I searched around but couldn't find an appropriate topic to drop these questions in...

We're looking to buy my wife a used RAV4 or CRV between '06-'08 and I was curious to get a few opinions. Is it worth the cost to spend $2-3k more to shave off ~20k miles? From my perspective, that could be another year or two the car could be running. There are many on the market in the 40-50k mile range, and fewer under 20k miles.

Additionally, anyone have any opinions regarding 4/6cyl and 2/4WD? Weight vs power vs extra $$ spent. We don't need to tow anything.

Limiting snarky comments about better vehicles would be nice, she's pretty set on a RAV4 or CRV.

k thx!

2/8/2010 9:50:21 PM

E30 M3

2/8/2010 10:17:55 PM

^snarky

2/8/2010 10:20:15 PM

obviously E30 M3 isn't a viable alternative, but the reality is that there's almost certainly something better suited for your needs, and it's almost certainly a car, not a stupid "crossover" SUV that pretty much sucks at everything.

2/8/2010 10:21:50 PM

You really should read this article if you're considering the Rav4 and the CRV. I own both a Honda and Toyota, but in that category I'm pretty sure what I'd choose between the two. http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/comparisons/10q1/terrain_vs._cr-v_rav4_tiguan_mariner_outlander_forester_grand_vitara_-comparison_tests

2/8/2010 10:23:13 PM

^^she wants something she can step down out of and i want something bigger & safer for her than her current Echo. RAV4 & CRV have great reliability & safety ratings, and she likes the look of them.

I guess I'm mostly interested in opinions on where the best value comes in with money vs miles. Is it worth it to buy a toyota or honda with less than 20k miles, or should I expect them all to last us over 200k and not really need to worry about a paltry extra 20k?

^thx Skack, definitely a good read... unfortunately we can't afford new...makes me think harder about getting a 6 cyl RAV4 perhaps.

[Edited on February 8, 2010 at 10:37 PM. Reason : .]

2/8/2010 10:26:18 PM

http://raleigh.craigslist.org/cto/1590832701.html

http://raleigh.craigslist.org/ctd/1587206813.html

http://raleigh.craigslist.org/ctd/1558964463.html

http://raleigh.craigslist.org/cto/1555937822.html



http://raleigh.craigslist.org/cto/1558322308.html

http://raleigh.craigslist.org/ctd/1576859748.html



http://raleigh.craigslist.org/cto/1592093079.html



http://raleigh.craigslist.org/ctd/1591649315.html

http://raleigh.craigslist.org/ctd/1560391270.html




http://raleigh.craigslist.org/cto/1590194703.html




I can't, for the life of me, understand why anyone would ever buy a CR-V or RAV-4, or really any other "crossover SUV". The CR-V and RAV-4 don't do any car-things as well as a car, and it don't really do any truck/SUV things at all, other than handle minor snow if you get one with AWD (still no reason to get one, as you could just get an AWD car...or a good car and a beater truck/SUV).

[Edited on February 8, 2010 at 10:42 PM. Reason : ^ yeah, buying new is kinda silly anyway, 99.999% of the time]

[Edited on February 8, 2010 at 10:42 PM. Reason : but whatever, you're the one paying for it and stuck driving the damn thing]

2/8/2010 10:41:18 PM

what's your budget? Generally, I'd rather spend 2-3k extra for a 20k miles one. When you get to the higher mileage car, you're getting near the major maintenances such as timing belt/water pump, etc...

2/8/2010 10:50:37 PM

^^i appreciate the sentiment Duke... I'll never stray from a car personally, but our goal is to get something she wants to drive.... and that is a crossover SUV. She's not down with any of the sedans you posted

sooooo, lets just say you're buying a honda or toyota. do you pony up a few extra grand to shave off 20k miles?

^ thx hgtran... ideally ~17k... up to 19k maximum perhaps?

[Edited on February 8, 2010 at 10:52 PM. Reason : .]

2/8/2010 10:51:51 PM

i personally would get the oldest one i could, so that it would die as soon as possible, at which point i could get something different.





if for some crazy reason you have accepted the fact that you're stuck with it, and actually intend to drive it, on purpose, I'd say it depends on the age/mileage that you're talking about to begin with. there's a difference between 5k/25k and 105k/125k for a $2-3k price difference. It also depends on the warranty and the maintenance schedules.

[Edited on February 8, 2010 at 11:05 PM. Reason : but again, i cannot stress enough how much i cannot fathom anyone buying either to begin with]

[Edited on February 8, 2010 at 11:06 PM. Reason : my God, the cars you could get for $17-19k that would be light years better]

2/8/2010 10:55:13 PM

if you're willing to go to higher miles, might as well go to this and use that saved money for maintenance.

http://raleigh.craigslist.org/cto/1589279485.html

2/8/2010 11:14:14 PM

yep, that's a better buy, in my book

2/8/2010 11:16:20 PM

How's buying an SUV with inferior handling safer than a car?



Eh, whatever. I'd go for something in the 20-40k mile range personally.

2/8/2010 11:35:01 PM

to answer your original question:

mileage only really matters if something happens to it or you are going to sell it

the more miles that are on it, the less you will get for it if something unforseeable happens (ie: tree falls on it in storm, accident, total loss...) or if you decide to sell it

so buying something with fewer miles makes sense

but if you don't care about resale value and put a million miles a year on it, get the one with the most miles and save your pennies for maintenance

2/9/2010 7:03:24 AM

thx guys, i appreciate the constructive feedback

i'd rather not push our budget either, so I think something in the 40k range mile wise may be best anyway... was just trying to convince myself completely.

and c'mon Duke, I could totally see you jammin' out in one of these:


[Edited on February 9, 2010 at 7:31 AM. Reason : .]

2/9/2010 7:30:43 AM

You shouldn't be taking this crossover shit lying down. Why does she want one? If she just want bigger, why only go so far as a small SUV? If she/you just want something safer, there are plenty of non-shitty options that will do everything infinitely better. I'm on-board for trying to make your wife happy, but in this instance she's insisting that you get something of very poor quality/utility per dollar, and on something you'll be stuck with for years to come. Take her to test drive some other, better stuff. Maybe she'll see the error of ways.

2/9/2010 9:38:57 AM

Quote :

"If she just want bigger, why only go so far as a small SUV?"

Maybe because thats the size vehicle that meets her needs without being grossly oversized? Bigger isn't always better.

Quote :

"she's insisting that you get something of very poor quality/utility per dollar, and on something you'll be stuck with for years to come."

You can't say that the CRV or Rav4 will be poor quality per dollar. These vehicles are known for quality. You can't argue being "stuck with it for years to come" either as these vehicles are known for their resale value. Utility arguments don't work simply because his wife's needs are probably vastly different than your own. Maybe it already has more utility than she'll ever use. In that case, why pay for extras you don't need?

Maybe you meant to argue amenities rather than quality. Amenities aren't everything though.

And lol at TheDuke pushing a bunch of Volvo, BMW, Mercedes and Audi vehicles. One of the beauties of a plain old Honda is that you buy it and it's dirt cheap to own from that point on. Apples to oranges.

[Edited on February 9, 2010 at 11:12 AM. Reason : s]

2/9/2010 11:09:53 AM

audi a3!

if your wife is hell bent on getting a crossover. you might as well test drive a kia sorrento to get a free gift card

http://2011sorentotestdriveoffer.cloudapp.net/

[Edited on February 9, 2010 at 11:40 AM. Reason : ]

2/9/2010 11:39:02 AM

My family bought a cr-v in 97 (first model year for you cr-v fanatics). Little brother still has it. I had it for a couple years. It sucked but it always ran. Weird thing is it was rear ended 3 times so far (lol). I was never impressed with the cargo room. Hell if a SO of mine really wanted a cr-v I would help her buy one. I've driven a lot worse cars and they are a breeze to work on.

2/9/2010 11:41:31 AM

i appreciate where you're coming from catzor, but I'm not seeing the poor quality vs dollar argument. Perhaps utility, because she isn't going to use it any differently than she would her old Echo. The poor girl has been driving a crap box for several years though. I don't have a problem with her getting a car she's excited to drive. What should she test drive that's bigger & better in your opinion? We're not interested in getting something that's ridiculously high in miles... and that seems to be what we'd have to sacrifice to fit a bigger & reliable vehicle in our price range.

Thx Skack, you're right on with your comments. Another thing my wife likes is good fuel economy (she's used to the Echo's), which is obviously tougher when you get into the bigger SUVs.

dub, i love me some audis... but an A3 won't be high enough off the ground for her, and she doesn't like wagons.

Quinn, sounds good to me



[Edited on February 9, 2010 at 11:46 AM. Reason : .]

2/9/2010 11:44:15 AM

I think what boggles the mind of most level headed people in The Garage as that crossover SUVs don't do anything well and yet people want them b/c they're an extra 6 inches off the ground.

Good handling? nope
Good cargo capacity? nope
Good gas mileage? nope
Good towing capacity? nope
Good off road capability? nope

2/9/2010 12:08:37 PM

Quote :

"I was never impressed with the cargo room"

Was that before or after it was rear ended three times?

2/9/2010 12:12:20 PM

I don't really need to tow anything or go off-roading or drag racing. A crossover's got way better cargo capacity than an Echo. (Think of all the groceries I could fit in there! ...) And better fuel economy than most anything with a SUV body-style. Call me shallow, but I just love the look of something SUV-ish, and I've got long legs, so stepping down out of a car is a priority for me.

Show me something with MPG close to or above 30 (that's not an expensive luxury hybrid suv) that's not CR-V or RAV4 and I'll be impressed.

2/9/2010 12:15:42 PM

^^

Hahahahah. Rear end magnet. I thought that treatment was reserved for scoobaru forrester drivers.

2/9/2010 12:32:45 PM

Quote :

"I think what boggles the mind of most level headed people in The Garage as that crossover SUVs don't do anything well and yet people want them b/c they're an extra 6 inches off the ground. Good handling? nope Good cargo capacity? nope Good gas mileage? nope Good towing capacity? nope Good off road capability? nope"

If you think you are going to convince a 20 year old female to buy a station wagon you are FAR from "level headed". Come on people! She aint buying no 6 year old german POS mom-wagon!

2/9/2010 12:38:35 PM

Quote :

"A crossover's got way better cargo capacity than an Echo"

You're kidding?!? Yeah, ANYTHING has better cargo capacity than a tiny sub-compact lol.

2/9/2010 12:52:51 PM

my point exactly. anything with better cargo than an echo, power locks, power windows and cruise control will be an upgrade.

2/9/2010 1:00:35 PM

there's a lack of logical thinking here...


anyway, good luck with your search.

2/9/2010 1:07:33 PM

why do you have to step down out of the new car?

how tall are you?

2/9/2010 1:23:57 PM

It's easier on my knees than stepping up out of a low-to-the-ground car. I'm 5'-9". It'd be nice to be in something larger and safer than a sedan. From what I've read, CR-V and Rav4 have really decent safety ratings.

2/9/2010 1:36:41 PM

any one else have thoughts on the best mileage to get in on for the $$?

2/9/2010 1:46:20 PM

lol

I'm 6'2" and both of my cars are quite low to the ground. I've got a reconstructed ACL and getting out of these cars is not a problem.

2/9/2010 1:51:21 PM

it hurts my knees to get out of a low car, especially in heels. idk what to tell ya.

i'd also just prefer to be higher off the ground. it'd be nice to feel more powerful on the road. i've been run off the road by a larger suv b/c the echo is tiny and fits really nicely in a blind spot...in a crossover, it'd be easier to see me.

i just have different priorities than you, it's ok.

2/9/2010 1:58:58 PM

stop driving in blind spots

2/9/2010 2:00:51 PM

passing other cars is the problem..
it's just not worth it to have the turning radius of a shopping cart sometimes. lol

2/9/2010 2:11:39 PM

i would personally choose a rav4 over a cr-v if i had to pick

and ive owned a cr-v and am an avid Honda fan

2/9/2010 2:23:58 PM

did homeboy post a budget in here?

2/9/2010 2:48:00 PM

he said 2006-08 honda or toyota small suv, not new

that's a ballpark

2/9/2010 2:49:17 PM

That comparo in this month's Car and Driver shows the RAV4 V6 to have almost equal gas mileage to the CR-V (with a 4 cylinder). Very impressive if you ask me.

I vote RAV4 if you can afford it.

2/9/2010 3:34:30 PM

^^^ Neuse, looks like 17-18k would be the upper limit

Yea Teg, we're definitely liking the 6 cyl RAV4.. I know I wouldn't mind the extra power when I occasionally end up driving it.... Plus they haven't recalled it yet!

2/9/2010 3:43:11 PM

I agree with duke on these crossovers, but I'll have to admit that the Rav4 my stepmom bought in 97 or so has been through hell and back. driven by a woman, towed things a 4-cyl was never meant to tow, marginally maintained, and is truckin at 250k+ miles on original tranny and motor

toyotas, man.

2/9/2010 4:55:02 PM

2 grand possibly but i wouldnt pay 3 grand 20,000

2/9/2010 4:56:52 PM

Question: Have you tried getting into some of the luxury sedans that can be had in your price range? You don't have to buy european, there's reliable japanese options available. Some of them, especially the larger ones, have a much more commanding view of the road and are easier to get into and out of than a tiny ass subcompact. They also have the added benefit of looking nicer, having better interior luxury features, and handling much better (especially considering that your driving style likely reflects the fact that you've been driving an echo around for a while).

It can be a serious shock switching from a zippy little compact to an SUV. It requires more care and attention while driving in bad road conditions and it is not safer to be driving an SUV in a situation where you could get into a wreck (your risk for a rollover after a collision is higher in any SUV, safety ratings be damned you will suffer a more severe injury in a rollover than you would if your car just whipped around in a bad accident). Your ride quality in an SUV will not be as good as the ride quality in a sedan. Your cost for fuel and tires will be the similar between SUVs and luxury sedans (depending on engine size, what type of tires you put on it, etc). The other thing about driving a car nicer than an echo is that you should have a handle just above the door to help you get out of the car if you require it to avoid injuring your knees.

It sounds a great deal like the justification for the SUV purchase here is "I think it looks pretty and I want a complete reversal from what I've been driving all my life", which I think neglects the fact that you could buy a sedan that is large, doesn't hurt your knees when you get out of the car, and gets better gas mileage than your SUV options. The worst thing possible is for you to put yourself $16k into debt and to realize, a few months later, that this car annoys you because it's not a car. At least go and give some bigger sedans a try.

2/9/2010 5:13:52 PM

It seems that the only real reason you are giving for wanting the CRV/RAV4 is that it is higher off the ground.

Your safety argument consists of problems with a blind spot. This has more to do with length of a vehicle than height.

2002 ECHO - 163.2 length (i don't know what year you had)
2007 RAV4 - 181.1 length
2007 CAMRY - 189.2 length

A car is almost always safer than a small suv, especially when considering accident avoidance.
You need to step back and take a look at your logic. Just because a taller car makes you "feel more powerful" doesn't mean you actually are. False sense of security.

2/9/2010 5:16:24 PM

Your rambling isnt helping answer the original question or give any feedback regarding either model. What exactly are you trying to accomplish? They have clearly said >5 times they dont want a car.

2/9/2010 6:15:21 PM

Quote :

"And lol at TheDuke pushing a bunch of Volvo, BMW, Mercedes and Audi vehicles. One of the beauties of a plain old Honda is that you buy it and it's dirt cheap to own from that point on. Apples to oranges."

A wagon would make perfect sense, here (and the enlightened among us know that wagons rock)...and the other thing was to show how nice of a car you could get for the kind of money they're talking about spending.

but at any rate, if that's what you want, then buy an Accord.


^ that's like you saying that you reaaaally want to eat a shit sandwich, and asking if it goes better with ketchup or mustard.

We're saying that you're better off with a cheeseburger.

[Edited on February 9, 2010 at 6:58 PM. Reason : ]

2/9/2010 6:45:21 PM

you can get a hell of a car for $17k

is you crazy?

[Edited on February 9, 2010 at 6:50 PM. Reason : this is like me trying to talk my sister out of a brand new cobalt. girls are dumb.]

i came across some great acuras for $17k-18k when deemarie was looking. ride is great and lots of luxury. they're (relatively) safe too.

[Edited on February 9, 2010 at 6:52 PM. Reason : afds]

[Edited on February 9, 2010 at 6:53 PM. Reason : by "relatively" i mean about as safe as a normal passenger car can get]

2/9/2010 6:47:26 PM

^^

No.. its like me saying I really want a shit sandwich does it matter if it was made by x or y. You come along telling me i should just eat a cheeseburger.

I'm best off with what I want.....a shit sandwich!

2/9/2010 6:53:49 PM

that's where i disagree (obviously).

I don't care what your reasons are, I'm not going to suggest that you eat a shit sandwich. If you were asking about philly cheesesteak versus a cheeseburger, that would be a legitimate question, but there's simply no reason to eat a shit sandwich, and what kind of advice would I be giving if I just told you to put mustard on it?

2/9/2010 7:00:41 PM

Lol at Duke's last couple posts.

Hey Heidi

Get the Rav4 V6, it is the better of the two.

2/9/2010 8:13:31 PM