Quote :

"^^he pollutes more than I ever have and probably ever will who is he to tell me what I HAVE to do? oh thats right it's ok for him to do things and then condemn "average joe" for it did you not even read about the pollution he has been responsible for? or are you just blindly nodding your head and agreeing with him because he is who he is"

where has he ever told you anything you have to do OR "condemn the average joe"?

i said he brought this issue to the attention of many people. do you care to actually respond to that?

[Edited on February 26, 2007 at 4:34 PM. Reason : quote]

i mean if you want to get mad at someone for telling you what you have to do, talk to the people in power. gore is definitely in no position to tell you what you can do. hell, bush has polluted more than you ever will, but he's also advocating lower emissions. is that hypocritical?


[Edited on February 26, 2007 at 4:37 PM. Reason : .]

2/26/2007 4:34:06 PM

ok, he brought the issue to attention


everyone should be concerned with making this planet cleaner with or without his poitical pressure

and no, I haven't seen the movie,nor do I plan on it... so I'm not sure if he's condemned anyone or not, but I do know he's been on this political enviromental kick for a while, the whole time he's been polluting

not to mention his retarded plan that he had to "ban internal combustion engines on off highway surfaces" or whatever from a few years ago


why does someone who pollutes more than any of us in this thread feel the need to do what he's doing and continues doing?

the dude has a mining facility that has been fined/warned numerous times by the EPA, but yet he's on some crusade to make this earth a cleaner place by instituting more government interference and regulation

[Edited on February 26, 2007 at 4:41 PM. Reason : he should look in the mirror first]

2/26/2007 4:38:58 PM

Quote :

"the dude has a mining facility that has been fined/warned numerous times by the EPA, but yet he's on some crusade to make this earth a cleaner place by instituting more government interference and regulation"

not true. the mine closed in 2003. (source: http://www.usatoday.com/news/opinion/editorials/2006-08-09-gore-green_x.htm)

Quote :

"everyone should be concerned with making this planet cleaner with or without his poitical pressure "

what political pressure?

Quote :

"and no, I haven't seen the movie,nor do I plan on it... so I'm not sure if he's condemned anyone or not, but I do know he's been on this political enviromental kick for a while, the whole time he's been polluting"

yet you still will argue about it. classic.

Quote :

"not to mention his retarded plan that he had to "ban internal combustion engines on off highway surfaces" or whatever from a few years ago"

this was addressed earlier in the thread, i'm pretty sure. it may have been the other inconvenient truth thread, i don't remember.

[Edited on February 26, 2007 at 4:46 PM. Reason : v double]

2/26/2007 4:43:18 PM

[Edited on February 26, 2007 at 4:45 PM. Reason : double. oops]

2/26/2007 4:45:24 PM

oh ok, closed now...

well yeah, mines don't stay open for forever

he still received fines/warnings for it

http://www.usatoday.com/news/opinion/editorials/2006-08-09-gore-green_x.htm

he's still a hypocrite

"what political pressure", I'm sure Gore throwing his weight around isn't political at all

I'm not arguing about the movie, I don't give 2 shits about his movie, I'm arguing that he's a hypocrite

I guess the roadless initiative was in another thread too, I'm not worried about it, but it shows that he's always been a hypocrite



[Edited on February 26, 2007 at 4:50 PM. Reason : .]

[Edited on February 26, 2007 at 4:50 PM. Reason : oh noes]

2/26/2007 4:47:02 PM

(hypocrite)

[Edited on February 26, 2007 at 4:54 PM. Reason : V i was just trying to help out. you misspelled it twice.]

2/26/2007 4:49:15 PM

yeah I mean, obviously me spelling a few words wrong has changed the fact that he still preaches one thing and does another

2/26/2007 4:51:23 PM

Quote :

"why does someone who pollutes more than any of us in this thread feel the need to do what he's doing and continues doing?"

Because someone who does what he's doing needs to pollute more than any of us. How is he supposed to make as many appearances as he does without a jet?

And I've never actually heard him talk down to the Average Joe-- perhaps that's just an assumption you make about all liberals ever.

2/26/2007 4:53:31 PM

Come on guys, Gore needs to pollute more than any of us

2/26/2007 4:58:48 PM

Well I suppose he could just float from continent to continent in a helium balloon.

2/26/2007 5:00:42 PM

this has gone straight to the typical tactic of politicians: when you can't come up with an argument against someone's ideas, you attack the person.

2/26/2007 5:04:13 PM

what about when your ideas directly clash with your actions, like Gore's

[Edited on February 26, 2007 at 5:06 PM. Reason : .]

2/26/2007 5:06:31 PM

see. there it is again.

2/26/2007 5:11:05 PM

what exactly are you trying to say?

we cant point out when somebody is being a massive hypocrite because we "shouldnt attack them as a person" or something?

[Edited on February 26, 2007 at 5:15 PM. Reason : .]

2/26/2007 5:14:52 PM

well tell me this liberals, since you are such "enviromentalists", what do you do to improve the quality of the enviroment on earth?

I'm willing to bet that I do more, spend more money, and invest more time in making the enviroment better than most of you

or am I just an earth hater becaue I'm not a liberal?
and yeah, Gore is on a political mission also.

hopefully it will be more than... "OMG I RECYCLE, BECAUSE I CARE ABOUT THE EARTH"

[Edited on February 26, 2007 at 5:24 PM. Reason : ..]

2/26/2007 5:23:55 PM

Quote :

"this has gone straight to the typical tactic of politicians: when you can't come up with an argument against someone's ideas, you attack the person."

2/26/2007 5:35:10 PM

Quote :

""this has gone straight to the typical tactic of politicians: when you can't come up with an argument against someone's ideas, you attack the person.""

This is not a valid point. Calling Gore a hypocrite is not an attack, it's simply what he's proven himself to be.

2/26/2007 5:46:45 PM

forgive me for thinking this thread was about climate change, carbon emissions, etc and not the actions of one person. you're trying to change the subject. i've addressed gore's actions as much as i'm going to already. see the previous page as well as lots of stuff prior to that in this thread and other threads.

2/26/2007 5:50:00 PM

I wanna know what you people do to help improve the enviroment since it's such a priority within your political party

thats not a hard question to answer

2/26/2007 5:52:00 PM

OMG, you people have never made fun of hypocritical politicians, especially Christian conservatives practicing very "unChristian" behavior

C'mon, Al Gore's pollution practices are fair game in a thread about his movie

2/26/2007 5:54:59 PM

you people can continue reaching for that GOTCHA moment as most heavily partisan people do...

but the fact remains that Gore's documentary has had a huge effect on this nation's and the world's push to reduce carbon emissions. yes there will be more government regulation, and yes the earth will remain habitable for a longer time as a result. i'm your stock portfolio will lose a percentage point as a result, but i'm sure you'll survive.

2/27/2007 12:00:12 AM

So, if you're a liberal and you're a VIP, it is acceptable to leave a disproportionately large carbon footprint--even with Earth in the Balance? Because your heart's in the right place and you're, well, "important," right? I just want to make sure I'm hearing you Gore defenders correctly.

[Edited on February 27, 2007 at 12:07 AM. Reason : .]

2/27/2007 12:05:57 AM

Quote :

"It hardly seems reasonable--or even ethical--to assume that it is probably alright [sic] to keep driving up C02 levels."

Al Gore, Earth in the Balance

2/27/2007 10:35:37 AM

Quote :

"I'm willing to bet that I do more, spend more money, and invest more time in making the enviroment better than most of you"

Just curious, what all are you doing?


Personally, I'm freezing my balls off in the winter, and walking around sweating in the summer in my house. I close off my bonus room (tape the vents and everything) and close off rooms I don't use. But thats more about saving me money than about saving the environment.

I typically try not to venture out of my house to make single trips anywhere (I'll shirk going to the grocery store until I can stack another errand or trip on top of it).

My worst offense is living far away from where I work and driving an SUV.

2/27/2007 1:18:08 PM

I've been a lurker in this thread for a while, mostly b/c I read it when I can't post (dont' ask) and I've got to say the people that steadfastly believe that increased CO2 emissions are responsible for global warming are a bunch of idiots that don't know and/or bother looking to actually look at the science of things. Its ridiculous to think that CO2 is responsible when we only contribute 3% (97% natural) to the atmosphere every year, not to mention that its just one of several greenhouse gases naturally occuring here on earth.

Some food for thought:
-the northest now has more forested areas than when european settlers came across the atlantic
-maybe a few more people will die each year from hotter summers, but fewer will die from colder winters
-there is no accurate way to monitor the earth's temperature since they are not uniformly spread across the globe. Additionally all the data has been skewed since the early 90s when hundreds of weather stations in Russia (read cold climates) went offline due to the collapse of the USSR.
-a slightly warmer climate will be slightly economically beneficial to the US
-if all countries followed the Kyoto Protocol properly, it would lower the temperature of the earth by around 0.07 degrees Celsius. That is far outweighed by the economic harm it would bring on the countries following it.
-the most prosperous periods in history have coincided with global warming trends
-solar activity is far more responsible for any additional heating of the earth than GHGs
-historically increases of CO2 in the atmosphere FOLLOW any increases in temperature, not precede.

And finally, I just wanted to say that yes I believe the world is getting warmer. Do I think we are responsible for it? No, not enough for any measureable difference. Do I think energy conservation is a good thing? Yes I do, but not to the point where the gov't is granted too much control over my standard of livng and economic well being.

(now go ahead greenies and flame away, b/c I won't be around to defend myself)

[Edited on February 27, 2007 at 1:30 PM. Reason : k]

2/27/2007 1:24:24 PM

SO WHO PAYS YOUR RENT, EXXON OR SHELL?

2/27/2007 1:25:50 PM

Hell, I haven't driven a car since the first week of December, or paid for gasoline since November. By that right I must be more green than almost everyone (if not everyone) in this thread.

2/27/2007 1:29:59 PM

Congrats! Hope you are enjoying paying through the nose for that NYC lifestyle too!

2/27/2007 1:36:31 PM

Most of it's offset by a higher salary, but thats for your concern

2/27/2007 1:40:50 PM

My point was that it costs money to live green.

2/27/2007 1:48:45 PM

You got that right.

2/27/2007 1:52:53 PM

Quote :

"Some food for thought: -the northest now has more forested areas than when european settlers came across the atlantic -maybe a few more people will die each year from hotter summers, but fewer will die from colder winters -there is no accurate way to monitor the earth's temperature since they are not uniformly spread across the globe. Additionally all the data has been skewed since the early 90s when hundreds of weather stations in Russia (read cold climates) went offline due to the collapse of the USSR. -a slightly warmer climate will be slightly economically beneficial to the US -if all countries followed the Kyoto Protocol properly, it would lower the temperature of the earth by around 0.07 degrees Celsius. That is far outweighed by the economic harm it would bring on the countries following it. -the most prosperous periods in history have coincided with global warming trends -solar activity is far more responsible for any additional heating of the earth than GHGs -historically increases of CO2 in the atmosphere FOLLOW any increases in temperature, not precede."

care to back any of this up with facts? i wouldn't doubt if some of it were true, but many of these claims are pretty dubious.

2/27/2007 1:53:34 PM

Quote :

"Just curious, what all are you doing?"

well, alot of the basic stuff on the homeowner level (time of use electrical, making sure stuff is off, high quality windows/doors/insulation)

organic gardening practices

but where I feel I make the biggest difference is as a landowner

I've established riparian and conservation buffers on my farm(protects watersheds and wildlife)
I plant trees and participate in reforestation
I use "no till" planting at my farm
I seldom use chemicals, the only "chemical" I really use is fertilizer
I plant perennials and annuals for wildlife
I donate money and time to organizations that help wildlife, wetlands, forestlands
use modern diesel, which puts less pollution in the air than unleaded

will begin manufacturing my own biodiesel in the next year



for work I do the following:
I help landowners create conservation and riparian buffers on their properties(1000's of acres in the last few years are now protected with the help of my company)
work with the NC Forestry Association to help landowners manage their forests by selective cutting/thinning/reforestation
use "no till" practices when establishing wildlife food plots (my company planted over 1000 acres in annual/perennial food plots last year alone)
create wetlands by designing and building waterfowl impoundments
we also donate money and do lots of work with organizations that improve water quality and wildlife quality

I wish more landowners would do what we do, it's good for everyone and everything

I feel that what I do can honestly make a difference

2/27/2007 1:55:16 PM

riparian buffers are smooth...they help filter out chemicals or anything else from reaching the water, and plus they look nice

2/27/2007 1:57:43 PM

oh yeah and where in the hell did you get this one?:

Quote :

"-if all countries followed the Kyoto Protocol properly, it would lower the temperature of the earth by around 0.07 degrees Celsius. That is far outweighed by the economic harm it would bring on the countries following it."

are you some sort of crazy psychic?

2/27/2007 1:59:27 PM

Quote :

"are you some sort of crazy psychic?"

Is Al Gore?

2/27/2007 2:07:22 PM

he at least cites sources

2/27/2007 2:08:28 PM

I wish he would've cited what source told him that sea levels could rise 20 feet in the next century considering the IPCC report said about 5" to 35"

2/27/2007 2:09:09 PM

Quote :

"I've got to say the people that steadfastly believe that increased CO2 emissions are responsible for global warming are a bunch of idiots that don't know and/or bother looking to actually look at the science of things."

SCIENCISTS DON'T KNOW SHIT ABOUT SCIENCE!

2/27/2007 2:09:26 PM

twwers dont

2/27/2007 2:12:17 PM

Quote :

"twwers dont"

Except for you, Twista.

2/27/2007 2:14:18 PM

Quote :

"riparian buffers are smooth...they help filter out chemicals or anything else from reaching the water, and plus they look nice"

yep, this is the first line of defense in keeping our waters clean, it all starts in the fields and lawns.

you can even enroll ditchbanks in a riparian buffer easement

good land management practices last a long time and will effect your children and their children

2/27/2007 3:36:03 PM

Quote :

"-the northest now has more forested areas than when european settlers came across the atlantic -maybe a few more people will die each year from hotter summers, but fewer will die from colder winters -there is no accurate way to monitor the earth's temperature since they are not uniformly spread across the globe. Additionally all the data has been skewed since the early 90s when hundreds of weather stations in Russia (read cold climates) went offline due to the collapse of the USSR. -a slightly warmer climate will be slightly economically beneficial to the US -if all countries followed the Kyoto Protocol properly, it would lower the temperature of the earth by around 0.07 degrees Celsius. That is far outweighed by the economic harm it would bring on the countries following it. -the most prosperous periods in history have coincided with global warming trends -solar activity is far more responsible for any additional heating of the earth than GHGs -historically increases of CO2 in the atmosphere FOLLOW any increases in temperature, not precede."

Even if these had valid sources, they still form a ridiculous argument

You're simultaneously arguing that climate change does and doesn't exist.

2/27/2007 4:41:03 PM

not everyone makes all their arguments from a "climate change exists" or "climate change doesnt exist" perspective

2/27/2007 4:47:47 PM

Sorry

"Anthropogenic climate change is significant, anthropogenic climate change is not significant"

2/27/2007 4:56:27 PM

He's pointing out possible effects from a number of different scenarios. I guess he should just stop with all that silly curiosity and faithfully believe the scientific consensus.

2/27/2007 5:03:20 PM

well he's also making many completely unsupported claims.

2/27/2007 6:42:24 PM

Quote :

"well tell me this liberals, since you are such "enviromentalists", what do you do to improve the quality of the enviroment on earth? I'm willing to bet that I do more, spend more money, and invest more time in making the enviroment better than most of you"

i dont understand what this has to do with the topic

2/27/2007 7:07:04 PM

I'm not all gloom and doom about the enviroment, but yet I do quite a bit to help ensure that my kids and their kids can anjoy this place, hell my livelihood is based around the outdoors


I just want to make sure that all of those who are pitching a fit about all this are doing their part


I hope you're all driving late model cars also

I'd hate to think you're polluting the enviroment when you could just buy a newer car with better emissions

2/27/2007 7:28:07 PM

Quote :

"-the northest now has more forested areas than when european settlers came across the atlantic"

I don't understand what this has to do with anything, are you saying that the reason behing the co2 increase is only because of a lack of trees?

Quote :

"-maybe a few more people will die each year from hotter summers, but fewer will die from colder winters"

yeah, becuase everyone knows more people die from the cold than the warm
even though thousands have died from single heatwaves while hundreds have died from single blizzards

Quote :

"-there is no accurate way to monitor the earth's temperature since they are not uniformly spread across the globe."

You must live in a world without satellites

Quote :

"-a slightly warmer climate will be slightly economically beneficial to the US"

w00t, bring on the money! who cares about the rising sea levels or the increase in malaria around the world!

Quote :

"-if all countries followed the Kyoto Protocol properly, it would lower the temperature of the earth by around 0.07 degrees Celsius. That is far outweighed by the economic harm it would bring on the countries following it."

I agree with this, but I think Kyoto was only the first step

Quote :

"-the most prosperous periods in history have coincided with global warming trends"

and we should expect no problems form this

Quote :

"-solar activity is far more responsible for any additional heating of the earth than GHGs"

true, but what is the variance of heating from solar activity?
hint, it is currently less and the change of heating caused by GHGs

Quote :

"-historically increases of CO2 in the atmosphere FOLLOW any increases in temperature, not precede."

yes, this is because solar cycles forced the starting of the heating period, while co2 finished it off and did a majority of the warming

[Edited on February 27, 2007 at 8:22 PM. Reason : ]

2/27/2007 8:19:39 PM