The 8x and Lumia 920 are very close in size, the Lumia just weighs more.

http://www.wpcentral.com/windows-phone-8-screen-size-comparison-chart
http://wpsuperfanboy.com/news.php?post_id=567


Similar size, bigger screen, better camera, just a little more weight. Ill have to hold to compare.

10/2/2012 8:12:11 PM

I used a 900 at work today and I must say that thing is garbage as a business user. With no way to change font size, you're stuck consuming mail something like 4-5 messages per screen and the calendar lacks more features than android. this is such a huge step back from winmo 6.5. I hope 8 fixes those things, as well as implements end point management through AD. Otherwise it's dead on the vine like winrt with no value add.

10/3/2012 8:16:49 AM

What calendar features do you miss? I use mine for work and have never noticed anything missing with the calendar.

I don't mind only being able to see 4-5 email messages, I like being able to read while glancing at it.

10/3/2012 8:39:55 AM

Quote :

"I used a 900 at work today and I must say that thing is garbage as a business user. With no way to change font size, you're stuck consuming mail something like 4-5 messages per screen and the calendar lacks more features than android. this is such a huge step back from winmo 6.5. I hope 8 fixes those things, as well as implements end point management through AD. Otherwise it's dead on the vine like winrt with no value add."

Having used a Lumia 900 as my main device for about 4 months now (and having used both an Evo 4G and iPhone 3GS previously), you're being pedantic. There's a solution to your problem, it's called scrolling. With threaded conversations you don't need to pack in 30 emails in a screen. I wade through 2-300 emails a day just fine on WP7.5 and it's a LOT better experience than the iPhone was (iOS 4) and comparable to the Evo.

As for endpoint management, that's what System Center Configuration Manager 2012 does (and System Center Mobile Device Manager 2008 before it). It *uses* active directory, but it doesn't make any sense to integrate device endpoint management into active directory.

10/3/2012 1:51:37 PM

I use threaded conversations too, if I need something thats not in the top 5-10 messages I'm just going to search for it anyways

10/3/2012 2:03:00 PM

This could go into like 5 different threads, but MS has officially announced xbox music - free (w/ads) or subscription based streaming music service for xbox, windows 8, windows phone, and eventually ios & android.

http://www.theverge.com/2012/10/3/3446070/xbox-music-free-streaming-october-26th

If this allows full access to music on mobile platforms in ad-supported mode it's gonna be killer.

10/3/2012 3:02:05 PM

Quote :

"If this allows full access to music on mobile platforms in ad-supported mode it's gonna be killer."

how is this any different/better than, say, spotify?

10/3/2012 3:05:02 PM

Spotify only allows "radio" on mobile platforms without a subscription.

10/3/2012 3:07:35 PM

what's the difference?

(seriously...i don't know really know how something like pandora and spotify differ, and how they will differ from this new service)

10/3/2012 3:12:00 PM

Subscription based (and the desktop version of ad-supported) spotify lets you choose whatever song you want and listen to it whenever you want. If you wanted to listen to Sabotage by the Beastie Boys you could look it up and listen to it 5 times in a row, or listen to the entire album back to back.

With the mobile version (ad supported) you type in Sabotage and it makes a radio station of supposedly similar songs. Maybe in 20 minutes or so you actually get to listen to the song you wanted to hear.

10/3/2012 3:15:55 PM

What's better than spotify is how beautiful Zune (Xbox music) is

10/3/2012 6:17:16 PM

I have a ton of folders so generally i can find what I'm looking for in the top 10-15 messages. I HATE threaded view because it makes it very difficult to find anything that isnt in the last or first message. not giving a user the option to change font sizes is pretty stupid, not to mention dismisses an entire audience of people with accessibility requirements. scrolling, while a functional replacement, is not a convenient replacement as it takes a lot more coordination and prolonging site time to execute the same task. quick glances, say while driving or walking, or just maintaining eye contact with something else are possibly with more data on the screen.

the calendar features I'm missing are being able to look at other people's calendars, automatically pull from the global address book in AD when looking someone up or trying to invite them, and without being able to see other people's calendars it's virtually impossible to schedule a meeting from your phone since you can't pick a good time.

i'm not going to tell you htc android on a phone with virtually no 1st party update path or an iphone is a better experience, but i wouldn't call them high benchmarks either. android 4.1 direct from google without carrier bloatware is the first smart phone OS i've liked in a LONG time.

sccm doesn't do any config management as per its wiki, just inventory. the only config management it does is around the mailbox, which activesync already lets you do on all clients. this gap (and physical keyboards) is the reason RIM is still in business, because they have the BES

10/3/2012 6:53:35 PM

What phone allows you to see others calendars? I would like that.

10/3/2012 7:01:20 PM

I do it on my galaxy nexus with touchdown

10/3/2012 7:06:17 PM

Oh, 3rd party

Also, you sound way outside the norm for email. I have multiple-folders and use email on my windows device over my iPad and android.

(I used touchdown, it was a mess. Made my phone freeze and crash. I think I spent $30 on it to. Fuck that.)

[Edited on October 3, 2012 at 7:31 PM. Reason : .]

10/3/2012 7:30:02 PM

standard business at a large software company

10/3/2012 8:34:58 PM

Quote :

"I have a ton of folders so generally i can find what I'm looking for in the top 10-15 messages. I HATE threaded view because it makes it very difficult to find anything that isnt in the last or first message. not giving a user the option to change font sizes is pretty stupid, not to mention dismisses an entire audience of people with accessibility requirements. scrolling, while a functional replacement, is not a convenient replacement as it takes a lot more coordination and prolonging site time to execute the same task. quick glances, say while driving or walking, or just maintaining eye contact with something else are possibly with more data on the screen."

Are you talking about READING incoming mail, or SEARCHING for mail? You are confusing two different tasks here. And by your own admission you used the thing for one day. The Mail app is completely accessible (and backed with TTS for vision impaired people) And you can increase the font size, rotate the phone to landscape.

The treading works REALLY well, and just by your immediate response it's apparent you haven't actually tried it out, because it's incredibly simple to find any point reply in the thread.

You are just making up shit with respect to the usability and "efficiency" arguments, because your two points (scrolling vs information density) both have usability issues, and high density text lists are rarely "glance-able".

If you are reading incoming mail, the interface works very well. If you are trying to LOCATE previously read mail, use the search button (yes, you are essentially forced to do this). It's a different pattern, but it works well and works reliably.

Quote :

"the calendar features I'm missing are being able to look at other people's calendars, automatically pull from the global address book in AD when looking someone up or trying to invite them, and without being able to see other people's calendars it's virtually impossible to schedule a meeting from your phone since you can't pick a good time. "

Yes, I 100% agree with this gap. Not sure this is even possible outside of Outlook proper. I certainly never was able to do it on iOS or Android.

Quote :

"sccm doesn't do any config management as per its wiki, just inventory. the only config management it does is around the mailbox, which activesync already lets you do on all clients. this gap (and physical keyboards) is the reason RIM is still in business, because they have the BES"

You are correct. Config management, policy management, and app management for mobile devices currently is handled with Windows InTune or by adding any number of 3rd party products on to system center (Symantec has a really good solution here).

[Edited on October 3, 2012 at 9:38 PM. Reason : .]

10/3/2012 9:38:11 PM

i was talking about finding mail ive already read or seen come in to look up specifics, like dates or figures or exact wording. it's obvious reading incoming mail wouldn't be hindered by topic density. threading doesn't help this, it merely increases density at a higher logical level.

i'd also like to know how to change font size. i spent a good 10min trying to figure out how, including looking it up on google. the response i found was "there's no way to do it."

windows mobile 6.5 and blackberry both had the calendar features and AD lookup

10/4/2012 12:18:46 AM

^Then why doesn't autocompleting search work just fine for that?

You can't set font size. If you want it even bigger (in reference to your "accessibility" notion) you can rotate to landscape.

Good to know about the calendar features. WP7.5 does have AD lookup, but it's always one more tap away.

10/4/2012 2:00:54 AM

does the phone index the contents of all your mail to prepopulate the autocomplete? like i said, it was my first time using wp7 actually configured/connected to a corporate mail server and i only had about 30min with it during a meeting.

going to landscape mode doesn't cut it as landscape isn't 1 hand operation friendly. this is a really basic usability element and there's no excuse for it not being there, especially the way most apps connect to hubs so their content is rendered by an os control. this would actually boast more usability than ios or android

10/4/2012 3:13:59 AM

Why do you need autocomplete, just search. Or, since you seem to be concerned about Folders, just select Folders and then pick the folder. I much much prefer simple clear email I can glance at verse showing me tiny text.

And you don't need to go to landscape

10/4/2012 7:07:14 AM

the point isnt to make it overly dense but with font size and other controls be able to control the result density to something that works for me individually, instead of stock being my only option

10/4/2012 9:34:08 AM

It seems like you just don't like it because, from a quick test, it doesn't work the same as how you do things now and not because it doesn't do email well. It's the top stock email by far.

10/4/2012 11:42:53 AM

Quote :

"I'd be beyond shocked if there were no Evernote for WP8."

I guess the feature I need is the "page camera" which is iOS only right now.

I haven't been able to find any confirmation that its coming to windows phone

10/4/2012 11:53:15 AM

Yes you can set the on-device cache limits for mail accounts. You can literally keep your entire mailbox synced locally to the phone, space allowing

10/5/2012 5:25:11 AM

So the Lumia 920 is AT&T exclusive, lame.

Down to the 8x and iPhone for me, I need an 8x iPhone low light camera comparison

10/5/2012 7:04:39 AM

yeah, if the 920 doesn't arrive on VZ, it's the 8X hands down for me.

10/5/2012 9:04:02 AM

Well AT&T announced it as exclusive yesterday, so its a done deal

I'm not sold on the 8X until I see low-light picture examples compared to iPhone 5.

Also, it only has Bluetooth 2.1+EDR; my car needs 3.1 so that song info displays on the screen

10/5/2012 11:12:21 AM

The HTC 8X that just got FCC approval does not include CDMA or Verizon-ready 700MHz LTE. That might mean its a little longer wait for 8X on Verizon.

10/5/2012 2:51:57 PM

^The CDMA model just passed through the FCC

10/6/2012 11:13:18 PM

yeah saw that, good

10/6/2012 11:14:17 PM

wow, $99 for the lumia 920

http://wmpoweruser.com/its-official-att-nokia-lumia-920-to-only-cost-99-htc-8x-49/

11/6/2012 10:46:27 AM

sweet! i might get one if i like it

11/6/2012 10:53:27 AM

So i decided to tape pennies to my current phone to make it the same weight as the 920, I did not like it. I think I'm going to go with the 8x.

11/6/2012 10:57:20 AM

That's a nice price! Too bad I don't have AT&T service where I live

11/6/2012 11:08:21 AM

dammit verizon....why couldn't you get in on a deal like this????

11/6/2012 11:27:12 AM

Have to figure out what is going to be locked out on the AT&T off-contract phone.

Hoping I'll be able to grab one off contract and hook to straight talk. Otherwise I guess I'll be ordering an unlocked phone from Rogers Canada and waiting until next week.

11/6/2012 11:38:44 PM

i'd like to play with one of these but i wouldnt want to use my upgrade on it. noen you should get everyone here some free phones so we can start making some apps.

[Edited on November 7, 2012 at 9:45 AM. Reason : a]

11/7/2012 9:45:33 AM

Just bit the bullet and bought the Lumia 920 off-contract from AT&T.

$459 is a really reasonable price, and it looks like the only "unlockable" feature of the phone is the mobile hotspot, same as the Lumia 900. I can wait 6 months for unlock codes for that (and save 300+ dollars over a Roger's unlocked 920).

^Even MS employees only get reimbursed for up to $220 bucks for our own phones, so we don't really get one "free".

That said, the Lumia 820 is $399 off-contract, and the 920 is $459.

Compared to the $749 32gb iPhone 5, that is a REALLY damn good deal.

11/7/2012 3:58:35 PM

If you live in an area with 42mbps HSPA+ coverage, the best deal out there is the $300 Nexus 4 paired with T-Mobile's $30/month pre-paid plan.

If not for that deal, I would go for the HTC 8X or the Nokia Lumia 920. But it's awfully tough to ignore just how much I would save with that combo.

11/7/2012 4:52:11 PM

^Not really. $299 is for the 8gb model. Which leaves you like 6gb of usable space. I can't imagine anyone who would buy that rather than the $349 16gb model.

I'm going with the 920 + Straight Talk for $45/mo unlimited everything. T-Mobile's $30/mo plan is pretty incredibly restrictive, and doesn't have the best network, especially when you're outside of those handful of 4G service areas.

11/7/2012 5:11:06 PM

I'm not a power user like you, Noen. I can understand you wanting all the bells and whistles, which is why the Lumia 920 makes a lot of sense for you.

For me, the Nexus 4 paired with T-Mobile will take care of what I need. I wasn't a fan of T-Mobile's service 2 years ago when I had a plan with them, but $30/month beats the $80/month I'm paying for Verizon.

That said, I probably will elect for the 16gb model.

11/7/2012 6:13:38 PM

^It's not bells and whistles that I'm talking about.

That $30/mo T-Mobile plan gets you 100 minutes a month of talk time and 5gb/mo of 4G data.

I prefer the Straight Talk plan for $45/mo which gets you unlimited talk, text and data (3G) on AT&T's network. (Comes down to ~$38/mo if you prepay a year at a time)

There are big trade-offs deciding between the two pre-paid plans. The service coverage for T-Mobile is pretty awful outside of major metro areas, the 4G (42mbps HSPA+) vs 3G (18mbps HSPA+) speeds for data, the voice talk time differences, the supported phones etc.

http://opensignal.com/network-coverage-maps/ to check coverage maps across all the carriers. Just something to keep in mind.

11/7/2012 6:33:59 PM

Who has the fast mobile service in Raleigh, I am fucking tired of this slow as Sprint. They have drove me away finally.

11/7/2012 7:57:08 PM

^Probably Verizon, followed by AT&T.

The problem with Verizon is that they don't have any good MVNO's, whereas with AT&T you can choose between several (US Cellular, Cricket or Straight Talk in north carolina I believe)

11/7/2012 10:42:58 PM

Preordered my 8X with VZW today. Got the blue one (ships by 11/13) initially and switching to the red one (ships by 11/19) after it becomes available! It was definitely a tough decision between that and the 822.

11/9/2012 11:28:57 AM

Since I missed the last round of phone orders at work because I was waiting to compare these to iPhone5?Galaxy SIII, now I can't place an order till the middle of December

I dropped in AT&T to play with the HTC 8x, but they didn't have it yet like they said they would

Also I with the 8S was spec'd better, I think its the most attractive Win8 phone

[Edited on November 9, 2012 at 11:59 AM. Reason : .]

11/9/2012 11:57:43 AM

I agree...the 8S definitely has the better looks / color options. Luckily, I'm the guy that orders the phones for the company, so I get to stay ahead of the curve.

11/9/2012 12:20:24 PM

HTC 8X + 10 quarters (55g) = weight of the Lumia 920

11/9/2012 4:03:53 PM

Wow, so I preordered my Lumia 920 on Wednesday afternoon (unfortunately after the wireless chargers ran out )

Then I heard they would be available in AT&T and Microsoft Stores Friday, so I went after work to pick one up (lost my phone 2 weeks ago, been waiting for the 920 and need a phone for business trip on Monday).

There was a 40-50 person line at AT&T, and the MS Store was packed but fortunately they had a separate line for phone buyers which was only 4-5 ppl long. Got in and out in about 15 minutes. (As an aside I have NEVER seen a Microsoft store so packed with people, and it has apparently been like this since the Surface units showed up in the store. I was shocked, it was like Apple store levels of busy)

Got home and set up my phone, then Saturday morning there's a knock and the door. The damn preorder phone ARRIVED with Saturday delivery from FedEx . Wow, super surprised by that. Now I've got two phones, keeping the preorder (Yay for Red!) and giving the Matte black one to my mom for Christmas (she is really interested in getting a "touch phone").

First impressions: It is HEAVY. The comparison to a roll of quarters ^ is accurate. It feels like it's full of lead. The matte finish on the black one is gorgeous and the super high gloss on the red (and most of the other colors) is also gorgeous. It honestly looks like an automotive grade paint job. The buttons and port openings are still black, which for me is really cool looking black on red.

The phone seems to have fixed all the quirks I had with the Lumia 900. USB port is at the bottom as it should be, speakers are pushed down and away from the touch buttons. The screen is fucking gorgeous. It really is retina-display beautiful.

Performance is noticeably faster, faster to boot, faster for app installs, and IE is DRAMATICALLY faster and more responsive.

Havent messed with the camera much, but another big surprise is how LOUD the speakers are, and the pre-amp for the headphones. The Lumia 900 was already loud, but the 920 is loud enough that when you push the volume over 20 (scale 0-30) it actually pops up a warning. Distortion playing music really gets bad about 23-24/30, but it makes the speakerphone 100x more usable than any other smart phone I've ever used.

The smaller tiles on the start screen really make a huge difference, and I definitely appreciate the extra screen space for tiles. Between the smaller tiles and higher resolution I have it configured to fit about 85% of my stuff on the screen without scrolling, compared to about 30% on WP7. I actually put my most used apps in an arc that my thumb can easily hit one handed.

Only other note, if you are charging the phone and using it for anything intensive (aka 3d game), the top back of the phone gets HOT.

Also pretty pissed that Skype isn't available yet, although it should be coming very very soon. One of the big features of WP8 is that is has full VOIP/SIP integration (which is why Skype is available still on WP7 but not 8). That means you can use Skype/Google Voice/ any other VOIP provider as the native calling experience (provided Google writes a GVoice app). I hope Google (or someone) releases a WP8 Google Voice app, it would really be a killer combination.

11/11/2012 12:34:58 PM