Quote :

" WASHINGTON (AP) -- Further evidence that times are tough: It now costs more than a penny to make a penny. And the cost of a nickel is more than 7½ cents. Prices for copper, zinc and nickel have some in Congress proposing steel-made pennies and nickels. Surging prices for copper, zinc and nickel have some in Congress trying to bring back the steel-made pennies of World War II and maybe using steel for nickels, as well. Copper and nickel prices have tripled since 2003 and the price of zinc has quadrupled, said Rep. Luis Gutierrez, D-Illinois, whose subcommittee oversees the U.S. Mint. Keeping the coin content means "contributing to our national debt by almost as much as the coin is worth," Gutierrez said. A penny, which consists of 97.5 percent zinc and 2.5 percent copper, cost 1.26 cents to make as of Tuesday. And a nickel -- 75 percent copper and the rest nickel -- cost 7.7 cents, based on current commodity prices, according to the Mint. That's down from the end of 2007, when even higher metal prices drove the penny's cost to 1.67 cents, according to the Mint. The cost of making a nickel then was nearly a dime. Gutierrez estimated that striking the two coins at costs well above their face value set the Treasury and taxpayers back about $100 million last year alone. A lousy deal, lawmakers have concluded. On Tuesday, the House debated a bill that directs the Treasury secretary to suggest a new, more economical composition of the nickel and the penny. A vote was delayed because of Republican procedural moves and is expected later in the week. Unsaid in the legislation is the Constitution's delegation of power to Congress "to coin money [and] regulate the value thereof." The Bush administration, like others before, chafes at that. Just a few hours before the House vote, Mint Director Edmund Moy told House Financial Services Chairman Barney Frank, D-Massachusetts, that the Treasury Department opposes the bill as "too prescriptive" in part because it does not explicitly delegate the power to decide the new coin composition. The bill also gives the public and the metal industry too little time to weigh in on the new coin composition, he said. "We can't wholeheartedly support that bill," Moy said in a telephone interview. Moy said he could not say whether President Bush would veto the House version in the unlikely event it survived the Senate. Sen. Wayne Allard, R-Colorado, who is retiring at the end of the year, is expected to present the Senate with a version more acceptable to the administration in the next few weeks. The proposals are alternatives to what many consider a more pragmatic, but politically impossible solution to the penny problem: getting rid of the penny altogether. "People still want pennies, which is why we're still making them," Moy said. Even Treasury Secretary Henry Paulson acknowledged in a radio interview earlier this year that getting rid of the penny made sense but wasn't politically doable -- and certainly nothing he is planning to tackle during the Bush team's final months in office. In 2007, the Mint produced 7.4 billion pennies and 1.2 billion nickels, according to the House Financial Services Committee. Other coins still cost less than their face value, according to the Mint. The dime costs a little over 4 cents to make, while the quarter costs almost 10 cents. The dollar coin, meanwhile, costs about 16 cents to make, according to the Mint."

5/9/2008 1:12:05 AM

100 million?


since when has 100 million been a lot of money anyways? we spend that in less than a day in iraq

5/9/2008 2:18:50 AM

Do we honestly need to mint that many coins anyway? Who here doesn't have at least $20 worth of change in their house? Honestly, I think there's probably plenty of metal in circulation right now that if they didn't produce more we'd probably be ok. Now, I don't have any statistical evidence to back that up, but with the continued decline in the use of cash for transactions and the monumental amount of coin already floating around I bet we could at least cut way, way, way back.

5/9/2008 6:40:52 AM

or just get rid of fiat currency










(wtf duke? you're losing it, man -- one photo of a shoe and you lock the thread? -- you fucking idiot -- fuck you)

5/9/2008 9:25:39 AM

Quote :

"since when has 100 million been a lot of money anyways? we spend that in less than a day in iraq"

way to stay on topic....

This is low hanging fruit. It should be an easy fix and should save us 100 Million a year. Good! Lets do it, and invest every nickel (pun intended) into energy resources or some other fiasco.

5/9/2008 9:57:32 AM

Am I the only one who is a little uncomfortable with the idea of making fiat currency of an even less valuable material? I understand the gold standard thing has long since been thrown away... but if the penny costs more than a penny to produce... Doesn't it seem like the problem is with the overall management of the currency? Not with the striking itself?

5/9/2008 10:04:09 AM

^
Great point.

The US dollar has lost over 95% of its purchasing power since the Fed. Reserve took control of it.

If you bought something for $100 in 1913 (the year the Fed Reserve took control of the currency), that same item today, just from inflation, would cost $2123.

Good job Fed.

5/9/2008 10:30:15 AM

if they got rid of pennies, people would loose faith in the money and the dollar would fall further.

If you have a problem, throw money at it. That'll always work. right?

5/9/2008 10:36:33 AM

[Edited on May 9, 2008 at 10:39 AM. Reason : nm found it]

5/9/2008 10:39:40 AM

Google: Freedom to Fascism


... and open your eyes.

5/9/2008 11:52:24 AM

There have been message boards for a few years dedicated to hoarding pre 1983 pennies (now worth about 2.5-3.0 cents each). They have invented machines that can run several 5000 count bags very quickly and seperate pre 1983's. Some people on these boards are hoarding tons and tons at a time by buying bags at there bank and then taking the junk (post 1982 back to free coin counters). I've seen 50.00 dollar bags of pre 1983 pennies going for 65-70 on ebay recently.

Melt Value vs. Purchasing Power

http://www.coinflation.com/

[Edited on May 10, 2008 at 5:20 AM. Reason : .]

5/10/2008 5:16:47 AM

Watch 60 Minutes' video about this issue:

http://60minutes.yahoo.com/segment/141/pennies

5/10/2008 5:30:00 AM

It is, however, illegal to melt coins into their aggregate metals.

The entire 'invest in pennies' movement, from my understanding, exists on the belief that at some point in the future it will no longer be illegal to do this.

5/10/2008 3:22:20 PM

I think it probably rests on the belief that by the time melting the pennies down is a viable way of maintaining your riches, it won't matter if it's illegal, because you're on your way out and opening a swiss bank account.

5/10/2008 9:33:34 PM

5/11/2008 8:32:11 AM