Thats because

Danny

this is the official EVO thread

Not the official "TRACK DAY" thread.

Reading comprehension is fairly important these days.


(yes the C6 rapes the face off both evo's)

2/7/2008 10:08:34 AM

hey queer

























page 11

2/7/2008 10:36:15 AM

I don't see how a car that's faster around a track is supposed to feel better. You should know better than most Dan...

Yeah, the Vette is faster, but even w/the horrid weight distribution Evos (9 anyway) do feel much better. I mean, I've been driving around a Miata, and I'm sorry but it's got superior feel to any street Corvette. An M3 feels better too, neither is anywhere near as fast on track, at auto-x, or anywhere else (short of clover liefs around the beltline that is).
Ahmet -->big fan of the Corvette's performance, not so much it's feel...

2/7/2008 3:06:46 PM

Because magazines give you a lot of info on the feel of a car don't they...
I mean they come with this new seat that you sit in that gives you all the butt dyno results from the car tests.

Listen man vettes do have an odd feel about them and those who have driven them know it; some like it some don't. Its really the way they seat the driver more than weight of the car or width of it or anything like that... you sit down in the car rather than on it. Its a great design as far as center of gravity etc. goes but it feels a little awkward and heavy if you're not used to it.

And as far as autox goes its light has tons of power and tons of grip with good brakes... duh its good.
Now what i wonder is if the vette auto crossers do a lot of power oversteering or e-braking cause or something the C5 i drove had to do a 5 pt turn to change direction on a wide 2 lane road unless you slowed down turned the wheel and pushed the U-turn pedal down.

2/7/2008 3:30:28 PM

Ahmet is blinded by roadster appeal. Ignore his comments!

2/7/2008 6:25:54 PM

who gives a fuck if vette is faster? steering is numb, it uses fucking LEAF springs, interior is out of rental grand am, it is old techonology, it is shit and people who drive the stupid thing are dumb motherfuckers to pay 50k for a car thats worthless in 10 years. engine is also big shit. there is zero engineering skills is extracting 400hp out of 6L motor. boo-hoo 505hp out 7L motor. it's a fucking pushrod. yeah, it works great, but there is nothing new about it or particularly special. when they get 750hp out of 7L vette without supercharging, they have the right to talk. dont give me titanium valve train and whatever the fuck else as advanced....

2/7/2008 9:05:13 PM

And it absolutely rapes things twice as expensive.

Seriously, don't knock engineering when clearly you don't know the meaning of ROI.

2/7/2008 9:36:07 PM

the used ones are under 20K easy... you'll be hard pressed to find something else that compares for that price.

i agree with the brand new ones are fucking rip-offs though.

2/7/2008 9:36:27 PM

Quote :

"it is shit and people who drive the stupid thing are dumb motherfuckers to pay 50k for a car thats worthless in 10"

lol

find me a cheap corvette sir. these things hold their value.

2/7/2008 9:39:06 PM

meh, can't agree with you there... the rich fucks sell the year old ones for nothing to get a new one quicker.. C5's are dirt cheap and have been for a while

2/7/2008 9:52:06 PM

Quote :

"Seriously, don't knock engineering when clearly you don't know the meaning of ROI"

you have a big fat zero of an argument when it comes to corvette and engineering on any level and on any aspect of it. ill argue with you to death about this. just about the only thing that is engineered well on that car is its cd.

what ROI? tell me your rationale. this car is expensive at 50k because it drives just like '93 Z28 did 15 years ago. look at the specs on '93 z28 and C6 and tell me how many things have changed?

Quote :

"find me a cheap corvette sir. these things hold their value."

i just ran autotrader from '97-'99 there are over 20 cars in range from 11k-15k.
you can buy '05-06 C6 for 26k-30k anyday.

[Edited on February 7, 2008 at 10:07 PM. Reason : f]

2/7/2008 9:55:55 PM

yea, bought a 99 vette with 120K miles for 14K a few years ago... that's hardly expensive compared to the original price tag

but i'm sure most of you have seen me say that 100x already so i'll shutup

2/7/2008 10:15:17 PM

nigger please. im talking a decent vette. not no vette with millions of miles. all cars are pretty much like that.

vettes hold their value. kind like my powerful civic



[Edited on February 7, 2008 at 10:20 PM. Reason : at least they did when i was looking 3-5 years ago. i was looking at c4 vettes]

2/7/2008 10:19:20 PM

it's a good powerful car that looks good. no, it doesn't depreciate like malibu.

..but cmon, for what is advertised and perceived, you know shit like "american legend", long heritage, and other bla bla, it depreciates faster than other cars that have the same historical reputation.

i get annoyed when car is put on pedestal like its godly. it's good for drag racing, it's good for straight line, it will take engine abuse, it will make great power and leave it at that. for track, it is not. not because it will not lap fast, but because there are other vehicle that are more communicative and enjoyable. it is the same shit for idiots (like myself on occasion) who drag race M3. car is not made for it. get the right tool for the job, thats all.

2/7/2008 10:42:07 PM

ehh, thats like telling these evo/sti owners that they bought their cars and are doing this wrong.

they should be on the dirt/mud and snow instead of on the track where a few of them have been.

[Edited on February 7, 2008 at 10:47 PM. Reason : ]

2/7/2008 10:45:07 PM

not really...because im not advocating you should not track the vette. im saying there are better cars (a lot of them) that will be more suited.

2/7/2008 10:58:05 PM

if everyone had that mentality, then every one would be tracking chevy montecarlos and ford taurus'.

but i see what you are saying. no matter what car you want to do whatever with, there will always me something better.

2/7/2008 11:12:16 PM

I'm sorry

I can't focus on your point with all the incessant backpedaling.

2/7/2008 11:20:33 PM

either way...nice way out.

2/8/2008 12:56:42 AM

Quote :

"This is retarded. Lets compare national autox as a measure of 'snappy, agile, mongoose-reflex feel'. The corvette is consistently faster in stock form than both the S2000 and Evo and is even classed higher. Hell, looking at the 2007 National ProSolo Tour results, they beat the Lotus Elises in their class more often than not. And on track it only gets better. "

Sorry, you're wrong. Not about what you're saying--just what you have chosen as a metric and on the general point.

The C6 is a fantastic sports car. I've thought about buying a C5 on a couple of occassions, and once the prices drop a little more on the C6s, I'll prob give them even greater consideration.

No doubt it kicks ass in most any performance contest. Anyone who denies that is a fool. Hence, I said "it generates great numbers..."

It also by NO means feels bad. I drove one for a half hour or so a few weeks back (C6 with Z51 package...haven't convinced my other buddy to let me take his new Z06 for a spin just yet). However, hop out of that 'vette and into my Evo, and the difference in feel couldn't be more pronounced. The Evo feels fucking SPASTIC compared to the Corvette. The Corvette--though I really do like it--does indeed feel like a freight train compared to an Evo, or even an S2000.

Quote :

"danny... dont get riled up. we're talking about magazine racers ricers here. "

I think not. I own one of the cars in question and have driven the other.

Quote :

"BTW how about some of you pussy EVO queers bring your cars to some rallyX's where your car is SUPPOSE to belong. "

haha, because the goddamn thing falls apart on a regular basis under street driving conditions, and Mitsu is just waiting to fuck you out of the warranty...no reason to give them any more justification to.

Quote :

"Listen man vettes do have an odd feel about them and those who have driven them know it; some like it some don't. Its really the way they seat the driver more than weight of the car or width of it or anything like that"

No, it's not even that, and it's not the weight of the car, either (the Evo outweighs it, but feels MUCH lighter and more agile). The Vette is kinda like an NFL running back...the Evo is like an Olympic gymnast.

Quote :

"who gives a fuck if vette is faster? steering is numb, it uses fucking LEAF springs, interior is out of rental grand am, it is old techonology, it is shit and people who drive the stupid thing are dumb motherfuckers to pay 50k for a car thats worthless in 10 years. engine is also big shit. there is zero engineering skills is extracting 400hp out of 6L motor. boo-hoo 505hp out 7L motor. it's a fucking pushrod. yeah, it works great, but there is nothing new about it or particularly special. "

I'm not a huge fan of the steering (although I'm spoiled from my last 4 cars). The C5 interior is garbage...the C6 is considerably better (though nothing great). Why give a flying fuck about specific output or engine configuration, though? I'm all about whatever works, and the LSx motors are shit hot. Tough, make huge power, and light.

Also, Corvettes tend to hold their pretty well, from what I've noticed.

Quote :

"this car is expensive at 50k because it drives just like '93 Z28 did 15 years ago. look at the specs on '93 z28 and C6 and tell me how many things have changed? "

I've driven a '94 Z28 as well as a C6, and let me tell you, about the only thing I'd compare between the two of them is the nameplate.

2/8/2008 1:55:17 AM

all of this whining about feel, etc. is a bunch of crap and an excuse. it doesn't help you get the car around the track any faster. just because you have some issue with how something is is YOUR problem, not the car's. so, if you want to go fast either suck it up and deal or spend more money making something else as fast. it's very simple.

as for the corvette specifically, hate how it looks, hate the interior, or whatever all you want. there's definitely a lot of things i don't like about them. however, you simply will not find a car ANYWHERE close to its performance for a comparable price. who cares if they still use pushrods, or leaf springs, or whatever. the shit gets the job done, doesn't it? they've definitely got some sort of engineering figured to be whipping and stomping euro and jap ass at any game. i'm as big of a fan of new technology as anyone, but it's a prime example of how some of the oldest things still get it done with a little modern attention.

hate it because it's american, hate it because you don't like the interior, but you can't hate it for being a poor performer. or maybe it's because some of you actually lack the BALLS to take control of a real car, adapt yourself to it, and push it. face it, some of you just don't have the desire to go as fast as others. you'd rather look pretty on the street, play the roll of a racer on the weekend to look cool, and turn in a few mediocre laps here and there without really working at it. all that means you've got to have a car that looks good, is adequately fast, and is comforable for all sizes. fast lap times come in somewhere behind all that.

2/8/2008 2:49:12 AM

Quote :

"all of this whining about feel, etc. is a bunch of crap and an excuse. it doesn't help you get the car around the track any faster. "

Just because it has little impact on the ability of the car to turn hot laps doesn't mean it's a bunch of crap.

Ultimate performance per dollar is high on my list of priorities, probably higher than for most of the other people in this thread. I don't really give a shit how hard it rides, or if anything bigger than a pair of socks will fit in the trunk, etc, but I personally just enjoy the snappier feel of an Evo or S2000, for example. Since I'm not going to race any of these cars competitively, that fun and enjoyment counts for something.

I can see myself buying a Corvette anyway, because it would still be a shit ton of fun in its own ways, but if I had my way, it would feel quicker on its feet and a little more high strung.


I agree with everything else you said, other than I also think the Evo ranks right up there with it in terms of performance per dollar.

2/8/2008 3:05:43 AM

Does AARP give a corvette discount?

I believe it only applies to red convertables with tan tops

2/8/2008 8:11:11 AM

lin10^9, you're being a retard.

Maybe you guys are confusing a quick steering rack w/ tossability? The EVO and S2k both have really quick racks and the corvette's is comparatively slower. but coming from BMW land the vette felt good response wise to me.

My Rabbit has a pretty darn quick rack and its actually more fun to autox than the E30 cuz its simply less work. the car moves a lot more per input of mine. Its of course slower, but its less work. It really gives the impression of being a more responsive car, even w/ all its body roll and 65 series tires

Feel is important because its what you base your confidence on. You can't go fast if you're not confident in what the car is doing.

2/8/2008 8:46:52 AM

apparently danny you need to buy a real track car.

we all do.

lets go spend gobs of money on cars that are suppose to be on track.

backpedaling? finding a way out? negros please. your arguement is valid but only if we know what a real track car is. people track different cars because they try different things.

like ivan said, if you dont like the interior, what the hell does that have to do with anything? buy a damned seat if you cant sit well. you fagg0ts should know by now that you cant get a cheap, fast, reliable, comfy car.

show me the mon4y

[Edited on February 8, 2008 at 8:59 AM. Reason : ]

2/8/2008 8:56:23 AM

*putputputputputputputputput*

2/8/2008 8:59:52 AM

and these AWD boys thought they had it all.

clearly all of my tires are spinning because mud is being kicked by all 4 tires.
maybe the civic is a real track car?

[Edited on February 8, 2008 at 9:03 AM. Reason : ]

2/8/2008 9:03:03 AM

Quote :

"Feel is important because its what you base your confidence on. You can't go fast if you're not confident in what the car is doing."

so aside my rant, you validated what i have been talking about all along. i guess that makes you a retard as well?

[Edited on February 8, 2008 at 3:46 PM. Reason : f]

2/8/2008 3:45:03 PM

OMG, something is wrong with me...

After enjoying that miata way too much, I spent some time in Quinn's S2000, and I'm looking at them... Should not have switched back and forth b/w miata and M3, now I want something lighter, this is not looking good.

Now if I only had a friend with a Corvette who'd let me drive one hard, or on track before buying a box of hamsters...
Ahmet

2/8/2008 3:48:40 PM

Quote :

"Ahmet is blinded by roadster appeal. Ignore his comments!"

2/8/2008 3:56:04 PM

Dude, I don't even like roadsters/convertibles. It just so happens that some of the cars I like are avail. only as roadsters. There's no way I'd pick an Mz3 Roadster over an Mz3 Coupe for example... But wow, I REALLY liked the S2k this time. Weird, because I still hate the engine tone though I used to not like anything about them 3 years ago. Maybe all the track time in the Type R is making me like Hondas more.

I am having a hard time justifying this to the logical side of my brain over a Corvette for the same $. Ugh.
Ahmet

2/8/2008 4:05:14 PM

isnt tracking an S2000 a hug PITA? like half the clubs don't allow them and the other half require a roll bar that doesnt exist?

2/8/2008 4:12:16 PM

^

Man brings up a very valid point

2/8/2008 4:17:19 PM

Quote :

"Quinn's S2000"

When did that happen?

2/8/2008 5:26:38 PM

the mans had the S2k for a while now

2/8/2008 6:04:13 PM

yay roadsters

btw.... dunno if y'all heard chrysler is going to build the Demon .... fwd ..... and in China

2/8/2008 7:03:36 PM

Quote :

"Dude, I don't even like roadsters/convertibles. It just so happens that some of the cars I like are avail. only as roadsters. "

Dude I get a mental segment fault every time I try to understand this.

2/8/2008 7:06:59 PM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ut9g6b7IJVY
^16 year old kid gets 500hp evo as first car. Can't even drive a manual, discuss.

More Details:http://forums.evolutionm.net/showthread.php?t=323822

2/8/2008 11:49:40 PM

self-correcting problem

2/8/2008 11:58:59 PM

^^^ I don't like convertibles with the exception of some sports cars including the Miata, MZ3, Boxster and the S2000. I have absolutely no interest in a CLK, a Sebring, an M3 convertible, or most other convertibles. Of those mentioned cars, the S2000 and the Miata are offered as convertibles only, and I can't afford the hard top version of the Boxster...
Ahmet

2/9/2008 8:33:49 PM

2/10/2008 8:50:36 PM

^I took that one, and these two, for some guy on your Evo forums...

2/10/2008 11:21:58 PM

that's a sharp looking Evo

Quote :

"Dude I get a mental segment fault every time I try to understand this."

I think he means that he prefers hardtops, yet likes a few certain cars DESPITE them being convertibles.


Ahmet, what do you think about the Z4 M-Coupe? It gives me a boner. I don't know how it compares to the M3s, though...not to mention the Cayman. Also, I'm not sure I'd buy one over a C6, and I still have raging mega-huge wood for an Elise.

2/10/2008 11:43:57 PM

^ I have a raging boner as well for BMW coupe hatchbacks. My jaw drops when I see a Z4 coupe on the road.

2/10/2008 11:50:31 PM

Quote :

""

def walked my tl after 130/140

[Edited on February 11, 2008 at 12:24 AM. Reason : .]

2/11/2008 12:23:55 AM

unless that big IC is mostly for show and there isn't really anything else done to it, it should've walked ran away from a TL at any speed

2/11/2008 12:51:44 AM

Not necessarily.

A stock evo's powerband drops off in the upper RPM's.

A new TL would might actually walk it 100mph +.

The brick like aerodynamics doesn't help either.

2/11/2008 1:18:16 AM

http://youtube.com/watch?v=zeYUyEAzmE0

2/11/2008 2:08:39 AM

I like the Z4M Coupe, but have not driven one. I think there's a decent chance they may stick the new M3's motor in it's final years like they did with the Z3M cars. If that pans out, it would actually be a good buy, as well as a superior performing vehicle.

That said, I've driven the Cayman S, and was very impressed with the dynamics vs. ride/comfort. I don't get very excited over the C6, I wouldn't buy one unless it was a z06. I've also yet to drive an Elise, I hope to fix that this week, we'll see. They're rather awesome, I couldn't spend the $ on one of those either though. Note again that Z4M cars are selling WELL below sticker, and depreciation on the Cayman S is favorable for someone in the lightly used car market...
Ahmet

2/11/2008 2:49:30 AM

Porsche's cars in general depreciate like a mofo buying a brand new one is like burning money.

the boxster is the only one that doesn't seem to plummet in price in the first couple years.


i'm pretty sure a stock evo would have a decent chance on walking a tl but i could be wrong at higher speeds the aero and the fact that less power is lost in a fwd setup may give it a bit of an edge but i'm assuming with that intercooler there is probably some sort of ECU mod too at the very least and i bet the evo makes a significant amount more power than stock

2/11/2008 7:57:52 AM