^I didn't say anything about the other people in her life; I know in the case of my bisexuality my family members were the last to know, way after peoples on the Internets

12/31/2011 1:13:46 AM

ive been keeping it on the DL for awhile because i didnt want it to effect me at work. but im signed up to go back to school now so work isnt such a big deal.

Quote :

"Did you at least give them a primer on how to treat you?"

what does this mean?

12/31/2011 1:16:21 AM

^ I think it means did you ask the ignorant people in your life to treat you with respect/how to talk about you?

^^and I am interpreting full time to mean everyone in her life now knows about her change

12/31/2011 1:17:58 AM

this is a recent development so im still working on everyone. not quite everyone knows but im not spending any energy trying to hide it anymore and i'm presenting female all the time now.

12/31/2011 1:19:59 AM

At my job here in Boston we have an office policy that when we meet team members for the first time we always state our preferred gender pronouns, so that there is never any confusion as to what a person is or prefers to be.

12/31/2011 1:22:12 AM

thats pretty neat.

ive actually met a couple dozen wolfwebbers

12/31/2011 1:30:01 AM

^^^^I thout maBIE the OP was like me, intentionally living far away from family.

^^kewl, are there also any awesome signs like this one seen by Cincinnati's own JAC Stringer (a.k.a. Midwest GenderQueer) in Chicago: http://midwestgenderqueer.tumblr.com/post/9095799097/sticker-advertising-all-gender-bathrooms-georges

12/31/2011 2:05:48 AM

Quote :

"At my job here in Boston we have an office policy that when we meet team members for the first time we always state our preferred gender pronouns, so that there is never any confusion as to what a person is or prefers to be."

I'm all for being able to live your life however you see fit, but this is easily one of the most rediculous and offensive things I've ever heard about.

12/31/2011 11:56:25 AM

about as

Quote :

"rediculous"

as your spelling. How is that offensive though? it takes all of 5 minutes and clearly there was a need for it in her office.

The fact that you let it bother you is ridiculous.

12/31/2011 12:16:15 PM

How is it NOT offensive? I would think that even if you are a transgendered person, it should still be obvious what gender you are presenting as and someone asking you to clarify would be just as offensive as someone asking a "normal" person. The simple fact of the matter is that MOST (i.e. well over 99%) people don't have an issue with people not being able to tell what sex they are. And if you look like a woman, dress like a woman, but want people to refer to you as a man, then the burden should be on you to let people know, or don't get offended when people don't get it right. Asking every single person to clarify, just for the sake of a small group of individuals is beyond stupid. This is a prime example of when political correctness has won out over common sense.

[Edited on December 31, 2011 at 12:35 PM. Reason : But I'm a straight white male, so I guess I'm not allowed to be offended at anything.]

12/31/2011 12:32:19 PM

I didn't say you weren't allowed to be offended but you are making a lot of assumptions on that group of people, maybe it is overboard, but I wouldn't classify it as offensive.

12/31/2011 12:42:42 PM

Well clearly you and I don't get offended at the same things. Personally, I would get offended at most anything that I would also classify as overboard, as you just did.

12/31/2011 12:51:02 PM

have fun with that heart attack when you reach 50, no point in stressing over shit that isn't in your control. If it comes about in your office then you can protest and demand a different company policy, but since you have no idea of the staff makeup in the business referred to above or the interworkings/past HR issues, then you are just being "rediculous"

12/31/2011 12:54:15 PM

Look who's making assumptions now. I'm not getting stressed, I'm not all worked up. I don't really care. I'm just pointing out that this policy is pretty dumb, regardless of how many silly HR issues it stemmed from. You're the one that seems to be getting all worked up about things.

For the record, you don't know anything about the makeup of the office personnel either. You even said it was a she, when a male posted about it.

Also, if you have to keep bringing up the fact that I got one letter of a word wrong in order to try and prove something, you really should get some better material.

12/31/2011 1:00:41 PM

lol

12/31/2011 1:02:00 PM

Quote :

"if you are a transgendered person, it should still be obvious what gender you are presenting as"

It isn't always obvious, and furthermore there are people with non-binary gender identities; I realize it's an accommodation to the less than 1% who are intergender or visibly androgynous, but it's an important consideration in light of the deficiencies in our language.

12/31/2011 5:19:46 PM

Right, but if you're that much of a freakshow, you should be accustomed to it. It's not fair to drag everyone else down to your "let's all share what sex we are" level just because you can't make up your mind. I mean seriously, if people can't tell what sex you are by looking at you, is it really going to make everything all better by starting off a conversation with "I'd prefer that you call me a woman"? There are other major issues at play here.

It makes about as much sense as tearing off the front steps to an office building and making everyone walk up and down the handicapped ramp just because you have one employee in a wheelchair. "Oh, look at me, I am totally relating to Jimmy just because it takes me 45 seconds to do something that I used to do in 5."

And where does it end? Are you going to start having companies that ask you to share your sexual preference with everyone at the start of meetings just so you don't accidentally offend them by asking about their wife when they are gay?

Like I said, I get that not everybody is a traditional man or woman, and it might not be obvious for everyone, but it's still insulting to make everyone take time out of their work day to give out information that is obvious for 99+% of people just so you can tippytoe around the feelings of the .whatever% of people that would "benefit" (I'm still not sure it wouldn't be insulting to a transgender person as well, but I won't pretend to know what that's like for sure)

12/31/2011 8:27:11 PM

http://www.livescience.com/16940-transvestite-birds-prey-sexual-mimicry.html


this article claims that some species of birds have male members who grow female-like plumage and act like females in order to get close to females and sneakily have (biologically heterosexual) sex...
the comments are kinda LOLish.


I've met a couple of t-girls into b-girls but are there any real numbers on transgender sexual orientation?

12/31/2011 8:27:45 PM

I'll refer to last year's National Transgender Discrimination Survey from the National Center for Transgender Equality and the National Gay & Lesbian Task Force: http://www.thetaskforce.org/reports_and_research/ntds

On Page 28, the breakdown of transgender and gender non-conforming (GNC) people (but not crossdressers) by sexual orientation is as follows:
25% Bisexual
23% Heterosexual
23% Homosexual (e.g., "t-girls into b-girls")
23% "Queer" (non-hetero, not otherwise specified)
4% Asexual
2% Other (Pansexual?)

Page 29 specifies MTF, GNC, and FTM respondents...
MTF (54%)
31% Bisexual
29% Lesbian
23% Heterosexual
7% Queer
7% Asexual
2% Other

GNC (14%)
45% Queer
33% Homosexual
13% Bisexual
4% Heterosexual
3% Asexual
3% Other

FTM (32%)
46% Queer
25% Heterosexual
13% Bisexual
13% Gay
2% Asexual
2% Other

Approximately 3% of the respondents were female cross-dressers, while 11% were male cross-dressers; the percentages above for MTF, GNC, and FTM respondents were out of those who were not cross-dressers (of the whole sample, they are respectively 47%, 28%, and 12%, and because of rounding error the percentages add up to 101%).
The breakdown of sexual orientation for male cross-dressers, according to page 174, is
44% Heterosexual
38% Bisexual
9% Homosexual
3% Queer
3% Asexual
2% Other
Also they were just as likely to be unemployed as the general population, 7% at the time of the survey (transgender/GNC people were much more likely), and they had been in the military at a much higher rate, 32%, than other trans people (20%), who themselves had served at much higher rates than the general adult population (10%).

For comparison with the general population, look at page 6 (about self-identification) of a meta-analysis of survey data conducted later in 2011 by the Williams Institute at UCLA: http://williamsinstitute.law.ucla.edu/research/census-lgbt-demographics-studies/how-many-people-are-lesbian-gay-bisexual-and-transgender/
Among women, 1.1% were lesbian and 2.2% were bisexual; among men, 2.2% were gay and 1.4% were bisexual; among the total population, 1.7% were homosexual and 1.8% were bisexual. Using the rough assumption that 1% of the total population was asexual and pansexuality and other queer orientations were in trace proportions, this means about 95.5% of Americans are straight.

Also, approximately 0.3% of the population has taken some steps toward transition, so using the fact that according to page 26 of the NTDS, 61% of respondents had undergone some sort of medical transition, and assuming that none of the cross-dressers had, this means approximately 0.43% of the population is transgender or GNC and that the NTDS sample represented about 0.5% of the American population.
Putting the data together, using both surveys to avoid double-counting of queer trans people, approximately 3.65% of Americans identify as LGBT.

Also, for El Nachó, according to the 2011 NTDS, over a fifth of trans/GNC folks claim that others can't clock them, while over half claim they usually can't be read; FTMs are much more likely to pass than MTFs.

1/1/2012 12:13:44 PM

Quote :

"making everyone walk up and down the handicapped ramp just because you have one employee in a wheelchair. "Oh, look at me, I am totally relating to Jimmy just because it takes me 45 seconds to do something that I used to do in 5"

so you comparing a 10 minute HR meeting to a major construction renovation aimed at helping a handicapped person?

1/1/2012 1:20:35 PM

^^So thanks for giving me some actual numbers to solidify my point. Waaaaaay less than one percent of people would actually benefit from a stupid policy like the one mentioned.

^No, I not. Not at all actually. Go back and read what I said, and if you still don't understand what I said, ask someone for help.

1/1/2012 3:02:47 PM

Einhorn is Finkle! Finkle is Einhorn! Einhorn is a man!

1/1/2012 3:58:52 PM

cut it out

1/1/2012 8:57:45 PM

1/1/2012 9:05:34 PM

^"shemale" porn IMO, where the whole point is for pre-operative trans women to tittilate straight guys by showing off their possession of balls both above and below

Quote :

"so you comparing a 10 minute HR meeting to a major construction renovation aimed at helping a handicapped person?"

Not only that, he was posting like the typical handicapped-accessible ramp displaced stairs; I mean I know places with ramps but no stairs but most places with ramps have stairs.

1/1/2012 10:13:12 PM

Jesus Christ, are you both retarded? That's not what I was saying at all.

Guess I'll have to spell it out for the slow kids.

Most publicly available places have stairs. They also have ramps for people with disabilities. Are you with me so far?

Now, as it stands now given the choice between the two methods of transportation practically everyone that is capable would rather walk up 5 stairs at the front of a building rather than walk ~100 feet up the handicapped ramp.

Still with me?

Now people in wheelchairs don't have the option of walking up the stairs. That's kind of the point of the ramp.

I'm saying that forcing everyone to specify what gender they would like to be referred to makes about as much sense as ripping out the stairs and forcing everyone to use the ramp. I'm not saying the ramp would replace the stairs, I'm saying that, in my silly example, you are forcing the 99+% of the normal people to have to do the exact same thing that the less than 1% have to do anyway, for no other reason than to claim some sort of strange equality. Yes, it's a stupid example, but as I said, it makes about as much sense as requiring normal people to state the obvious that even though I was born a man, have been living my entire life as a man, have a wife and 3 kids, dress like a man, and have a beard and adam's apple and am named Steven, but yes, please refer to me as a man. It's insulting to even be asked to clarify, when in almost all but the freakishly rare occasions, it's simply unnecessary.

1/1/2012 10:32:02 PM

^ you mad?

just came here to say i won my fantasy football league this year

1/1/2012 11:09:06 PM

No. I'm not mad at all. I was actually trying to have an intelligent discussion about this issue, but with the group of mental midgets that keep chiming in, it doesn't look like that's gonna happen.

1/1/2012 11:17:41 PM

oh look el nacho's being an asshole again

1/1/2012 11:18:33 PM

ok look, Bubblebobble has contributed exactly nothing to TWW again.

1/1/2012 11:19:25 PM

Quote :

"I'll refer to last year's National Transgender Discrimination Survey from the National Center for Transgender Equality and the National Gay & Lesbian Task Force: http://www.thetaskforce.org/reports_and_research/ntds "

25 MB pdf, wow.

And yeah, don't really know what people are getting mad about ITT. In 100 years we'll all be robots anyway, so doesn't really matter.

1/1/2012 11:19:40 PM

oh look, what the fuck are you contributing exactly

negative stupid opinions?

yep.

1/1/2012 11:21:13 PM

Did you know that your genome is only different from a reference human genome by about 20 MB?

http://www.genetic-future.com/2008/06/how-much-data-is-human-genome-it.html

Quote :

"For those who don't want to read through the tedious details that follow, here's the take-home message: if you want to store the data in a raw format for later re-analysis, you're looking at between 2 and 30 terabytes (one terabyte = 1,000 gigabytes). A much more user-friendly format, though, would be as a file containing each and every DNA letter in your genome, which would take up around 1.5 gigabytes (small enough for three genomes to fit on a standard data DVD). Finally, if you have very accurate sequence data and access to a high-quality reference genome you can squeeze your sequence down to around 20 megabytes."

In a certain sense, the pdf is bigger than you are.

1/1/2012 11:24:06 PM

^^It's called an intelligent discussion. But I wouldn't expect you to understand what either of those words mean.

I know this is Chit Chat, but can't you go shit somewhere else? Aren't there miley cyrus threads you can go post "k" in?

Run along little boy, the grown ups are trying to talk.

1/1/2012 11:26:01 PM

haha

well it looks like you've accomplished a lot today

1/1/2012 11:27:09 PM

not nearly as much as you. I see you've added over 150 posts to your count today. Your parents must be so proud.

1/1/2012 11:29:19 PM

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nong_Tum





This is what I learn when I try to research something.

1/1/2012 11:30:28 PM

1/1/2012 11:31:05 PM

You guys will just have to excuse El Nachó. He's just sexually frustrated because his BF stopped giving him rim jobs and started making him play the catcher. Not to mention half of his family is now unemployed after the only place they were qualified to work (Taco Bell) shut down because they couldn't keep their hands out of the guacamole. Not to mention he's still scarred after the football players at his high school called him a faggot after they walked in on him and Jimmy the mentally retarded pianist (he mainly just hit the keys with his keyboard, though he can play a mean Moonlight Sonata) giving each other handjobs. I mean, he is a faggot, but only because he liked it when his school's Quidditch team shoved one of their brooms up his ass and made him suck on their Golden Snitches.

He mainly lashes out at people because his head hurts from his tiny little brain trying to comprehend what the big boys are saying. If you want him to give up, try using big words like "morphology," or "fornication." His brain will quickly run out of memory, causing it to crash.

If someone could quote this and post it so he can read it. He actually has my posts blocked because he has the temperament of a wife beater.

1/1/2012 11:59:29 PM

Quote :

"You guys will just have to excuse El Nachó. He's just sexually frustrated because his BF stopped giving him rim jobs and started making him play the catcher. Not to mention half of his family is now unemployed after the only place they were qualified to work (Taco Bell) shut down because they couldn't keep their hands out of the guacamole. Not to mention he's still scarred after the football players at his high school called him a faggot after they walked in on him and Jimmy the mentally retarded pianist (he mainly just hit the keys with his keyboard, though he can play a mean Moonlight Sonata) giving each other handjobs. I mean, he is a faggot, but only because he liked it when his school's Quidditch team shoved one of their brooms up his ass and made him suck on their Golden Snitches. He mainly lashes out at people because his head hurts from his tiny little brain trying to comprehend what the big boys are saying. If you want him to give up, try using big words like "morphology," or "fornication." His brain will quickly run out of memory, causing it to crash. If someone could quote this and post it so he can read it. He actually has my posts blocked because he has the temperament of a wife beater."

--merbig, 1/1/2012 11:59:29 PM

1/2/2012 12:07:11 AM

Quote :

""You guys will just have to excuse El Nachó. He's just sexually frustrated because his BF stopped giving him rim jobs and started making him play the catcher. Not to mention half of his family is now unemployed after the only place they were qualified to work (Taco Bell) shut down because they couldn't keep their hands out of the guacamole. Not to mention he's still scarred after the football players at his high school called him a faggot after they walked in on him and Jimmy the mentally retarded pianist (he mainly just hit the keys with his keyboard, though he can play a mean Moonlight Sonata) giving each other handjobs. I mean, he is a faggot, but only because he liked it when his school's Quidditch team shoved one of their brooms up his ass and made him suck on their Golden Snitches. He mainly lashes out at people because his head hurts from his tiny little brain trying to comprehend what the big boys are saying. If you want him to give up, try using big words like "morphology," or "fornication." His brain will quickly run out of memory, causing it to crash. If someone could quote this and post it so he can read it. He actually has my posts blocked because he has the temperament of a wife beater." --merbig, 1/1/2012 11:59:29 PM"

--BubbleBobble, 1/2/2012 12:07:11 AM

1/2/2012 12:11:14 AM

I tried to do nested quotes on that but it was taking too long to figure it out

1/2/2012 12:14:17 AM

So what you guys are trying to tell me is that I'm not missing out on any intelligent discussion by having merbig blocked.

Thanks guys, but I already had that one figured out.

1/2/2012 12:18:55 AM

I just re-read El Nachó's rant and it turns out he talked about removing steps that had co-existed with the ramp, rather than removing the steps to build one; anyway it would still only make sense if, say, there were some sorting device that sent people to the ramp or the stairs based on their physical handicap, and if determining the handicap status sometimes had problems, so workers would need to make sure the office that runs the device puts in the proper exceptions. Another implausible counterfactual that would make his rant make sense is if people could just compel others to use the proper pronouns, so that they'd never need to ask them beforehand.

1/2/2012 12:20:46 AM

http://tossingfrogs.wordpress.com/about/

Quote :

"Why “Tossing Frogs” Back in 2007, I was using my real name as my twitter ID. I wasn’t comfortable doing so. I could see potential employers googling my name and taking something I said on Twitter out of context. I have a very dry sense of humor. Which is something not everyone gets. Especially in text. While talking to a friend about this, I recounted a story from my youth. My family lived in a newer house that backed up to an older house that had a frog pond. Being the stereotypical Californians, my parents put in a swimming pool. Not too long after that, we started finding frogs swimming in our pool. Since we were fishing these frogs out of the pool with a net on a long pole, it seemed like fun to send them back via air mail. Hey, what can I say. I was a kid. I suddenly realized this was a great analogy to why I wanted to blog. I have been a long sufferer of social anxiety. There are things I want to say. Things I want to do with my life. I’m tired of social anxiety and depression holding me back. So, along with medication, I’ve decided to throw these “frogs” over the fence where they belong. So, always look up. You never know when I might be throwing frogs. :-) Disclaimer: Some people have asked me the following questions about my username. None of them are true. They are funny. But, not true: Q: Do you throw French people? A: No. But, it sounds fun. Q. Tosser is British slang for masturbating. Do you help get frogs off? A. No. If I had known more British slang, I probably would have gone with “Frogthrower”."

I was going to make a thread "Catch 22 versus mrfrog"

but this was the best I could find.

1/2/2012 12:21:24 AM

-El Nachó, having intelligent conversation since never.

1/2/2012 12:31:33 AM

wut is going on in here?

1/2/2012 12:32:27 AM

Just trying to chase El Nacho out of your thread.

1/2/2012 12:34:04 AM

^^^^^I can't believe I'm actually responding to such lunacy, but...{sigh}

Even if there was a device that was in charge of sorting people, statistically speaking (using your own stats even) the amount of times it would be wrong is so small it's practically insignificant in real world examples. And in the rare event when it was wrong, the burden would be on the person in the wheelchair to say "Hey guys, you got it wrong, I'm actually supposed to go up the ramp" and then they would. Instead you've just installed a default burden on everyone in the name of equality.

Also, I didn't say that the two examples matched up perfectly one to one. Only that they were both equally stupid. I still firmly stand by this assessment.

1/2/2012 12:34:48 AM

thanks

thinking about nachos is making me hungry though

1/2/2012 12:35:06 AM