After hearing what he's said, I think it would be better for Obama to be Muslim at this point. I've never heard such hateful things spoken by a "man of God." This pastor is no small connection to Obama... he married Obama and his wife and baptized his children.

The pastor claims that America lied about Pearl Harbor and 9/11 and that the government is lying about inventing HIV to create a genocide of black people...


This will hurt Obama, if not bring him completely down.



[Edited on March 14, 2008 at 7:01 PM. Reason : .]

3/14/2008 6:35:02 PM

i dont get how this is all coming out now...you'd think he's never ran for public office before or something...if he and/or his pastor is so bad, how did he get elected in the first place?

3/14/2008 6:38:04 PM

the same way that bill clinton was able to hide all of his activity with women... the process of campaigning brings out all the demons you thought would never surface.


I personally do not know how Obama listened to this man for 20 years... I now know why michelle obama said that she's never felt proud of her country... she's listened to this insane batshit for 20 years... and if that's any indication of brainwash, I do not want Obama leading our country with hidden disdain for the country he's to be serving.

3/14/2008 6:42:30 PM

if he wins maybe he'll give his pastor a spot in his cabinet

3/14/2008 6:45:29 PM

McCain has the same problem, it just hasn't been publicized yet.

Shit, his reverend called for a holy war against ALL MUSLIMS - they have a word for that

GENOCIDE

3/14/2008 6:46:29 PM

^ if true, and although reprehensible, it is not the same as actively wishing for the demise of the United State of America and with the following quote being branded about, it is clearly evident this "pastor" is evil:

Quote :

"God bless America? No, GOD DAMN AMERICA!"

That one got me. Any part of me that was going to vote for Obama will never do so now.

3/14/2008 6:48:39 PM

is genocide anything like jihad?

3/14/2008 6:49:30 PM

And wtf... replace the word "black" with "white" and you'd find this page on the KKK website

http://www.tucc.org/black_value_system.html

Quote :

"THE BLACK VALUE SYSTEM Trinity United Church of Christ adopted the Black Value System, written by the Manford Byrd Recognition Committee, chaired by the late Vallmer Jordan in 1981. Dr. Manford Byrd, our brother in Christ, withstood the ravage of being denied his earned ascension to the number one position in the Chicago School System. His dedication to the pursuit of excellence, despite systematic denials, has inspired the congregation of Trinity United Church of Christ. Prayerfully, we have called upon the wisdom of all past generations of suffering Blacks for guidance in fashioning an instrument of Black self-determination, the Black Value System. Beginning in 1982, an annual Black Value System – Educational Scholarship in the name of Dr. Byrd was instituted. The first recipient of the Dr. Manford Byrd Award, which is given annually to the man or woman who best exemplifies the Black Value System, was our brother, Dr. Manford Byrd. These Black Ethics must be taught and exemplified in homes, churches, nurseries and schools, wherever Blacks are gathered. They consist of the following concepts: 1. Commitment to God. “The God of our weary years” will give us the strength to give up prayerful passivism and become Black Christian Activists, soldiers for Black freedom and the dignity of all humankind. 2. Commitment to the Black Community. The highest level of achievement for any Black person must be a contribution of strength and continuity of the Black Community. 3. Commitment to the Black Family. The Black family circle must generate strength, stability and love, despite the uncertainty of externals, because these characteristics are required if the developing person is to withstand warping by our racist competitive society. Those Blacks who are blessed with membership in a strong family unit must reach out and expand that blessing to the less fortunate. 4. Dedication to the Pursuit of Education. We must forswear anti-intellectualism. Continued survival demands that each Black person be developed to the utmost of his/her mental potential despite the inadequacies of the formal education process. “Real education” fosters understanding of ourselves as well as every aspect of our environment. Also, it develops within us the ability to fashion concepts and tools for better utilization of our resources, and more effective solutions to our problems. Since the majority of Blacks have been denied such learning, Black Education must include elements that produce high school graduates with marketable skills, a trade or qualifications for apprenticeships, or proper preparation for college. Basic education for all Blacks should include Mathematics, Science, Logic, General Semantics, Participative Politics, Economics and Finance, and the Care and Nurture of Black minds. 5. Dedication to the Pursuit of Excellence. To the extent that we individually reach for, even strain for excellence, we increase, geometrically, the value and resourcefulness of the Black Community. We must recognize the relativity of one’s best; this year’s best can be bettered next year. Such is the language of growth and development. We must seek to excel in every endeavor. 6. Adherence to the Black Work Ethic. “It is becoming harder to find qualified people to work in Chicago.” Whether this is true or not, it represents one of the many reasons given by businesses and industries for deserting the Chicago area. We must realize that a location with good facilities, adequate transportation and a reputation for producing skilled workers will attract industry. We are in competition with other cities, states and nations for jobs. High productivity must be a goal of the Black workforce. 7. Commitment to Self-Discipline and Self-Respect. To accomplish anything worthwhile requires self-discipline. We must be a community of self-disciplined persons if we are to actualize and utilize our own human resources, instead of perpetually submitting to exploitation by others. Self-discipline, coupled with a respect for self, will enable each of us to be an instrument of Black Progress and a model for Black Youth. 8. Disavowal of the Pursuit of “Middleclassness.” Classic methodology on control of captives teaches that captors must be able to identify the “talented tenth” of those subjugated, especially those who show promise of providing the kind of leadership that might threaten the captor’s control. Those so identified are separated from the rest of the people by: 1. Killing them off directly, and/or fostering a social system that encourages them to kill off one another. 2. Placing them in concentration camps, and/or structuring an economic environment that induces captive youth to fill the jails and prisons. 3. Seducing them into a socioeconomic class system which, while training them to earn more dollars, hypnotizes them into believing they are better than others and teaches them to think in terms of “we” and “they” instead of “us.” 4. So, while it is permissible to chase “middleclassness” with all our might, we must avoid the third separation method – the psychological entrapment of Black “middleclassness.” If we avoid this snare, we will also diminish our “voluntary” contributions to methods A and B. And more importantly, Black people no longer will be deprived of their birthright: the leadership, resourcefulness and example of their own talented persons. 9. Pledge to Make the Fruits of All Developing and Acquired Skills Available to the Black Community. 10. Pledge to Allocate Regularly, a Portion of Personal Resources for Strengthening and Supporting Black Institutions. 11. Pledge Allegiance to All Black Leadership Who Espouse and Embrace the Black Value System. 12. Personal Commitment to Embracement of the Black Value System. To measure the worth and validity of all activity in terms of positive contributions to the general welfare of the Black Community and the Advancement of Black People towards freedom. "

3/14/2008 7:11:08 PM

yep...heres the link the the church's website http://www.tucc.org/

i brought it up a couple of times a few weeks ago and it fell on def ears, at least as far as Obama supporters

3/14/2008 7:18:44 PM

Quote :

"In an interview with a Pittsburgh newspaper, Obama personally addresses the revelations that Obama's pastor said "God damn America": Q: I don't know if you've seen it, but it's all over the wire today (from an ABC News story), a statement that your pastor (the Rev. Jeremiah Wright of Trinity United Church of Christ on Chicago's South Side) made in a sermon in 2003 that instead of singing "God Bless America," black people should sing a song essentially saying "God Damn America." A: I haven't seen the line. This is a pastor who is on the brink of retirement who in the past has made some controversial statements. I profoundly disagree with some of these statements. Q: What about this particular statement? A: Obviously, I disagree with that. Here is what happens when you just cherry-pick statements from a guy who had a 40-year career as a pastor. There are times when people say things that are just wrong. But I think it's important to judge me on what I've said in the past and what I believe. The fuller context of Wright's quote is here. In a 2003 sermon, Wright said: "The government gives them the drugs, builds bigger prisons, passes a three-strike law and then wants us to sing 'God Bless America.' No, no, no, God damn America, that's in the Bible for killing innocent people. God damn America for treating our citizens as less than human. God damn America for as long as she acts like she is God and she is supreme."

http://tpmelectioncentral.talkingpointsmemo.com/2008/03/obama_i_profoundly_disagree_wi.php

3/14/2008 7:21:14 PM

Quote :

"I haven't seen the line."

yeah right

3/14/2008 7:26:15 PM

if MSM picks this up and actually plays the videos of him doing it, it coudl do real damage.

Obama tried to do some damage control today saying he is like the uncle you sometimes disagree with. I think that answer wont suffice with many. You cant pick your uncle, but can sure pick your preacher. Plus all his praise he draws from obama in his book. This one could stick if mainstream picks up the videos and doesnt try to deflect it.

3/14/2008 7:27:56 PM

^^ Obama didn't need to see it--he's supposedly been going to that church for twenty years! Did the good "Reverend" have special cleaned-up sermons on the days that Obama was there? I doubt it.

HE WAS RIDIN' DIRTY!!!1

^ Good point.

[Edited on March 14, 2008 at 7:29 PM. Reason : .]

3/14/2008 7:29:10 PM

What's so terrible about that black value system?

Of course, I don't see anything wrong with cursing America either.

3/14/2008 7:36:09 PM

I think the exclusive nature of it, and if reversed, would be derided as racist is my problem with it.



And your second point is telling...

3/14/2008 7:40:11 PM

Quote :

"I don't see anything wrong with cursing America either."

regardless of what you personally think, don't you think cursing america is a bad trait to associate with someone campaigning to be the leader of that same nation?

3/14/2008 7:41:42 PM

I suspect it's based on the assumption that blacks are oppressed by mainstream American society. I don't necessarily agree with all the details, but it makes plenty of sense in that context.

3/14/2008 7:42:15 PM

GOOD THING OBAMAS PASTOR ISN'T RUNNING FOR PRESIDENT

phew!!

3/14/2008 7:50:03 PM

You're missing the point... this is a man that speaks of obama countless times in his book, obama claims to have been influenced by this bastard... these are the things that raise legitimate questions in the minds of many Americans. Most Americans, maybe not on TDub, don't like it when people hate on America, claims America is equivalent to Al Qaeda, etc... and the connection between Obama and Wright are more than superficial.

3/14/2008 7:52:35 PM

good thing nobody bush associates with is president so they have no influence on what happens!

3/14/2008 7:53:13 PM

Quote :

"regardless of what you personally think, don't you think cursing america is a bad trait to associate with someone campaigning to be the leader of that same nation?"

Nope. Again, note the context. I want no leaders, but I'd love to see a president work to decrease prison populations and so on.

3/14/2008 7:53:51 PM

Quote :

"I want no leaders"

well nevermind then, forget i asked

3/14/2008 8:01:22 PM

BTW, Wright served on a advisory committee on Obama's campaign.



Obama is toast.

3/14/2008 8:07:23 PM

just an fwi

hannity and combs will be replaying this pastors only tv inteview that he did with them some time ago, and also, barack obama will be on hannity and combs to refute the claims....hannity just said hes not fit to even be a senator...i hope its a decent interview

3/14/2008 8:10:46 PM

looks like it's Hillary vs McCain

3/14/2008 8:29:40 PM

If it indeed does turn out to be Hillary vs. McCain (and its still early...) I wonder how blacks will vote...they've primarily been with the Democrats in recent history, but I wonder if all the attacks by Hil-Dog will turn any black voters off to Clinton and either make them consider voting for McCain or not voting...just thinking out loud as a white dude

3/14/2008 8:38:08 PM

The racism coming from Hillary's campaign bothers me a lot more than this.

OMG, folks only like Obama because he's black!!1

3/14/2008 8:54:24 PM

i thought before the 92 and 2000 elections that both Clinton and Bush would get elected simply for their camera presence and personality, regardless of policies and stances on issues

its not that far fetched that you'd see some feminists or just women in general voting for hillary because she represented them more than any typical white male candidate, and that some black people would vote for obama simply because they could relate to him more than some average white male candidate

but yeah, campaigning is vicious...i wonder overall what the effect will be of Obama and Clinton still going back and forth with negative ads, etc, while McCain has the nomination on lock and therefore doesn't have to dish or take too much fodder at/from other Republicans

3/14/2008 8:58:14 PM

^^^
they'll probably sit out like the fundies will do on the Republican side

[Edited on March 14, 2008 at 8:59 PM. Reason : ]

3/14/2008 8:58:43 PM

While it is fun to think that this will matter to the Obamaniacs I think that all ya all are getting a little ahead of the story at this point. Is what the pastor said reprehensible? Sure. Is it racist? Manifestly so. Has Obama repeated any of that tripe though? That is the question. Association may be enough for us since we already have immunity to his messianic aura, but it is hardly a smoking gun. These are things that another person who is a leader in his community has said. These are not things Obama has said, correct? I mean I have not read "The Audacity of Hope" ( title borrowed from the pastor ha ha) but I'm going to assume the O-man was smart enough to keep from publishing racist diatribes. Just guessing, no actually I'd put $$$ on it because Obama is the slickest politician I've seen for many years. Who knows, Obama may think everything the pastor says is garbage and he just likes the political connections the pastor affords him in the community.


All of this said, to make a comparison to McCain is absurd. McCain does not go to a church charged with racist mumbo jumbo. I believe what you are referring to is that some evangelical has endorsed McCain. This is a far cry from taking advice and maintaining a personal relationship over a period of years.

I mean if the Naked Cowboy says he likes Obama do I get to say that Obama is in favor of hillarious public semi-nudity? No?

Yeah, I thought not.

[Edited on March 14, 2008 at 10:06 PM. Reason : .]

3/14/2008 10:04:31 PM

dude, who cares what the pastor of the MESSIAH says...

3/14/2008 10:36:53 PM

Obama believes in change, change that looks towards the future, a future of hope and change, change and hope which we can believe in, Obama believes in change, change that looks towards the future, a future of hope and change, change and hope which we can believe in, Obama believes in change, change that looks towards the future, a future of hope and change, change and hope which we can believe in, Obama believes in change, change that looks towards the future, a future of hope and change, change and hope which we can believe in, Obama believes in change, change that looks towards the future, a future of hope and change, change and hope which we can believe in, Obama believes in change, change that looks towards the future, a future of hope and change, change and hope which we can believe in, Obama believes in change................

Yes we can!!!! Yes we can believe in hope, hope that is based on change, change that looks towards the future, a future that is filled with hope, hope that is based on change, change that looks towards the future, a future that is filled with hope, hope that is based on change, change that looks towards the future, a future that is filled with hope......

Yes We Can

3/14/2008 10:46:14 PM

maybe if you cut and paste that in every thread, it will be funnier.

3/14/2008 10:51:51 PM

HOPELESSNESS AND DESPAIR 08!

3/14/2008 10:51:51 PM

haha yeah really....the repubs act like john mccain would be so much better than barack obama...its like give me a fucking break....anyone with half a brain knows it would be so much better with him than mccain

3/14/2008 10:57:11 PM

Quote :

"I categorically denounce any statement that disparages our great country or serves to divide us from our allies," Obama said in his blog posting. "I also believe that words that degrade individuals have no place in our public dialogue, whether it's on the campaign stump or in the pulpit. In sum, I reject outright the statements by Reverend Wright that are at issue." --Barack Obama speaking at a press conference with Major General Scott Gration, U.S. Air Force, left, General Merrill McPeak, U.S. Air Force, and other military leaders from the United States armed forces Wednesday, March 12, 2008 in Chicago. Citing his judgment and ability to lead, admirals and generals from the U.S. Army, Navy and Air Force, that together have served under the last nine Commanders-in-Chief today announced their endorsement of Obama for president. (Associated Press)"

[Edited on March 14, 2008 at 11:01 PM. Reason : ]

3/14/2008 10:59:07 PM

So Obama is attacking a US Marine for being critical of the US now? What a douche.

3/14/2008 11:04:33 PM

Quote :

"Why didn't Obama explain to the public what Wright is talking about? Obama could have opened up an important dialogue with white people about the realities of Racist America. Reverend Wright was on target with most of these statements. I want a black presidential candidate who will take the issue of race to white people, not run away from it or talk around the subject like Obama always does. He keeps talking about hope and unity. Where's the substance? MLK talked about hope and unity, too, lofty ideas he understood must be accompanied by throwing racism in white people's faces."

http://wwsword.blogspot.com/2008/03/i-like-reverend-jeremiah-wright.html

Quote :

"This is not surprising, Obama is a Democrat and wants to be President of a deeply racist country which does not tolerate talk of its atrocities. But a historic opportunity is missed, as a black man clearly versed in the philosophy of black liberation, could explain to white America that the African American community still has grievances, that it still feels like the stepchild, that it is hard to be proud of America when you are black."

http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2008/3/14/171754/793/218/476765

3/14/2008 11:12:26 PM

^ Obama knows if he talked about being black, white people would freak out.

[Edited on March 15, 2008 at 12:01 AM. Reason : and he'd lost lots of votes]

3/15/2008 12:01:30 AM

Quote :

"haha yeah really....the repubs act like john mccain would be so much better than barack obama...its like give me a fucking break....anyone with half a brain knows it would be so much better with him than mccain "

care to explain why, DNL? you probably can't... After all, your name is...

DRUNK
N
LOADED

seriously. learn to actually think for yourself, then come back.

3/15/2008 12:14:56 AM

Wow....As a Conservative, I actually kinda liked Obama (as a good, likeable guy, not saying I would vote for him) but this is just rediculous. Obama is now claiming that he never heard Wright speak this way in the 20 years that he attended the church? Noo way.

3/15/2008 12:24:20 AM

see, Obama smoked marijuana, but he never inhaled. so it's all OK.

3/15/2008 12:25:08 AM

Quote :

"The pastor of my church, Rev. Jeremiah Wright, who recently preached his last sermon and is in the process of retiring, has touched off a firestorm over the last few days. He's drawn attention as the result of some inflammatory and appalling remarks he made about our country, our politics, and my political opponents. Let me say at the outset that I vehemently disagree and strongly condemn the statements that have been the subject of this controversy. I categorically denounce any statement that disparages our great country or serves to divide us from our allies. I also believe that words that degrade individuals have no place in our public dialogue, whether it's on the campaign stump or in the pulpit. In sum, I reject outright the statements by Rev. Wright that are at issue. Because these particular statements by Rev. Wright are so contrary to my own life and beliefs, a number of people have legitimately raised questions about the nature of my relationship with Rev. Wright and my membership in the church. Let me therefore provide some context. As I have written about in my books, I first joined Trinity United Church of Christ nearly twenty years ago. I knew Rev. Wright as someone who served this nation with honor as a United States Marine, as a respected biblical scholar, and as someone who taught or lectured at seminaries across the country, from Union Theological Seminary to the University of Chicago. He also led a diverse congregation that was and still is a pillar of the South Side and the entire city of Chicago. It's a congregation that does not merely preach social justice but acts it out each day, through ministries ranging from housing the homeless to reaching out to those with HIV/AIDS. Most importantly, Rev. Wright preached the gospel of Jesus, a gospel on which I base my life. In other words, he has never been my political advisor; he's been my pastor. And the sermons I heard him preach always related to our obligation to love God and one another, to work on behalf of the poor, and to seek justice at every turn. The statements that Rev. Wright made that are the cause of this controversy were not statements I personally heard him preach while I sat in the pews of Trinity or heard him utter in private conversation. When these statements first came to my attention, it was at the beginning of my presidential campaign. I made it clear at the time that I strongly condemned his comments. But because Rev. Wright was on the verge of retirement, and because of my strong links to the Trinity faith community, where I married my wife and where my daughters were baptized, I did not think it appropriate to leave the church. Let me repeat what I've said earlier. All of the statements that have been the subject of controversy are ones that I vehemently condemn. They in no way reflect my attitudes and directly contradict my profound love for this country. With Rev. Wright's retirement and the ascension of my new pastor, Rev. Otis Moss, III, Michelle and I look forward to continuing a relationship with a church that has done so much good. And while Rev. Wright's statements have pained and angered me, I believe that Americans will judge me not on the basis of what someone else said, but on the basis of who I am and what I believe in; on my values, judgment and experience to be President of the United States."

3/15/2008 9:27:10 AM

Quote :

"haha yeah really....the repubs act like john mccain would be so much better than barack obama...its like give me a fucking break....anyone with half a brain knows it would be so much better with him than mccain "

You still sound VERY undecided there drunkloaded. LOL

In all reality, this wont matter one bit to the obama supporters, but it will matter to alot of people. This isnt the reason why I think he is a disaster for POTUS, but this wont help he case with many. I saw him trying to say he has never heard the Rev. talk like this. LOL. I guess so many have believed his BS until now, he thought that would fly too. I guess he never heard ANY of the remarks this man has made over the last 20 yrs? Hard to believe. And someone running on his "judgement" ability should have gotten away from that racist POS rev. Maybe he agree with the rev, he is allowed. I just dont think it will carry well with the majority of the voting public.

Oh anyone remember the shit Bush got bc he SPOKE at Bob jones university? Bush spends an hour at a school that didnt allow blacks until 1971, and was against interracial dating and got skewered. Obama spends 20 years and praises this racist and no one should talk about it? Thats "judgement" you can trust.

3/15/2008 9:28:18 AM

Yes, let's keep on calling blacks who dare to resist racist.

3/15/2008 9:34:35 AM

Quote :

"Obama knows if he talked about being black, white people would freak out."

Seriously what would Obama know about being black in the terms that his pastor describes? He was raised by his white mother and grandparents in freakin' Hawaii, unless Hawaii is more gangsta thug than I've been led to believe.

With regards to this pastor, this is about the same as if McCain was taking spiritual advice from David Duke. And while the leftwingnuts will spin this and try to dismiss it as if it doesn't matter, imagine their fervor if this same kind of controversy centered around McCain.

3/15/2008 9:59:31 AM

How is this guy like David Duke?

3/15/2008 10:06:04 AM

so why should i vote for mccain over obama again? other than the whole staying in iraq forever thing?

3/15/2008 1:09:09 PM

^ because Colby is a racist.

I think it looks bad though that Obama threw his friend under the bus so easily, but I guess it had to be done.

3/15/2008 1:09:39 PM

Geez stalk much?

You wanna brand me as a racist? Prove it mother fucker.

Is it because I questioned your candidate's so called "blackness?" I'm willing to bet that your pasty ass lives by the glow of your computer monitor, so how the fuck can you either A) relate to the way black people live or B) dare think that Obama talks about being black that it'll freak white people out. Sounds like to me that you're the racist, Stan. I have news for you and you may find this shocking, but not every black person is a thug or from the ghetto or collects welfare.

[Edited on March 15, 2008 at 1:20 PM. Reason : Stan, what a douche dick name anyhow]

3/15/2008 1:14:59 PM