Specific questions:

shmorri2:
I haven't taken any pictures, here's one from the dealer lot the morning that I bought it:


Quinn
Yes, 911s (actually almost all Porsches) don't come with an LSD standard. I would say they don't need one unless you want to get sideways on power. Some would argue that it dilutes the driving experience, and adds understeer. I agree with this to some extent though I do think the latest crop of Porsche LSDs with very limited lock up under power (that's where the dual stage comes from) and very heavy lock up under braking works great. Factory race program agrees with me, as they've had clutch type dual stage LSDs since the late 90s. Even on track I think it's most noticeable under heavy braking. I wanted a 911 with an LSD, and probably would not have bought one without though, and it's a rather rare option.

1in10^9:
As you see above, it is a 996. I like a lot of things about the MK1 design (like the weight, friend's stock car came in under 2900lbs), but I bought one because I can't afford a $40k MKII model and at $40k I would've been tempted to spring for a GT3 for just a bit more anyway.

dannydigtl:
It appears to have not been loved by it's last mechanic. Check engine light on (looks like a mass air flow meter, code takes a few days to come back), windshield washers/horn don't work, missing rear sway bar and a few under body plastic panels, hazard light switch. I think that's all that remains, I've fixed a few things already, I have roughly 10 hours in the car so far. It's actually a very clean car. Realistically, I probably couldn't be happier. Of the 9 or so 911s I've driven hard, I'd say this is easily one of the best.

General;
Over the last few years as I started riding/talking to pro drivers and driving friends', working with students that had 911s, I had started wanting one. I enjoy driving them immensely on track, but I don't want to push somebody else's car as hard as I would my own. I would not have bought this car, as I already had the M3 and the WRX but it was too good of a deal to pass up. It will be sad to let the m3 go cause I really like how it's set up now, and drives great, or the WRX because I have yet to put it on track, and it's such a cute fun little car. Unfortunately, now I'm in debt and HAVE TO let at least one -but probably both- go.

Anyway, it's got a few options that I really wanted like the LSD and decent sounding stereo, a bunch of options I don't care for or mind (like silver metal door sills, silver color matched gauges, etc.) and it's also void of any really stupid crap like partial faux carbon fiber steering wheel or the like. Anyway, the mods include suspension/short shift kit, tune, fabspeed exhaust (promptly coming off, and I intend to pocket some $ by switching to the stock exhaust, which is not obnoxious unlike what's on there) and an intake as well as wheel spacers, etc. It appears to have more, but I just picked it up a few days ago and haven't had a chance to go over it yet.

1/20/2009 12:25:47 AM

whats the chassis code on that

1/20/2009 12:34:31 AM

very nice, congrats. enjoy new ride, but keep the m3.

1/20/2009 1:40:52 AM

Congrats on the new car!

I am a HUGE fan of the 911, but I honestly can't stand the 996

1/20/2009 2:22:57 AM

a poorly maintained, modified porsche sends shivers down my back. hope it works out well for you though, you've talking about them non stop since damn high school. i still say you shoulda gone for a c5z or coupe even.

1/20/2009 7:17:45 AM

Looks awesome man. Glad to see you finally got what you want (for this month ).

Can i have the /// now?

1/20/2009 8:09:04 AM

Quote :

" (for this month )."

Man, I know how that goes.

I foresee a 911 in my future as well, but I think I'll hold out and buy a 997, and probably at least an S, if not a GT3 or Turbo. However, that means it'll be a few more years for me. No matter, there are a few more cars to check off the list in the meantime (M3, C6...)

Congrats on the new Porsche, though. I'll see you at VIR and CMP in a few months.

1/20/2009 8:27:21 AM

Thanks peoples.

As for the "other Porsche vs. 996", it's a lot lighter/more powerful than a 993, while having less lift and less drag, on a stiffer chassis, and generates more grip. It feels better too, and to my eyes, looks better. I admit a 993 twin turbo is a sweet car, but I'm not at all interested in an AWD Porsche, not that I could afford one...

The C5z is undoubtedly a faster car, but I really like the driving challenge a rear engined car poses. The C5z is not as lively in comparison. However, I still appreciate the Z and wouldn't mind one someday.

I had been talking about 944 turbos in high school. I actually did not like 911s at all, I thought they were overpriced and over hyped until I started spending time in/around them on track. I won't attempt to explain it's dynamics any further, however I sincerely have an open invitation to anyone to come check it out, particularly on track, just PM me.

It's modified, but appears to be a very solid car. I certainly would not have bought one if I didn't think so. Still, parts are very expensive, labor is sky high, and they can have major issues (but then so can every other car I'd been interested in). That concerns me, but you gotta pay to play. Almost all of my good friends that do track events have moved to them, between us there's 5 examples, I know guys that specialize in them, as well as dealer mechanics, etc. Just Saturday a mechanic at the Leith dealer did perhaps a couple of $100 worth of work for free, while we chatted about his Porsche and some of the salesman. I've been a club member, and active in track events for a little over 10 years now, it's about time. :p

As for "flavor of the month", for a multitude of reasons, I'm not "excited" by it. My Subaru takes the cake for the most surprisingly fun to drive car. I mean that. Putting the 911 where you want is close to the satisfaction of getting a math problem right. The Subaru is still work to drive fast (more than I expected, in fact), but the 911 takes concentration. It's exhausting, but you smile the whole way through.

Note to duke; the MKI 997 is not much improved over an MKII 996. A modified 996 drives a lot like a GT3. I was not interested in a U.S. spec suspension 996. Honestly, as I've been saying, I would suggest you just drive one, it's unbelievable how light AND communicative the steering is, how firm the brakes are. There's literally less than half an inch of free play on the brake pedal. No other car I've driven lets you get into threshold braking so quickly and stay there from 140+ all the way down to 30mph or so. However when not moving fast, they can be a bit grabby. You may not like it, a lot of people don't. I didn't like them until I drove one either, at all. There's also the image. People are either nice letting me in traffic/giving right of way, etc. or come up and want to race, drive very close... Mine cost less than a Toyonda Camcord which certainly doesn't raise an eyebrow, and people still assume things. The e36 M3 does strike a nicer balance though, nobody cares that I drive it hard either. I'm still the guy that orders water when eating out, and won't buy a new pair of boots for 10 years, I'm -C-H-E-A-P.

BTW, as usual the factory seats SUCK, and I don't have the $ to remedy that for a while.

1/20/2009 11:13:58 AM

Oh, if I intended to get a 911 right now, it would be a 996...but in a few years when I'm more likely to do it, I'll have more money, they'll have depreciated some more, and I won't be deployed all the time, so I'll have an easier time convincing myself to drop some cash on a car...so I expect it'll be a 997 C2s or C4s.

Right now, I'm spending too much time overseas to spend 911 money, and I live in eastern NC. There aren't many good roads, anyway. Plus, there are at least a couple more cars that I just have to own, and it only makes sense to own them in order of ascending price.

1/20/2009 12:53:37 PM

Nice, congrats!

1/20/2009 1:28:31 PM

yeah they're lighter and better handling than the 993 but it looks like a Japanese version of the 911...

but who am I kidding I'm still jealous. hope its well sorted!

1/20/2009 1:53:53 PM

you're a brave man to buy one modded

1/20/2009 2:06:08 PM

Well the 996 kind of IS the Japanesified version of a "911", but it was the only way to move forward, LONG LIVE HONDA! It's certainly not as "raw" as an earlier example, but then that's what cars do. I think the noise to useful feedback ratio is even better though. Again, this is personal, and to each his own.

You call me brave for buying this car, how'bout driving it today w/out full coverage? Yea, I'm retarded but I freely admit to this (my agent hasn't been at work since last Friday). In any case you act like an exhaust, short shift kit, intake, tune, suspension etc. is actually "modified", it's a normally aspirated car with 70k miles... Remember, I also own a 200+k mile WRX that actually is modified. THAT was a gamble, turned out alright so far though it is proving to be tough to sell.

1/20/2009 3:08:34 PM

i like how the 996 feels waay better than the 993 turbo

the 993 felt like it was floating in the front end at 70+mph, not inspiring very much confidence

but i have very limited time in porsches

im a definitely a honda guy

nice car though

1/20/2009 3:12:20 PM

Quote :

"my agent hasn't been at work since last Friday"

you need to get your shit setup so you can do changes online--More than once I've added a car to my insurance from my phone as I was about to drive it home

1/20/2009 3:17:48 PM

haha, i've added to them to my policy from my phone WHILE driving them home.

1/20/2009 3:42:15 PM

I'm sure I've done that too. The worst was almost making it home and getting pulled and them not believing me I had insurance on it and they basically said tough shit and called a tow truck. $140 tow for a few miles. I was pissed.

1/20/2009 4:00:06 PM

Meh, I called my agent from the DMV line one time and he told me I was automatically covered on any car I bought for up to 30 days after I bought it.

1/20/2009 4:19:26 PM

Your coverage is liability only for the 30 days (and I think state minimum liability at that) before you officially add a car. I used to add cars over the phone, but w/my driving record the current policy is pretty convoluted, and I'd rather go in person to do it. Besides, I'd just love to drop one of the other cars before doing so. My multi car discount's pretty miniscule on a 3rd car.

1/20/2009 4:25:32 PM

Good info. I still wouldn't worry about driving home from the DMV, but I can understand worrying on days like today.

You have a WRX wagon and you chose to drive the 911; what gives?

[Edited on January 20, 2009 at 8:23 PM. Reason : l]

1/20/2009 8:23:18 PM

To get going from a dead stop, the WRX does do better, but the 911 really gets around just fine. Besides, it's more fun. I'll take the WRX out shortly in search of a parking lot. I've been dying to get it out in the snow also.

Oh, and I'm not the only dumb one, Jordan met me @Tangerine cafe w/his e90 M3:

1/20/2009 9:01:36 PM

VERY nice Ahmet. Congrats. I hope the car treats you well.

1/21/2009 10:00:01 AM

yah, my car's stayin parked with 6" of snow on it for now

sure, I can drive

it's the other idiots / gawkers to worry about

1/21/2009 12:22:00 PM

damn you, i'm wasting time looking at 911s for sale now, without any real intention of buying one.

1/21/2009 1:46:08 PM

^i'll go pick one of those up/use it untill you return too.

1/21/2009 2:00:50 PM

^ haha, I need to figure out how to buy partial shares of a car, kind of like people do with airplanes--let someone else have a 1/3 share of something awesome--he could use it when I'm off in suck-ass 3rd world countries, and I'd have it when I'm home.

i bid on one on eBay...but it was like a 20k bid or something for a 996 GT3.

<--high bidder, but reserve not met.


looking around, I bet I could get a nice 996 with 75k miles or so for about $20k. I thought for a few minutes about bidding $20k on a clean, lower mileage 996, but I don't know...would I rather have that than an E46 M3 for, say, $16-17k? Considered in a vacuum, maybe. Probably. the M3 is a car I've had in my sights for a while, though, but they were always more expensive than I thought they were worth. They're finally getting reasonable in price, though, and if I don't get one now, I'll probably never get one. The Porsche can wait, and then I'll get the one I really want.

[Edited on January 21, 2009 at 2:14 PM. Reason : speaking of airplanes, that's another thing that could throw a wrench into my sports car outlook]

1/21/2009 2:12:02 PM

look hard and you can find a decent milage 996 for less than 20k

1/21/2009 2:23:22 PM

oh hell, now look at what you've done.

My goal is to score an M3 for $15k...if that turns out to be unattainable, and I can indeed find a good 996 for less than $20k, I'd give serious thought to dropping another kilobuck or two for the Porsche.

1/21/2009 2:26:53 PM

You should go drive one, really. You may not find anything special about them. I didn't like them at all for quite some time, and actually was rather underwhelmed w/a bone stock US spec suspension example.

1/21/2009 3:02:11 PM

They're night and day from an M3, but an M3 is OK without mods, the 911 really isn't IMO. It's also not quite as comfortable, certainly not as quiet, etc. It's a lot more personal though.

$20k ought to do it, but don't stretch to buy the car either. I'd say with LSD, decent lights (no orange crap), and perhaps not the base stereo, you're looking at $22-24k ish for a decent deal unless something way unorthodox pops up. Same w/the M3, except you don't need rare options, they're all cool. I'd budget $17k ish, but hey look at the market, the bottom has dropped out of everything. "Waiting" generally makes financial sense, but you live once. Tough call.

Let me know if you want any comparisons between the two, I have oh so much to make. I think the M3 would take better to sitting aside, and is likely not to cost as much to own either. I have more connections than I know what to do with, that makes owning any car easier for me, for now. I may be moving for a job in the future though, so who knows what then...

1/21/2009 3:08:23 PM

yeah, my buddy has the 19x10's on the back of his

those 315's aren't cheap and dont quite last as long as you'd like either

1/21/2009 3:31:41 PM

nice car. let me drive it next time i'm up. I've never driven a porche before

wow, i see Jordan's biz is working out well for him. Which is a bit surprising, but i good i guess from my one experience with Mpowered. I wanted a couple bottles of a specific diff fluid to break in my new rebuild with. I called and he confirms he has it. I drive all the way out there. Wups, he doesnt actually have it and tries to sell me something else. Then he said he'll go pick some up and call me when its in. He never called. I have no plans to go back.

Fortunately i got some off a friend later that day.

1/21/2009 5:09:49 PM

Yeah, I'm sorry you've had a bad experience with Jordan. He's been pretty cool to me, and I've seen him go out of his way to help somebody out (he had some sway bar mounts delivered to VIR for me on a Saturday). He's lent me cars, and we switch occasionally (the e90 M3 is quite the impressive machine). The shop has worked out well for him, he's got great mechanics working over there, and seems to be building a customer base.

The 911s proving to be something else. It's eye opening the exit speeds it attains on regular road tires, just pushing to 85%. I cannot wait to take it on track. It's killing me not to have it fully sorted, gotta sell some cars dang it. I'll keep this updated.

1/22/2009 12:33:00 AM

good grief people
does it really take that much effort to get the snow off your roof?

1/22/2009 3:24:50 AM

what do you use to remove the snow that wont scratch the roof?

1/22/2009 8:14:51 AM

im not touchin the snow on my roof

1/22/2009 10:43:17 AM

Did anyone see that pretty 911 Cabriolet sitting all crooked in the grass on Wade Ave. past the arena? I was like "That snow way to treat a 911!"

[Edited on January 22, 2009 at 2:12 PM. Reason : s]

1/22/2009 2:12:14 PM

Ahmet, or whoever...you have any hookups on rebuilding or installing a reman engine in a 996? There's a clean 996 on eBay located in Troutman, NC. It's a '99 model with 50k miles, on a no-reserve auction with 1 day remaining, currently at ~$8400.

for that matter, do you know how much it would cost to rebuild/replace it? I figured prob $10k or so, but maybe I'm being a pessimist. For the right price, I'll snatch that sucker up, have my Dad drive over with my gorilla-truck and trailer, and tow it to a shop...have myself a shiny new Porsche waiting for when I get home.

1/22/2009 2:54:46 PM

I would LOVE to help you out, if you decide to go this route. I should also add, if you try to find a good deal on one with a broken engine or trans I would look for an 02+ car, just to make the headache worthwile. Those are greatly improved over MK1 cars (99 through 01).

That said, this particular car (other than being red/tan) can't be test driven since it needs an engine, and it's already at $9+k. It appears that it may need a shifter base, as the shifter looks like it's sitting too far back for 2nd gear). Could be a sign of a car that was driven hard, or not, who knows. I think your $10k estimate IS pessimistic, -could probably have it done for around $8k if no surprises arise- but you could buy one that you can test drive for $18k. Like I said, I would budget $22k or so if you want a 996. This is an incredible price, considering what other Porsches (or other exotic-ish cars $20k will get you). You run the risk of catastrophic failure, but if that off chance doesn't hit you, they're supposed to be rock solid.

As far as your e46 vs. 996 thing, the e46 is a fun drive, but it drives more like a large vehicle you pilot around and as long as you're cool with the disclaimer "for it's size and weight" it drives great. Steering feel is second IMO only to a 911. For my comments regarding a "stock" 996, the U.S. spec suspension is VERY soft, and it's raised from the RoW (that stands for rest of the world in Porsche speak) as well. Shocks, springs, sway bars are all modified. The way they were shipped here is not acceptable IMO, sport suspension is a necessity, as a bare minimum. Also, keeping up a car that sold for $80k is a different proposition than an e46 m3. For example, you can't get each headlight for less than $6-700 used for a xenon unit. Not as bad as an e90 m3 w/a $5k+ headlight, but it's no e36 or Corvette either.

If you have specific questions comparing the 911 to something else, feel free to ask. Here's a general observation, it has high HP and relatively low torque coupled with strong rearward bias gives you amounts of grip that are hard to believe when applying power out of corners. It can also understeer heavily on corner entry, and depending on set up mid corner, or when on throttle. It really is a challange to drive fast. Steering is fairly quick though, and the chassis communicates so well. The front and rear respond to bumps and input at different rates. Some find this disconcerting, this is one of the reasons I suggest you DRIVE ONE (do it darn it) before thinking you'd like the car... Even with the rear sway bar disconnected, the car can oversteer. It's intuitively kept in check for me, but this is NOT like the M3. Also, when the car gets sideways, especially if the yaw increase rate is fast, it's takes a bit more room to keep it in check, or worse. I think I remember a quote talking about how "a favorite pass time of mine was watching stock brokers drive their new 911s up light poles" from Top Gear.

Child seats should fit fine in the rear. The 911 will feel more like your Evo than a Corvette, regardless the generation. Keep in mind, even a 997 doesn't make as much power as a C5. If you need that much power, the 996 is not your car, but it does weigh ~2900lbs. I look forward to putting mine on track regardless, I think the corner speeds it achieves are ridiculous, especially on exit, and how hard you can brake. Steering/brake feedback is just un real.

1/23/2009 6:53:23 AM

yeah, with the auction at $9500+, it's not so appealing. If I could be all set up and ready to go with a fresh-motored 996 for $16k, it would make it worth my while to buy it without test driving it and go through the trouble of getting the engine fixed. At $20k or close to it when all is said and done, I'll pass.

[Edited on January 23, 2009 at 7:45 AM. Reason : it seems inconceivable that a 911 could drive even slightly similarly to an Evo]

1/23/2009 7:44:56 AM

My comments regarding the 911 driving more like the Evo refer to it's sharpness, not it's dynamic behavior at the limit.

Are you in Raleigh nowadays? What are you driving btw?

1/23/2009 8:00:05 AM

ah, gotcha. yeah, those were the two things that made the Evo my favorite car to flog so far...the razor sharpness and the cartoonish ability to hang on at its very high limits no matter what you did. You could have either or both ends sliding, tires howling, wheels spinning, at 2.5 times the advisory speed for a corner, and feel completely in control.

I got stationed back in NC last summer, then promptly headed out the door to Al Asad, Iraq. I'll be back in NC in early April, probably living in New Bern. At the moment, my only 4-wheeled vehicle is a 1995 Ram 2500, but I'll sell that when I get back.

1/23/2009 8:42:58 AM

[Edited on January 25, 2009 at 8:35 AM. Reason : psi]

1/23/2009 7:23:29 PM

hahaha i like how they all got serious when he started accelerating on the straightaway

1/23/2009 7:59:23 PM

Oh my this car is SO insane. I can see why so many people wreck them all the time. So I finally put the rear sway bar on, +lots of chassis bracing back there, and jeez it's SO tail happy. It takes GOBS of steering input to keep it pointed in the right direction. This is not a car I would want my mother driving, it dares you to come in hard. Scratch what I said about corner exit grip being immense, at least in the wet. It did SO much better w/out the rear sway bar, grip wise. I should remember this if I run wet sessions on track...

1/24/2009 1:09:22 AM

Why exactly is it that you don't like C4s? Is it mostly a matter of being a Porsche purist? Does it significantly degrade steering feel and feedback? I always figured that adding AWD to a 911 would retain most of the endearing qualities, while domesticating it enough that it wouldn't be out to get you quite as much.

1/24/2009 3:08:56 AM

^Doesn't only like 5% of the power go to the front wheels? Because then, having that 5% probably wouldn't make THAT much of a difference on the track (if not hindered from the added overall weight of the vehicle). I believe the awd is more helpful in dramatic weather conditions than on the track, but I could be wrong.

[Edited on January 24, 2009 at 8:19 PM. Reason : .]

1/24/2009 8:18:38 PM

because porsche + complexity + rarity = $$$$$$$

1/25/2009 12:11:43 AM

Well I wanted a 911 mostly because of it's dynamics. The AWD dilutes those IMO, but the C4S is actually slightly faster on track than a regular 911 (but it also comes with modified aero, a few different suspension bits, wider track, etc.). The torque distribution is 5% under no slip, but can go up to 35% I believe.

Anyway, that's taking a 911 in the wrong direction I think. If I could've found one w/center console +sunroof delete, I would've bought that. Am I making sense? If you want a predictable car, well I don't think the 911 is it. It takes a lot of effort to get more than 7/10ths out of the car IMO. I can honestly say I wouldn't recommend it if you don't want to work to drive fast. Hmm, seems like you're going to have to drive one at some point doesn't it? :p

1/25/2009 2:07:13 AM

Well, it doesn't have to be as idiot proof as my Evo was, but I don't want a car that makes me look like a WORSE driver.

I was aware of the wider track. That seems like a plus. It sounds like the C4 is a better sports car all around, but you just like the C2 because it requires the maximum from the driver. I'm ok with an involving sports car, but I think I'd really prefer the nastier habits to be subdued a little, especially if it doesn't really significantly degrade the good qualities.

and yes, I will definitely have to drive your 911 as soon as I get the chance and get you to let me behind the wheel. I'm pretty sure that it's gonna be an M3 this time around, though, unless I find a deal on a 996 that I absolutely cannot walk away from.

1/25/2009 1:09:20 PM