going to?

1/16/2010 10:40:05 PM

The best you can hope for is that it doesnt pass inspection, but it will.

Reading back over your initial post, it seems like you are just pissed off that one of them is going "at a snails pace" as you say, and you feel like thats one of the reasons you cant sell your house, even at the lower price.

I doubt there is much you can do, aside from whine enough for them to investigate, and maybe get him fined a little. You won't speed up the process, or "improve the quality" as your cover story states your intent as being.

1/17/2010 12:10:38 AM

Quote :

"I may mention it to the board once everything is said and done and let them take it from there just for the simple fact that he is taking work from people who have paid their dues. "

I do not know anyone with a General Contractors license who is willing to stand around a construction site while rehab work is going on, I do not think you have any idea what is involved in getting a general contractors license. It is more than just passing some exams, you have to have thousands of dollars in personal cash (not borrowed) in your account for over a year. I think its like $10,000 or more and then do all of the other stuff required.

The guys that go through all the trouble to do this do not spend a lot of time at jobsites. They budget money, hire subcontractors, its more managerial than anything. They always have someone else on site overseeing the actual construction. Even if they hired a GC he would only be breezing through now and then, there would be somebody just like the guy that's there now overseeing the work.

If anything the owners of that home are glad to have probably gotten a good deal on the work being done, if the work passes inspection by the local inspection authority (in this case City of Raleigh) it is obviously not that shoddy. I could see you having a gripe if no permits were pulled and inspections were not being done but you even agree in this case they were.

You should really consider moving to a PUD maybe in Cary or Wake Forest. Get on the HOA and get in everyone's business.

1/17/2010 12:13:49 AM

Not to mention him filing complaints against those doing the work is sure not going to get the house finished any quicker.

[Edited on January 17, 2010 at 12:38 AM. Reason : k]

1/17/2010 12:38:33 AM

there's nothing wrong with looking out for your neighbors
there's nothing wrong with trying to protect the integrity of honest people

1/17/2010 12:51:44 AM

Quote :

"i don't think you understand. homeowners are paying this guy directly. he has his own company which is not licensed. he is using another company's license to pull permits. the only way that it is legal is if this guy works for the company that pulled the permits. "

THIS HAPPENS ALL THE TIME AND IS COMMON AND LEGAL.

as long as the license holder is aware his license is being used...they likely have a simply written agreement in place.

Quote :

"I think it's funny how many people came in here to say what the contractor is doing is legal. They must not have a clue as to how contractors licenses work or why they exist."

you are the one that doesnt quite understand it. legally, the license holder is responsible for the bid and job. a written agreement can be in place that the GC is basically the 'umbrella' for the project and someone else is actually the person on the ground. the GC is liable for whatever happens there, however he/she doesnt have to be the one supervising the work.

getting a license is difficult aside from simply knowing how to build something. my license required $17k in an account for several months, full criminal background check and full credit check...both of which were very explicit on what would fly and what wouldnt. a DUI in your history, for example, wouldnt....stuff like that can prevent a lot of otherwise qualified people from getting a license.

when you have your license, you can act at the 'qualifier' for 2 different entities. a lot of the time, one company will have multiple LLCs that the license applies to. sometimes, a person with a license only has one entity that requires the license...in these cases they will let another person or company without a license work under the second slot of their license for a fee.

[Edited on January 17, 2010 at 10:19 AM. Reason : .]

[Edited on January 17, 2010 at 10:20 AM. Reason : ,,]

[Edited on January 17, 2010 at 10:44 AM. Reason : damn]]

1/17/2010 10:18:13 AM

^apparently you missed the part where they are fraudulently listing the construction work as being under $30,000. You must have also missed the part about the homeowners paying the working contractor directly instead of the GC. The whole reason for requiring a GC on jobs larger than $30,000 is to protect the customer in the event that the contractor screws something up. If the contract for the work isn't bid and/or invoiced by the GC, then the job isn't being done legally.

The fact that the guy claimed he was a sub of some other GC even though he filed the permits listing the construction under $30,000 hints that something isn't on the up and up. He doesn't need a contractors license if the project is truly under $30,000.

1/17/2010 12:22:12 PM

Quote :

"I do not know anyone with a General Contractors license who is willing to stand around a construction site while rehab work is going on, I do not think you have any idea what is involved in getting a general contractors license. It is more than just passing some exams, you have to have thousands of dollars in personal cash (not borrowed) in your account for over a year. I think its like $10,000 or more and then do all of the other stuff required. The guys that go through all the trouble to do this do not spend a lot of time at jobsites. They budget money, hire subcontractors, its more managerial than anything. They always have someone else on site overseeing the actual construction. Even if they hired a GC he would only be breezing through now and then, there would be somebody just like the guy that's there now overseeing the work. If anything the owners of that home are glad to have probably gotten a good deal on the work being done, if the work passes inspection by the local inspection authority (in this case City of Raleigh) it is obviously not that shoddy. I could see you having a gripe if no permits were pulled and inspections were not being done but you even agree in this case they were. You should really consider moving to a PUD maybe in Cary or Wake Forest. Get on the HOA and get in everyone's business. "

Thanks for your knowledge on the subject but I do know what it takes because I am licensed by the State of North Carolina as a General Contractor.

^^ I wouldn't advertise that I am a GC and then say those things that you are saying...

Quote :

"What do I need to do to transfer my license? Licenses are not transferable. "...Any person or firm or corporation..." engaging in the practice of general contracting must hold a general contractor's license. The holder of an individual license may not allow a partnership or corporation to use that individual license for any reason (GS 87-1)."

Quote :

"Can a parent company's financial information be submitted for a subsidiary's application? No, the financial information or financial statements must be solely on the entity applying for a license."

http://www.nclbgc.net/faq_fr.html

You can be a qualifier for up to two companies but each company has to go through the application process and each company will have it's own license number.

No one would go through the hassle of getting a GC license if what ^^ is saying is true. If it was I would have a "borrow my license for your job because you are too stupid to get your own" company. That has a nice ring to it...

1/17/2010 1:19:17 PM

i did miss the $30k part.

Quote :

"Licenses are not transferable. "...Any person or firm or corporation..." engaging in the practice of general contracting must hold a general contractor's license. The holder of an individual license may not allow a partnership or corporation to use that individual license for any reason"

nobody is talking about transferring a license. the GC's name is on the permit. nothing has been transferred.

yes i gave the abbreviated version. you have applications and paperwork but its not that big of a deal and happens all the time in the industry. you guys are acting like it doesnt. I am saying it does and can be done legally.

and its not a matter of being too stupid to have your own license. there are several examples of when a construction company would need to work under the license of another. say the qualifier in your company leaves to take another job. you have to apply for another person to get the license but in the meantime you have on going projects. to keep your jobs going, you team with another GC until you have your new qualifier. this is not an ideal way to run your own business because you are going to end up paying the other GC ~2% of the job cost as a fee which is pretty substantial.

further, the GC who the permit is under has all of the liability, so the customer is still protected. [quote]

1/17/2010 1:44:33 PM

^ I feel like you of all people in this thread should be able to put two and two together since you are a GC or have attempted to become a GC. This situation is legal if...

-The "guy on the ground" is directly employed by the GC that pulled the permit.
or
-The "guy on the ground" is a subcontractor of the GC that pulled the permit.

The people that hired this guy are paying "the guy on the ground" directly. Please tell me how the GC that pulled the permit is getting paid...

My subcontractors do not get paid by the owner, i do. I then pay them.

"further, the GC who the permit is under has all of the liability, so the customer is still protected"

that GC could say that he didn't know the guy was using his license. All "the guy on the ground" needs is his license number and address and he can pull a permit. The revenue of the City of Raleigh permits is down. They are just looking for the money. This is why I requested a letter from that GC saying that this guy works for him but they are having a hard time producing it.


If I had an employee, the owner would not pay him and then he pay me. Makes no sense.

Quote :

""

1/17/2010 3:35:17 PM

IT'S NOT YOUR PROBLEM!

STOP WORRYING ABOUT OTHER PEOPLE'S BUSINESS!

1/17/2010 3:39:02 PM

directly employed can mean a lot of things...in a 1099 situation for example. I agree the flow of money is important and I admit that I am not sure what the contractual law says in this case...does the "GC" on the permit have to be paid directly by the owner, or can the GC be paid by the "broker" or middle man of the deal to act as the qualifier?

if the GC isnt aware his information was used to pull the permit, thats a whole other issue.

1/17/2010 3:55:32 PM

a qualifier has to work for a company. You cant pay one on a per job basis. That would be "using" someone else's license.



if this "guy on the ground" is the broker in the deal then why is he managing the construction of the project.

this is what you are suggesting is going on. owner pays "guy on ground" to hire a real GC. Real GC hires him to manage construction??? that is a lot of hands in the pot...

The two reason that I think I am having a hard time seeing this letter...

1. The GC doesn't know that he has pulled a permit under his company's name.
2. The GC knows he is in the wrong and is hoping it will go away.

Quote :

"What do I need to do to transfer my license? Licenses are not transferable. "...Any person or firm or corporation..." engaging in the practice of general contracting must hold a general contractor's license. The holder of an individual license may not allow a partnership or corporation to use that individual license for any reason (GS 87-1)."

1/17/2010 4:17:17 PM

Quote :

"if this "guy on the ground" is the broker in the deal then why is he managing the construction of the project. this is what you are suggesting is going on. owner pays "guy on ground" to hire a real GC. Real GC hires him to manage construction??? that is a lot of hands in the pot."

Im saying that the guy on the ground could have a relationship with a GC in that the GC is his qualifier..say they are partners. the GC gets a taste of a job he normally would not have otherwise, and the guy on the ground builds the project.

I think you are sticking your nose where it doesnt belong, but a simple call the GC would answer all of your questions.

1/17/2010 4:25:01 PM

Then guy on the ground's company would have a license number. you can be a qualifier for up to two companies but if you are, there will be two separate license numbers.

this is the only development in a neighborhood(that is surrounded by positive development) that has been neglected for 50 years. i started it and invested in it and I want it to remain positive. this guy and the developer are misrepresenting themselves to people that wouldn't know the difference so that is why I expressed my concern to the homeowners and the developer.

if these homes cant sell because of quality and the developer keeps dropping prices then that will cause my property value to potentially go down. I think it is somewhat my business.

1/17/2010 4:36:11 PM

If you are a GC the whole system is flawed.

1/18/2010 12:21:44 AM

^^Oh, I get it now. No, no, no.

If the builder is lowering the prices, it's not because the houses are poor quality. All new homes are pretty shoddy these days.

If he's lowering the prices, it's because the economy is total shit, and the house isn't worth as much, and yes, the same probably goes for your house. Hundreds of thousands of people are reckoning with precisely this thing right now. Bought at the wrong time/built at the wrong time (bad luck)...it happened to a lot of people, and you can't fucking blame that shit a perceived lack of quality in some random dude's work, like you got screwed in a unique, special way. You're actually just like every other unlucky schmuck getting fucked.

Just be glad he's still building and selling houses.

1/18/2010 12:58:44 AM

^^I am assuming that you have never heard any of the thousands of horror stories about people having work done and a contractor misrepresents themselves and the homeowner end up screwed? How is the whole system flawed if I am a GC? There is a reason that NC requires someone to be licensed and this guy is it.

^I am not selling for another year because of capital gains. what you are saying doesn't make much sense. You are telling me that all products are worth the same amount of money because the economy is bad? I should go to the Cadillac dealership and ask for KIA prices? The builder has the prices at $235/sqft right now(which is a lot). If people end up saying those houses aren't well done then they wont pay that for them and they will lower prices.

1/18/2010 8:53:40 AM

Quote :

"If you are a GC the whole system is flawed."

Im not sure if you are talking to me or not, but I never said that I do business like that. I am just saying that there are ways to build legally in this manner, and that it is probably a lot more common than most think....especially with the times as they are now in construction. lots of businesses closing and opening as the jobs become scarce and customers/architects are funneling projects to PMs they know. further, most architects will tell you that projects coming to them now are coming via GC, instead of straight from the owner. it is an odd time.

1/18/2010 8:53:54 AM

looks like he was talking to me, which brought the funny...

1/18/2010 9:11:28 AM

Quote :

"Im not sure if you are talking to me or not,"

for the record was referring to OP

1/18/2010 9:24:09 AM

Quote :

"Thanks for your knowledge on the subject but I do know what it takes because I am licensed by the State of North Carolina as a General Contractor."

If you are a GC then you would know the laws and wouldnt be up here asking dumb questions about what to do

1/18/2010 7:38:54 PM

^ He has a point.

1/18/2010 7:40:17 PM

if i didn't know the laws I wouldn't know he was doing anything illegal. I came looking for opinions because if I report it the development will come to a stand still but if I don't the development wont be all that it can be, the new owners could get screwed, and I think it could potentially hurt my property value.

Not once did I ask about a law, several people (in TWW fashion) provided what they thought they knew about it.

I am in a sticky situation and thought that maybe, just maybe, someone could offer insight.

It also annoys me that the developer told me that a house that is well done and one that is shoddy with the same curb appeal will sell for the same price because people don't know the difference...

I don't want my neighborhood having that reputation.

[Edited on January 18, 2010 at 8:21 PM. Reason : ..]

1/18/2010 8:19:25 PM

Quote :

"the development wont be all that it can be, the new owners could get screwed, and I think it could potentially hurt my property value."

you're making a huge leap here.. like, a fucking ridiculous one.

ZOMG SOMEONE MIGHT NOT HAVE A LICENSE THAT'S BUILDING SOMETHING, MY WHOLE NEIGHBORHOOD VALUE JUST WENT TO SHIT!!1!

1/18/2010 8:29:46 PM

its not just one house. it is going to be like 15-20

1/18/2010 8:35:32 PM

dude your property value has bigger forces than that working against it

the whole area would be rehabbed already if money still flowed like it used to.

1/18/2010 8:38:59 PM

You need to report this.

Having done this work, the homeowner could NEVER pay us directly for any subcontracted work. Anything that required a GC permit, inspection or signoff we had to legally do through the GC, both in terms of paperwork and payment.

What is happening is not at all uncommon, but it sure as shit isn't legal, and it's going to cause a world of hurt for the homeowners if anything happens down the line.

The reason this happens is because it allows both the developer (GC) and the builder to easily skim money. It's a highly effective and simple form of tax evasion. The builder gets paid, and only reports a fraction of that to the GC. The GC then has a much lower tax burden on the income, and the builder usually will offset the difference in material billing to cancel out any reported income for him as well.

Where this comes to hurt the homeowner is in the event something goes wrong. Because it's pretty likely that the work orders, bill of materials, and every other piece of documentation about the work being done isn't going to match up to what ACTUALLY gets done. So a pipe bursts, and the homeowners work order shows 3/4" copper was used, but when you go look at it, it's actually 3/8". Or the homeowner got billed for 200 feet of siding, but there's only 100 on the house.

You reporting this isn't going to do anything horrible to anyone. It'll just make the builder have to do the paper work he's supposed to be doing anyway, and it will give the homeowners a much better traceable set of materials and work orders in case of any disputes later.

KaYaK: Shut your goddamn mouth.

Quote :

"Hopefully these people buying the substandard homes are getting thorough home inspections done before closing. I know some people think that is a waste of money on a new home, but I'd much rather fork over a few hundred dollars for a good inspection than be stuck with a lemon on the biggest purchase I'd ever made."

Home inspections are fucking worthless. They carry ZERO accountability, and are hardly ever done thoroughly. You are better off hiring a GC to inspect the home properly. Even then, without pulling the place apart, you have to rely on the work history to give any real indication of the quality of the construction and it's current condition.

Do the right thing, call it in. Looking out for your neighbors is something more people should do. But as you can see, very few people on this site have any sense of integrity or honesty.

1/18/2010 9:43:05 PM

Quote :

"If he's doing something illegal, report him to the proper authorities, but don't be surprised when work stops on the house"

1/19/2010 9:16:09 PM

interesting developments since the last post in this thread.

the 10th illegal renovation started and it happens to be directly beside my house. I came home one day to find 6 nails in the drive way. I emailed the guy that was doing it and told him that I don't mind parking in the street so that I don't run over nails and my cars don't get hit with debris. He said he was sorry and that he would do that. Well a couple days later I found like 10 more nails. I emailed him again (politely) and told him I found more nails and to please let me know when they were working on that side of the home. He said "ok." Right after that email I found a nail in the sidewall of my wife's car. I sent him an email with the pic and he agreed to pay for it. I then found one in my truck tire. It was repairable. A few days after that I found like 12 more nails in the drive way. I sent him a really ugly email and then turned him in to the licensing board. He got his letter this week. He sent me an email asking to bring me a check and sign a paper saying that he did so. He has also asked me to "stay off of his property and out of his permit box." Any real general contractor knows that you don't need to go in someone's permit box to find out information on permits pulled. It is public knowledge and most info is online.

I'll keep you guys updated.

PS he is doing a terrible job on the renovation. My parents came by the other day and were like "wtf is this?" lol

4/11/2010 9:12:40 PM

I would have already installed surveillance cameras all down the side of my house.

4/11/2010 10:20:33 PM

FWIW if you are still contemplating anything, I would take action now, because as you wait, the likelihood that this will happen to more of the homes in your area increases. If I am a developer and I get away with something once, and it saves me money, you can bet I have zero incentive to be more stringent in the future.

4/12/2010 12:13:49 AM

the guy that's renovating the house next door has been using the lady that lives on the other side's water without her permission. what a class act...

4/24/2010 9:34:09 PM

Tell the lady, get him in trouble for trespassing.

4/24/2010 9:43:21 PM

oh she knows...

4/24/2010 9:57:33 PM

can you prove that he used her water line illegally? if so, she can have the guy arrested for theft. technically the guy never trespassed if he was never told to leave the property, but a theft charge won't go away easily.

4/25/2010 1:54:37 AM

I'm not sure how it all played out. I was at work. I do know the police came.

4/25/2010 10:46:49 AM

Jesus christ at all of these "I'm going to stay here with my head in the sand while my neighbors are getting fucked over". Seriously, you people are the same that took out your cameras and videotaped an old woman being beaten in traffic by a mugger.

4/25/2010 4:31:44 PM

It is out of my hands now. I reported this guy and may or may not have given a little/lot of information about all the other folks.

they can do with it what they would like.

4/25/2010 9:34:11 PM

does this even need to be bttt?

6/1/2010 7:08:53 PM

sorry

So, I have had several issues with the guy that is renovating the house next door. He has had a hard time being respectful of our property. The first issue had to do with nails in our driveway. I sent him several emails telling him that due to the close proximity of the house that is being renovated we didn't mind parking on the street. He just needed to let us know when we needed to do so. He failed to do that and clean our drive at the end of each day so we ended up having to replace a tire on our tahoe and plug a tire on my truck. He agreed to pay for it but it was taking him a long time to do so. I turned him in to the licensing board (he is not licensed but borrowing a friends) and it didn't take him long to pay up.

I had my truck cleaned this weekend and noticed that the driver side is covered in paint overspray. I bought a magnifying glass and to me it looks like the same color as the house (they just sprayed it last week). I've tried to get it off but it doesn't seem to be working and since it is a black truck I don't want to do too much.

The only other overspray I can find is on some windows on the same side of our house. It is hard for me to tell if it is the same color though.

You guys/gals are smart... Any ideas?

6/1/2010 7:26:26 PM

ok, i didn't read the rest of this thread, but ... does no one live in the house? you would have better luck talking to the owner, if possible. besides very rare cases, contractors don't care about quality. they care only about speed. quality only becomes any issue when the quality is so poor that the owner/buyer demands the work be done over. paint overspray, leaving a mess, generally not giving a shit is the norm. forget trying to get them to do the right thing - park your car on the street until the work is completed.

6/1/2010 9:07:16 PM

Pretend you are in Clayton and torch it.

6/1/2010 9:13:09 PM

an investor owns it and hired a "contractor"(that borrowed his buddies license) to renovate it. i am going to try and call the owner tomorrow

6/1/2010 9:49:51 PM