2

I'm saying that Romney is more likely to be business friendly than is McCain. With a comment like "If you thought the Bush Administration was a little bit too friendly with big business, you ain't seen nothin' yet" I figured you were implying that was a bad thing and I was stating that Romney was far more disposed to be business-friendly.

Quote :

"Honestly, he is running on his foreign policy credentials, when his war mongering when combined with his "loose cannon" damn the consequences nature and age scares the hell out of me."

McCain is acutely aware of the consequences of war so I don't worry about him pulling the trigger unnecessarialy in the sense that I do with certain other current presidents. *cough*

1/30/2008 2:13:31 PM

Quote :

"certain other current presidents."

haha. yup, all of them...

1/30/2008 2:16:46 PM

plus i see him executing a war a lot better than bush also

1/30/2008 2:17:15 PM

^ You can say that about practically anyone. Shoot, HRC could have probably done it better than Bush.

1/30/2008 2:25:23 PM

McCain must be near the middle, since half of you are calling him a right-wing warmonger and the other half are calling him a raging liberal in disguise.

This pleases me.

1/30/2008 2:50:17 PM

I'd say he is a conservative. He has a lifetime vote of 83% from the ACU. The only reason why these right wingers call him a liberal is because he is against torture and for spending cuts if we are going to have tax cuts and of course McCain-Feingold. Other than that, he is practically lock and step.

1/30/2008 3:06:33 PM

Quote :

" I still think Newt would have won this mess."

Quote :

"They would have never even been in the race had Newt signed on. It would have been Newt vs Giuliani vs Romney from the get go. "

AHHHH HAHAHAHA

you must've mistaken this for the nonexistant "OFFICIAL SOAP BOX JOKES THREAD"

I mean, I like a lot of Newt's stances on policies, but do you really think he'd get elected President?

Oh wait, scratch that...you think that John McCain is a liberal. Clearly your judgement and political astuteness is questionable borderline nonexistant.

Quote :

"If its McCrypt vs Hillarious, I may have to start promoting the bloomberg run. "

Wait, wait, holy Christ, you are shitting on McCain for being liberal, but are promoting Bloomberg?

Regardless, he's not jumping in.

Maybe if Huckabee won the GOP nod, or MAYBE if Edwards took the Dems, but not against either McCain/Romney or Obama/Clinton.

Quote :

"I'm just saying that McCain gets a free pass on the "moderate" tag when he he is only less conservative on the social issues, which seems to be all the media is interested in covering/sensationalizing. I guess you can't be a real conservative if Rush doesn't love you."

I agree on these things...but if he can survive the primaries with that perception, I'll take it all the way to the bank in the general--regardless of whether or not it's well-founded.

Quote :

"Honestly, he is running on his foreign policy credentials, when his war mongering when combined with his "loose cannon" damn the consequences nature and age scares the hell out of me. "

I understand that foreign policy--particularly military affairs--are his bread and butter. His entire life has revolved around it since he graduated highschool (and he probably had exposure to it since he learned to crawl, given who his father and grandfather were). Still, I wish he'd at minimum play up his strength as a fiscal conservative/budget hawk a little more. He's not on Giuliani's level of wearing his trump card out at the expense of ignoring other legitimate arrows in his quiver, but it doesn't seem to me that he's running the most effective strategy he could...but whatever, I guess it's working. Maybe he'll keep the other issues new and shiny for drawing in independants and lighting a fire under an uneasy GOP base in the general election.

______________________________


^ yeah, there are a few other odds and ends...a few environmental issues, moderate on immigration, stem cell funding...but yeah, he's much more to the right that most seem to give him credit for (and more so than a lot of people these mistaken people support).

[Edited on January 30, 2008 at 4:06 PM. Reason : asdfasd]

1/30/2008 4:05:56 PM

Quote :

"Super Tuesday is too close, no matter how bad Rudy does, his campaign has been more focus on super tuesday states and he will not drop out. And theres no reason for him to back this guy."

You were saying?

1/30/2008 6:16:55 PM

Quote :

"I wish he'd at minimum play up his strength as a fiscal conservative/budget hawk a little more."

Unfortunately, economics is not his strength. He has admitted more than once that he does not grasp economics as well as some other candidates. And his stated reasoning for voting against the Bush tax cuts was that "it was unfair to the middle class". Hell, response to a question about stimulating the economy was to "cut government spending", which would actually hurt the economy in the short term and likely trigger a recession.

Nevertheless, he did vote for numerous tax cuts under Reagan and now says he supports the Bush tax cuts. He also wants to simplify the tax code, cut back on bloated funding projects like Amtrak, and he absolutely opposes earmarks / pork-barrel spending.

I'd say he's a fiscal conservative, but it's definitely not his "trump card".

1/30/2008 6:29:44 PM

Quote :

"theDuke866 I know that Rush Limbaugh claims it to be--so this may blow some of your minds--but this idea that McCain is some sort of liberal is laughable."

It's not just Rush. It's most of the people who actually believe in both fiscal and social conservatism.

Moreover, if you heard Tom Delay speak about McCain you would get a clearer picture of his legislative weasel-work over the past decades. Tom Delay said straight out "McCain is no conservative", he then began to give a laundry list of obstructionist garbage. Specific acts that McCain took in opposition to the policies that I support. So forgive me if I don't trust McCain when he has proven to be an obstacle to conservative progress.

Oh, I just heard Rudy has endorsed McCain. Well big surprise. I wish Huckabee, Romney and Ron Paul would have a meeting and just pick one. They all suck in their own special way, but any one of them could beat McCain if the choice was clear. Well at least that's what I think.

1/30/2008 6:38:45 PM

oh no, it's not his trump card by any means

but he has enough credentials as a budget hawk that he could very legitimately play up

i'm just tired of hearing little about anything other than his foreign policy/military experience.

[Edited on January 30, 2008 at 6:42 PM. Reason : i want to hear more "If anyone sends pork projects to me, i will veto his bill and make him famous"]

[Edited on January 30, 2008 at 6:42 PM. Reason : although i'm not sure how easy that will be]

1/30/2008 6:39:44 PM

Obama's picking up in the polls in the past few days.
http://www.gallup.com/poll/104017/Gallup-Daily-Where-Election-Stands.aspx

ZOMG BILL GAT3ES AND MRS. STEVE JOBS LIKE OBAMA
http://gizmodo.com/350866/obama-1-in-gates-and-jobs-households-donation+wise

1/30/2008 7:36:31 PM

It's going to be hillary. Hispanics love hillary and hate black people.

1/30/2008 8:03:15 PM

looks like Hillary will beat Obama in the states that have the most delegates

http://www.pollster.com/


will Obama be dropping out this time next week?

1/30/2008 8:07:31 PM

Quote :

"One of the biggest crocks of shit from the Clinton campaign, and a dirty one at that, has been the claim that Latinos won't vote for blacks. It's quickly become CW. Too bad it's not true. University of Washington political scientist Matt Barreto has compiled a list of black big-city mayors who have received broad Latino support over the last several decades. In 1983, Harold Washington pulled 80% of the Latino vote in Chicago. David Dinkins won 73% in New York in 1989. And Denver's Wellington Webb garnered more than 70% in 1991, as did Ron Kirk in Dallas in 1995 and then again in 1997 and 1999. He could have also added that longtime Los Angeles Mayor Tom Bradley won a healthy chunk of the Latino vote in 1973 and then the clear majority in his mayoral reelection campaigns of 1977, 1981, 1985 and 1989. Here in L.A., all three black members of Congress represent heavily Latino districts and ultimately couldn't survive without significant Latino support. Five other black House members represent districts that are more than 25% Latino -- including New York's Charles Rangel and Texan Al Green -- and are also heavily dependent on Latino voters. Not only is the spin wrong, but it's racially divisive."

http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2008/1/30/105954/205/1007/445474

^^

1/30/2008 8:07:46 PM

^We'll see. It's like how North Carolinians elect democrats to every state and local office but won't go democrat in a national election.

1/30/2008 8:57:28 PM

Wait, wait... I thought the stereotype was that Blacks hate Hispanics, I didn't realize it ran the other way.

1/30/2008 9:07:22 PM

1/30/2008 9:10:11 PM

so....

How long until the media start tearing McCain apart? They've done a fine job of building him up, and plenty of Republicans have swallowed the kool-aid. They must be waiting until he has the number of delegates to preclude buyer's remorse. McCain has enough skeletons to fill Liberace's closet. What's he going to do when the pressure builds? Blow his top, like he did to his fellow senators?

1/31/2008 1:10:36 AM

mccain is going to win this because clinton will be the nominee

and people that say mccain is not conservative should be suspended in my opinion

[Edited on January 31, 2008 at 2:39 AM. Reason : .]

1/31/2008 2:39:26 AM

Quote :

"Tom Delay said straight out "McCain is no conservative", he then began to give a laundry list of obstructionist garbage. Specific acts that McCain took in opposition to the policies that I support. So forgive me if I don't trust McCain when he has proven to be an obstacle to conservative progress."

Quoting Tom Delay doesn't exactly make for a strong argument, but I'd like to see individuals articulating specific reasons why they do not support John McCain or find him to be a "Liberal". Because the completely lost talking heads on radio say so doesn't cut it, and the Bush tax cut opposition doesn't either since he actually did it on the principle of fiscal conservatism. Oh hell, I'm going to make whole new thread just so you folks will have a place to bash him.

/message_topic.aspx?topic=512651

1/31/2008 6:55:11 AM

just because McCain is the most liberal of the republican candidates that doesnt make him a liberal.... he is definitely more moderate than the others, but he is still a conservative.

and i agree with some that said that if Hilary wins the Democratic Nomination, McCain will win the general election. Not sure Obama can beat him, but i'm pretty damn certain Hilary wouldn't.

1/31/2008 7:54:46 AM

Yeah I'd agree. I like Obama alot and he has my vote...but if it's freaking Hillary, I'm voting for McPain. I'm not the only one that feels this way. Not by a long shot.

1/31/2008 9:40:29 AM

Its amazing to me that everything is still as up in the air as it (seems it) is for Tuesday.

Running down the states voting, at this point it wouldn't be surpising if the outcome was anywhere from 18 states for Clinton and 2 for Obama all the way to 7 states for Clinton and 13 for Obama.

The Republican side is perhaps more confused. I can't decide if Huckabee isn't going to pick up any states or if he is going to win as many as 7. Romney is probably only safe in 4 states but is competing in about 15.

1/31/2008 6:29:02 PM

Just gotta remember that the Democrats hand out delegate votes proportionally. All Obama has to do is keep the percentages somewhat close, and he'll be more than able to hang in there.

1/31/2008 6:35:08 PM

^ True, it will be interesting to see when the race transitions from a race of momentum to a race of delegates.

If you believe momentum is still a major factor, then if Clinton wins 17 states to 3, even if the delegates are close it may be hard to prevent Clinton from securing a majority now that Edwards has dropped out, because the message of Obama "losing" so badly will hurt him headed into the remaining states.

If we've already transitioned into a delegate count mode, then maybe 17 -3 won't be the headline, it will be 875-725-100, and not such a major headline of defeat.

Personally I think it is still the former right now. I think the message out of this will be who won states, and then from Feb 6 on out it will be a delegate watch.

1/31/2008 6:53:45 PM

1681 delegates for Dems will be awarded

My Prediction

950 Clinton
731 Obama

2/3/2008 5:34:48 PM

My prediction

666 Clinton
1015 Obama

For the republicans, hopefully Romney, sad to say.

2/3/2008 7:32:26 PM

My prediction,

875 Clinton
806 Obama

On the Republican side I think about a 43%-38-20 McCain/Romney/Huckabee Split

2/3/2008 10:54:05 PM

my count is 2064 delegates up for grabs for dems on tuesday.

my bet:

1015 for obama
1049 for clinton

2/3/2008 11:53:00 PM

no more guesses?

2/4/2008 10:09:41 PM

"Every way you look at it, we lose."

2/4/2008 10:15:49 PM

Bill Maher made a good point, there's really no reason to hate Hillary. She actually isn't terribly worse then anyone else running and remarkably better then Huckabee, Paul or Romney.

Why she gets that much hate is probably related to why the Patriots were so hated this year.

2/4/2008 10:18:36 PM

Quote :

"Every way you look at it, we lose." "

2/4/2008 10:20:13 PM

Quote :

"McCain is acutely aware of the consequences of war so I don't worry about him pulling the trigger unnecessarialy in the sense that I do with certain other current presidents. *cough*"

he gives enough fucking lipservice to a new war with Iraq for the love of God.

But still, I'm fairly sure I would vote for him over any of the Democratic nominees. And the other strong thing going for him in my mind:

/message_topic.aspx?topic=512989

People who I hate seem to hate McCain.

Also, out of the republican nominees, the only 2 i have any respect for are McCain and Ron Paul. Yes, i understand how much of a contradiction this is.

2/4/2008 10:21:11 PM

ok. so my previous guess for delegates was wrong (i included superdelegates). my revised guess:

830 - obama
851 - clinton

2/4/2008 11:42:47 PM

^^ McCain doesn't give lip service to Iraq, he truly believes it’s a worthwhile endeavor. People may or may not agree with him, but I give him the credit of at least believing in the war, as opposed to simply going along with it like some other folks on account of having no political backbone.

*cough*mostofthedemocratswhoarecurrentlyopposingthewar*cough*

I'm fairly confident McCain will solidify his position as frontrunner today. I don't expect us to know anything more about the Democrats, even if Hillary did shed a tear again the day before yesterday.

2/5/2008 8:21:01 AM

Quote :

"Every way you look at it, we lose."

Yeah, it's been this way for a few election cycles now. Looks like it will remain that way for the foreseeable future.



[Edited on February 5, 2008 at 9:58 AM. Reason : -]

2/5/2008 9:57:16 AM

^ ah cynism. America's new favorite hobby.

Anyway, some one help me out here today.

When do each State's polls close (EST)?

I'm trying to see if my class that goes to 9pm CST, will be over just in time to watch California. I cannot find the info anywhere, and I don't know where to look besides the MSM's web pages who don't help.

2/5/2008 10:05:04 AM

^Well, the average voting American hasn't really had a candidate to stand behind for quite some time. The past two presidential elections were nearly 50/50 and this is the first primary in history where there is no true standout going into, and possibly coming away from, super Tuesday.

I'd like to think that if there were a candidate that was truly worth voting for that the numbers wouldn't be as close as they have been.

2/5/2008 11:33:56 AM

I dunno, I think the Democrats are genuinely excited about their prospects (just look at the voter turnout numbers) . . . the Republicans . . . not so much.

2/5/2008 11:43:49 AM

Quote :

"the Democrats are genuinely excited about their prospects"

i, for one, do genuinely get excited imagining Obama as president

2/5/2008 11:58:50 AM

Quote :

"i, for one, do genuinely get excited imagining Obama as president "

Many felt that way about Stalin too.

He is too much of a socialist and he has accomplished nothing. He is a likeable do nothing senator that has a more liberal record than clinton. Despite what he says, that will come out if he wins the nomination. Just my opinion. I can see why people like him that dont follow politics or issues and dont pay taxes.

2/5/2008 12:05:35 PM

Thats a pretty asinine comparison. I don't expect that Obama will be committing mass genocide any time soon.

2/5/2008 12:09:33 PM

^ahhh. Many were excited and happy with stalin. Would you disagree with that? Just because you are excited about one doesnt make thier views/policies right. THat was more my point.

That and alot of his views are socialist and discriminatory.

2/5/2008 12:18:36 PM

Romney FLIP FLOPS! OMG!

http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/

Romney on Bob Dole defending McCain to Rush Sleazeball:

Quote :

""probably the last person I would have wanted to have write a letter for me." A short time later, Romney also referred to Dole as “an American hero.” He added that he would love to have the former senator’s support for his own bid."

2/5/2008 12:24:39 PM

^holly shit. THat seals it for me. No way could I vote for romney after he changed his mind on Dole after dole endorsed mccain and attack mitt. Forget taxes, experience, etc....its all about his opinion on bob dole.

phried, you actually thought that was important?

Now he flips on something important that MATTERS I might change my mind.

2/5/2008 12:32:44 PM

Quote :

" Anyway, some one help me out here today. When do each State's polls close (EST)? I'm trying to see if my class that goes to 9pm CST, will be over just in time to watch California. I cannot find the info anywhere, and I don't know where to look besides the MSM's web pages who don't help. "

(all times EST)

7:00 - Georgia closes
8:00 - 9 Primaries close + Kansas caucuses announce (AL,IL,CT,MA,NJ,OK,MO,DE,TN)
8:30 - Arkansas closes
9:00 - NY and AZ close, most caucuses announce (CO,ID,MN,NM,ND)
10:00 - Utah closes
11:00 - California closes

Not sure when Montana, Alaska, or American Samoa announce

2/5/2008 1:08:49 PM

American Samoa is something of a bellweather for presidential nominations.

2/5/2008 1:10:11 PM

Quote :

"and [Obama] has accomplished nothing."

Since when do someone's previous accomplishments correlate to competence as a president?

Maybe his major accomplishments will come during his presidency.

[Edited on February 5, 2008 at 1:15 PM. Reason : .]

2/5/2008 1:15:02 PM