Quote :

"World. Of. Warcraft. You are wrong."

WOW is not shit. It's not the best thing out there, but it's HARDLY shit in the world of MMORPG's. I would be glad to list you out a few dozen games that suck a fat one before WOW.

Once again you confuse your personal taste with the worthiness of success.

A large part of what fuels the WOW community is it's economics (both real and virtual).

7/20/2006 9:24:09 AM

For the past year I've played only 2 different games.
1) Starcraft
2) Freecell

Actually I've recently started playing Clash'N Slash

http://www.enkord.com/games/clashnslashworldsaway/
But I'll probably get tired of it in a week or two.

Freecell I've been playing forever and I've actually gotten pretty good at it.

On the other hand, Starcraft I've been playing for at least 7 years now and I still suck at it! But I don't care, it's still fun as hell.

7/20/2006 10:16:21 AM

Quote :

"This is an extremely low polygon game and they hide it remarkably well."

First of all I never argued Blizzard doesn't do a great job with its art and settings -- however, they don't hide that it's a low polygon game very well. Don't you ever look at a land mass as you approach it?

Quote :

"The game isnt the ultimate challenge for hard core MMO players, but then who gives a fuck? "

It probably IS, given the extent and time-consuming nature of its end-game PVE raids etc.

Quote :

"Who wrote the definition of an MMO that it has to focus on PvP, or that it must take an inordinate amount of time investment to get enjoyment or accomplishments?"

Well MMO's don't have to focus on PVP, but maybe you just get your rocks off beating computer controlled monsters in a game that's supposed to be about war. I'm actually arguing that they shouldn't take an inordinate amount of time investment -- the PVP grind and ESPECIALLY the PVE stuff in WOW just takes too fucking long. I'd rather get to the ass whooping a lot quicker and leave the unfun stuff behind, but WOW seems to focus on the unfun stuff.

Quote :

"They know what appeals to the average gamer, and what is addicting about an MMO."

Yes, precisely -- and neither of those things makes for a good game. It makes for a "pop" game. It's like arguing that today's pop music, designed to appeal to the average consumer, is somehow great shit. It just ain't.

Quote :

"They created a world that is completely immersive, easy to pick up and play with friends, and not easy to put down."

That's all true. There are other games that are easy to pick up too, without being too simplistic. There are too few character builds. Not to mention the fact that Blizzard has been almost continually racing to make this game worth a damn from a PVP/balance perspective.

Quote :

"WOW is not shit. It's not the best thing out there, but it's HARDLY shit in the world of MMORPG's."

Yeah there are plenty of shithouse games that go beneath WOW on the list, but what does that really prove?

7/20/2006 11:15:30 AM

Quote :

"First of all I never argued Blizzard doesn't do a great job with its art and settings -- however, they don't hide that it's a low polygon game very well. Don't you ever look at a land mass as you approach it?"

OK so you notice their L.O.D algorithm in action. big deal. I would rather see some shifts in the upcoming terrain than continuous fog 5 feet in front of my face.

I was refering to their models and use of textures. The characters and environments pull of the effect of having a much higher polygon count than they do. The art style facilitates this, but there is still extremely high model and texture quality to pull it off.

Quote :

"Yes, precisely -- and neither of those things makes for a good game. It makes for a "pop" game. It's like arguing that today's pop music, designed to appeal to the average consumer, is somehow great shit. It just ain't."

Actually, youre wrong again. Drop the fucking music industry analogy. It doesnt apply. Bad games dont appeal to gamers. Nor do gamers get addicted to bad games. Thats how the gaming industry works. Good games stay on top and sell well, bad games fall of extremely fast.

Quote :

"That's all true. There are other games that are easy to pick up too, without being too simplistic. There are too few character builds. Not to mention the fact that Blizzard has been almost continually racing to make this game worth a damn from a PVP/balance perspective."

There are too few builds in your opinion. and play balancing is part of the MMO genre since the game is constantly evolving and new content is being added, so saying blizzard is racing to balance the game isnt really any kind of a point. PvP wise yes, its definatley not the best. But its quite obvious that blizzard didnt focus on pvp nor consider it very important for the games launch.

And if you think WoW takes too long to do shit in pve then i am curious if you have played any other MMOs. It is very 'easy' to get to high end content in WoW and enjoy the story and characters that Blizz has created. Which is probably why it has millions of subscribers.

[Edited on July 20, 2006 at 11:56 AM. Reason : *]

7/20/2006 11:56:05 AM

^Because, the rating of a game is relative to it's competition.

And see here we go again, you are bring your PERSONAL enjoyment in as a measure of what constitutes a "good game". Obviously, as is representative by the sales of the game, a pretty large majority of gamers disagree with you.

While you can say "people are stupid", it doesn't make it a bad game if stupid people enjoy it.

Take Snood for instance, probably one of the worst games from a design and gameplay point of view that was ever made, but it has been a massive commercial success.

Whereas Starcraft was both innovative in many areas of it's UI, gameplay AND it was a massive commercial success.

7/20/2006 11:57:05 AM

Dunno so much what you mean with Starcraft -- I'd argue that TA was much more revolutionary, and hit it right on the head while Blizzard marched on to creating "Korean" style play.

7/20/2006 11:59:03 AM

I never liked TA, but I can tell you it wasnt a bad game.

7/20/2006 12:05:53 PM

And I liked Starcraft but I can tell you it wasn't a great game.

It's not like I'm saying its devoid of value here.

7/20/2006 12:19:30 PM

Eh, I personally think people rag way on WoW way too much for its lack of PVP. It's true that Blizzard didn't put a great deal of focus on PVP, especially at the games launch, but you can't expect them to do everything for you. You forgot it's an MMORPG, and what you get out of it directly relates to what you put into it. Trust me, if you go out and look for fights, you'll find them. Probably the most fun I've ever had in that game (probably ever will have) were the massive melee's at outdoor raid spawns. While it drives the raid leaders crazy, nothing beats setting off a huge fight between opposing guilds by fucking with their outdoor raid attempt. Battlegrounds can be fun too, but only when the opposing sides are evenly matched in gear. They really need to implement some sort matching based on average item level into their BG queue system, especially with the new cross server BGs coming out.

As far as graphics, the game is over 2 years old now if you count the public beta, cut it some slack. Even Prey (based on the Doom III engine) looks dated by the standards set by games such as Oblivion and F.E.A.R.

7/20/2006 4:24:16 PM

MOTHERFUCKERS


CAN ANYONE CREATE A NEW ACCOUNT ON BATTLENET?



WAY TO FUCK UP MY THREADS YOU FUCKING ANNOYING COMPUTAR NERDS

7/20/2006 4:53:02 PM

pwnt

7/20/2006 5:23:33 PM

I rag on anyone who plays WOW or any MMORPG for that matter because its a fucking stupid way to waste away your life, but that doesn't make it a bad game, or a shitty one.

And TA didn't and doesn't have the universal APPEAL of Starcraft for the reasons I've already outlined, which is a HUGE part of the success of any game.

You can argue that TA did everything perfectly, but your argument would be invalidated by the fact Starcraft outsold it like 1000 to 1. Perfection and execution is determined by the marketplace, not by the "experts". People buy what they like, not what they are told they should like.

7/21/2006 12:34:51 AM

LOL

ahh, it's past midnight. Nothing like a game of Starcraft before going to bed.

Quote :

"This is a very creative piece of music in mp3 format done completely using in game Starcraft sounds. Only a true master can turn gunshots and nuclear warnings into a musical masterpiece. Created by [P]aradox."

http://www.infoceptor.com/files/media/scsoundmix.mp3

[Edited on July 21, 2006 at 12:47 AM. Reason : .]

7/21/2006 12:39:32 AM

anyone that wants to play some SC on bnet, regular or BW, pm me your name, versus or team i dont care, hit me up, could use some new ppl to play it with

7/21/2006 12:46:47 AM

They broke the mold with Starcraft.

7/21/2006 12:55:28 AM