.

It's like me moving to Goldsboro and bitching that F-15's are flying over my head

2/28/2007 7:22:29 PM

fuck the government man, its like they dont even care about the bird refuge, I hope a flock of these birds all drop massive shits all over the cars of the bastards at the navy that wont let this shit go

3/1/2007 12:02:13 AM

Quote :

"fuck the government man, its like they dont even care about the bird refuge"

They don't even care about you or me, what makes you think they care about a bunch of birds?

3/1/2007 8:57:27 AM

true, my statement still stands:

Quote :

"I hope a flock of these birds all drop massive shits all over the cars of the bastards at the navy that wont let this shit go"

3/1/2007 5:07:25 PM

If i remember correctly the navy also tried to get away with not doing an environmental assessment and other protocols that are required to build something that massive.

They thought those folks would just give up and do nothing to stop them.

3/1/2007 11:20:34 PM

Heres some OLF information for those interested, one of the better chronicles of the events

http://www.albemarlecommunity.net

also http://www.noolf.com



[Edited on March 2, 2007 at 2:34 PM. Reason : .]

3/2/2007 2:32:53 PM

^^if its on govt land i dont think the govt has to do an Environmental Impact Statement...but I guess that wouldnt be the case here since its not already govt land?

3/2/2007 2:37:46 PM

they always have to do an environmental impact statement. no matter what.

3/2/2007 10:50:22 PM

well technically everyone who buys land should do a environmental land site assesment. It covers your but if something is wrong on the property. If you buy land without doing that and something is wrong on it then you have to pay for it.

3/5/2007 9:05:44 AM