The fact that a 9-14 game stretch is going to sway your opinion that much is the crux of what's wrong with your rationale.

5/19/2011 4:53:25 PM

I judge a player's greatness on what he does in the playoffs, in crunch time, when it really matters

Consistency in the regular season is great and all, but they don't award the O'Brien trophy for that

5/19/2011 4:56:26 PM

So right now, in your opinion, Tayshaun Prince is a better player than LeBron James

5/19/2011 4:57:18 PM

I never said Trent Dilfer was better than Dan Marino, but I sure as hell think Joe Montana was

5/19/2011 4:58:40 PM

I give up. Another win for TWW's Skip Bayless.

5/19/2011 5:01:03 PM

Tree, who is the best player in the league? Is it Wade because he was a finals MVP 5 years ago and is still playing at an extremely high level? Based on your criteria, that has to be the definitive answer.

Your dislike for Lebron is palpable - nobody's crowning him solely because of his athleticism and strength. No one in the league has a better all-around game. It's not even close.

5/19/2011 5:07:54 PM

When I watched Lebron play his rookie season, I thought eventually he would be better than Jordan. It excited me. He had more potential than Kobe or Vince or any of the other Jordanesque players to come into the league since Jordan. After a couple seasons, I watched him ball out and single handedly lead his team to the NBA Finals and lose to the veteran Spurs, to which theres no shame at all. I thought he was just going to keep improving and would get over the hurdle.

Then I watched him continue that and lead his team to the best record in the league the last couple seasons, without a great supporting cast. However those regular-season best records didn't translate to an NBA Finals appearance either of the last 2 seasons. I regarded that as him choking. Then while watching the Eastern Finals last year, I didn't watch Lebron choke. I watched him quit. He quit on his team.

From that point on, I knew he wasn't as mentally tough as guys like Kobe and Jordan. I don't blame him for leaving Cleveland either, just question how he did it. But he just doesn't seem to have the desire to be a true winner.

Because of that, and to answer your question, I would rather have a guy without quite the physical skillset as Lebron, but with a greater desire and passion to win. I would rather have a guy like Durant, Wade, Rose, or a younger Kobe than Lebron.

Nobody can do what Lebron can do all around. Nobody has his combination of strength and speed. Nobody that size can move like he does. But he has weaknesses too. Lots of players in the league are better shooters, like Dirk and Durant. Down 1 point with 5 seconds to go, I'd rather Wade have the ball than Lebron. I'd rather have a LOT of guys on the line down the stretch than Lebron (or Howard).

Bottomline is I respect the hell out of Lebron's game, but not his attitude. The only way he's going to earn my respect back is to win a title. Until then he's just a great player who can't get it done in the postseason.

So thats how I feel completely and literally. I will mention that there is no hyperbole or facetiousness mixed into this post as some TWWers have trouble discerning sarcasm mixed into some of my posts.

5/19/2011 5:19:19 PM

I'll close with this...just look at these names.

Gibson, Daniel
Hickson, J. J.
Ilgauskas, Žydrunas
Jackson, Darnell
Kinsey, Tarence
Pavlovic, Sasha
Smith, Joe
Szczerbiak, Wally
Varejão, Anderson
Wallace, Ben
West, Delonte
Williams, Jawad
Williams, Maurice



This team plus LeBron won 66 games.

Replace LeBron with anyone else in the league...do they even win 50?

I doubt it

5/19/2011 5:25:46 PM

And the question becomes, if he can lead that group of knuckleheads to a 66-16 record, how come he can't lead them to an NBA Finals appearance?

Actually I think I know why, because playoff basketball takes it up another notch and he wasn't mentally tough enough to do it.

Even though rally would argue that theres no statistical difference in the regular season and playoffs.

5/19/2011 5:27:59 PM

Almost every team he faced in the playoffs had the 2nd, 3rd and 4th best players on the floor. Kicking it to Wally Schzerbiak for open looks doesn't get you rings, which is why he bolted in the first place.

But now, now that he actually has competent teammates, we can't just expect him to win the whole thing every year. Boston won one. I fully expect multiple championships over the next seven years (and I'll be the first to shit on him if they don't), but he gets at least one grace year from me, maybe two. Championship basketball is a process. LeBron finally has his Pippen, but that might not show right away.

5/19/2011 5:35:00 PM

maybe I had false expectations after he led his team to the Finals in his 4th year

its not like Jordan led his team to the finals and then regressed afterwards, he just kept winning

5/19/2011 5:37:57 PM

because only one player needs to be mentally tough to win in the playoffs. the mental toughness of that roster you listed is irrelevant.

Kobe quit against the Suns five years ago.

5/19/2011 5:40:28 PM

Kobe already had titles, he can get a free pass, just like the Spurs versus Memphis

and yeah its a team sport, its not all on him, but back to back years of the best record in the NBA, you should be able to at least get one of those same teams to the Finals

5/19/2011 5:42:46 PM

Beating Boston and LA on a Tuesday in January is a bit different from beating them four times in May. He played good teams in the playoffs, not sloppily assembled rosters of one star and a bunch of guys you wouldn't want on the Bobcats. Now, since he finally has a real team around him, the championships will eventually come.

5/19/2011 5:45:17 PM

Like he did the year before. Your criteria are arbitrary

5/19/2011 5:45:53 PM

just seemed like his desire peaked in 07, and until he wins a title I won't be convinced he's gotten it back

5/19/2011 5:50:25 PM

That's definitely fair, and actually really similar to how I've felt about his career trajectory (with less loathing and more optimism). As a fan of the game, I want him to realize his potential. He still has plenty of career left.

5/19/2011 5:50:59 PM

i'd have a lot less loathing too if he had gone anywhere but Miami

if you look at any of my posts about him prior to the end of the Eastern Finals last year, i was much kinder and much more optimistic about him too

5/19/2011 5:55:57 PM

Yeah, he definitely did his heel turn this past summer. Maybe he'll spend the offseason with Dirk's shooting coach and/or Hakeem.

Anyway, I'm looking forward to tonight's game. Expecting it to be similar to last night's grindfest as the refs swallow their whistles some.

5/19/2011 6:09:31 PM

this pretty much sums up how i feel about lebron

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l3XVW676Rus#t=113s

5/19/2011 7:22:09 PM

Doris Burke looks terrible

5/19/2011 9:19:59 PM

Durant walked on that monster dunk

5/19/2011 10:21:02 PM

lebron may never have the fire of kobe or jordan (he has a better all around game than kobe though now that his defense has come around) but he really was playing at jordanesque level just two yrs ago in the playoffs (averaging 35, 9, and 7 which is prob better than any playoff kobe has ever had), yes the yr after wasn't that great but thats prob because he realized it was impossible to win a title with that bunch and yea did quit a tad but my point is he can def take it back up to that level again and has plenty of time

and damn I didn't realize kobe offended gay people enough to start a whole ad campaign apologizing



[Edited on May 19, 2011 at 10:28 PM. Reason : k]

5/19/2011 10:24:14 PM

i'm sure he offended a lot of people, but a good PR department is responsible for the ads he appears in now

better to be proactive about it than sit back and take the pressure about not being friendly to the gay community.

5/19/2011 11:11:26 PM

Harden and Barea nice off the bench

5/19/2011 11:15:34 PM

5/19/2011 11:43:37 PM

man crush on Harden growing stronger by the day

5/20/2011 7:21:25 AM

Thank god tree warned me that Dallas had the series. Locked up before i bet okc at 3:1. Oh wait that's not what happened at all

5/20/2011 8:55:19 AM

is there any good reason that Dallas/OKC, who played last night, play tomorrow, but we have to wait until Sunday for the next Bulls/Heat game?

5/20/2011 5:57:33 PM

^ I'm pissed about that too. Clearly, Chicago is the deeper of the two teams so it favors Miami, particularly Haslem who probably couldn't have bounced back tonight.

There were two days off between game 2 and now three days off before game 3 what the fuck.

I really think they should have to play every other day to be fair. A team like OKC has a huge advantage on bouncing back without days off becasue they're 21 and deep. On the flip side an older team like Miami with no depth has a big advantage when they get more rest. Seems unfair to mix it up during the postseason this drastically.

5/20/2011 6:24:42 PM

i understand how increasing the first round from best-of-5 to best-of-7 a few years back gives the NBA more revenue from advertisers, etc, but i dont know why the fuck the playoffs are so staggered nowadays

5/20/2011 6:26:50 PM

pussy move by the nba just to avoid for the nights of the week where more people will watch it on tv. (sunday)

5/20/2011 7:32:25 PM

^ what does your post mean, i dont get it.

[Edited on May 20, 2011 at 9:03 PM. Reason : fdg]

5/20/2011 9:02:54 PM

they stagger the games the way they do to get the money-days for tv. (sunday etc)

5/20/2011 9:14:06 PM

man I had no idea westbrook was 2nd team all nba this yr, I thought those nba teams were supposed to be the most objective awards, voted on by people who knew their stuff

5/20/2011 11:33:35 PM

Nope they just vote for the hyped players. Believe it or not kobe was first team this year. As if any GM would put him in their top five players anymore

5/21/2011 9:37:04 AM

Thats because GM's take futures into account but this is talking about this season only. Kobe has no future but he was still pretty damn good this season. (playoffs excluded)

5/21/2011 11:29:46 AM

He had an ok season but he was clearly not worthy of first team

5/21/2011 12:37:32 PM

It is a shame that D Wade didn't make it.

5/21/2011 2:35:08 PM

wow. dont think OKC can play any worse than that.

4-17 FG and 7 turnovers in the first quarter.

Durant, Westbrook, Ibaka, and Harden are truly awesome players to be age 21-22. NBA players don't peak until age 25 on average, so they could definitely win championships together.

But individually they are all a little bit overrated right now (except Harden if he keeps playing like he has in the playoffs).


I just want to point out Jason Kidd is THIRTY EIGHT YEARS OLD. He singlehandedly beat a Duke team that nearly won 3 championships in 4 years in 1993 for god's sake. That was 18 years ago.

That means Kevin Durant was like 3 when that happened. Think about that. How in the fuck is he still doing this? Guy looks like he has another 2-4 seasons left. How far is he from Stockton's assist record?

[Edited on May 21, 2011 at 9:37 PM. Reason : a]

5/21/2011 9:35:33 PM

He'll never catch Stockton if he plays till he's 50

He will pass Jordan in steals next year tho, which is crazy to think about

5/21/2011 9:52:26 PM

i wish they would go to south beach and realize the heat don't play there.

5/21/2011 10:25:59 PM

i remember when Kidd and David Wesley banged heads literally during a playoff game...they both got consussed like fuck but only Kidd bled, not D-Wes

also, as I've said previously, this series has been over and Dallas has it sewn up

The first half makes that fact pretty obvious

the Mavs will clearly win the series and any GM would agree

5/21/2011 10:35:27 PM

Harden is a great actor


http://christianmingle.com

[Edited on May 21, 2011 at 10:54 PM. Reason : .]

5/21/2011 10:49:37 PM

Miami is big enough to count Miami Beach as a borough, although technically it is a "city". Get over it.

5/22/2011 1:48:20 AM

even if it was a borough, i would find it annoying if people constantly said the knicks played in brooklyn, any GM would agree.

5/22/2011 2:33:09 AM

you think last night proved the series was over?

Id be concerned if I was a Dallas fan, they seemed to have solved Dirk a little bit and dallas is having trouble scoring.

They dont have an answer for Chandler yet though.

Anyway, the big story is that OKC didnt get a fair shake from the refs in that game which is pretty alarming considering it was a home game.

5/22/2011 12:10:33 PM

pitchers duel in the first half

^lol blame the refs

5/22/2011 9:48:38 PM

someone needs to fire that Miami announcer. his voice is grating.

5/22/2011 10:00:29 PM

I've been saved in this game by wade playing like a scrub bc bosh is killing it. I need rose to stop sucking and Noah to get going

5/22/2011 10:01:19 PM