spending even more than congress planned to cut defense spending over the next 10 years.



Watch.

9/14/2011 9:27:55 AM

maybe if you didn't use so much money making baby-murdering machines

9/14/2011 9:30:27 AM

What is this I don't even

9/14/2011 9:35:19 AM

cuts should be made across the board.

starting with elected official's salaries and benefits. let them feel some pain that they so conveniently always get left without.

9/14/2011 9:36:30 AM

^^^
Like this?


Or like this?



[Edited on September 14, 2011 at 9:39 AM. Reason : ]

9/14/2011 9:38:01 AM

I'm thinking training, the F35, ship building, and furloughs for civilian workers will be the first on the chopping block

9/14/2011 9:42:25 AM

^^Honestly both of those are probably pretty cheap, and one is a minesweeper, so it actually helps saves lives.

Shredder was built off the Abarams chassis, so there was little new cost for R&D there, aside from the deployment system for clearing the mines by C4 on rocket propelled wire. They will probably never build more than a couple hundred of them, so this is a minor drop in the bucket. And its not a very effective offensive weapon as its only weapon is a 50 caliber machine gun to defend itself.

As for the Spectre Gunship, that is a pretty crude design honestly. Its based off a very cheap and proven airframe, the C-130, and basically just has and artillery gun and other weapons added to the payload area. They have some nice fire control systems and night vision, but the entire fleet of Spectre gunships ever fielded costs less than 1 B-2, and in the current combat situation, is a much better weapon to have around. I would trade a fleet of them for one B-2 when fighting Taliban insurgents.

9/14/2011 10:20:08 AM

Cool.

9/14/2011 10:24:55 AM

Well then

9/14/2011 10:26:43 AM

Nighthawk - 1
GrayFox33 - 0

9/14/2011 10:38:51 AM

BUT DEFENSE WINS CHAMPIONSHIPS

9/14/2011 10:45:12 AM

The best defense is a good offense

9/14/2011 10:49:45 AM

a good o-line helps the quarterback

9/14/2011 10:50:54 AM

The world's top 7 largest military budgets in 2010. Figures sourced from SIPRI[1]


sounds good to me

[Edited on September 14, 2011 at 11:18 AM. Reason : you're a talented guy, you'll find another job]

[Edited on September 14, 2011 at 11:18 AM. Reason : .]

9/14/2011 11:17:38 AM

motherfucker says a plane that costs $190M apiece is very cheap. there's nothing cheap about that, relative or not.

[Edited on September 14, 2011 at 11:20 AM. Reason : although i'm being a bit hypocritical, since the DOD funds my research.]

9/14/2011 11:19:27 AM

qntmfred, taking that graph at face value is like asking someone how much they weigh without asking how tall they are...then calling them fat.


You should consider the defense budget as it relates to GDP. Quite a different picture, no?

[Edited on September 14, 2011 at 12:28 PM. Reason : l]

9/14/2011 12:27:16 PM

stop being greedy EMCE

other people want some money too ok

9/14/2011 12:28:53 PM

Serious question: how much does this affect you, Jeff? Isn't this what your company does?

9/14/2011 12:29:48 PM

Quote :

" starting with elected official's salaries and benefits. let them feel some pain that they so conveniently always get left without."

This

9/14/2011 12:33:23 PM

^^ the industry as a whole is shrinking. aerospace and defense (yes, theyre tied) has been laying off tens of thousands of people in the past few years. That will continue. the workers that remain have to do more for less.

I think patreus is supposed to meet with the leaders of A&D this week to come up with a plan...


More specifically me, in a civil capacity, still feel the company wide pinch from the reduction in DoD budget

[Edited on September 14, 2011 at 12:37 PM. Reason : F]

9/14/2011 12:35:00 PM

Not sure what that has to do with elected officials

9/14/2011 12:37:06 PM

Quote :

"taking that graph at face value is like asking someone how much they weigh without asking how tall they are"

i think of it more like a rich kid buying a $1000 supersoaker to defend himself against the poor kids with neon green elephant squirt guns they got at Dollar General

just cus the rich kid can easily afford the supersoaker, he'd probably still be fine buying the $25 version


personally, i think it's a wiser use of our country's resources to help more people like yourself (and many other of my friends) use their education and skills to do things that build up our country

[Edited on September 14, 2011 at 12:42 PM. Reason : .]

9/14/2011 12:38:12 PM

9/14/2011 12:42:44 PM

and yes, these were the only squirt guns my family could afford when i was growing up



[Edited on September 14, 2011 at 12:44 PM. Reason : we didn't like it, but we made due]

9/14/2011 12:44:15 PM

I'm not so sure you fully understand how that budget is spent.

9/14/2011 12:44:22 PM

as qntmken has said: defense spending is relative to your enemies' defense spending, not how much money you can afford to spend on defenses. just don't cut ONR.

[Edited on September 14, 2011 at 12:45 PM. Reason : .]

9/14/2011 12:44:56 PM

Did they cut defense by accident when they were cutting degrass?

9/14/2011 12:46:31 PM

Sorry kid....research and development is the first to go

Followed by cybersecurity standards

9/14/2011 12:47:05 PM

haha I remember those squirt guns. I think you can still find them at the dollar store.

9/14/2011 12:47:28 PM

Its not like technology developed first for the defense goes on a helicopter and stays there for all eternity. Advanced tech from defense contracts can easily be applied (and sold) to civilian aircraft or otherwise like devices, or be used in methods completely separate from any military-esque application.

Same shit that applies to discoveries in space related funding can apply to defense spending. I'm looking at you, microwave

(Granted this pertains to research)

9/14/2011 12:52:55 PM

I'm just saying, almost all the examples given ITT ( buy jets, tanks, squirt guns, twinkies) would be included under procurement within the defense budget, which isnt even within the top two most expensive items. defense is far too often the fall guy.

9/14/2011 12:58:09 PM

that's a good point and i'd hate to miss out on that trickle down effect

but when it comes to how the nation spends federal money, what's more important? spending money on weapons to be used overseas? or spending money on programs at home that position us to be globally competitive in the future economy?

i know which one i think is smarter

9/14/2011 1:01:43 PM

^^ Right on. Defense spending as a percentage of GDP is as low as its been in decades. Military spending is not our problem. Yeah there are projects that need to be eliminated, but overall massive cuts like we went through in the early 90s would be a big mistake.



[Edited on September 14, 2011 at 1:03 PM. Reason : gh]

9/14/2011 1:02:49 PM

how come every other country in the world gets by without spending $700b on their military? just b/c it's not 50% of GDP like it was in WWII doesn't mean we're not overspending

9/14/2011 1:06:35 PM

http://www.pogo.org/pogo-files/reports/contract-oversight/bad-business/co-gp-20110913.html

Quote :

" Bad Business: Billions of Taxpayer Dollars Wasted on Hiring Contractors contractors [are paid] 1.83 times more than the government pays federal employees in total compensation, and more than 2 times the total compensation paid in the private sector for comparable services. "

9/14/2011 1:11:25 PM

Quote :

"how come every other country in the world gets by without spending $700b on their military? just b/c it's not 50% of GDP like it was in WWII doesn't mean we're not overspending"

I think America has the highest paid workforce with the most benefits...

These guys are getting housing allowances... marriage bonuses...child bonuses ON TOP of their good pay too.

Not saying they don't deserve it, but I am saying that the money adds up REAL quick.

9/14/2011 1:21:44 PM

^

Quote :

" I'm just saying, almost all the examples given ITT ( buy jets, tanks, squirt guns, twinkies) would be included under procurement within the defense budget, which isnt even within the top two most expensive items. defense is far too often the fall guy."

Or healthcare members and families, salaries, housing, testing, maintenance, research, blah, blah, blah.

9/14/2011 1:34:42 PM

I like how "defense" has become synonymous with "military spending."

Defense spending is money spent to actually protect the borders and the mainland.

Invading countries and nation building is not defense. It actually makes us less safe. That's what is costing us a ton of money. We shouldn't neglect national defense. We should put an end to policing the world.

9/14/2011 1:44:40 PM

Well, yeh, that's easy to say... but 9/11 happened and they brought the war to us and bush wanted to fight on their land and ruin their land before it gets to our land.

9/14/2011 1:48:46 PM

It's my understanding that homeland security, FBI spending, police, etc.... comes from a different bucket of money

9/14/2011 1:50:11 PM

If you really want to see the national defense breakdown there is a 250+ greenbook for public consumption..

9/14/2011 1:54:18 PM