typical Freeper bile: "If the swishers get to act openly and with impunity, our military will turn into a protected haven for their misfits and will drive off our manly men - and it will literally destroy our military. I pray to God this will not happen."
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2623061/posts

12/20/2010 10:20:32 PM

I work out at a gym here and I'm about 80% certain 3 military dudes that work out there are gay guys. And if those are the type of gay dudes our military is recruiting, I'm all for it.

12/20/2010 10:30:59 PM

I'd think at least a fifth of the guys who work out there are cruisin'; everybody knows the gym is a meat market.

[Edited on December 20, 2010 at 11:01 PM. Reason : also yes military men are likely manly, regardless of sexual orientation

12/20/2010 11:01:02 PM

Quote :

"I imagine though that they will decide to cease discharging soldiers while this process is going on, so it may be effectively over well before the final approvals and waiting period are officially over."

Discharges have essentially stopped anyway. When the court decision came down they upped the level of authority needed to discharge under DADT and there haven't been any discharges since.

[Edited on December 20, 2010 at 11:28 PM. Reason : ,]

12/20/2010 11:19:19 PM

Alright, I'm going to say this. You guys are throwing polls out at me and you're telling me that the military has been polled and surveyed and all kinds of studies.

In fact, I'm led to believe that my job on a daily basis is to fill out surveys.

I'm going to tell you right now. I haven't seen shit!

12/20/2010 11:31:12 PM

Wow. That's crazy. Next thing I'll bet you'll say is that you've never been in a Nielson family.

12/20/2010 11:34:13 PM

http://voices.washingtonpost.com/federal-eye/2010/07/a_pentagon_survey_sent_this.html

Quote :

"The Pentagon doesn’t want to know whether troops are gay or lesbian, but is curious if they ever shared a room or the showers with homosexual colleagues, according to portions of a questionnaire sent this week to 400,000 active duty and reserve troops."

The survey got a lot of criticism at the time, but in hindsight, it was pretty clear that it was being used to help lay groundwork for the DoD's push in Congress to repeal of DADT.

12/21/2010 12:45:26 AM

Jesus, is this still being discussed? What's done is done. Short of some unprecedented string of gay rapes, it's not going to be undone. We might as well be having a thread debating whether or not the weather is good.

12/21/2010 12:48:08 AM

Well there's no debate there. Clear, sunny days are terrible and boring while dark, stormy days are perfectly amazing. [/weather nerd]

12/21/2010 1:06:04 AM

Generally I agree but right now I could really go for two hours of clear so I can see this fucking eclipse.

12/21/2010 1:06:57 AM

^^^It is still possible that Adm. Mullen, Sec. Gates, or even Pres. Obama might back out at the last minute from signing off, and if any of them does, the policy stays in place.

12/21/2010 1:50:15 AM

Speaking of the importance of military personnel having a say on issues... Maddow did a live interview with some of them who were being affected by this policy as a follow up to the repeal vote. (Including Fehrenbach who I believe theduke said he has met or worked with. Not Choi though).

It was an interesting interview since they were at the crossroads of having military experience, and actually knowing what being affected by this policy is like. And they had a lot of positive things to say about love for their country and belief that the military is disciplined and can handle this change quite well.

Visit msnbc.com for breaking news, world news, and news about the economy

12/21/2010 3:15:10 AM

Joe_schmoe and supplanter are the most moved by this topic. He says the military works directly for him in an indirect fashion.

Jcashfan is talking about acu's and asu's but I'm not sold... I'm pretty sure he's a naval officer of some sort now.

[Edited on December 21, 2010 at 4:59 AM. Reason : Just saying... This conversation has lost it's way... It should die now]

12/21/2010 4:57:55 AM

LOL Wut?


On another note, gay Soldiers are still going to be made fun of for being gay . . . and well they should. Just like the skinny Private who only fucks fat chicks or that one white Sergeant who only fucks black women. If you're different, you will be mocked and you'll learn to deal with it. That is how dudes bond.

So if you're a skinny white Specialist who only fucks fat black dudes, you'd better learn that rule quick.


The worst outcome for gay service members would be to cocoon them in a shroud of DoD mandated protections so their little queer feelings don't get hurt. Man up brother. Being a gay man still means you need to be a man. (Or woman).

12/21/2010 7:15:38 AM

^ exactly.

Quote :

"(Including Fehrenbach who I believe theduke said he has met or worked with. Not Choi though). "

yeah, i'm sympathetic to Fehrenbach's situation, as I believe he got outed by a 3rd party, and from what I've seen, has handled himself pretty professionally. Choi is a huge douche and needs to shut the fuck up.

Quote :

"The survey got a lot of criticism at the time, but in hindsight, it was pretty clear that it was being used to help lay groundwork for the DoD's push in Congress to repeal of DADT."

I thought it was pretty clear and overt at the time that the survey was directly linked to the debate on Capitol Hill.

12/21/2010 10:25:59 AM

Quote :

"Choi is a huge douche and needs to shut the fuck up."

Inclined to agree with you here. There is plenty of room in the Army for Soldiers who happen to be gay. There is no room in the Army for Gay soldiers.

12/21/2010 10:44:22 AM

^Now that I agree.

there are a lot of things not to be discussed during duty hours because people seriously get into arguments and fights about this: Personal thoughts and beliefs on Religion, Politics, Race, Gender and especially sexual orientation.

For some reason, that kind of talk just starts breeding all kinds of trouble. Serve openly, but that's not a license to throw it in everyone's faces.

12/21/2010 2:36:07 PM

Quote :

"Generally I agree but right now I could really go for two hours of clear so I can see this fucking eclipse."

Don't worry, I got pwnt here in Burlington too. I saw bits of it on the passing occasion that there were breaks in the clouds.

12/21/2010 2:52:18 PM

"The armies of other nations have allowed gays to serve openly in the military. The reason they could afford to do this is simple: they could allow homosexuals to serve in their military because we didn't allow them to serve in ours.

They knew they could count on the strength, might, power, and cohesion of the U.S. military to intervene whenever and wherever necessary to pull their fannies out of the fire and squash the forces of tyranny wherever they raised their ugly heads around the world.

Those days are now gone. We will no longer be able to bail out these other emasculated armies because ours will now be feminized and neutered beyond repair, and there is no one left to bail us out. We have been permanently weakened as a military and as a nation by these misguided and treasonous Republican senators, and the world is now a more dangerous place for us all."

--Bryan Fischer of the American Family Association, arguing how DADT repeal will destroy America: http://www.rightwingwatch.org/content/reaction-dadt-vote-few-proud-sexually-twisted

12/21/2010 5:11:59 PM

Sometimes I wonder if these thundering, thundering dunderheads actually believe the shit that plops out of their mouths or if they just have a good understanding of who their audience is.

I really, really doubt that now that you can serve as an openly gay man or woman there will be a huge rush of homosexuals to recruiting stations. There are gay people serving now, there have ALWAYS been gay people serving in the military. Just because they don't have to closet themselves doesn't mean we will somehow stop having a bad ass bunch of motherfuckers serving in our military.

12/21/2010 5:17:09 PM

more from Bryan Fischer:

Quote :

"Character-driven officers and chaplains will eventually be forced out of the military en masse, potential recruits will stay away in droves, and re-enlistments will eventually drop like a rock. The draft will return with a vengeance and out of necessity. What young man wants to voluntarily join an outfit that will force him to shower naked with males who have a sexual interest in him and just might molest him while he sleeps in his bunk?"

after all gay men are interested in all other men and lack self-control

12/21/2010 5:26:56 PM

What worries me is that the real effect of this is going to be more lesbians will join the service, thereby worsening the chances an average guy can pick up a chick in a military town, and forcing more young military guys (like I once was) to become chubby chasers.

12/22/2010 10:53:26 AM

McConnell tried an amendment to the defense bill to try to stop DADT repeal, today on the same day repeal was signed, but it failed. Its funny that the GOP used it being a part of the defense bill as a reason to be against repeal, then when it was done independently they tried to use the defense bill to stop it.

12/22/2010 12:13:28 PM

the congressional republican leadership is the most morally broke bunch of cocksockets i've ever seen.

12/22/2010 12:42:27 PM

Quote :

"thereby worsening the chances an average guy can pick up a chick in a military town, and forcing more young military guys (like I once was) to become chubby chasers."

This war was lost YEARS ago.


The real question is this, when faced with all the money that they could make on deployment, will lesbians whore themselves out like a lot of straight females already do?

12/22/2010 1:48:27 PM

Quote :

"Its funny that the GOP used it being a part of the defense bill as a reason to be against repeal, then when it was done independently they tried to use the defense bill to stop it."

yeah, what a douchebag.

12/22/2010 3:06:18 PM

^^ haha, that's a good question. That would be kinda cool to bang a lesbian (like, not a straight chick who fools around with girls when she's drunk, but a no-shit lesbian). Unfortunately, I'm totally averse to paying for it. That's not really sporting.

I've actually never personally known any women who did this (or personally seen anyone get caught), but I've heard plenty of stories.

Quote :

" Sometimes I wonder if these thundering, thundering dunderheads actually believe the shit that plops out of their mouths or if they just have a good understanding of who their audience is. "

Yeah, no shit. I guess I support DADT repeal on the grounds that it's the right thing to do, although I'd be lying if I said I'm enthused about it, for a variety of reasons. Regardless, dudes like that dipshit are retarded. We aren't the #1 military in the history of the world because we're fag-free (or at least force it into the closet). There are a number of reasons, but a lot of it has to do with the almighty dollar.

12/22/2010 10:32:50 PM

Just one mention of "OMG buttraep in teh showerz!" will bring out almost everyone's inner homophobe; also IMO if a "lesbian" actually is willing to whore herself out to the men on base, I think there's another term for that, one that also describes a type of person who will be able to serve openly early next year: bisexual.

12/22/2010 11:21:13 PM

Quote :

"I've actually never personally known any women who did this (or personally seen anyone get caught), but I've heard plenty of stories."

Probably because you're in an avation unit, so you're officer heavy. The consequences, both direct and indirect, for a female officer whoring herself out are significantly higher than for an enlisted SM, especially given the fact that they're getting paid a good deal more in the first place.

I'm not saying prostitution on a formal level is rampant (it is in some units, it isn't in others), but there are certainly some women in theater who will let you pay them if you're so inclined . . . they just aren't making a business out of it.

12/23/2010 8:33:44 AM

When I was at Manas (the transit hub for people going in and out of Manas) there were girls that were stationed there would do the whole 'prostitution' thing for guys going in/out of the AOR. I never knew any girls that did it solely for the money (although I'm sure there are some or those girls were lying) most just did it for the attention.

Yay Desert Queens or 2-10-2's!

12/23/2010 8:51:24 AM

Quote :

"most just did it for the attention."

Yeah, I think a lot do it for the attention, it is a hard drug to pass up. There was even this one married "devout" Mormon Navy Lt that was attached to us who was extremely flirty. I don't know that she ever cheated on her husband, but she definitely basked in the attention.



(Very little is hotter than an in shape woman in Marine panties and a tight t-shirt with an M-4 strapped across her back)

12/23/2010 9:10:01 AM

so, will Obama do the right thing and order all discharges and proceedings to stop immediately? I sure hope so. Let's get this albatross off our necks now!

but seriously, I don't see why it needs to take so long to unravel this thing. You just simply say "stop firing people for being gay." That's about all you need to do. Sure, change a couple policy manuals here and there to remove references to kicking people out for being out, but other than that, there's not much else to do.

12/23/2010 9:47:55 PM

Oh if only that were true.

Do you have any idea of the amount of power point slides and briefings will have to be prepared for this?

12/24/2010 5:29:21 AM

hahaha, I couldn't believe that my NIPR inbox wasn't absolutely blown up when I went to work yesterday (after being on leave for a few days). There was only 1 email about it. That won't last, though...the powerpoints, training videos, online courses, etc will all bombard me soon enough.

Side note, but I feel like preparing to fight wars is about #27 on my priority list.

1. Online safety training
2. Vehicle safety inspections
3. make sure all my Marines get their flu shots
4. command climate survey
5. make sure all my Marines are Class 1 dental
6. Online safety survey
7. prepare for administrative audits the maintenance programs I'm responsible for
8. watch mandatory videos telling us not to speed, drink and drive, or commit suicide
9. delete pointless base-wide all-hands emails from my inbox. I need to set an auto-delete rule.
10. Go through leave packages for my Marines to make sure their travel plans are ultra-conservative and don't involve driving more than a few daylight hours per day.



...


27. All manner of things related to gaining/maintaining proficiency at flying my attack jet into combat and killing bad guys/breaking their stuff.

[Edited on December 24, 2010 at 11:27 AM. Reason : goddamn out of control safety culture and risk aversion in DoD.]

12/24/2010 11:26:44 AM

12/24/2010 11:32:11 AM

more h8 spewed from the asshole of Bryan Fischer: http://www.afa.net/Blogs/BlogPost.aspx?id=2147501429

Quote :

"Well, all that’s gone now, both for gays and straights willing to tell odious lies about themselves. If a homosexual signs up now, he’s stuck with the whole magilla. Go to your superior officer now and say, hey, I’m a flaming homosexual, I hate the army, let me out of here, the superior officer will say, tough darts, those days are gone. You’re stuck with us now, Nancy-boy. So, who’s sorry now? This may be the silver lining in this whole mess. Conservative groups, simply as a public service, may want to sound this message far and wide out of simple, straightforward compassion, just in order to protect potential homosexual soldiers from themselves and from the distressing discovery that they just kissed off a handy exit option that nobody else had. The more this message resounds, the fewer homosexuals will want to enlist. It’s one thing to be gay, and say, hey, I’ll give it a few weeks and then bail if I don’t like the food, can’t get enough action in the barracks, or thought I’d enjoy ogling male soldiers in the shower more than I did."

He also referred to all gays as "limp-wristed"

12/25/2010 12:17:07 PM

Quote :

"Oh if only that were true. Do you have any idea of the amount of power point slides and briefings will have to be prepared for this?"

Oh, I don't doubt it. I just don't see why it's necessary to do that. One slide will do: "STOP FIRING HOMOS!" i mean, it's pretty fucking simple, lol

12/25/2010 1:01:39 PM

I don't see the point in wearing a reflective belt while in a PT uniform which is made up of reflective material...but I do anyways!

12/26/2010 5:11:28 AM

^^also keep in mind that as long as DOMA is still on the books, the military still can't provide spousal benefits to same-sex spouses of service-members

anyway WTF is wrong with these cartoonists?

12/28/2010 2:19:46 AM

Oh come on, it's cartoons. You should become an islamic fundementalist if you want to start getting mad about cartoons.

12/28/2010 9:24:33 AM

lol @ all Jazz hands on deck

12/28/2010 10:56:36 AM

^^^
They're stupid--it's a problem many people have.

12/28/2010 10:59:02 AM

they are stupid because you disagree

i disagree with a lot of things but i dont have a big enough stick up my ass to not see the humor in them

funny right thar i'dn care who y'are

[Edited on December 28, 2010 at 11:02 AM. Reason : f]

12/28/2010 11:01:59 AM

^
I'm not offended by it. It's just about as funny as Garfield. It's stupid people humor.

12/28/2010 11:05:24 AM

O i see. Rock on wit ya bad self.

12/28/2010 11:11:08 AM

Quote :

"Oh come on, it's cartoons. You should become an islamic fundementalist if you want to start getting mad about cartoons."

Can't tell if you're serious or joking

12/28/2010 12:19:45 PM

the first one was excellent dark satire. so good in fact i was appalled at the lack of respect for the dead until I 'got' it.

the second one was dumb people humor.

12/28/2010 8:36:33 PM

I'm not calling for death to Cagle for mocking the sacred and hallowed religion of faggotry or anything like that, so plz don't compare me to the Islamic fundamentalists.

12/28/2010 10:55:11 PM

Quote :

"also keep in mind that as long as DOMA is still on the books, the military still can't provide spousal benefits to same-sex spouses of service-members"

There would have to be changes deeper in scope than the repeal of the DOMA...otherwise I predict that you'd have a shitload of soldiers, sailors, airmen and Marines marrying each other for the pay and benefits.

[Edited on December 28, 2010 at 11:25 PM. Reason : i'm interested to see how many get "married" just to get out of the barracks, too .]

[Edited on December 28, 2010 at 11:26 PM. Reason : ]

12/28/2010 11:25:14 PM

Quote :

"otherwise I predict that you'd have a shitload of soldiers, sailors, airmen and Marines marrying each other for the pay and benefits."

Are a lot of men and women doing that already? It seems like you could just apply whatever countermeasures to fake gay couples as you would to fake straight couples. I just have a hard time believing that a straight soldier, given the options, would decide to fake a marriage with another man rather than a woman, if he wanted to be in a fake relationship in the first place.

Then again I wouldn't have pegged the military, with all its emphasis on honor and integrity and all that, to be all that big on lying to cheat the system. Besides, marriage comes with a lot of legal entanglements. And given that only a handful of states allow gay couples to get married, and all the residency requirements and what not, its not that easy to get married, and even harder to get divorced if they ever wanted to get into a real relationship down the road.

12/28/2010 11:56:02 PM