Page 12

just stop smoking, its pretty simple, and live longer

4/30/2009 2:49:17 PM

Quote :

"do you want to make more money, or work in a nonsmoking environment "

Unreal.

Quote :

"what about retail?"

Different skill set than waiting tables, assuming everyone that is currently working in a smoking environment could simply switch to retail.

4/30/2009 2:49:22 PM

it all boils down to choice vs gov intervention...I think that people are capable of and should be able to make their own decision in situations like this, as there are ample alternatives should you not want to be around it....Apparently others believe that the gov should choose for everyone (owners, workers and patrons alike)....Sad thing is you'll probably get your way, as the gov is making more and more choices for people these days.

4/30/2009 3:05:49 PM

ATTN: SMOKERS

GO OUTSIDE TO FUCKING SMOKE

5/2/2009 2:24:26 AM

http://www.news-record.com/content/2009/05/06/article/senate_panel_may_weaken_smoking_ban

The senate thinks that they can pass some version of the bill, but I question what "somewhere between the strict version and the house version" means... At least it's a start.

Quote :

"As of Tuesday afternoon, the weakened version of the smoking ban to be considered today had not been made public. But those involved say it will likely be somewhere between the current strict version and the version passed by the House, which is considered “gutted” by backers of smoking restrictions. The House version would let virtually any bar opt out of the ban if they did not serve or hire anyone under the age of 18."

5/6/2009 11:06:15 AM

Quote :

"I question what "somewhere between the strict version and the house version" means"

my guess is that bars will still have the option to opt out of the ban...I don't know any bars that employ people under age 18 anyway

most likely, you guys will have to deal with being exposed to smoke when you choose to go out and binge drink

5/6/2009 12:22:04 PM

Quote :

"It's looking more like the Legislature wants a broad smoking ban in tobacco-growing North Carolina. The Senate scheduled a second and final vote Monday on a measure that would ban lighting up in all enclosed restaurants and bars. Senators gave an initial OK to the bill last week. Another "yes" vote would return the bill to the House, which passed an earlier version extending the ban to work sites where children under age 18 visit. The House could agree with the Senate or seek a compromise."

http://www.wral.com/news/state/story/5121758/

5/11/2009 2:32:25 PM

Quote :

"work sites where children under age 18 visit"

wtf does that mean. just stop making cigs i guess

5/11/2009 2:36:06 PM

^^ That article has made me lose faith in WRAL.

5/11/2009 2:59:24 PM

You had faith in wral?

5/11/2009 3:10:37 PM

NC Senate Clears Smoking Ban In Restaurants, Bars http://tinyurl.com/o2fh6x

Now it goes back to the house so they can agree or compromise. My guess - some stand-alone bars will still be allowed to permit smoking, maybe via permit or something, but all restaurants, with or without bars, will be under the ban.

5/11/2009 10:30:49 PM

private clubs and cigar bars will still allow smoking.

[Edited on May 11, 2009 at 10:52 PM. Reason : Thank goodness. ]

5/11/2009 10:52:02 PM

they'll just make every bar a "private club" with a membership cost of a nickel or something available at the door

5/11/2009 11:03:49 PM

hooooooooooleeeeeeeeee shiiiiiiiiit

The N.C. General Assembly has passed statewide ban on smoking in all restaurants and bars.

The bill now goes to Gov. Bev Perdue, who is expected to sign it.
http://www2.morganton.com/content/2009/may/13/general-assembly-bans-smoking-all-restaurants-and-/

5/13/2009 4:11:30 PM

^^half the bars here require membership now (like the goat, buckhead, mosquito, etc), but i doubt that will fit in the loophole.

5/13/2009 4:17:28 PM

Damn, this is so surprising. I think some non-smoking pigs just flew by as hell froze under them. One of you law dudes, sort this out for me. Am I right? Basically regular bars are not exempt, even if they requiremembership?

" "Private club". – A country club or an organization that maintains selective members, is operated by the membership, does not provide food or lodging for pay to anyone who is not a member or a member's guest, and is either incorporated as a nonprofit corporation in accordance with Chapter 55A of the General Statutes or is exempt from federal income tax under the Internal Revenue Code as defined in G.S. 105-130.2(1). For the purposes of this Article, private club includes country club."

http://www.ncleg.net/Sessions/2009/Bills/House/HTML/H2v8.html

5/13/2009 4:31:17 PM

Damn, this is so surprising. I think some non-smoking pigs just flew by as hell froze under them. One of you law dudes, sort this out for me. Am I right? Basically regular bars are not exempt, even if they requiremembership?

" "Private club". – A country club or an organization that maintains selective members, is operated by the membership, does not provide food or lodging for pay to anyone who is not a member or a member's guest, and is either incorporated as a nonprofit corporation in accordance with Chapter 55A of the General Statutes or is exempt from federal income tax under the Internal Revenue Code as defined in G.S. 105-130.2(1). For the purposes of this Article, private club includes country club."

http://www.ncleg.net/Sessions/2009/Bills/House/HTML/H2v8.html

A cigar bar if smoke from the cigar bar does not migrate into an enclosed area where smoking is prohibited pursuant to this Article. A cigar bar that begins operation after July 1, 2009, may only allow smoking if it is located in a freestanding structure occupied solely by the cigar bar and smoke from the cigar bar does not migrate into an enclosed area where smoking is prohibited pursuant to this Article. To qualify under this subsection, the cigar bar must satisfactorily report on a quarterly basis to the Department, on a form prescribed by the Department, the revenue generated from the sale of alcoholic beverages and cigars as a percentage of quarterly gross revenue. The Department shall determine whether any additional documentation is required of the cigar bar to authenticate or verify revenue data submitted by the cigar bar. This subdivision shall not apply to any business that is established for the purpose of avoiding compliance with this Article.

5/13/2009 4:31:54 PM

looks like hookah bars are a thing of the past

5/13/2009 4:39:17 PM

My guess would be they can stay based on the "cigar bar" exemption. Maybe all bars can just become "cigar bars"...

5/13/2009 4:45:27 PM

im not very happy about this

5/13/2009 4:45:27 PM

Most places will become private clubs and it won't even affect them.

Place such as the goat and jackpot can keep their "charm"

5/13/2009 4:46:50 PM

Read Again:

Quote :

""Private club". – A country club or an organization that maintains selective members, is operated by the membership, does not provide food or lodging for pay to anyone who is not a member or a member's guest, and is either incorporated as a nonprofit corporation in accordance with Chapter 55A of the General Statutes or is exempt from federal income tax under the Internal Revenue Code as defined in G.S. 105-130.2(1). For the purposes of this Article, private club includes country club." "

Unless I'm missing something, I think you're wrong.

Also, as for cigar bars:

Quote :

""Cigar bar". – An establishment with a permit to sell alcoholic beverages pursuant to subdivision (1), (3), (5), or (10) of G.S. 18B-1001 that satisfies all of the following: a. Generates sixty percent (60%) or more of its quarterly gross revenue from the sale of alcoholic beverages and twenty-five percent (25%) or more of its quarterly gross revenue from the sale of cigars; b. Has a humidor on the premises; and c. Does not allow individuals under the age of 21 to enter the premises."

[Edited on May 13, 2009 at 4:50 PM. Reason : .]

5/13/2009 4:50:06 PM

private clubs are exempt from the smoking bill.

are you suggesting the bars cannot become private clubs, because it seems to me they can as long as they don't serve food.

5/13/2009 4:51:50 PM

they can provide food, but only to members

5/13/2009 4:52:50 PM

It seems to me that to be a private club, all of these must apply:

- maintains selective members
- is operated by the membership
- does not provide food or lodging for pay to anyone who is not a member or a member's guest
- is either incorporated as a nonprofit corporation in accordance with Chapter 55A of the General Statutes or is exempt from federal income tax under the Internal Revenue Code as defined

This is an "and" condition, not an "or" condition. So unless your bar can somehow become nonprofit, it's not exempt. This was used to make sure lion's club, vfw, etc could still allow smoking. If you're a business, no smoking allowed.

[Edited on May 13, 2009 at 4:57 PM. Reason : .]

5/13/2009 4:57:01 PM

are country clubs non-profit? it would seem to me that if they are allowed then bars should be as well.

5/13/2009 4:58:05 PM

Maybe they are non-profit, not sure, but it would seem to me that rich people get what they want

5/13/2009 4:59:05 PM

country clubs in general are non profit. All proceeds either go towards expansion or dues are lowered. Country clubs are owned by its members as well. You would need the bar to become run by its members to allow this.

5/13/2009 5:04:16 PM

Soon as this becomes law, I'm going to do a bar crawl to all of the bars that are notorious in Winston Salem for being smoke-filled hell-holes.

5/13/2009 5:17:07 PM

Even after it becomes law, though, it's going to take a while to affect anyone. The fine is only $50 if you smoke, and that's only after you've ignored a warning from the proprietor, assuming he even tries to stop you. And the bars themselves are only punished if the health inspector decides to punish them, and then the fine is only $200 I think.

A person who manages, operates, or controls a restaurant or bar in which smoking is prohibited shall:

(1) Conspicuously post signs clearly stating that smoking is prohibited. The signs may include the international "No Smoking" symbol, which consists of a pictorial representation of a burning cigarette enclosed in a red circle with a red bar across it.

(2) Remove all indoor ashtrays and other smoking receptacles.

(3) Direct a person who is smoking to extinguish the lighted tobacco product.

(b) Continuing to smoke in a nonsmoking area described in this Part following oral or written notice by the person in charge of the area or the person's designee constitutes an infraction, and the person committing the infraction may be punished by a fine of not more than fifty dollars ($50.00).

(c) Conviction of an infraction under this section has no consequence other than payment of a penalty. A person found responsible for a violation of this section may not be assessed court costs.

(d) Notwithstanding G.S. 130A-25, a violation of this Part shall not be punishable as a misdemeanor.


...


A local health director may take the following actions and may impose the following administrative penalty on a person who manages, operates, or controls a public place or place of employment and fails to comply with the provisions of Part 1C of Article 23 of this Chapter or with rules adopted thereunder or with local ordinances, rules, laws, or policies adopted pursuant to Part 2 of Article 23 of this Chapter:

(1) First violation. – Provide the person in violation with written notice of the person's first violation and notification of action to be taken in the event of subsequent violations.

(2) Second violation. – Provide the person in violation with written notice of the person's second violation and notification of administrative penaltie s to be imposed for subsequent violations.

(3) Subsequent violations. – Impose on the person in violation an administrative penalty of not more than two hundred dollars ($200.00) for the third and subsequent violations.

Each day on which a violation of this Article or rules adopted pursuant to this Article occurs may be considered a separate and distinct violation. Notwithstanding G.S. 130A-25, a violation of Article 23 of this Chapter shall not be punishable as a criminal violation."

5/13/2009 5:33:44 PM

5/13/2009 5:41:31 PM

it's performance art.

5/13/2009 6:22:02 PM

That comic makes no sense. Where can you allow smoking but not drinking?

5/13/2009 6:59:50 PM

the smoking ban seeks to ban smoking anywhere food or drinks are served. so no food or drinks, and i guess you'd be allowed to smoke.

5/13/2009 7:53:50 PM

DirtyGreek, where are you finding that definition of "Private Club"?

I found this on the NC ABC's website: (http://reports.ncabc.state.nc.us/uploads/resources/24dce8e93e1e4c4eb0dfd0910c697fed.pdf)

Quote :

"Q: What qualifies a business as a private club? A: N.C.G.S. 18B- 1000 (5) states “A private club is an establishment that is organized and operated solely for a social, recreational, patriotic, or fraternal purpose and that is not open to the general public, but is open only to the members of the organization and their bona fide guests”."

Talking with a friend, he was telling me that if a place serves mixed drinks and it isn't a restaurant (getting 51% of its profits from food sales) then it is a "private club". "bars" only serve beer and wine.

If that's true, then I'd bet there are actually more "private clubs" in NC than there are "bars". If so, then dammit, why couldn't they've passed this with "private clubs" not exempt from the ban

5/13/2009 8:26:47 PM

what i wanna know is how this is gonna affect hookah bars and cigar lounges

i mean, anyone who goes to a hookah bar and bitches about the smoke is probably a genuine fucktard.

5/13/2009 8:44:33 PM

my thread has a better title

5/13/2009 9:32:07 PM

indeed it does, my apologies

5/13/2009 9:32:45 PM

I don't smoke, but I also didn't give a fuck enough about other peoples' lives to actively get their 'bad' habits banned out of establishments that they frequent.

5/13/2009 9:33:33 PM

here it is.. a bit older than what i read, but pretty close to the numbers i remember

Quote :

"Elon, N.C. — Sixty-eight percent of North Carolina residents support a statewide law that would ban smoking in public places, including public buildings, offices bars and restaurants, according to the latest results of last month's Elon University poll."

yet at the same time

Quote :

"Although a majority of respondents indicated support for legislation that would ban smoking in public places, in assessing who is responsible for the regulation of smoking, 62 percent said the decision should be left to business owners."

http://www.wral.com/news/local/story/1883905/

5/13/2009 9:37:56 PM

i generally oppose the gubment telling anyone what to do on their own property, but i also realize that very few restaurant owners would voluntarily go smoke-free, especially in NC. i fucking despise breathing in someone else's carcinogens.

5/13/2009 9:42:39 PM

Quote :

"If that's true, then I'd bet there are actually more "private clubs" in NC than there are "bars". If so, then dammit, why couldn't they've passed this with "private clubs" not exempt from the ban "

well lets see. oh, i know, because of the word PRIVATE

5/13/2009 9:46:20 PM

I cant wait to see this getting implemented.

THAT SHIT IS GONNA BE A NIGHTMARE.

I can see it right now waiting an hour for a drink in a small bar because the entire staff is trying to kick out some drunk bastard who will not put his cig out.

5/13/2009 9:47:19 PM

photogrob, I'm getting that definition from the bill, here. Bills define the important terms used within them, and that's how the bill defines private club. So your friend appears to be incorrect. As I also already said (I've repeated myself alot in this thread, it feels like ) This was used to make sure lion's club, vfw, etc could still allow smoking. If you're a business, no smoking allowed.


fredbot, cigar bars are also covered in the law. they must make 25% of their money through cigar sales and 60% through alcohol. I'm not sure how that affects hookah bars, since the law specifically says "cigars"

http://www.ncleg.net/Sessions/2009/Bills/House/HTML/H2v8.html

Quote :

"THAT SHIT IS GONNA BE A NIGHTMARE. "

Especially with the whole bartender tells person to put out cigarrette, then calls in authorities to give him a measly $50 ticket thing.

[Edited on May 14, 2009 at 8:54 AM. Reason : .]

[Edited on May 14, 2009 at 8:55 AM. Reason : .]

5/14/2009 8:52:26 AM

when i was watching the news last night it said that some bars would be able to circumvent the law by acting as a private club, however, this is local news so i doubt they got it right. Further conflicting information arose when they said that the bill would not take effect until 2010 yet the bill itself says its effective immediately upon becoming law.

5/14/2009 10:52:50 AM

supposedly the new hookah bar in boone is circumventing local laws by calling it "performance art," and by entering the premises you agree to taking part in the performance.

5/14/2009 10:54:32 AM

That was tried in other states and quickly quashed. We'll see hwo it goes here. I am confused about one thing, the law seems to prevent bars from circumventing the law by being private clubs, but then wxii says:

The final exemption and the largest are any so-called "private" clubs, like West End Opera House. It includes bars that don't sell food, make more than 50 percent of their profit on liquor and have a members-only policy.

http://www.wxii12.com/news/19452640/detail.html

That doesn't jive with my reading of the law. Anyone?

5/14/2009 12:05:32 PM

Quote :

"Even after it becomes law, though, it's going to take a while to affect anyone. The fine is only $50 if you smoke, and that's only after you've ignored a warning from the proprietor, assuming he even tries to stop you. And the bars themselves are only punished if the health inspector decides to punish them, and then the fine is only $200 I think. "

actually i will take it upon myself to take care of any rogue smokers....

"I'm sorry i don't know how that beer spilled on you"

5/14/2009 3:56:57 PM

SO TUFF

5/14/2009 3:58:54 PM

thats a good way to get the shit beat out of you by strangers

but you have the choice of whether or not to do it

maybe the govt should force you to deal with rogue smokers by passing legislation

5/14/2009 3:59:14 PM