Dayton plays George Washington tonight at 7pm on ESPN2. I'm gonna see if I can force myself to watch the whole game while objectively critiquing Archie's coaching.

2/6/2015 4:47:21 PM

I'll check back later for your notes. You're doing a good thing.

2/6/2015 5:26:40 PM

Let the Archie credibility watch begin

2/6/2015 5:33:31 PM

Still playing Ralston the entire game.

-40 for 4 games

2/11/2015 10:04:07 PM

15 loss season

2/11/2015 10:08:04 PM

Any of you guys catch the Mark Gottfried show? Does he answer why Ralston's getting PT?

2/11/2015 10:10:29 PM

from his show last week

Quote :

"...us too pal." On Turner, "Taylor really likes when he hits threes, so we keep him on the court. I coach with my head.""

2/11/2015 10:16:42 PM

Thought it was a mistake at then end to not foul but it worked out because UVA took a quick shot. I would get mad at him for playing Turner but we have no other options on offense. Caleb Martin's shot has gotten just as bad as Turner's.

2/11/2015 10:22:18 PM

On the bright side we lose basically nothing after this season unless someone transfers

2/11/2015 10:32:03 PM

True we don't lose much, but do we gain anything other than the transfer from West Virginia. Barber is the only one that looks like he is developing, and I could see Abu making a big jump next year, but not overly excited about anyone else changing big time for the good.

2/11/2015 10:35:10 PM

IF no one transfers, we could be a hungry team next year with a chance of finishing top 4 in the ACC.

[Edited on February 11, 2015 at 10:37 PM. Reason : ]

2/11/2015 10:37:15 PM

we are hungry now. having everyone back just means the same team back that is about to finish bottom 4 of the acc

2/11/2015 10:43:14 PM

I respect anyone trying to polish this turd of a season.

2/11/2015 11:09:53 PM

and if you're hungry long enough, you starve to death.

2/11/2015 11:10:50 PM

Lol.


Seriously though, watching Turdgeon turn Maryland around, and watching Bennett do his thing gives you hope that Gott can get it done too.

[Edited on February 11, 2015 at 11:18 PM. Reason : ]

2/11/2015 11:17:47 PM

I want to play this UVA team again...get the 8/9 seed and play them on that Thursday.

2/11/2015 11:46:28 PM

http://promo.espn.go.com/espn/contests/infiniti/2015/index?next=home

let him at least win something!

2/12/2015 12:44:23 AM

2-7 in the ACC since starting 3-0. Basically we've become VT or GT except the losses are not as lopsided.

2/12/2015 1:37:15 AM

Tied for tenth in the ACC in year 4 with FSU. Behind Clemson and Miami. This is Gott basketball.

Under contract through like 2018 too right with the NCAA bids?

2/12/2015 12:22:20 PM

Next year is going to be big in terms of the future Gott has. We lose Turner next year and gain Henderson plus everyone getting a year older & more experienced. We've been close with every ranked team we've played this year, next year hopefully those turn into wins.

My biggest issue with Gott is not winning games against teams that they should win. We'd still be in the NCAA-T if we'd taken care of Wofford, Clemson & Wake. Those games can't happen in Year 4.

2/12/2015 2:03:18 PM

From what I've heard, Henderson is a slightly smaller, more athletic version of Turner. Both shoot about the same from deep, and both are great FT shooters.

Hopefully Henderson is a better decision-maker. Turner does at least one thing a game that makes you think it's his first bball game ever.

2/12/2015 3:30:39 PM

Gott can't develop players. TJ Warren is the only example someone could use and I'm not certain how much credit should be given to the coaches there

[Edited on February 12, 2015 at 3:47 PM. Reason : M]

2/12/2015 3:47:20 PM

he didn't help develop Howell?

2/12/2015 3:53:20 PM

Quote :

"My biggest issue with Gott is not winning games against teams that they should win. We'd still be in the NCAA-T if we'd taken care of Wofford, Clemson & Wake. Those games can't happen in Year 4."

this... and although losing those kinds of games is basically nc state shit, I'll never EVER give up on trying to be rid of that motto (holding breath starting now)

2/12/2015 4:33:52 PM

Quote :

"Gott can't develop players. TJ Warren is the only example someone could use and I'm not certain how much credit should be given to the coaches there"

I thought Turner shown signs of improvements earlier in the season. Much higher free throw %, drove to the rim, and seemed to had a consistent stroke. What happened to him the past several games is a question mark to me, but not sure Gott can be blamed for that. The players that I believed showed 0 signs of improvement are the bigs, more specifically Anya, Turner, & Washington. Anya & Turner are absolutely terrible on offense, and are lazy with rebounds. Washington is streaky on offense just like he was last year, and have very low ball IQ. It seems like Anya was better last year when he was even fatter.

2/12/2015 4:35:15 PM

Quote :

"Tied for tenth in the ACC in year 4 with FSU. Behind Clemson and Miami. This is Gott basketball. "

3 consecutive NCAAT appearances. 3 consecutive ACCT semifinal appearances. This is Gott basketball.

We're struggling this year...but let's not act like this season is representative of what Gott's done in his previous 3 years.

2/12/2015 5:05:42 PM

Quote :

"he didn't help develop Howell?"

he helped him lose weight

howell was talented and a good rebounder from day 1. his problems were weight and fouling

2/12/2015 8:26:14 PM

Quote :

"My biggest issue with Gott is not winning games against teams that they should win."

Since when is this exclusively a Gottfried issue??

This has been an issue with our basketball program for at least two decades. Probably longer.

It's pretty disingenuous to claim this is all on Gott.

2/12/2015 8:48:51 PM

Yeah I love how everyone thinks last second heartbreaks and inconsistent performances are purely NC State traits. It's fucking college basketball people. Everyone deals with this shit. We're not special.

2/12/2015 11:41:20 PM

nobody knows that better than Georgia Tech. 7 losses by 3 points or less

2/13/2015 12:10:58 AM

Great example. They lost to us by missing two free throws, and then having us inbound the ball with less than 5 seconds left and hitting a 3 to win. That's some serious Georgia Tech Shit!

2/13/2015 12:16:00 AM

I hope we're not aspiring to be the next Georgia Tech in basketball.

Also, I don't think yrey know the players' names. His post was completely nonsensical.

2/13/2015 6:37:46 AM

Gott has actually been very good at beating the teams we're supposed to beat since coming here, with the exception of losing @ Wake Forest every season.

The worst losses are Wofford where we hit a 3 .01 seconds after the clock expired and NCCU in OT. When you're playing 30 games a year, that's pretty damn good. Sometimes you just dont show up, especially when you're playing scrubs.

The problem is that he hasn't raised our program to a level where "teams we should beat" includes enough of them to get us past being a bubble squad every year

2/13/2015 8:29:58 AM

^that's very true. and in conference it's not unusual to drop a couple games you shouldn't on the road (@wake, for example). there's definitely been some WTF losses (wofford, nccu, clemson) but i don't know that i'd say there's been a ton of those. in fact, winning the game we're "supposed" to win is a big reason we made the tourney last year and Gott's first year. we were a bubble team with no or very few "bad losses"

Quote :

"I hope we're not aspiring to be the next Georgia Tech in basketball."

they've made a final 4 in the last decade...it's been 3 decades since we've done it

[Edited on February 13, 2015 at 8:42 AM. Reason : a]

2/13/2015 8:42:45 AM

this season reminds me a lot of the season two years ago. two years ago, we looked to be firmly in control of our own destiny with early season wins over duke and unc before losing to shit teams like maryland, wake, and florida state. this year we looked to be firmly in control of our own destiny with early season wins over pitt and duke before losing to shit teams like clemson and wake. and don't forget we were a lucky buzzer beater away from being deep into a six game losing streak.

if this becomes gott's MO the way, say, TOB couldn't win on the road in the division and regularly shit the bed against inferior competition, i doubt debbie keeps him around more than 2-3 more years. though he is a huge improvement over sid and herb, she's made it clear how she measures success: perennial top 25 teams. while i expect to be better next year with a more experienced team and with terry henderson stepping in as an upgrade over ralston, we watched gott underachieve with a top 25 team two years ago.

debbie struck out with her top choices when she went looking for a basketball coach four years ago, but got us a credible coach who can recruit top 100 talent and has been competitive against the top teams in the acc, getting wins over duke, unc, uva, and syracuse during his tenure, while not getting blown out when losing to the same. i've always felt gott's primary purpose is to dispel the idea that we can't compete with duke and unc so that next time we're looking for a coach debbie can get the guy she wants instead of settling for her sixth or seventh choice. i'd say thus far he's served his purpose. if we go looking for a coach in 2-3 years and debbie is able to get her top candidate, i'd argue gott would deserve at least a share of the praise given what he's been able to do here thus far.

2/13/2015 9:07:55 AM

I've stopped reading a lot of Sports Talk. At least it's not quite as bad as PP.

[Edited on February 13, 2015 at 9:20 AM. Reason : ]

2/13/2015 9:20:26 AM

I am fine with Gott because as far as a program goes if we make the tourney most years thats about the best we can hope for. There are too many much better coaches and programs in the ACC for us to hope to finish better than 5th or 6th in the conference. Unfortunately, its been way too long since the days of winning ACC and National Championships for any kids that arent State fans to even know about. Our best hope is to wait until the Coach K's, Roy, Boeheims etc retire and hope somehow we have a great coach in place at that time who can take advantage of it.

2/13/2015 9:26:52 AM

Quote :

"this season reminds me a lot of the season two years ago. two years ago, we looked to be firmly in control of our own destiny with early season wins over duke and unc before losing to shit teams like maryland, wake, and florida state. this year we looked to be firmly in control of our own destiny with early season wins over pitt and duke before losing to shit teams like clemson and wake. "

other than the fact that 2 years ago we were preseason top 10 (vastly overrated I know, but the expectations were high) and this year we were a preseason bubble team at best

2/13/2015 9:47:26 AM

right, and the one constant is the coach, so eventually we'll have to question whether we're going to turn a corner or if we're always going to play up and down to the competition under gott regardless of the team he puts on the floor.

2/13/2015 10:18:58 AM

Quote :

"The worst losses are Wofford where we hit a 3 .01 seconds after the clock expired and NCCU in OT. When you're playing 30 games a year, that's pretty damn good. Sometimes you just dont show up, especially when you're playing scrubs. there's definitely been some WTF losses (wofford, nccu, clemson) but i don't know that i'd say there's been a ton of those."

Wofford are not scrubs and it's not a WTF loss. They went to the dance the last two years and are probably going this year as well. We are not.

2/13/2015 10:23:32 AM

We should not have lost to Wofford, NCCU or Clemson. All of those games weren't WTF losses because we played like crap. No excuse.

2/13/2015 10:35:19 AM

that's tuff. Clemson and Wofford aren't bad teams. Clemson even beat #18 Arkansas and are 6-6 in the ACC.

2/13/2015 10:43:01 AM

We shouldnt be losing to Wofford/NCCU I dont care how many wins they rack up in the Sisters of the Poor Conference. Davidson with Steph Curry they are not

But as my original point was, Gott's problem isn't WTF losses. It's the cumulation of losses in total - whether they're to top teams, good teams, bubble teams or average teams

2/13/2015 11:45:48 AM

I don't understand. His culmination of losses in the first three seasons got him to the NCAAs three straight times, and his team won more games in three consecutive seasons than any NCSU team since the early 70s.



[Edited on February 13, 2015 at 12:18 PM. Reason : ]

2/13/2015 11:58:14 AM

This thread is basically the argument between people who think we aren't living up to expectations from 30 years ago and people who realize this is what NC State basketball is now and have accepted it. Sure I am disappointed in how this season has turned out when it looked promising to start, but I also didnt expect to make the tourney this year from the get go. If Gott can get us to the dance 3/4 of the time I think he is doing just fine but thats just me.

2/13/2015 12:02:50 PM

Quote :

"This thread is basically the argument between people who think we aren't living up to expectations from 30 years ago and people who realize this is what NC State basketball is now and have accepted it. "

I like it.

2/13/2015 12:06:03 PM

I, for one, will never give up. Never ever give up.

2/13/2015 12:18:45 PM

The decline starting 30 years ago was man made. Nothing about the University/program since then has really changed that can hinder our chances to be Top 10 nationally again.

[Edited on February 13, 2015 at 1:32 PM. Reason : ]

2/13/2015 1:32:18 PM

we're actually better positioned than we have been at any time in recent history with quality leadership in randy woodson and debbie yow. the benefit of oblinger resigning and the subsequent shitcanning lee fowler by randy woodson has yet to be fully realized.

and by that i don't mean i expect to be top 10 nationally. i mean that we finally have people in key positions who understand that athletic success is a major part of gaining national attention for the university as a whole, which leads to better faculty and more competitive admissions. and that leadership has only been in place for five years.

[Edited on February 13, 2015 at 2:39 PM. Reason : ]

[Edited on February 13, 2015 at 2:39 PM. Reason : ]

2/13/2015 2:33:44 PM

Quote :

"I don't understand. His culmination of losses in the first three seasons got him to the NCAAs three straight times, and his team won more games in three consecutive seasons than any NCSU team since the early 70s."

Right...his lack of bad losses is what helped us get into the tourney when we were firmly on the bubble. Obviously the goal is not to be a bubble team every year. But I don't think losing head scratchin games is something he does a ton of compared to other coaches/teams. Correct me if I'm wrong...but most people viewed NCCU as our worst loss last year. And yet they were a tourney team, top 100 RPI. Not that we should accept losing to NCCU. But if his worst fuck up game is losing to a veteran, RPI top 100 team and still get us in the tourney then that isn't the worst thing ever.

Also, we have the #4 toughest schedule in the nation right now. Wow.

2/13/2015 5:14:52 PM