1) War is always paid for with inflation. The people are not likely to support a military empire if they are told outright that it means higher taxes. They will, however, support an empire if they are told that taxes will be lower and that we will be nuked unless we take action. Inflation is a way for politicians to raise money without having to pay the consequences at the voting booth...at least not right away. Point is, these wars that are ruining so many lives could not be waged without the backing of the Federal Reserve.

2) What we're doing is essentially currency manipulation. You can say that it's necessary to do all this money creation, but we trade dollars for foreign currencies and produced goods, and it means a lower standard of living for those countries. To wipe our hands of this mess and pretend that there are no negative externalities is a very nationalistic and selfish behavior.

9/19/2011 3:17:38 PM

http://www.usatoday.com/news/politics/story/2011-09-19/republican-poll-gop-perry-romney/50467944/1

Perry 31%
Romney 24%
Paul 13%

Nobody else over 5%.

Yet, the next debate will still treat one of the five-percenters as the strongest contender with the top two.

Paul is also at the same level McCain had in September 2007.

*I still don't think Paul can win, but I'm loving this.

9/19/2011 5:50:01 PM

go RP!!

9/19/2011 5:54:59 PM

Quote :

"The Ron Paul party, unlike the Republican Party, is full of people who whisper darkly about “international bankers,” “the New World Order,” “globalization,” “American imperialism,” “war profiteers,” and the like. They hate Dick Cheney more than any three-espresso leftist ever hated Dick Cheney. And if Ron Paul is not the nominee — and let me go ahead and break the bad news to you guys: He’s not going to be — many of them will not be supporting the Republican in 2012. They’re already talking about an independent or third-party run for the most electable Republican who isn’t going to be elected as a Republican. And the fact that Ron Paul is on his way out — he’s not running for the House again — has a few Republicans worried that he’s going to be a looser cannon than usual."

That's from the national review!

http://bit.ly/r7vBHJ

9/22/2011 7:29:24 PM

Quote :

"But, seeing as how he has such a hard-on for states rights, I don't think he'd...try and [sic] get rid of row [sic] v. wade. "

Ummm...

9/22/2011 7:59:36 PM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tI-yStFdjfQ

Paul's answers in the debate tonight. It's 7 minutes of a 2-hour debate, and that includes time for the question.

Total question count (including the 3 questions asked to all candidates):

Ron Paul: 6
Perry- 14
Romney- 15
Huntsman- 9
Santorum- 9
Bachman- 8
Herman Cain- 7
Gingrich- 7
Johnson- 5

[Edited on September 23, 2011 at 12:28 AM. Reason : a]

9/23/2011 12:24:47 AM

Paul is not a Republican. Why should they want to talk to him?

9/23/2011 12:35:14 AM

thanks for the clip. i didn't get to see the debate yet but plan too soon. i liked his answers. he seemed very much more composed this time around.

9/23/2011 10:21:36 AM

There's always 2016.

9/26/2011 10:29:16 AM

Last night's Ron Paul interview on the Daily Show. Go to 21:45 for the start of the interview. John Stewart asks some good questions.

http://www.thedailyshow.com/full-episodes/mon-september-26-2011-ron-paul

9/27/2011 1:06:21 PM

Ron Paul is a good guy but his idea of state's rights is absolutely retarded. This isn't 2000BC. Human civilization has been around for ~5000 years. It's not 1776 either, who the fuck cares what a bunch of elitist slave owners with a handful good ideas thought nearly 250 years ago. We know what works and we know what doesn't work by now. There is no point to his Darwinian idea (I thought republicans didn't believe in that shit anyway) that 50 states should just experiment on their own with retarded shit that we know will fail. Even the current system allows states like South Carolina and Alabama to devolve into 3rd world countries. There is no need for that when we can just implement everything that works at the federal level and maintain at the very least a high standard of education, health care, utility services, transportation, etc.. in every state.

9/27/2011 1:28:18 PM

one size does not fit all

9/27/2011 1:33:28 PM

Quote :

"We know what works and we know what doesn't work by now."

wait, we do?

9/27/2011 1:49:42 PM

Quote :

"There is no need for that when we can just implement everything that works at the federal level and maintain at the very least a high standard of education, health care, utility services, transportation, etc.. in every state."

Problem is that we can't agree on what works, so implementing these "standards" at the federal level is a bad idea. Yes, you believe that you know what's best for every person in all 50 states. I don't. I barely know what's best for myself or people similar to me.

Progressives should support federalism. At least then, the progressives can concentrate in one area and prove how good their ideas work. And, when a bunch of social conservatives take over Congress, they won't have the authority to change your local/state laws.

I don't get this obsession with controlling people's behavior when they're thousands of miles away. It's part of this broken, nationalistic, "team mentality" approach. If you want to see change, then get out there and start making changes. Don't shirk your responsibility and expect the clumsy, overreaching federal government to solve all the problems.

^My thoughts exactly.

[Edited on September 27, 2011 at 2:03 PM. Reason : ]

9/27/2011 1:52:53 PM

Shrike I could not disagree with you more.

States should be ran how their constituents want it to be run. If you don't like it, you can move to another state.

9/27/2011 1:57:50 PM

man, he rambled quite a lot. And when Jon asked him to point to a time in history where the market regulated itself and was as humanitarian as Ron Paul suggests...hems and haws response.

Quote :

"States should be ran how their constituents want it to be run. If you don't like it, you can move to another state."

Then what's stopping you from moving to a different country now? You don't like it, move, right?

[Edited on September 27, 2011 at 2:00 PM. Reason : .]

9/27/2011 1:58:06 PM

i sat in my living room sipping my cup of chicory and looking out my window and pondering my choices. overhead flocks of ghang gliders soared through the soot, taking advantage of the unregulated skies to make their morning commute. i shifted, somewhat uncomfrtable. i needed to make a decision soon, before my neighbor rumbled out of his driveway in his abrams tank and the vibrations from the tearing of pavement made the decision for me

i read through the billboards on the sidewalk again. joe's sewage: faster than anyone! shit-b-gon [as i read the name i silently thanked z0r for the death of the nannu state and the freedom to curse in public]: no clogs! there were five others that i passed over, but i knew, that morning, i was a shit-b-gon man. i trotted outside and grabbed the sewage hose that sat dribbling on my lawn. where was the nearest linkup station? i jogged down the street, briefly warming my face on the fire from my neighbor's house, before i tripped on a stray corpse and fell face first onto the sidewalk. as i pushed myself up and wiped the blood [not mine ] from my hands, i saw the linkup station. after paying my thirty dollar day-fee [a small price to pay for fredom] and jogging the mile back to my house, i was soon happily doing my business. like a free man

i jammed my foot on the gas and grinned as my engine roared. it was free of catalytic converters and other emasculating controls, and at last, was the robust and mighty machine i had always known it could be. i flipped my sunglasses open and jammed them over my eyes and the cloud of black smoke behind me was witness to the power of my works. ther umble of gravel beneath me was like glorious harmony to the howl of the engine. for nearly fifteen seconds i was grinning like a maniac as the car jolted and crunched down the crumbling street. of course , i had to slow and toss my tiny cube of gold into the toll box, and wait for my neighbor to wave me past, but soon i was back to full speed, living life as free as the birds used to do before we shot them all.

i downshifted into third as i caught side of an unfamiliar barricade ahead. smoke rose in a plume behind the stacked wood and bodies. as i came to a stop a man with a cigar gritted in his teeth and a shirt soaked red and cracked sunglasses waved me to roll down my window.

"what seems to be the problem?"

"new repairs on this stretch. going to need double tolls till weve got it fixed"

i grimaced as i searched around my glove box for an extra cube. at this rate id never make the public hanging...


i run into the center of bear-baiting ring. my stomach churns as i face the beast. howls and cries from the crowd wash over me like hypodermic needles at the beach. i feint left b ut as i push off the blood-soaked earth my foot explodes throgh the my shoddily-constructed shoe. with a silent curse for whatever nameless ten-year-old sewed it i kick it off and dash to the right. thank z0r i always ccw, i think to myself as i air-somersault past the bear. the crowd of mercenaries roar at the sight of my acrobatics.

if i can win the crowd then perhaps the king of this stretch of road will let me go...good thing i have an ace up my sleeve.

make that two, i think as i pull out my twin desert eagles, locked and loaded with the finest hollow-tip bullets that our local toy/gun store carry. the recoil from both firing at once knock me back against the blood-drenched wall of the arena but i keep firing at the bear.

as it finally staggers back and crashes to the ground i air somersault forward again and kneel, crossing my arms in front of my chest and holding my guns against my shoulders and feeling the cheers of the crowd wash over me. i have won my freedom. i let only the briefest pity for the less skillful travelers wash over me, but content myself with the thought of penning a scathing letter against these mercenaries tonight. then i grin. score one for the market, motherfucker


shoeless and gasping i run down the road toward the city, dodging shards of glass and the bones of long dead children. i had paid the last toll with my car itself. once the consortium has purchased enough of sick and dying bodies from the local hospital to grind into cement, we'll have our new roads [or so the ads promise], but it's too late for my car.

i hear a faint stirring in the underbrush that stretches out toward the asphalt. with all the nimbleness of an unregulated manufacturer responding to demand, i do a three-quarters cartwheel while simultaneously firing ten shots from my dual DEs. i chuckle at the crashing and groaning from the brush in the silence after my deafening barrage. oen step closer to that new road.

i take off running again. by three p.m. i'm at the office. as i approach the elevators there's a deafening crash and smoke comes from behind the elevator doors. i note the name of the manufacturer and use my bleeding feet to write a message of warning on the floor of the hall. i ignore the moans and take the stairs to my office.

my manager scuttles toward me as i enter. "eight hours late? you're fired. and you can be sure no other company will hire your scummy ass in the future"

my left eye twitches as i calmly respond. "you forgot one thing."

"what's that?"

"there's only one monopoly we don't tolerate. a monopoly of force." i backflip as i pull out my DEs and start firing. the screams of the dying fill the air like mercury. this is one market that just got regulated.

before i leave the office, i loot the bodies of my dead coworkers, murdered by my hand, like an irs employee mailing a 1040. i leave the office a tomb; a blood offering to the hungry god i worship now. stepping back into the stairwell is like stepping through a looking glass. i am wearing shoes ripped from the dead feet of my former boss. call it an audit.

with a ninja's grace i leap from stair to stair as i exit the building. light bulbs flicker and dim; the local smallpox epidemic is two weeks old and they've almost run out of bodies to burn for power. they're talking about charging customers one child per year as fuel. some people were upset about it but at least the government isn't behind it.

my shoulders are heaving as i crash through doors into the lobby. a pack of wolves lurk around the receptionist's desk. night is almost here. they begin to howl as i jog outside into the gathering darkness

i check my watch—6 oclock. I had meant to run a few errands before going home. Just one, actually. I run down the street until i see a dimly-lit verizon store. the salesman doesn't even blink an eye when i enter, dripping blood and gore, desert eagles jammed in my waist. then i pull out my guns and point them in his face.

he blinks.

"i paid 5 bucks more last month, you know?" i growl between gritted teeth
"so?" he says
i put the guns back in my waist. the salesman exhales in relief

then i kneel and draw my katana. with one smooth motion i behead the clerk.

"i wish to file a complaint," i say, as gouts of arterial blood spray paint the ceiling.

at last i'm home. i recline back in my babyskin chair and swirl some orange juice in a mug. as i bring the mug up to my limits i feel a sudden pain in my lip. i fish around in the juice and pull out a shard of glass. rolling my eyes i toss it on the pile in the corner.

my pet tiger pads into the room. not for the first time i offer a silent thanks that no gang of criminals can tell me not to keep it. then i see the blood dripping from its jaws.

i curse as i ease out of my chair and walk into the next room, following the blood. the corpse of my neighbor's son is still warm on the floor of the kitchen. i turn on the alarm system and set up the house defenses just in time for the doorbell to ring.

I look out my front window; my neighbor is carrying a shotgun and has a crazed look on his face. I call out:

"What do you want?"

"I want that damned tiger."

"No."

"GIVE ME THE TIGER."

"Come and get him."

My neighbor shudders as he considers his options: 1) wait to ambush me later, 2) attack now, 3) write a scathing letter and mail it to all our neighbors. He cocks his shotgun and fires it at the door.

My defense system activates. With fury and power that would warm the heart of a Blackwater soldier it reduces my neighbor to ash. As the whir of the chainguns slows i walk back to my babyskin chair. it feels soft. it feels warm. it feels like freedom.

alarms wake me from my slumber. not my house; the neighborhood coop alarms are ringing. i listen to the sound. next to me my slave girl stirs. i casually backhand her across the mouth to keep her quiet. three horns followed by a low ringing—possible outsider invasion.

i check to see that her chains are secure then lower myself out of bed. a low whistel summons my tiger. i press a button next to my bed; a slave child scurries in. i order him to bring me my katana.

wrapped in my robe and with my sword strapped across my back i slip outside into the ringing night. the noises are coming from the south. i see a neighbor across the street slap his wife in the face as she begs him not to leave and i thank z0r no slave has tempted me.

the light from torches flicker in the distance at the watch point. there are already several neighbors gathered in a circle. i can hear a low muttering but i cannot see what they have surrounded

i reach the outside of the circle with my tiger at my side. it carelessly bites one of the men in the circle on the leg. he falls to ground and i take his place and see...

it is worse than i had feared...a face as dark and soulless as the night sky looks up at me. tears stream down his face. i shudder at the thought of more of them...out in the darkness...i lope away from the circel and call my tiger to my side. tonight...we hunt

9/27/2011 1:58:53 PM

i see the fear in their eyes as i approach the campfire. i wear a chain of tiny ears around my neck and my face is spattered with blood. i grip the head of my enemy in my right hand.

ashen-faced, my neighbor asks me of the forces in the darkness

"it's a group seeking medicine for sick children," i reply. "it was." i suppress a giggle. i toss the little head into the middle of the circle.

"are you ok?" one asks

the others mumble, afraid to look me in the eyes

i look him in the eyes. he twitches. i say

"sanity is like a rule. a regulation. i am free."

i heft my katana in my right hand, then bring it to his neck

"will you question me, or will you do as i say."

it is not a question.

"a man chooses" i say.

they kneel before me. alarms wail in the distance. i see the earth soaked in a tide of blood. i finger the necklace of ears like a rosary.

"we are strong," i say. "together we are free".

they murmur in assent. one man remains quiet. i remove his head, then hand it to one of my followers.

"we are free. put it on a stake, to warn those who would oppose us."

i order the rest of the men to secure the neighborhood gold. we will keep it at my house; i will disperse it as necessary. the gold is mine...the precious...

...

i sit on a throne of skulls inside my new house. palace. i run my fingers through the head of the slave who kneels at my side. in my other hand i grip the femur of a dead enemy. a slave used a rock to hone the end of the bone to sharp points. the walls and floor are red, spattered with blood and smeared with dirt; the ceiling is black with soot. my tiger stalks outside.

when the snows come we move to the caves in the hills for warmth. i will spread my seed.

a beast stirs. i breath in the fetid air, thick with blood and death. law is dead. i am the law. the market is dead. i am the market. i scratch at my fur loincloth and crush a louse. government is dead. i am the government. god is dead. i am a god.

somewhere in the distance i hear the howl of the alarms and the chatter of guns.

and this is heaven.


But you remember one thing: if you screw up just this much, you'll be flying a cargo plane full of rubber dog shit out of Hong Kong!

epilogue

the cave is dark but warm. the women huddle under furs and blankets for warmth during the day. i lead the hunting parties out in search of game but any creature larger than a chipmunk has long since been slaughtered. we hunt squirrels and rodents with our AK-47s; sometimes a scrap of meat is still left after the hail of bullets.

one of the women is heavy with my child. i alone may mate with them. the heads of the men who objected rot on stakes outside the cave mouth.

one evening after we have returned from our mighty hunt with two squirrel carcasses and a dead robin someone almost tripped on, we spy a man in the distance staggering toward the cave. we watch as he winds his way through the badlands. black snow falls, mixed with ash. his powder blue shirt is badly torn and bloody and there is no spark in his eyes.

he begs us for shelter. i explain that our food supplies are low but that there is room in our cave if he will hunt and accept my rule. he nods, exhausted, and starts to shuffle past me to the fire.

then i catch sight of the patch on his sleeve. a stylized white eagle on a field of blue. the mark of the oppressors. i grab his collar and growl in his face "you're one of them"

"what? what are you talking about"

"one of them. the patch. the eagle."

"p-p-please...i just...delivered mail"

i grip his throat in my hand and lift him and shout "A CRIMINAL!!!!!"

my tribe huddles around me.

"HE WORKED...FOR THE GOVERNMENT!!!"

i see the rage in their eyes. hooting, they jump up and down, calling for blood. i lower the man to the ground and they mutter with disappointment. i beckon for a slave to bring me my club: all sharpened bone and shattered glass. i put my mouth next to the man's ear and i grasp the club and hold it in front of his eyes. "If you want a vision of the future," I say. "Imagine my warclub, smashing a human face, forever."

then i swing it against his head, and it crunches, and he falls to the ground. "we eat meat tonight" I say with a smile. the cheers are deafening.

9/27/2011 1:59:20 PM

Quote :

"And when Jon asked him to point to a time in history where the market regulated itself and was as humanitarian as Ron Paul suggests...hems and haws response."

The biggest atrocities in human history were committed by governments. Even if not everyone will be taken care in a free market (read: they won't be - people are going to die), it isn't worse than what we have with government: widespread poverty, senseless killing, and lives being ruined all over the globe by disastrous policies.

9/27/2011 2:08:12 PM

And you know that because?

Ron Paul claimed a big issue was the corporations being in bed with the government and writing regulations. Taking the government away is going to inhibit the corporations from fucking over the citizens further how exactly? The market?

9/27/2011 2:25:25 PM

Ron Paul isn't an anarchist - he advocates a strictly rights-protecting government bound by the Constitution.

A lot of the bad things being done by corporations are things that have been explicitly allowed by government "regulators" - things that would be seen as clear violations of rights otherwise.

[Edited on September 27, 2011 at 2:30 PM. Reason : ]

9/27/2011 2:29:32 PM

^^not completely. the government also write regulations that do nothing to resolve the issue for which they were intended and instead create tons of red tape for these corporations which results in needless spending. secondly, yes the market will drive the regulations. they will be written in a way that streamlines corporations making them more profitable. If consumers do not like the way a corporation is run then they have a choice by not buying the product.

[Edited on September 27, 2011 at 2:31 PM. Reason : ^^]

9/27/2011 2:31:35 PM

Poll: Obama would beat Ron Paul by just four points

http://www.latimes.com/news/politics/la-pn-obama-paul-poll-20110927,0,5007276.story?track=rss

Quote :

"If you are looking for signs of President Obama’s vulnerability, there are plenty to be found in the latest CNN poll. But one number stands out: If that hypothetical election were held tomorrow, Obama would beat Ron Paul—yeah, that Ron Paul—by just four points. While it may be a sign that some voters are adopting an anybody-but-Obama attitude, that same poll shows Obama handily stomping candidates such as Michele Bachmann and Sarah Palin. And, truth be told, Obama still tops everyone in the GOP field with the exception of Mitt Romney, who runs even with the president. Obama would beat Rick Perry by five points, the poll said...."

9/27/2011 2:32:56 PM

Quote :

"Then what's stopping you from moving to a different country now? You don't like it, move, right?"

I already have contingency plans in France if shit hits the fan here.

However, I like it here. And business is going well and growing, so I'll probably stick around.

9/27/2011 2:38:02 PM

Quote :

"A lot of the bad things being done by corporations are things that have been explicitly allowed by government "regulators" - things that would be seen as clear violations of rights otherwise."

What kind of things are you talking about here, and how will regulating these things that are currently unregulated in practice be any more of a free market?

9/27/2011 2:38:15 PM

Quote :

"Then what's stopping you from moving to a different country now? You don't like it, move, right?"

Logistics, for one. Most people don't have the resources to up and move. There's also the fact that everyone I've ever known lives here. I don't want to leave my friends, family, and job. I'd be okay moving to another part of the continent if it came down to it, but now I have to fly to another continent entirely?

Of course, escaping the effects of the federal government is not as simple as leaving the United States. U.S. policy has wreaked havoc across the globe, especially when it comes to the economy.

Quote :

"What kind of things are you talking about here, and how will regulating these things that are currently unregulated in practice be any more of a free market?"

I think I could write a book on the topic, but let's just use an area that is typically championed by "the left": environmental pollution.

The very nature of our financial system explicitly allows corporations to avoid paying the full cost of the damage they cause. That's why they're called "limited liability companies" (LLC). If you as an individual cause harm, you're liable for 100% of the cost. For some reason, our system is designed in a way that allows corporations to externalize risk onto the people. That's probably because the system was designed to work for the rich and powerful, not the people.

9/27/2011 4:41:19 PM

Well it's true that corporations are an artificial government construct, but I don't really see how ending LLCs would do anything to curb pollution under a Ron Paul presidency. I mean, he wants to end the EPA, so will there be any environmental regulations and if so, who's going to enforce them? I assume you're saying let the affected property owners sue whoever's polluting and sort it out. But have you ever driven through a place like Tar Heel, NC, where that giant Smithfield plant is? Nobody down there could afford a lawyer that's going to beat Smithfield's legal team. They would basically have free reign to dump hog shit wherever they wanted if it was cheaper than building lagoons that complied with current EPA standards. Maybe you'd get a nonprofit to come challenge it pro bono, but this is the kind of thing that would quickly happen on a nationwide scale and there aren't enough nonprofits in the world to handle that.

[Edited on September 27, 2011 at 5:04 PM. Reason : This is all true even if John Q. Smithfield CEO is personally liable]

9/27/2011 4:52:58 PM

Quote :

"Logistics, for one. Most people don't have the resources to up and move. There's also the fact that everyone I've ever known lives here. I don't want to leave my friends, family, and job. I'd be okay moving to another part of the continent if it came down to it, but now I have to fly to another continent entirely? "

So the magical distance at which moving to address a concern with your government is inconvenient is "another continent"? Why is it OK to move to another state, but not country?

Quote :

"Well it's true that corporations are an artificial government construct, but I don't really see how ending LLCs would do anything to curb pollution under a Ron Paul presidency. I mean, he wants to end the EPA, so will there be any environmental regulations and if so, who's going to enforce them? I assume you're saying let the affected property owners sue whoever's polluting and sort it out. But have you ever driven through a place like Tar Heel, NC, where that giant Smithfield plant is? Nobody down there could afford a lawyer that's going to beat Smithfield's legal team. They would basically have free reign to dump hog shit wherever they wanted if it was cheaper than building lagoons that complied with current EPA standards. Maybe you'd get a nonprofit to come challenge it pro bono, but this is the kind of thing that would quickly happen on a nationwide scale and there aren't enough nonprofits in the world to handle that."

The answer is that people will magically stop buying Smithfield products and Smithfield will either change its tune or go out of business. Or you have to move some place where people don't dump pig shit.

[Edited on September 27, 2011 at 5:00 PM. Reason : .]

9/27/2011 4:58:15 PM

Quote :

"So the magical distance at which moving to address a concern with your government is inconvenient is "another continent"? Why is it OK to move to another state, but not country?"

It's easier to move to another state than another country. There's no "magical distance." The closer the government is to the people, the easier it is to escape tyranny. When you're regulating values at the federal level, it's going to be very difficult for most people to get out.

"But we want Alabama to be progressive too, so let's have the federal government force them to be progressive!" Well, too fucking bad. They don't want what you want, and they're not going to accept it no matter how hard you shove it down their throats. Cultural problems aren't effectively solved by federal legislation. If that were the case, we'd just write a single bill called, "All parents have to give a damn starting now" and we'd have a perfect society. It's not that easy.

Quote :

"Well it's true that corporations are an artificial government construct, but I don't really see how ending LLCs would do anything to curb pollution under a Ron Paul presidency. I mean, he wants to end the EPA, so will there be any environmental regulations and if so, who's going to enforce them? I assume you're saying let the affected property owners sue whoever's polluting and sort it out. But have you ever driven through a place like Tar Heel, NC, where that giant Smithfield plant is? Nobody down there could afford a lawyer that's going to beat Smithfield's legal team. They would basically have free reign to dump hog shit wherever they wanted if it was cheaper than building lagoons that complied with current EPA standards. Maybe you'd get a nonprofit to come challenge it pro bono, but this is the kind of thing that would quickly happen on a nationwide scale and there aren't enough nonprofits in the world to handle that."

This is more of a failure of the justice system than a problem of regulation. Judges are in the "good ole boys" network and the people end up not being represented. When you dump pig shit into the water, you're infringing upon someone's rights. State or local governments should be stepping in.

[Edited on September 27, 2011 at 5:06 PM. Reason : ]

9/27/2011 5:04:20 PM

Quote :

""But we want Alabama to be progressive too, so let's have the federal government force them to be progressive!" Well, too fucking bad. They don't want what you want, and they're not going to accept it no matter how hard you shove it down their throats. Cultural problems aren't effectively solved by federal legislation."

I have a feeling I know the answer, but do minority rights ever factor in for you? I mean, obviously it would be different if YOU were the minority...

Should we care if some other country commits genocide against its population? Or is this just one of those classical libertarian scenarios of "well, I'd disagree with it and stand with the oppressed group but THE HELL if I think that WE should do anything because the GOVERNMENT is taking my money at GUNPOINT and MAKING me care now!"

9/27/2011 5:25:40 PM

Quote :

"I have a feeling I know the answer, but do minority rights ever factor in for you? I mean, obviously it would be different if YOU were the minority..."

Rights are based on the individual, not group membership.

Quote :

"Should we care if some other country commits genocide against its population? Or is this just one of those classical libertarian scenarios of "well, I'd disagree with it and stand with the oppressed group but THE HELL if I think that WE should do anything because the GOVERNMENT is taking my money at GUNPOINT and MAKING me care now!""

Yes, we should care. And, if people think it's bad enough, they should do something about it...themselves. Don't say, "Man, that's terrible! We should invade this country and overthrow their government! And, by we, I mean some 18 year old kid that I don't actually give a shit about. Also, I don't want to pay for it, have someone else do that too. Shit, you think I'm going to fight and die for this cause?"

It's easy to support these grandiose civilizing missions when it's never your flesh on the cutting board.

9/27/2011 5:34:23 PM

Quote :

"Yes, we should care. And, if people think it's bad enough, they should do something about it...themselves."

So...mercenaries only? If someone is mad about some genocide, they should go fight it themselves?

Proceed to the WWII thread.

Quote :

"The biggest atrocities in human history were committed by governments."

Are governments sentient beings separate from humans?

[Edited on September 27, 2011 at 5:55 PM. Reason : x]

9/27/2011 5:50:06 PM

Quote :

"Human civilization has been around for ~5000 years. It's not 1776 either, who the fuck cares what a bunch of elitist slave owners with a handful good ideas thought nearly 250 years ago."

yeah. fuck our founding document. just let the government do whatever the fuck it wants. nothing bad could happen, right? look, if you hate the Constitution so much, then I never want to hear you complain about something not being Constitutional. I never want to hear you bitch about your "rights" or anyone else's "rights".

Quote :

"There is no need for that when we can just implement everything that works at the federal level and maintain at the very least a high standard of education, health care, utility services, transportation, etc.. in every state."

except we DON'T have high standards of education. what the fuck are you smoking? If we implemented "everything that works at the federal level" we'd be implementing the military and that's about it. if we could magically figure out all that other stuff and know it was perfect, then fine. but we don't live in that utopia. As such, THAT is why we allow the states to figure that shit out, because we precisely know that the federal government isn't capable of doing those things right.

Quote :

"This is more of a failure of the justice system than a problem of regulation. Judges are in the "good ole boys" network and the people end up not being represented."

bit of a cop-out

9/27/2011 8:38:21 PM

Quote :

"So...mercenaries only? If someone is mad about some genocide, they should go fight it themselves? Proceed to the WWII thread."

If there are enough men that think there's a fight worth fighting, then they should be willing to support the effort themselves. We don't need a government constantly sending troops around the world trying to end supposed "genocides" when the majority of the time, the real motive is protecting the economic interests of the politically connected.

WWII wasn't about ending genocide. You know this.

Quote :

"Are governments sentient beings separate from humans? "

No, not at all. Government is when the people hand over power to a select group of individuals and hope that they don't abuse it. History has shown that politicians are not, in fact, very good stewards.

Quote :

"bit of a cop-out"

I don't think so. Regulations don't mean anything if "justice" is simply a function of "money," which, in our current system, it is. No uncorrupted judge could possibly rule that it's okay to dump pig shit in public water.

9/28/2011 11:30:44 AM

Quote :

"WWII wasn't about ending genocide. You know this."

Sloppy on my part. I was referring to separate scenarios.

What was it about?

9/28/2011 12:22:35 PM

That's a complex question, but the simple answer is that our involvement was in response to Axis aggression. The justification for everything we did was not to "end the Holocaust". The full extent of what was going on was not even fully known, at that point.

9/28/2011 6:22:42 PM

Quote :

"If there are enough men that think there's a fight worth fighting, then they should be willing to support the effort themselves. We don't need a government constantly sending troops around the world trying to end supposed "genocides" when the majority of the time, the real motive is protecting the economic interests of the politically connected."

I agree with the second sentence.

But I think its ridiculous that you think anyone but a politician would be motivated to end genocide on another part of the globe. The only reason anything good ever happened on that scale is because politicians were serving their own interests.

9/29/2011 1:02:13 AM

Quote :

"If there are enough men that think there's a fight worth fighting, then they should be willing to support the effort themselves."

LOl

Sometimes the best defense is a good offense.

You can't seriously believe that even in your fantasy dream world, there's no scenario where we have to send troops abroad for a reason other than rote physical defense?

9/29/2011 8:49:17 AM

haha. O'Reilly had some poll on his website about the repub candidates and came on tonight and bitched the the Paul and Cain supporters "flooded the poll". So O'Reilly's conclusion? Throw out Paul and Cain and use the rest of the results and declare Perry the winner of the poll. fucking hilarious how much Bill hates non-establishment candidates

9/30/2011 9:00:49 PM

9/30/2011 9:48:24 PM

i keep seeing similar statements to that. what's the source for that data? i mean, it wouldn't surprise me, but still

9/30/2011 10:00:18 PM

http://www.ronpaul2012.com/2011/07/20/ron-paul-campaign-raises-most-donations-from-military/

This seems to be the source, but it's not sourced.

9/30/2011 10:06:19 PM

Unfortunately the military is <1% of the population. I'm surprised we even let them vote, many countries don't.

The rest of us are having a jolly good time with these wars. No need to stop now. Why would the military give money to Ron Paul? Why would they hate America like that?

9/30/2011 10:57:15 PM

Quote :

"No, not at all. Government is when the people hand over power to a select group of individuals and hope that they don't abuse it. History has shown that politicians are not, in fact, very good stewards."

Why is that people are so willing to accept that businesses are people, but the government is always some BIG BAD entity that can't be controlled. I never understood why people thought that a democracy that answers to its constituents is harder to control (or somehow more unfair) than a business that's only obligation is to its shareholders.

9/30/2011 11:06:36 PM

Because with enough money you can fix any business. You can't fix 300 million cases of stupid.

9/30/2011 11:09:27 PM

and with a little more money, businesses can keep pumping pig shit into our drinking water for profit

9/30/2011 11:13:38 PM

it's pretty simple. businesses only have money. governments have money AND guns and the authority to use those guns however the fuck they want. which one is more dangerous?

10/1/2011 2:30:35 PM

If allowed what is to stop corporations from having guns and authority. Also what is to say they don't already have guns and authority.

10/1/2011 8:19:17 PM

well, in some respects, they do. they have their cronies in the government that protect them, so one could argue they effectively do have guns.

10/1/2011 11:15:40 PM

Quote :

"they have their cronies in the government"

They do at that, especially in a post citizens united world.

10/2/2011 2:00:41 AM