^ the man speaks the truth. people like luvinglife are exactly why the phrase "pretty white girl syndrome" exists.

7/2/2008 6:40:59 AM

Quote :

"How many helpless victims do you think there are in this country every day?"

i don't find this surprising. I mean if the president got shot the whole country would be in a roar.

Not only was she blonde but she was also SBP of UNC and an outstanding college student. Regardless of being blonde and with tits those two former qualities earn more outrage from the populace then some ghetto chick working at McD's who gets murdered by her drug dealer boyfriend after sleeping with Tyrone from the other gang.

7/2/2008 1:18:25 PM

why?

Are you really comparing an assassination on arguably the most powerful individual in the world, which will have a marked effect on the country as a whole

to a girl who is a figurehead for student government?

Really?

7/2/2008 1:26:20 PM

Imagine that, another HUR "example" populated with black stereotypes. How racist do you get?

[Edited on July 2, 2008 at 1:27 PM. Reason : her?]

7/2/2008 1:26:46 PM

Quote :

" Are you really comparing an assassination on arguably the most powerful individual in the world, which will have a marked effect on the country as a whole to a girl who is a figurehead for student government?"

set 'em up

7/2/2008 1:41:03 PM

he is right the presidents life is worth more than a normal persons'

7/2/2008 1:58:24 PM

Quote :

"why? Are you really comparing an assassination on arguably the most powerful individual in the world, which will have a marked effect on the country as a whole to a girl who is a figurehead for student government? Really? "

I remember having this debate all the time during intro to polysci all the time, the bottom line is people are not vulcans or robots focused solely data, although sometimes I wish they were more that way, otherwise they would make road and car safety a bigger priority than terrorism, but regardless in this case it's the issue that is important and people are justified to be outraged at this crime

and anyways who is to say what kind of potential this girl had, she could have saved people's lives being a doctor which is more productive than some idiot in the whitehouse attacking other countries cause he doesn't know how to deal with terrorism

[Edited on July 2, 2008 at 4:15 PM. Reason : k]

7/2/2008 4:15:00 PM

Quote :

"and anyways who is to say what kind of potential this girl had, she could have saved people's lives being a doctor which is more productive than some idiot in the whitehouse attacking other countries cause he doesn't know how to deal with terrorism"

Wow.... way to be a liberal fuckhead

7/2/2008 4:49:59 PM

Quote :

"How racist do you get"

I prefer to call it observation

7/2/2008 5:48:40 PM

omg racism

7/2/2008 6:09:20 PM

kill those useless fucktards.

7/2/2008 7:58:51 PM

[/quote]"How many helpless victims do you think there are in this country every day?" - one is too many

Quote :

""Do you doubt that this is true for EVERY SINGLE PERSON WHO HAS KNOWN THEY ARE ABOUT TO DIE THROUGHOUT THE HISTORY OF THE GOD DAMNED WORLD?!?" - of course - come on we're talking about a 22 year old - just too damn young to die - white, black, yellow - doesn't really matter rich, poor (my)Quote : "I usually would think living in jail would be better punishment than being able to check out via the death penalty, however there are certain folks that do not deserve to live - even in prison." reply [quote] "This is exactly my point: "Normally, I'm against the death penalty...but this time I guess I'm not." No guessing here - I think what I said was - "Usually the death penalty doesn't quite sit well with" (did I say why?) "but this is certainly not one of those times. If they skate by the D/P, well let's just say they have created their own hell." "

Don't straddle the fucking fence. Either you want a certain outcome in general or you don't. Otherwise, you're just being swayed by a pretty face who died in a similar way to your "friend's sister."
I'm not on any fence, life matters are not to be generalized, (that's like saying anyone who is ever grumpy people should be put on an island - w/no internet!) ..... each such crime will hopefully be brought to a trial - as far as [quote]"who died in a similar way to your "friend's sister."
thank you for your compassion

[quote]"if you think they are special"?" The only thing special about them is they are the scum of the earth, anyone who would do this to any other being, does not deserve to sit out their life in prison and hopefully think about the horrific crime they've committed every day of the rest of their life.
and we're back to where we started

(God forbid I ever wind up charged with anything and have you as my fellow peer!)

the sky is blue

7/3/2008 1:07:26 AM

yeah I've had diarrhea that was more special than those two assclowns.

7/3/2008 3:39:19 AM

luvinglife, I really, really want to be able to respond to what you posted, but it's barely legible. Between what appear to be random insertions of

Quote :

" and the otherwise appalling syntax and grammar, I'm flabbergasted. I shall do my very best, however. [quote]come on we're talking about a 22 year old - just too damn young to die"

Ah, I see.

And precisely how old must a person be before they are no longer too young to die?

Would you have said that about someone who was 25? 30? 60?

Quote :

"life matters are not to be generalized"

No, life matters are not to be subject to whims regarding the age/sex/race/status/etc.

How about you save us some trouble and explain why specifically you support the death penalty in this case, but not in most others? How dissimilar can a case be from this one before you hold up a hand and say, "Nope, can't execute those guys"?

Actually, pretty much everything after this last quote gets my vote for "Least Sense Made, Lounge Category, 2008." Perhaps you'd like to clean it up and I'll take a crack at it.

7/3/2008 4:04:06 AM

kill them bitches.

7/3/2008 6:11:29 AM

Federal carjacking charges possible in Carson case
http://www.wral.com/news/local/story/3161089/

How can federal charges come into play?

7/7/2008 3:57:13 PM

i dont understand, federal carjacking carries a death penalty?


i understand that killing during the commision of a felony is auto 1st degree and that can carry the death penalty, but i dont understand how the carjacking thing fits in, unless they are tryna keep an ace in the hole in case they dont receive the death penalty upon conviction


or if they arent convicted they can get the same punishment on a lesser crime? i can only see this as some sort of legal circumvention trick


personally i dont think theyll need it

7/7/2008 4:22:51 PM

^^the feds can charge anything they want that hasn't already been charged, period.

its pretty normal for both agencies to charge them with different parts of whatever the crime is. i'm not really sure of the reason besides double-fucking them

Quote :

"Federal carjacking can carry a death penalty sentence if federal prosecutors can prove the carjacking was committed during a homicide."

..these fuckers are getting the death penalty one way or another.. they've got it coming from two angles now

[Edited on July 7, 2008 at 4:27 PM. Reason : asdf]

7/7/2008 4:24:17 PM

Carjacking is a federal offense, and killing someone in the commission of a carjacking is a capital offense (as it is in NC). It's just a legal maneuver to get Atwater the death penalty in federal court if he doesn't get it in Orange County.

7/7/2008 4:27:05 PM

yea exactly

7/7/2008 4:27:25 PM

So maybe this is the loophole to get Lovette the death penalty, because he can't get the death penalty otherwise because he was only 17? Hmm.

[Edited on July 7, 2008 at 4:43 PM. Reason : ss]

7/7/2008 4:42:49 PM

i'm not arguing against capital punishment, but i have a question for all of you rolling in here w/ 'kill these fucking worthless pieces of shit', etc:

do you want to kill everyone convicted of murder?

7/7/2008 4:46:26 PM

take that shit to the soapbox

Quote :

"So maybe this is the loophole to get Lovette the death penalty, because he can't get the death penalty otherwise because he was only 17? Hmm."

wouldn't surprise me

[Edited on July 7, 2008 at 4:54 PM. Reason : asdf]

7/7/2008 4:54:39 PM

^^ first degree murder?


yes

second degree murder and manslaughter, absolutely not

shit happens and people lose their cool sometimes, they deserve to think about what they did for a long period of time.

people who plan shit like this, or are tryna do some bullshit like rob or jack somebody and wind up killin em?? hell yea fuck it sentence em all to death once convicted

[Edited on July 7, 2008 at 5:02 PM. Reason : d]

7/7/2008 5:01:37 PM

Quote :

"^^ first degree murder? yes second degree murder and manslaughter, absolutely not shit happens and people lose their cool sometimes, they deserve to think about what they did for a long period of time. "

well it's a good thing that isn't always the case, because sometimes people get convicted for 1st degree murder when it should be 2nd degree. for example, kid i grew up with killed a sheriff (it was a pretty big story, i'm sure everyone around here remembers it). he was on probation and trying out his new gun as target practice, cop pulled up, he panicked, fired a shot, and killed him. he got convicted on first degree murder charges because they somehow argued it was "premeditated." luckily he did not get the death penalty. and no, i am not trying to stand up for him, and i still think he should be in jail for a very, very, very long time, but i also don't think that he should have been convicted of 1st degree murder. he was probably lucky not to get the death penalty.

[Edited on July 7, 2008 at 5:11 PM. Reason : .]

7/7/2008 5:10:26 PM

well thats what sentencing is about


you consider those mitigating factors and their feasible likelihood


if you are convicted of murder in the first degree, the death penalty should be strongly considered

ill say it that way, though i believe that the sentence should be based on the findings of the court, not how sympathetic the defendants best friends are towards him or her...in terms of maintainign consistency

thats kinda crazy that theyd call that first degree murder, prolly some other stuff goin on you aint tellin or have no knowledge of

[Edited on July 7, 2008 at 5:19 PM. Reason : f]

7/7/2008 5:18:23 PM

Quote :

"well it's a good thing that isn't always the case, because sometimes people get convicted for 1st degree murder when it should be 2nd degree. for example, kid i grew up with killed a sheriff (it was a pretty big story, i'm sure everyone around here remembers it). he was on probation and trying out his new gun as target practice, cop pulled up, he panicked, fired a shot, and killed him. he got convicted on first degree murder charges because they somehow argued it was "premeditated." luckily he did not get the death penalty. and no, i am not trying to stand up for him, and i still think he should be in jail for a very, very, very long time, but i also don't think that he should have been convicted of 1st degree murder. he was probably lucky not to get the death penalty."

You need to read up on how the law deals with cop killers.

7/7/2008 6:48:32 PM

Quote :

"well it's a good thing that isn't always the case, because sometimes people get convicted for 1st degree murder when it should be 2nd degree. for example, kid i grew up with killed a sheriff (it was a pretty big story, i'm sure everyone around here remembers it). he was on probation and trying out his new gun as target practice, cop pulled up, he panicked, fired a shot, and killed him. he got convicted on first degree murder charges because they somehow argued it was "premeditated." luckily he did not get the death penalty. and no, i am not trying to stand up for him, and i still think he should be in jail for a very, very, very long time, but i also don't think that he should have been convicted of 1st degree murder. he was probably lucky not to get the death penalty."

The one on Holly Springs road? I lived a few miles from there when that happened.

7/7/2008 6:52:12 PM

^yea, the place where the new ymca is. i got in trouble for camping there once

[Edited on July 7, 2008 at 7:20 PM. Reason : .]

7/7/2008 7:20:22 PM

http://www.wral.com/news/local/story/3161089/

Quote :

"Eve Carson murder suspects indicted on additional charges Hillsborough, N.C. — The two men charged with murder in the death of University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill Student Body President Eve Carson were each indicted Monday on additional charges, including first-degree kidnapping and armed robbery. Demario James Atwater, 22, and Laurence Alvin Lovette Jr., 17, also face one count each of felonious larceny and felonious possession of stolen goods. Atwater was also indicted on a charge of possession of a firearm by a felon, and possession of weapon of mass destruction for the size of the shotgun that investigators believe was used to killed Carson. Orange County District Attorney Jim Woodall said that if the overall size of a shotgun is less than 26 inches or the barrel is less than 18 inches, it could be considered a weapon of mass destruction."

I'm all for throwing the book at them, but I don't know what to say to that.

7/7/2008 7:52:25 PM

that's pushing the bullshit-o-meter

weapons of mass destruction?? come the fuck on.

[Edited on July 7, 2008 at 7:53 PM. Reason : i'm all for them dying but damn]

7/7/2008 7:53:45 PM

^ thats actually pretty common charge if you have a nig-rigged sawwed off shot-gun

7/7/2008 8:28:08 PM

I assume that means that at least one of the weapons was recovered.

7/7/2008 9:20:00 PM

Never heard the term WMD applied to that. NFA laws refer to such a thing as a "destructive device" or a "short-barreled shotgun". Sounds like something WRAL cooked up to make it sound scarier.

7/8/2008 8:49:39 AM

Quote :

"^ thats actually pretty common charge if you have a nig-rigged sawwed off shot-gun"

ditto. WMD has been the term used for any "shortie" shotgun or "street-sweeper" style shotgun...i've read/seen it before other than the news.


That's why a person has to have a Class III to purchase such type of weapon (equivalent to a full-auto rifle/pistol)

[Edited on July 8, 2008 at 9:07 AM. Reason : is the correct my b, myb]

7/8/2008 9:05:43 AM

The Supreme Court has ruled that the death penalty for defendants <18 when the crime was committed cannot be executed. It doesn't matter if they are tried in State or Federal Court. The additional Federal charges are really only meaningful for Atwater (assuming the prosecution doesn't screw up Lovette's case), providing another venue in which he might get the death sentence.

7/8/2008 10:16:46 AM

Quote :

"The Supreme Court has ruled that the death penalty for defendants <18 when the crime was committed cannot be executed. It doesn't matter if they are tried in State or Federal Court. The additional Federal charges are really only meaningful for Atwater (assuming the prosecution doesn't screw up Lovette's case), providing another venue in which he might get the death sentence."

i fail to understand the reasoning why a 17 year old who shot someone 4 times and probably would've been responsible for her death without the shotgun blast can't be put down like a dog just because he's a few months away from being an "official" adult as our society has defined it

7/8/2008 12:42:47 PM

Quote :

"The Supreme Court has ruled that the death penalty for defendants <18 when the crime was committed cannot be executed."

i'm sure the Aryan Brotherhood will "appeal"

7/8/2008 12:54:52 PM

^^because he's not 18? where's the cutoff point? 18. not 17 and a few months. not how old you think is appropriate. 18 is 18.

[Edited on July 8, 2008 at 12:56 PM. Reason : ^]

7/8/2008 12:55:29 PM

So then what would be a better cutoff for charging people as an adult? 18 seems pretty reasonable if you consider that that is generally accepted as the age at which people become an adult. It's ridiculous for people under 18 to not be allowed all of the privileges of being an adult (being able to vote, buy cigarettes, etc) but be held responsible as an adult...either they are fully an adult and have all the rights, privileges and accountability of an adult or they don't...can't have it both ways

7/8/2008 1:00:19 PM

i think you actually can have it both ways

dont you often hear the term "he's going to be tried as an adult"

7/8/2008 1:02:07 PM

Quote :

"i fail to understand the reasoning why a 17 year old who shot someone 4 times and probably would've been responsible for her death without the shotgun blast can't be put down like a dog just because he's a few months away from being an "official" adult as our society has defined it"

yeah, you're running into a slippery-slope argument there. It may not make perfect sense or be totally fair, but they law has to draw the line somewhere

7/8/2008 1:02:18 PM

Quote :

"i think you actually can have it both ways dont you often hear the term "he's going to be tried as an adult""

Sure, people under 18 get charged as adults all the time, but it doesn't make it any less hypocritical...you should either never charge minors as adults (and then you can deny them the rights and privileges of being an adult) or change the age at which you become an adult and allow people at that age to buy cigarettes, porn and to vote. That way you are consistent in your application of the law.

7/8/2008 1:20:09 PM

Quote :

"you should either never charge minors as adults...or change the age at which you become an adult"

i agree in principle but i think 1st degree murder is an extenuating circumstance

7/8/2008 1:23:13 PM

Quote :

"Carson indictments released Indictments returned Monday in the Eve Carson homicide case reveal some new information about the weapons believed to be used in the UNC senior's death. The documents, released Tuesday, state the suspects used a sawed-off Harrington & Richardson Topper model 12-gauge shotgun and an Excam GT-27 .25-caliber semi-automatic pistol. Already charged with first-degree murder, Demario James Atwater, 22, and Laurence Alvin Lovette Jr., 17, were indicted Monday on one count each of first-degree kidnapping, armed robbery, felonious larceny and felonious possession of stolen goods."

http://www.wral.com/news/local/story/3169087/

Pictures of the two online:



[Edited on July 8, 2008 at 1:55 PM. Reason : .]

7/8/2008 1:55:21 PM

that .25 looks just like an F.I.E.



i've got one...its a piece of junk but its small

its also in the top 10 list of guns used to commit crimes

7/8/2008 1:56:58 PM

Quote :

"Letter confirms federal probe of Eve Carson homicide Hillsborough, N.C. — A letter made public Thursday confirms federal authorities have opened an investigation into the March 5 shooting death of the University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill's student body president. U.S. Attorney Anna Mills Wagoner says in the letter, dated April 23, to Orange County District Attorney Jim Woodall, that investigators opened the investigation nine days after Eve Carson, 22, was found dead several blocks from the UNC campus. Federal sources told WRAL News earlier this month that investigators are looking at carjacking charges against the two men charged in her death – Demario James Atwater, 22, and Laurence Alvin Lovette Jr., 17. Both already face state charges of first-degree murder, kidnapping and armed robbery, as well as other charges. If federal prosecutors bring charges, Woodall said, that would mean a separate prosecution; federal involvement would not affect his state case "They might have some similar charges, but usually, they are going to have some charges for crimes that, frankly, don't exist at the state level," Woodall said. A federal carjacking charge can carry a death penalty sentence if prosecutors can prove the carjacking was committed during a homicide. Possible federal charges are significant because Orange County juries have rarely sent someone to death row. The last defendant executed from Orange County was in 1948. "I think it's well known," Woodall said. "It's been many years since around 1970 or 1971 since there's been a death verdict returned in Orange County." Under a U.S. Supreme Court ruling, Lovette cannot be tried on capital murder charges, because he was under the age of 18 at the time he allegedly committed the crime. A hearing to determine whether Atwater will face the death penalty is scheduled for Aug. 11. Carson, who was a senior from Athens, Ga., had been shot five times, including once to her head with a shotgun, according to an autopsy report; search warrants suggest both suspects might have shot her."

http://www.wral.com/news/local/story/3310693/

7/31/2008 10:45:28 PM

Quote :

"Never heard the term WMD applied to that. NFA laws refer to such a thing as a "destructive device" or a "short-barreled shotgun". Sounds like something WRAL cooked up to make it sound scarier."

In addition to the federal laws that apply, NC law considers a short-barreled shotgun a WMD.

[Edited on July 31, 2008 at 11:14 PM. Reason : .]

7/31/2008 11:14:24 PM

Yeah, it's bullshit, but who cares.

7/31/2008 11:21:33 PM

mass destruction?

8/1/2008 9:27:08 AM