Quote :

"What's on tap? Religion By Katie Liesener Globe Correspondent / November 16, 2008 A group of Boston University theology students were gathered at the Crossroads Irish Pub for their usual fish and chips last year when, caught up in theological discussion, someone suddenly asked: Why can't church be more like this? It was one of those wild propositions typically forgotten by morning. Except they followed through, designing a new kind of church to capture the authenticity they had felt. They welcome all to their services, but with a friendly word of advice: "Feel free to bring your own shot glass for communion." They're not kidding. This is the Pub Church: a weekly service held in a pub. Since April, the group has met every Saturday at 5 p.m. to celebrate the divine in a dive, welcoming Christians and non-Christians alike in a setting where notions of God flow as freely as the beer. "With pubs in particular, people feel they can come as themselves. You don't have to be or dress any particular way," said Xochitl Alvizo, 35, one of the church's founders. "We're affirming the potential sacredness of any place." For last weekend's service, that place was the back room of the Dugout, a college bar tucked below street level on Commonwealth Avenue. Amid dartboard and pool table, a harpist plucked a celestial flourish of arpeggios as the nine congregants bowed heads to sip their beers. At the center of their seated circle, a low coffee table doubled as their altar "for the sharing of resources" - cheese pizzas, a pitcher of Sam Adams Octoberfest and a church-shaped donation box for charity and the tab. Their service bulletins, slipped into upright plastic holders, looked vaguely like drink specials. Alvizo started the service by playing a Youtube clip of Barack Obama lauding the power of "one small voice." Then, from a leather couch, she initiated the conversational sermon: "What do we think of the 'one small voice?' " In the absence of rote ritual, anything could happen. In this case, a long, awkward silence. Gradually, people ventured ideas. "What I find to be most enriching in Christianity is the days you meet your opposite, that's what makes your world larger," said Marie Ramsdal-Thomsen, 27. "Even a conversation can be a revolution," responded Maggie Keelan, 24. Just as their communal sermon gained momentum, funk music blasted over their voices from a speaker overhead. For attendees of the Pub Church, these logistical challenges are still a welcome tradeoff for the psychological barriers many say they experienced in traditional congregations: coercive evangelism, hypocrisy, sexist liturgy, even rampant homophobia. The key to avoiding those pitfalls, they believe, is leaving services open to personal expression and group revision. "This feels more invested in people, more active, instead of sitting and watching a show, which is what church felt like," said Jaclyn Jones, 30. Bryan Stone, a professor at Boston University's School of Theology, sees this impulse as reflective of the wider culture. "Wikipedia is an example of this," he said, referring to a consensus-based online encyclopedia. "Everyone contributes to the truth rather than relying on something handed down by an authority." Indeed, a handful of other pub churches have sprung up independently of each other in recent years, mostly in the United States and England. One of the earliest, Holy Joes in London, has met since 1989. But whether Boston's Pub Church can help spark a newly liberated era, like the American Revolution that simmered in the city's taverns so long ago, is another question. Mark DeVine, an associate professor of divinity at Samford University in Alabama, identifies two strains of emerging churches, or congregations departing from institutional religion. One is evangelical, attracting outsiders to a particular faith; the other exists contentedly without dogma. He believes the latter, which includes the Pub Church, may fall victim to its own openness. "To the extent that they refuse to define themselves, they may fade away," DeVine said. "People don't invest their time, treasure and talents in something that has no goal, no mission, that's reducible to just a safe place to talk. It's a wonderful idea, but not the basis for a church." Still, the Pub Church mirrors some aspects of traditional worship. It is applying for membership with the Disciples of Christ and adopt recognizable Christian rituals, such as communion. Also, though they hoped to rotate pubs every week, they have found themselves as cozy at the Dugout as an evangelical in a favorite pew. Their service last Saturday concluded in relative sobriety (to be expected, after just 45 minutes) and spontaneous shouts of approval. Nearly everyone stayed afterward to drink and socialize. For Alvizo, this sense of community is essential to the dogging question: What is a church? "From a Christian perspective," she said, "church is the people who respond to God's good news." For the Pub Church, that's good enough. The only remaining question: What's on tap?"

may be [old] but couldn't find a related topic...

7/8/2010 9:56:58 PM

We're trying to start one here in Fayetteville. Most likely will start up toward the end of the year or January. We're pledging the first 50 pints are on us

And no pushy religion stuff, just hang out, question your faith, and chill with some normal people who love Jesus but won't ram it down your throat.

[Edited on July 8, 2010 at 9:59 PM. Reason : modeled after a church in ohio who has a brewery in their basement ]

7/8/2010 9:58:42 PM

to each his own

7/8/2010 10:00:42 PM

yeah I think I'd be much more prone to go to church like that, it would be a lot less intimidating to a non-churchgoer

I was wondering if there was something like this in Raleigh but couldn't turn up anything on google.

7/8/2010 10:01:10 PM

i think it'd be even less intimidating if they didn't call it a church. not that they can't or shouldn't, like the article said a church is just a collection of people.

sounds a little gimmicky i suppose, to draw such obvious attention to a twist of common perceptions of the word church

on the other hand, i do like the idea of open invitation where people can just talk about "church stuff". and i like the idea of having a few drinks while talking to people, so i can't complain too much about the idea

7/8/2010 10:06:56 PM

Apparently enough beer can even make god look more attractive.

7/8/2010 10:07:07 PM

I think that it is wonderful for people to openly question their faith and explore their relationship with God. However, I'd be uncomfortable with "pub church" replacing more traditional/organized forms of worship and study. But seriously, I think that it could be very enriching.

7/8/2010 10:07:49 PM

i feel like when i go out and drink with friends we already talk about religion (and other things)

so i don't really think a pub/church would be different for me except that instead of a bunch of people discussing theology it would be christians discussing christianity. which is fine, but not my thing. so it wouldn't encourage my attendance.

i wonder, too, if it would deter people like ^ who feel turned off by the non-traditional aspect of it. isn't that why there are non-traditional churches in non church buildings with bands and you dress casually, etc?

i think it could be encouraging for some people, though.

7/8/2010 10:17:09 PM

~5 years ago Vintage21 in Raleigh did a Theology on Tap at Mitch's on a Tuesday once a month - it was always great conversation i thought

7/8/2010 10:18:23 PM

I told you all that religion doesn't have to be bad -- it's just mostly been that way for the last few millennia.
It will evolve into many different and better forms, including atheist churches and object worship.

If this pub church trend continues, with perhaps even some bud churches, then damn... I might go.



also,
smc wins:

Quote :

"Apparently enough beer can even make god look more attractive."

[Edited on July 8, 2010 at 10:23 PM. Reason : ]

7/8/2010 10:20:43 PM

for anyone still in school, presbyterian campus ministry goes to mitch's on wed after their meeting

7/8/2010 10:24:46 PM

didnt read the article


but we've had these groups here for 4 years

[Edited on July 8, 2010 at 10:28 PM. Reason : called religion on tap ]

7/8/2010 10:28:01 PM

^ where do you have them around here, and by "here" do you mean Charlotte or Raleigh?

Quote :

"i wonder, too, if it would deter people like ^ who feel turned off by the non-traditional aspect of it. isn't that why there are non-traditional churches in non church buildings with bands and you dress casually, etc? "

I was baptized/raised Episcopalian (went to St. Timothy's-Hale a.k.a. St. David's in Raleigh) and I've always been turned off to non-traditional Churches but this approach seems nice because of smaller group settings and the informality of it. I actually don't like many of the churches I've been to outside of my school's church, for instance Faith (in North Raleigh) which was like a cult, and Crossroads (my Dad's church) in Cary to a lesser extent....

7/8/2010 10:36:16 PM

I didn't read the whole article, but the baptists would never stand for this.

7/8/2010 11:18:51 PM

Quote :

"~5 years ago Vintage21 in Raleigh did a Theology on Tap at Mitch's on a Tuesday once a month - it was always great conversation i thought"

Was there in 2004-2006

Do I know you?

7/8/2010 11:28:17 PM

Quote :

"Do I know you?"

potentially - I was friends with Hao (the guy that used to run ToT - maybe he still does) and we made a ToT spinoff that met once Sunday evenings over a few beers with some of the regulars

7/9/2010 11:42:22 AM