I hope someone's lousy existence isn't wholly determined by their diet. I can see how subsisting on mocha frappucinos and Cheetoh's would contribute to that though.

3/23/2008 9:14:40 PM

it's hard to get good fish around here at a reasonable price that isn't fried.

3/23/2008 9:16:23 PM

^^ or on this:

Quote :

"fruits - yeah, i'm not sure which would be allowed in this diet vegetables - not reallly nuts - not that i know of seeds - no meat - if it's in a hamburger bun, it kind of doesn't work"

Dude, you gonna get raped die.

[btw, all fruits are ok. what fruits do you eat?]

3/23/2008 9:17:25 PM

Well, odds are someone who plays video games and watches tv all day, when not sitting on their ass at work, isn't going to be that worried w/ their diet.

3/23/2008 9:17:55 PM

if fruits are allowed that's good. I'm all about some fresh apples and canned fruits.

but WTF seeds and nuts?

[Edited on March 23, 2008 at 9:19 PM. Reason : ]

3/23/2008 9:18:50 PM

he lives off the insulin response.

3/23/2008 9:19:10 PM

what about chicken and turkey?

And what about rice? And eggs!

[Edited on March 23, 2008 at 9:21 PM. Reason : and flies, lol]

3/23/2008 9:20:32 PM

canned fruits? that's not good, unless they are canned in water or their own juice which you consume as well. if in sugar syrup, that's nasty.

fish, you have to buy your own fresh/frozen and cook it yourself.

seeds and nuts? what are you asking? YOU DON'T KNOW WHAT THEY ARE?

hello?

almonds
cashews
walnuts
pistachio nuts
pine nuts
pecans
macadamias
pumpkin seeds
sunflower seeds
flax seeds

ring a bell?

rice: NO (it is a grain)
all meat and eggs: YES, but under one condition: unprocessed + naturally fed (NOT corn/soya) and/or free-range.
flies: YES (again, as long as they are not intensively farmed, genetically modified, or corn/soya-fed)



[Edited on March 23, 2008 at 9:26 PM. Reason : OUT OF ALL THE FRUITS OUT THERE, YOU JUST LIKE APPLES? dude, you need to get out more!]

3/23/2008 9:24:37 PM

but the canned fruits, you see,

they put ALL the different kinds that you'll want into one can! All you have to do is open the can, have a fork, and turn the TIVO to My Name is Earl. I don't think they add sugar to the juice (eww), but I'm sure it differs by the brand. If this wasn't an amazing invention, people wouldn't write songs about canned peaches, alright.

Quote :

"almonds cashews walnuts pistachio nuts pine nuts pecans macadamias pumpkin seeds sunflower seeds flax seeds"

This is a negative. Are any of these any good?

3/23/2008 9:33:23 PM

^^dude, i think you are being trolled...

3/23/2008 9:34:58 PM

^ If so, it doesn't bother me. Giving health advice is one of the things I do in my life. I am just glad to help.



^^ HOLY FUCKING SHIT

YOU HAVE NEVER HAD

ANY NUTS OR SEEDS???



AND YOU LIVE IN THE US???

WTF?

You are missing out dude. Try them out.

My favourites:

Cashews (roasted)
Pistachio nuts
Pine nuts
Macadamias (YUM)
Hazelnuts
Brazil nuts
Sunflower seeds

BTW, I still can't believe it. You are joking, right? At least, you DO know about them, right? Cuz if you don't, that's not possible. But you must have come across them in cookies, cakes, brownies, ice cream, etc?

As for fruits, you should strive to eat fresh fruits (that's the whole goal of this diet, to eat whole fresh foods), but if the best you can do is the can of mixed fruits, keep doing it. Something is better than nothing (assuming they are not in sugar syrup... some brands are, so just check).

And oh, vegetables. It is time you started getting deeply/darkly colored veggies into your body. Greens, oranges, purples, reds, whatever. Eat some veggies.


[Edited on March 23, 2008 at 9:45 PM. Reason : 2 more NUTZ]

3/23/2008 9:43:28 PM

I thought oranges were fruit, lol

And of course I've heard of the major nuts. But they just could never comprise a large part of my diet. They're just too... nutty.

3/23/2008 9:45:38 PM

ummm... oranges are fruit. who said they aren't?

nuts don't have to be a 'large' part of your diet. as long as you eat a handful a day (10-20 nuts), you reduce your chances of heart disease, cancer, etc by up to 30-60%

eat a handful every other day. eat them once a week.

every bit helps.

3/23/2008 9:49:16 PM

this thread has been more entertaining than most

really, though, i don't see much different on this diet than just eating "healthy"

things like white bread and fine white flour are bad for you...there's no way around it - practically everything beneficial about what they started out as (grain) is stripped to make it taste sweeter...which is the reason that i ONLY eat whole grain (not "wheat" bread, but WHOLE GRAIN) breads and only cook with minimally-processed flour

i think that this diet takes it a bit too far in disallowing things like dairy, legumes, and grains for the reason that just because our ancestors developed without these things, it doesn't mean that our body isn't capable at extracting vital nutrients and processing these foods...it's true that people really aren't meant to eat significant levels of dairy products (it's not at all "natural" to milk a cow or any other animal), but that doesn't mean that, within moderation, our bodies can't handle it (though maybe i'm just making up excuses because i LOVE cheese )

all this said, it seems to me that a paelolithic diet is just something that's been said for decades, specifically about america: people eat WAY too much processed food - artificial preservatives and over-processed staples are not even remotely natural, and our bodies do not react well to them (hello fatties!)...healthy (but not overwhelming) portions of minimally-processed meats, vegetables, and fruits are key to a healthy body...throwing some grains and dairy in there are just fine, just don't overdo it

the other thing that must be taken into account is exercise - "cavemen" WORKED all day...none of them sat in offices or classrooms, none of them played video games, and i suspect that the vast majority slept no more than 8 hours a day (there's a great deal of research that suggests that our bodies can operate just fine on 6 hours of sleep, if proper nutrition and exercise are involved)

all-in-all, this diet really isn't that special - common sense tells me that it calls for the same basic nutrition that nutritionists have been preaching for decades, with the minimization of grains and dairy, those staples that our bodies didn't evolve to require

3/24/2008 9:04:29 AM

Yeah I think most people can agree with that

Some people do take this diet in a different direction though, what i would consider a high animal fat intake.

go to this website http://www.paleofood.com and see what some of their daily menus are. Some seem to fit in a lean meat and nuts, veggies fruits, no processed foods normal type of healthy diet. Others mention eating Bacon and eggs with butter! every morning for breakfast and then sometimes one or two pounds of meat later in the day (with some veggies and fruit mixed in). They seem to be pretty happy with their diet.

For the people that say they have tried this before is that how you ate or were you more of a "normal" healthy diet. Also if you have tried it where was your primary source of unprocessed/freerange meat?

3/24/2008 11:16:40 AM

Quote :

"Permitted foods Any foods that can be hunted or fished, such as meat, offal and seafood, and that can be gathered, such as eggs, insects, fruit, nuts, seeds, vegetables, mushrooms, herbs and spices are allowed. Certain advocates allow only those root vegetables that are edible raw (but can be eaten cooked),[3] or that have a low glycemic load, such as beets, rutabagas, carrots, celeriac and turnips.[43] However, consumption of root vegetables is also advocated without restrictions.[44] Natural sugars, including honey, maple sugar and date sugar are allowed in small amounts by some.[3] Practitioners are advised to drink mainly water, but certain other beverages, such as tea, coffee, juices, diet sodas and alcoholic beverages, are permitted by some advocates under certain conditions.[3][7] Some versions of the diet permit the use of oils with low omega-6/omega-3 ratios, such as flaxseed oil, canola oil and olive oil,[7] or oils derived from foods which can be obtained and produced through Paleolithic means and are edible in their natural, uncooked state.[3] Examples include sesame oil, olive oil, and safflower oil, but not oils derived from beans (e.g. peanut oil) or grains (e.g. corn oil).[3] Not all proponents of the diet allow the use of oils, as they are processed foods.[29] [edit] Restricted foods Grain products are considered restricted foods. Grain products are considered restricted foods. The foods falling into this category are mainly grains, legumes (including peanuts), dairy products, salt and refined sugar (including table sugar, corn syrup, fructose and molasses). Practitioners are sometimes advised to avoid root vegetables that are inedible raw (but can be eaten cooked),[3] or that have a high glycemic load, including cassava, potatoes, taro, parsnips, sweet potatoes and yams.[43] The diet also excludes yeast-containing foods, including baked goods, pickled foods, vinegar, fermented foods and beverages, as well as processed meats (made with nitrites and additives), such as hot dogs, bacon, sausage, and lunch meats. Some versions of the diet exclude fatty meats[7] and cashews.[3]"

This is pretty close to the diet I try to maintain with a few exceptions. I eat potatoes, cashews, and peanuts on occasion, but I avoid them when I'm trying to lose weight. I eat sweet potatoes in moderation because I feel they are very nutritious and have a lot going for them. I have to break down and eat a hot dog every once in a while, but I know that's terrible for me the whole time I'm doing it.

3/24/2008 1:05:15 PM

for a healthy diet avoid salt, refined sugars, and fatty foods.

For anything else, there probably isn't a consensus among nutritionists, so no need to change my life to conform to speculation.

3/24/2008 2:20:04 PM

If we are going to advocate for this diet, shouldn't we take it to its logical conclusion? People of European descent shouldn't eat any new world fruits or nuts or meats since those were not available to our ancestors and therefore our bodies are not developed to eat those substances?

3/24/2008 2:42:12 PM

as long as beer's involved i'm okay with it

3/24/2008 2:42:24 PM

nope, beer contains grains

3/24/2008 2:49:28 PM

^^^ why stop there, just submerge yourself in a glucose-saline solution and absorb it via osmosis....



[Edited on March 24, 2008 at 2:51 PM. Reason : s]

3/24/2008 2:51:49 PM

Thats the first time you've written anything that made me laugh.

Grats.

3/24/2008 2:56:24 PM

Quote :

"for a healthy diet avoid salt, refined sugars, and fatty foods"

that's the only part i agree with...salt is downright necessary and "fatty" meats and such aren't bad, per se...as mentioned earlier, it's easier for your body to get rid of fat from food than it is to get rid of sugar (though correct me if i'm wrong in my understanding)

unless, of course, you're talking about foods out of context from this thread - in that, the salty foods you're referring to are things like chips, and fatty foods are things that are high in trans fats (like french fries)

if you ARE referring to those types of foods, it should be obvious to just about everyone with a high school education that these foods are not even remotely healthy...forget the current trend in eating fresh and organic - these foods scream "fatty american"

now, if you're referring to "natural" foods that are high in salt content (tuna, ham, celery) or those that have high(er) levels of fat (just think bacon), i daresay that it's unfair to give them a bad rap...it's the refined and processed salts/fats that are so awful

also, as an interesting tidbit, i just read a few studies that state that natural sea salts don't increase blood pressure (while refined and processed table salt does)

refined sugar is always bad

[Edited on March 24, 2008 at 3:37 PM. Reason : .]

3/24/2008 3:34:18 PM

Quote :

"refined sugar is always bad"

3/24/2008 4:29:27 PM

Quote :

"Some seem to fit in a lean meat and nuts, veggies fruits, no processed foods normal type of healthy diet. "

Yeah, that's the way it is supposed to be.

Quote :

"Others mention eating Bacon and eggs with butter! every morning for breakfast and then sometimes one or two pounds of meat later in the day (with some veggies and fruit mixed in)."

No, it is not supposed to be like that. There is a name for that one: Atkins Diet.

3/24/2008 4:45:25 PM

^^^ Naturally salty foods, I can kind of see that. A lot of the other stuff you said, just goes whooosh over my head. If I'm going to decide tomorrow to make small changes to my diet in the interest of health... fatty meats will be one of the first to go. That just seems so... rational? inherent? 2nd grade knowledge? If a nutritionist tells me to eat a bunch of fatty meats, like maybe this Paleolithic Style Diet is, or maybe like the Atkins diet did, then I'm going to stop listening to them. Which is largely what I've done.

And what's with the hatin on flower? Grains, they're at the bottom of the food pyramid!!1 That means they're good!

3/24/2008 5:00:46 PM

cut out fatty meats. (and all saturated fats!)
cut out refined sugars and simple carbs.

[Edited on March 24, 2008 at 5:30 PM. Reason : ]

3/24/2008 5:29:34 PM

Cutting out all fatty meats is a bad idea. You need to consume fat saturated and esp. unsaturated. Fatty fish and grass fed beef are good for omega 3's. You also need saturated for things like test. production and other bodily functions.


Cutting them all out is NOT a good idea.

[Edited on March 24, 2008 at 5:37 PM. Reason : simple carbs also do have their place (around workouts)]

3/24/2008 5:34:54 PM

i meant limit the sat fat. you can't get rid of all of it.

3/24/2008 5:45:37 PM

there is some research coming out now that seems to indicate that Omega 3's by themselves aren't all that healthy either. stocking up on Omega 3's without having a good balance of Omega 6's to accompany them causes its own set of problems.

3/24/2008 6:44:23 PM

Quote :

"rice: NO (it is a grain)"

Don't asian societies on the whole tend to have the longest lived people?

Quote :

"here is some research coming out now that seems to indicate that Omega 3's by themselves aren't all that healthy either. stocking up on Omega 3's without having a good balance of Omega 6's to accompany them causes its own set of problems."

In short, eat a little bit of everything, in moderation.

3/24/2008 8:20:26 PM

Quote :

"If I'm going to decide tomorrow to make small changes to my diet in the interest of health... fatty meats will be one of the first to go. That just seems so... rational? inherent? 2nd grade knowledge?"

yeah...that'd be a bad move...i'm not suggesting you down bacon by the pound, but cutting out fats (unsaturated or saturated) is a bad idea...your body benefits from omega 3/6 fatty acids (as mentioned above) and while i suppose you could take supplements, the point is to get these necessities in their most natural form - the food you eat...if it seems like 2nd grade knowledge to you, then you were taught by a teacher who hopped on the OMG bandwagon without properly researching first

this may not be the most authoritative site, but the information is valid and they do a good job of summing it up (i wish they quoted their sources appropriately, but you can find them pretty easily if you just google their references): http://www.preventionisbest.com/site/saturatedfat.html

Quote :

"And what's with the hatin on flower? Grains, they're at the bottom of the food pyramid!!1 That means they're good!"

flour != grains

white flour (bleached and refined) is bad for you and it's that simple...all that WAS good for you in the grain before it became white flour (namely bran and germ) has been removed, and "enriched" flour is a joke...grains themselves are good for you - go with oats or whole wheat though, because anything that contains white flour (which is really just sugar at that point) is horrible (partly due to the process, but the alloxan that bleaches the flour is also suspected of causing diabetes, if i'm not mistaken)

3/25/2008 9:12:33 AM

Quote :

"Don't asian societies on the whole tend to have the longest lived people?"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_life_expectancy

not really, within a year or 2 of several European countries and some asian countries are all clumped, china comes in at a full 5 years less than us. most of the 80+ countries are in europe

3/25/2008 10:47:21 AM