I posted this in chitchat, but it was suggested I post it here because people won't be so rude.. and yes, I have posted this in multiple other advice forums before.

Here's some backstory. For those who are patient enough to read, thanks in advance! And if you don't want to respond something constructively, please don't respond at all. This is a pretty serious situation in my life, and I would really like some honest, thought provoking answers.

I am an Indian born American, brought to this country at the age of 7 by my parents. During that time, I have grown more and more distant with my family in India and my roots. About 3 years ago, I started dating a Palestinian man. It's good to note here that although he's Palestinian, neither him nor his family adhere to the religion of Islam-- this will come into play later on in my story.

Recently, 3 days ago, my parents found out about my relationship with him, and gave me the ultimate choice.. him, or them. Their reasoning for this is that he is a Muslim (he's not) and he will not gel well with my family back in India (whom I do not see or talk to, at all). My mother has even gone so far as to say that she will cut all ties with me should I choose to stay with him, and that we are as good as dead to each other-- she believes that me being with him will ruin her reputation, both with Indian families here and my family in India.

He is one of the most amazing men in the world, and he is one in a million. The way he treats me and looks after me is rivaled by no other relationship I've ever encountered within my family or friends, and I don't wish to lose that kind of a relationship. I believe that even if I search for the rest of my life, I may only be half as lucky to find someone as loving and caring as he is.

Now, the question I pose to you, and your understanding, eloquent audience is this-- what choice do I make? Do I simply give up the person who might as well be the LOVE OF MY LIFE for the sake of my family's integrity? Or do I stay with him in the hopes that my parents will come around to the relationship in the future? Will they come around? What are the chances of that?

10/4/2013 4:31:45 PM

Are you going to marry him and have kids with him? If so, dump your parents.

Hell, if it was me I'd dump them anyway for being assholes* but I don't have a close relationship with my parents myself. They probably won't come around but you have your own life to live without pleasing old folks.

*what kind of parents put a "him or us" ultimatum on their child?

[Edited on October 4, 2013 at 4:46 PM. Reason : .]

10/4/2013 4:37:32 PM

That's what everyone says.. and yes, I do plan on marrying him and having children with him. That was the intention from year 2 onwards, when I realized how happy he made me.

I am actually considering just leaving my house because of them being assholes.. and not even because of my boyfriend. I don't think I can live with values like that. Sometimes it's hard though, when you make a decision and no one else stands up for that decision with you, to think that you're right.

10/4/2013 4:51:10 PM

Quote :

"Sometimes it's hard though, when you make a decision and no one else stands up for that decision with you, to think that you're right."

sounds like EVERYONE is "with you" in this, though

your parents will come around once they realize they're assholes...or they won't, and as much as that will suck, it will suck less than catering to their silly notions of society/religion/whatever

10/4/2013 4:55:19 PM

Before I read your post in full, I just skimmed it and caught a few sentences. That lead me to believe that someone had made an alias just to copy paste one of my very old posts on this site, to troll me. (This was earlier, in chit chat)

See, I was in that exact same situation a decade ago, just on the other side. I was madly in love with an Indian girl who had come to the US to study and her family was still in India. I had also come from abroad to study. She was Hindu, and I am Muslim, but only nominally. I felt the same as you, that if I were to search the world, I couldn't find anybody with whom I clicked even half as much. We were inseparable, and our personalities and emotions had completely gelled into one, making a new entity. We even had made several new words that only we understood, it was fabulous.

We met at NCSU in October 2000 and I fell in love with her the moment I saw her. I courted (in the true sense) her for a few months, and around April 2011 told her I wanted to spend the rest of my life with her. She said the same, and I was shocked. Until then, she had basically been saying no because she was wary of the fact that her parents wouldn't approve. Anyway, we were together till February 2003, and then I left the US. We stayed together in a long distance relationship till August 2004, and then she told me she had to break it off.

Her mother had told her that if she were to marry a Muslim man, either she (mother) would kill herself or society would kill her (mother), on more than one occasion. My ex never told her family that she was dating me, but her older sister had apparently told the parents. So my ex told me that she had to make a choice, and she couldn't possibly turn her back on her family as they had invested so much in her education even though they weren't well off. Not only that, they had a family business (carpet making) back in India, and her and her 4 siblings were expected to play their part in running the business after finishing their studies. So there was no way she could do any of that if she were to marry me.

As for your case, it is slightly different, because your parents moved to America. Why do people move from underdeveloped oppressive countries to rich democratic multi-ethnic countries and then stop their daughters from marrying men of other races/cultures/religions? It is like the Pakistanis who immigrate to the UK and then prevent their daughters from marrying English men, or worse take them back to Pakistan and force them to marry their own, or even kill them in so called 'honor' killings.

My advice would be to try to have a rational calm discussion with your parents. If they understand, great. If not, choose him if you really think he is the 'one'. One day, you, not your family, will live with a man. So choose the person you want to choose, as long as he makes you happy.

Another example I can give you is of a friend (uni classmate) of my wife. She is Indian, and she married an English man. Her parents disowned her, and from what I know of the latest, they still haven't come around even though she has had a child with him. In fact, my ex and I discussed this very point. I was trying to convince her that her parents would come around one day if she stuck with me, especially after we had a child. She didnt want to take the risk. So, your parents might come around, they might not. You have to go into this thinking that they won't. If you can live with that, go with your man. Good luck!

inb4theridiculeandtrolling

10/4/2013 5:18:14 PM

have your parents even met this guy? if so, what were their thoughts of him as a person? if not, perhaps you should try to get together as a group and have your man impress them and maybe they'll change their minds

10/4/2013 5:18:36 PM

Thank you for that post 0EPII1. It makes me feel a little safer to know that people have been in the same or similar situations, even though yours didn't turn out the way you had hoped it would.

As for my parents meeting him, they have explicitly stated that they don't want to meet him, don't care for him, and whether or not he's a good person, it doesn't matter to them. They have simply stated that they just don't want me to marry him, period.

10/4/2013 5:37:29 PM

sounds like your parents are closed-minded, ignorant, prejudiced assholes. Ultimately you have to decide whether it's better to associate with people you love or people you hate.

I'd cut your parents loose if I were you

10/4/2013 5:42:34 PM

thanks guys.. you have honestly made me feel better about the situation. it sucks to be at such odds with the people who raised you.

10/4/2013 6:14:35 PM

it does, but at least you're open-minded and objective, instead of clinging to stupidity.

There's enough stupidity in the world.

[Edited on October 4, 2013 at 6:39 PM. Reason : to edit. ]

10/4/2013 6:38:59 PM

10/4/2013 6:40:03 PM

"Those who mind don’t matter, and those who matter don’t mind."

ditch your parents

because if they mind, they seriously don't matter

10/4/2013 8:26:12 PM

I just want to bust in with a couple questions of practicality.

You mentioned earlier that you live with your parents. Your profile says you are 21. Have you graduated from college? Do you have a job? Asshole parents or not, before you decide to ditch them you need to KNOW that you are stable with or without their assistance. If you're not finished with school and are dependent on them, you're talking about a big change here. If you currently pay your way and have a job, or your boyfriend is financially independent, then maybe this isn't such a big factor. It sounds like this is a deal or no deal with your parents, and if you cut yourself off from them, you need to be able to survive. I'm sure you realize that, but you need to be DAMN CERTAIN about the practicality of that decision.

I personally think you should do whatever you can to calm down the parent's fervor about this. I think finding a way to not cut all ties while still making decisions for yourself is ideal], however unlikely. Even if you hate them now, I would be cautious about doing or saying anything that ruins your ties to family. Not saying you should listen or even consider their advice on your personal relationship (obviously their opinion here is worth nothing), but you don't have to leave them behind forever for this guy. And however ONCE IN A LIFETIME a relationship seems to you right now, it isn't. It could be great and you should definitely be considering marriage if you two want that, but it's a bad mindset to think that your relationship at 21 is literally impossible to top, at least when you're making decisions about family as well. Just to offer a little devil's advocate.

10/4/2013 11:43:49 PM

I, unlike Netstorm, assumed you're a grown woman, and have thought through everything he mentioned already

21 is a perfectly reasonable age to seriously consider marriage in a stable relationship (of three years: it's not like she just met him)

10/5/2013 4:48:15 PM

do you believe in this guy? or do you just like the way he looks at you?

10/5/2013 5:15:43 PM

^^If you dun read gud you'd see that I wasn't saying she was too young to marry, only that her saying he is "THE LOVE OF MY LIFE" shouldn't inherently be part of the decision to permanently break ties with her family.

[Edited on October 5, 2013 at 7:02 PM. Reason : devil's advocate, don't be a bitch]

10/5/2013 7:01:57 PM

Do you have any other family in this country besides your parents? If so, are any of them more open-minded? If so it would be a really good idea to have an open and honest discussion with the other family members--perhaps they could help convince your parents that you are your own person and that rigid cultural ideas/stereotypes don't have to persist from the old country to the new. Or, even if that won't happen, it's good to have some family to keep in contact with since your parents will be (temporarily) out of the picture.

Overall, though, if you're sure this man is the one for you--if, parental situation aside, you know you'd say yes without reservations if he were to ask you to marry him tomorrow--then I think you've already made your decision. Not having your family on your side sucks, it really does, but when they're being unreasonable and guided by fear, and if you know you have a loving, caring, man who is devoted to you... You're not going to spend the rest of your life living with your parents and you don't want to spend it living in their shadow. Make the choice that is most compatible with your goals, your dreams, and the person YOU truly are.

10/5/2013 7:56:24 PM

Quote :

"Post new threads in the right section - Save us the trouble of having to move your topic to the correct section. Post in the right section to begin with. Additionally, if you post the same topic in multiple sections or post a dummy topic pointing to a topic in another section, this is grounds for immediate suspension. Nothing pisses us off more than seeing "I posted this in <insert right section> but no one looks there so now I am posting it in <insert wrong section> to get more attention". The Wolf Web does provide free advertising and attention, in the CORRECT places."

10/5/2013 8:29:56 PM

21 is a little too young to be certain about the rest of your life, but your parents should be long past the point of knowing that you aren't their property.

You have zero obligation (regardless of them raising you) to spend your life living their dreams.

10/5/2013 10:39:11 PM

I am definitely capable of living on my own.. I will be graduating in December and already have one job lined up (hopefully more to come soon). And Netstorm, you're right. A guy is not something to lose family over. But I guess I'm looking at this situation from a moral perspective as well. I don't believe in what they want to make me believe, and I'm afraid that if I stay under their wing forever, I will lose the values that I believe are important-- tolerance, humanity, love, etc.

Additionally, I do have family in the US (and actually family right here in the Raleigh area), but I have a pretty good idea of how they will react to the situation also. I also don't want to involve them because a) I feel that if I told them, it would ruin their ties with my family, because they will forever see me as the black sheep and b) Again, looking back on my earlier paragraph, I don't want to cut ties with my family just to be with this man. I also want to cut ties because I feel that if I stay connected, my fundamental values will be compromised.

I do think, however, that this is it. I know you can never be sure in life that you are 100% committed to a person, but as committed as I can be, I am. Yes, if he were to ask me to marry him right now, right this moment, I would say yes. It's not like we haven't talked about it either-- we've been dating for 3 years, and have been super serious for 2 of them. We pretty much did everything together when I lived away from home, and we were, for the most part, "a married couple". We have talked about getting married, we have talked about having kids, and we are on the same page about all of our core values and necessities in life. He treats me like an equal partner, and I involve him in all of my major decision making. Without him, I wouldn't be where I am right now career wise, education wise, or life wise.

I guess the thing that angers me the most about this situation, and brought me to so many different forums seeking advice, is that I always considered my parents as the "right" in every situation in my life. I looked up to them, and still did up until everything happened with my boyfriend, and I always assumed that if they were saying something to me or teaching me something, it was for my own good. Now I'm conflicted because I really feel as if I'm right in this situation, but I don't want to think that my parents are "wrong".

10/5/2013 11:16:23 PM

I must've died and gone to heaven, cause' there's an angel in front of me. Tell what Special A can do for you?

10/5/2013 11:45:49 PM

Tell your mom and dad to piss off and to have fun dying alone. You don't need negative unsupportive people around you, even if they are blood.

10/6/2013 12:54:19 AM

Quote :

"I guess the thing that angers me the most about this situation, and brought me to so many different forums seeking advice, is that I always considered my parents as the "right" in every situation in my life. I looked up to them, and still did up until everything happened with my boyfriend, and I always assumed that if they were saying something to me or teaching me something, it was for my own good. Now I'm conflicted because I really feel as if I'm right in this situation, but I don't want to think that my parents are "wrong"."

Been there, done that, lived to tell about it. I'm an only child with parents who, while I know they love me and wish the best for me, have been *very* controlling and overbearing over the years. I'm 33 and it's really only been in the past few years that I've really asserted my independence (in a "not always right" context, I've been financially independent since college.) I totally get considering them to be the default Voice of Right, and it's a good thing growing up to have those voices you can always refer to. But at this point you're grown up, and you need to start listening to your own Voice rather than theirs. It's a hard transition for some of us, and one that my girlfriend/fiancée at the time (now wife) had to help/prod me along with. I consider it a blessing that it never came to a complete cutting off, though there were a few screaming arguments along the way.

But you have to live your own life, and part of that is discovering that even those you trusted implicitly as a child have flaws all their own. And those flaws don't have to be yours too.

10/6/2013 1:53:11 AM

Quote :

"I always considered my parents as the "right" in every situation in my life"

You're definitely young and naive then.

Your parents are cunts, but you're pretty naive to believe you've met the person of your life.

10/6/2013 2:34:59 AM

You parents are racists. You still have doubts about whether their opinions are right or not?

Get some perspective.

10/6/2013 3:16:39 AM

Your parents will do all they can to influence your decisions, but if they are good human beings, they will come to accept your decision and find their way back into your life, and probably be better people for it after realizing that your decisions are yours and no one else's. If they don't then you probably wouldn't want them in your life because this issue will keep coming up as they try and control you more and more. I have a friend at work who was "disowned" by her indian parents for the same reason, they came back into her life less than a year later.

10/6/2013 11:31:25 AM

this is AMURIKA! If they don't like it, they can GIT!

10/6/2013 11:40:42 AM

It's called parental disillusionment . It's mostly a normal thing to go through.

Your parents are just as dumb and narrow minded as the people you see walking around target.

10/6/2013 11:57:10 AM

Quote :

"sounds like your parents are closed-minded, ignorant, prejudiced assholes. Ultimately you have to decide whether it's better to associate with people you love or people you hate. "

10/6/2013 1:34:49 PM

1) Is this your parents normal reaction to you dating? If they are racist in general or hate all your suitors, it's easier to blow them off.

2) Have they met the guy or do they know much about him based on what you have told them?

When blinded by love, parents tend to be good at identifying the warning signs that we're with assholes long before we see it. It's usually red flags from negative changes in our own behavior, and they react by trying to convince you there is something wrong with the guy rather than just tell you you're acting weird. Definitely make an effort to have your parents get to know him before making any big decisions.

10/7/2013 9:00:49 AM

Don't go all "him or them" back to your parents, it's wrong for all the same reasons it's wrong for them to go all "us or him" on you.

10/7/2013 9:40:21 AM

People ignorant of South Asian views of family honor and female honor ITT.

10/7/2013 12:24:46 PM

People who realize its silly ITT

10/7/2013 12:48:13 PM

^^You're right, what were we thinking?

madeinindia, dump your boyfriend and go be completely miserable because of tradition or something.

10/7/2013 12:59:14 PM

yep, I can't believe you'd ever even think about trying to be happy at the expense of your family's honor. Tradition is much more important than love and happiness.

10/7/2013 1:12:01 PM

yes, 21 year old. do whatever your heart desires. there's no way that could lead you astray.

10/7/2013 1:36:29 PM

^^ , ^^^

That's obviously not what I meant. Did you even read my advice at the top of the page? I guess not.

At the same time, it would be helpful to know how and why the parents are feeling the way they are feeling, and which has everything to do with the part of the world they are from.

Also, insulting her parents and calling them nasty words is not helpful at all, and not necessary at all for giving her advice.

10/7/2013 2:14:02 PM

^^once you're 21, it's probably better to make your own decisions. it's probably not very healthy to let your parents dictate who you can or can't date. 21 is old enough to make your own decisions.

[Edited on October 7, 2013 at 2:56 PM. Reason : ]

10/7/2013 2:29:09 PM

Let me edit this by saying that I do understand where my parents are coming from. The way they were raised and the family they come from makes it seem like it's impossible for a mixed race relationship to ever work out for their daughter. At the same time, I'm also not asking "should I leave them and go be with my boyfriend?".. Maybe I should have rephrased the first initial comment, because I wrote that in the heat of the moment when things first went down, and it doesn't really represent how I feel now. Now, I feel that I want to give them time, but I don't want to let go of my relationship. Right now, I'm at a point where I want to become financially stable, move out of my house and live on my own, do whatever I want, and let them come around in their own time. I will still be living in the Raleigh area, and so will they, so there are plenty of chances for redemption on their part. I'm not going to force them to be okay with my decision, because that's not the right thing to do either, but at the same time, I'm not going to change my decision to fit their model.

I hope that makes more sense.. and honestly, my parents aren't cunts or assholes. They're just.. ignorant? I guess that would be the best word for it.

10/7/2013 3:57:37 PM

Quote :

"That's what everyone says.. and yes, I do plan on marrying him and having children with him. That was the intention from year 2 onwards, when I realized how happy he made me. "

Before you dump your parents, makes sure that marrying and having kids will not result in you being a lonely housewife with kids to watch, because you will not have your parent's help. Do you have a career? can you afford daycare? Are you guys gonna be paycheck to paycheck?

If you are living in a america, paycheck to paycheck, and don't have help from a parent, having a child could destroy your relationship.

10/7/2013 5:15:15 PM

Quote :

"madeinindia, dump your boyfriend and go be completely miserable because of as is tradition or something."

[/south park]

10/7/2013 7:31:27 PM

Of course I'll have a job. He's a college graduate with a stable career right now, and I will be graduating in December (I already have a full-time job right now that I'm starting on Monday). We will definitely not be poor or broke or any of those things, as long as we continue to pursue our careers, which neither of us have any intention of not doing so. I've already started saving up for the rest of my life and have a pretty substantial nest egg right now, which will continue to grow as I have my full-time job and live at home for the next 6 months. I do feel bad that I will be living at home with a job for the next 6 months, relying on my parents to provide for me, but I don't think that moving out now will solve anything and I really want to be able to save up, as selfish as that sounds. So when I do tell them what my choice is, it will be sometime next year. I already have a goal of when I want to move out and how I want to achieve the things I need to before then.

10/8/2013 11:45:53 AM

Are you a troll? (I really think you are one)

If not,

Do you know if his family is going to accept you?

Are you sure if his family knows about you? Have you met his family?

If his family rejects you, does he also agree to leave his family just like you are ready to do it?

Will you be required to convert to marry him and what if you do not want to? Have you guys discussed about the future of your children?

You have to find the answers for questions like the ones listed above and make your own decision. Family dynamics can be very complicated especially in some cultures .

10/9/2013 6:11:17 AM

Lol, Okay, I'm definitely not a troll. I would like to prove otherwise and offer up my real name, but I go to NCSU so I would rather not (since people I know might use this site).

I have definitely met his family, and they all love me. I won't be required to convert because both of us are atheists (even his family is mostly agnostic.. they really only adhere to the cultural aspects of Islam). And yes, we have talked about children and all that good stuff. We're pretty much on the same page on everything regarding our future.

10/9/2013 9:48:50 AM

Well, this is basically the only thing that sucks about Indian culture.

10/9/2013 10:57:57 AM

/middle eastern culture in general. MUST SAVE FACE!

10/9/2013 11:02:34 AM

Seems easy to me. Have him convert to hindi. As an atheist he knows the words have no power over him. But the fake ritual might sooth your parents.

10/9/2013 11:22:46 AM

is there any kind of financial appeasement he could do to soothe your parents? like a reverse dowry/bride price?

10/9/2013 11:33:25 AM

I'm all about choosing your own life over your family's ideas when they are counter to what you believe in or harmful to you. This is hard. My wife has little or no contact with her family (not because of me, I think they're happier with me than they are with her, but they are part jackasses, part unmedicated/undiagnosed mental...). But this lack of contact and animosity on their part is incredibly painful to her. Cut this cord with extreme caution, but cut it, if it needs to be done.

However, don't go from family to man. Leave the family because they need to be left, not to go live with him. If their opinion of who you marry is important enough to you to cut ties with them, then do it. But do it and be your own person _first_. Live life and support yourself for a while.

This doesn't mean you should ditch the guy. He sounds great. But don't leave your parents and move straight in with him. Don't let your choice to be with him be a part of your choice to leave your parents. Once you are living your life, and supporting yourself, then you will be in a place to see this guy for how wonderful he is, and give the decision to live with him forever the attention and honor it deserves. Then, when you choose him, it will be with all of who _you_ are.

10/9/2013 11:56:53 AM

Next

10/9/2013 12:10:01 PM