^^^Agreed. As an e-reader to simply read books the iPad just can't compete. Get both if you want the features of an iPad AND want to read. Maybe a 7" iPad would be more pleasing to read on but 10" is just too big. It's heavy, cumbersome, shitty outside, and you actually have to recharge it regularly. If you have an iPad and read a lot just get an actual e-reader you won't be disappointed and use the iPad for other things. If you have the budget for an iPad you probably have the budget to spend another $130-190 on an actual e-reader.

Quote :

"While we're being realistic, you're not reading much if you charge every 3 weeks. I was charging every 3-5 days with the k3 an it get better life than the k2 or my nook. Moving from 3-5 days to 1-2 days is really not a big deal IMO. "

jesus how much do you read? I read at least an hour a day. Probably 2-3 on average. I don't charge it but every 2-3 weeks. I don't keep the wireless turned on though. That'll kill the battery.

[Edited on November 27, 2010 at 8:15 PM. Reason : s]

11/27/2010 8:10:27 PM

^ varies from week to week. I did keep wireless on so that affected it. If something has wireless I'm at the stage where I'm keeping it on out of convenience. I use it often enough for it to be a hassle to cut it on/off every time I want to do something. If something can't get decent batt life with it on then I don't buy it. I do read a lot and read fast so that makes a difference too (1 book or more a day isn't uncommon). Even my sister has to charge her k2 every 10-12 days though and she's more of what I consider an average user. I just don't see 3 weeks being realistic for anyone that is a serious reader.

Also, 10" is great (have you never read hardbacks?), outside is far from shitty unless you're in direct sun and have it lying flat for some reason (granted i usually read in my hammock in my wooded backyard but...) and any tablet is far less cumbersome than a book (ever tried to lay your book on a table so you could read while you ate?). You're entitled to your opinions but those are obviously not those of an iPad owner or someone that has used one in depth for reading. Other than reading outside, I find no real benefit to owning a stand alone e-reader.

11/27/2010 9:00:22 PM

Quote :

"I did keep wireless on so that affected it."

i'd say so...if you have the 3G, you effectively reduced your battery by 66%

Quote :

"If something has wireless I'm at the stage where I'm keeping it on out of convenience. I use it often enough for it to be a hassle to cut it on/off every time I want to do something. If something can't get decent batt life with it on then I don't buy it."

well that's certainly your prerogative...but from my point of view (and the majority of the k3's target consumer base, i'd wager), it's pretty silly to leave the wireless on when you are quite likely not using but infrequently, just because it's simply too much of a hassle to spend 6 seconds turning it off

you can't say the k3 is a mediocre intarweb device (which it is, no one would argue) and then claim that you'd rather reduce your battery life by 66% than spend a few seconds switching it off...with the ipad, it makes sense to leave the wireless on because it is designed to be an internet device and the frequency with which a user utilizes the internet is significantly higher than the average k3 user...leaving the wireless on while using the k3 for what it was designed for is just retarded

Quote :

"I just don't see 3 weeks being realistic for anyone that is a serious reader. "

look harder...2 hours of reading per day is a far cry from barely using it, especially if you're an adult with a life and a full-time job...i'm sure there are some statistics out there regarding how much the average adult pleasure reads per day, but i'd be surprised if between lunches and toilet breaks and some time in bed it's even 2 hours

Quote :

"I do read a lot and read fast so that makes a difference too (1 book or more a day isn't uncommon)."

this means nothing...i used to read a goosebumps book in 30 minutes in elementary school, so your statement actually makes you seem like an extremely slow reader by that comparison

my average book is ~800 pages...and it depends on the complexity of the book (there was a time i could read a crichton or grisham novel in a day, too, but that's because it took zero effort...don't get me wrong, i love them anyway)

it also depends on what font level you've selected in the kindle, as a lower number of words on a page will increase the number of page turns (thereby decreasing the battery life)...mine's on the second smallest font (i could do the smallest, but when i'm on the elliptical at the gym it becomes difficult to see if i'm not holding it)

Quote :

"Also, 10" is great (have you never read hardbacks?), outside is far from shitty unless you're in direct sun and have it lying flat for some reason (granted i usually read in my hammock in my wooded backyard but...) and any tablet is far less cumbersome than a book (ever tried to lay your book on a table so you could read while you ate?)."

10" defeats the purpose of having something the size of a paperback...you might be one of those people who have to have the book the day it comes out and are willing to purchase a hardback at retail and tote it around, but there is a reason that even though consumers have to wait, paperback sales are almost always significantly higher than hardback...obviously it comes down to preference (yet again), but by your logic, why don't we carry around 15" tablets simply because they're bigger?

obviously everyone's situation is different, but since your experiences seem to come mostly from lying in a hammock in your wooded back yard, i'm going to go ahead and assume that you don't represent the average user...argue all you want, but overall, glossy LCDs (especially touchscreens) are awful in high light situations

i, for one, have never had trouble eating lunch with one hand, and my dinners are usually spent eating with other people, so i've never had cause to curse books for being so cumbersome...that said, we DO agree that something like a tablet or ebook reader is much easier to lay flat (which is obvious to everyone in the world, of course)...unfortunately, the ipad's viewing angle sucks donkey balls compared to the k3's, and i'll call you a liar if you say that increasing the angle at which you're viewing the ipad doesn't frequently increase the glare

what we come back too, of course, is personal preference...it is a FACT (as in, your opinion means nothing) that the contrast of an e-ink screen is better and easier to read in all normal-to-high-light conditions and it doesn't cause eyestrain for the overwhelming majority of users (unlike a backlit LCD, which does cause eyestrain in a statistically significant number of people during extended use)...it is also a FACT that an ereader gets significantly better battery life when used as it is intended

i'm not sure why people feel the need to defend their ipad purchase so badly...it is a fact that you purchased an inferior ebook reader, but a device that was not specifically designed to be such (and so should not be expected to be as good)...it is much more versatile, as it should be the for 4x the price...if it works for you, then be happy...just because others are happy with the better performance they receive (for what they use it for, mind you!) and get that performance for 25% the cost of yours shouldn't make anyone bitter

[Edited on November 28, 2010 at 7:56 AM. Reason : .]

11/28/2010 7:54:10 AM

You're kidding me, right? Why are you still arguing that e-readers are better e-readers? Are you that insecure that people enjoy something other than a nook or kindle that you feel the need to defend them with statements that everyone agrees with and nobody is arguing against. For the record, once again I agree that e-readers are better e-readers.

However, that does not mean that I cannot enjoy my iPad and clarify FACTS about it when people such as yourself that have little to no experience with it try to make statements about why using it is like.

Majority of the K3's user base is probably not very technologically advanced and are more likely to leave wireless ON simply because they don't realize the advantages of cutting it off. But you are right that it's my perforative for doing so. Thank you for being so kind as to point that out. I'm happy that I now have your permission to use my device how I prefer.

I can certainly say that it is a mediocre web Device regardless of my wireless habits. I don't know if you're aware but the browser works with both 3G and wifi and doesn't have some kind of setting that makes it suck more if you dare not save your battery life by cutting wireless off. It sucks period.

2 hours a day is pretty good and I'd agree that it's probably more than the average person. We're no discussing the average adult though. We're discussing "serious readers". I'd say that 2hours a day maybe qualifies for that but is by no means extreme. And yes, I average more than that. No, I still don't believe 3 week average recharge periods for the normal "serious" reader.

Congrats for moving on from the "Goosebumps" series. I've never tried it but whatever you enjoy. When I read for pleasure (i.e. When I'm reading 1-2 books a day) then it's a novel and average 4-600 pages. I save the journals, biographies, etc. for when I don't want to get caught up in something.

You are correct that 10" defeats the purpose of having something the size of a paperback. I forgot how many people buy e-readers because they need something the size of a paperback. Wait, I forgot that most e-readers are larger than a normal paperback. Size of the screen has nothing to do with the size of the device. iPad is 1.5" taller than a nook and 2.5" wider. Kindle 2 was larger than the nook. Sony's is bigger still. The only one that's actually approaching standard paperback sizes is the K3. You should have argued weight. That's the only real size argument that there is. The pocketable stuff is bullshit. People don't care about being able to put it in their pocket until they own it. Why? Because people don't stuff a 500 page paperback in their pocket on the way to the airport, park, coffee shop, etc.

Please do me a favor and go buy an iPad, use it outside for 2 weeks and then return it. Then you can discuss it's merits (or lack thereof) while outside all you want. All LCDs are not created equal. I've used plenty that were completely wiped out when outside. I've also used those that take a hit but are still completely useable (like the iPad). Being worse in a situation is not the definition of being shitty or awful. It simply means that it's worse. That ranges from good to trash. Would a real book or e-reader be easier to read in this situation? Definitely. Is the iPad or many other tablets unusable? Far from it.

Now you want to talk about people feeling the need to defend their purchase. The whole thing started when YOU posted talking shit ("priceless apple product badge of pride") and then Nighthawk following up with how he hated the "iCrap" badges. Perhaps if some users would just grow the fuck up and quit acting like children that can't stand someone daring to enjoy something that they didn't like then we wouldn't need to keep rehashing the iPad argument. You want to talk about being an adult while posting juvenile shit and thinly veiled insults. Do us all a favor and just stop posting. Whatever you do, please stop telling everyone about how your nook is a better e-reader than an iPad. Nobody disagrees with you and we're all getting tired of hearing you post the same thing over and over.

[Edited on November 28, 2010 at 12:02 PM. Reason : .]

11/28/2010 12:01:54 PM

Anybody a comic book reader? I had some cbrs on my computer and put CloudReader on my iPad and tried it out. With the nice contrast of the screen, it definitely does comic books justice. I know its not "serious" reading, but it is far more enjoyable than reading a comic book on a computer screen, and I imagine, than looking at one in grey on an e-ink screen.

11/28/2010 12:05:02 PM

For the love of god, keep it to the subject of dedicated e-readers guys. You both have perfectly valid points sitting in a nest with blatantly exaggerated blanket statements. Everyone understands that tablet alternatives can serve as e-readers, and we've nodded to that in this thread, but can we keep the primary focus on dedicated e-readers instead of hassling each other about the feasibility of tabletv alternatives? That could easily be another thread on its own.

11/28/2010 12:34:37 PM

I'm done arguing with quaggy on the iPad vs. ereader fanboism. But I was interested if any other readers had tried to do comic books instead, and how the other e-readers (of which I have almost no knowledge) can handle these, if at all. I honestly read magazines way more than anything else, followed by books, and occasionally comic books on a specific series.

11/28/2010 12:50:10 PM

Sorry, wasn't aimed at you, was talking to the two guys writing TSB-esque response essays.

And yeah, you can apparently read most comic books and manga on Nooks and Kindles, but obviously without color. A lot don't use color anyway. Someone, while talking about the Kindle, said they were using some manga program or site to view and read, but I don't know what thread that was in, blah.

[Edited on November 28, 2010 at 12:59 PM. Reason : f]

11/28/2010 12:56:38 PM

i, too, am done debating pointing out how the ipad isn't an actual ereader and that despite it's 300% higher price, doesn't do what an ereader was designed to do nearly as well as any actual ereader

fwiw, the ipad will continue to be brought up because the nook color is nothing BUT a cheaper and smaller ipad...it sucks as an ereader in the same way that an ipad does...i guess you could argue the screen contrast, screen glare, and battery points, but no one will listen because both the nook color and ipad fail miserably compared to an ereader with e-ink...neither the ipad nor the nook color emulate ink and paper, so they really don't belong in a discussion of ereaders anymore than does netbook

[Edited on November 28, 2010 at 3:10 PM. Reason : also, dave421, i have a kindle 3G, not a nook...reading comprehension FTL ]

11/28/2010 3:07:20 PM

nook 3G refurb (same warranty as new) for $99 free shipping and no tax: http://www.buy.com/prod/217612847.html

11/28/2010 4:45:58 PM

^^^ http://foosoft.net/mangle/ is what I've seen for doing manga on the kindle. I'm not a comic/manga (not sure of the difference) guy though so no idea on how well it works. I have seenit recommended several times though on forums. I know that several of the comic book houses are jumping on the iPad bandwagon and I'd imagine at least a couple of them are supporting regular e-readers too. Amazon also has a "comics and graphic novels" section of the kindle store http://www.amazon.com/b/ref=sr_tc_2_0?ie=UTF8&node=156104011&qid=1290981740&sr=1-2-tc though it appears a bit light to me.

^^ wait, so you're saying an e-reader is a better e-reader than a tablet? Fuck, who would have thought?!?! BTW, congrats on being the densest member of tww.


Has anyone found how you loan books with kindle? I don't understand why but I can't find any info on it other than it's now possible. Nothing obvious shows up in my kindle apps either (supposed to be on all devices and apps).

[Edited on November 28, 2010 at 5:28 PM. Reason : .]

11/28/2010 5:07:45 PM

Just for the record there is an iPad in my household and I've used it quite extensively for a variety of purposes including attempting to read on it. I won't compare two products unless I've used them both extensively and in my opinion and the opinion of most people I've talked to that have used both a Kindle and an iPad the Kindle is by far the superior device for reading. But to each his own.

Quote :

"I can certainly say that it is a mediocre web Device regardless of my wireless habits. I don't know if you're aware but the browser works with both 3G and wifi and doesn't have some kind of setting that makes it suck more if you dare not save your battery life by cutting wireless off. It sucks period. "

I still don't understand the wireless part. There's a multitude of warnings telling you to keep the wireless off unless you're using it. Even my 65 year old dad who isn't very tech literate knows to turn off the wireless and it saves the battery. Unless you're constantly downloading books every hour or so there's really no reason to keep the wireless on. If you are then good for you. I'd rather waste the 6 seconds it takes to turn it on and save weeks of battery then keep it on all the time and have to charge it every few days. Even on vacation when I've read 6+ hours a day I haven't had to charge it nearly as much as you say. Maybe you have a bad battery? I download a few books at a time then read them. I don't need the wireless once but every week or so.

Quote :

"Congrats for moving on from the "Goosebumps" series. I've never tried it but whatever you enjoy. When I read for pleasure (i.e. When I'm reading 1-2 books a day) then it's a novel and average 4-600 pages. I save the journals, biographies, etc. for when I don't want to get caught up in something. "

Congrats on having that much time to read. I have a full time job, work out, eat, and socialize and typically only have 1-2 hours a day to read. If that. If you can read 1-2 novels in 1-2 hours then I'm very impressed. If you take longer than that good for you for spending that much time a day reading. My dad's retired and probably reads 4-5 hours a day on his Kindle 2 and STILL doesn't have to recharge it but every few weeks and he reads with the larger fonts (more page turns).

I'm not saying it isn't enjoyable reading on an iPad. I enjoy it when I do it. Just in my opinion reading on a Kindle 3 is a better experience overall.

Quote :

"Has anyone found how you loan books with kindle? I don't understand why but I can't find any info on it other than it's now possible. Nothing obvious shows up in my kindle apps either (supposed to be on all devices and apps). "

So it's officially possible? I know you can log into someone else's account on your kindle, download all their books from their archive, then log back into your account and it keeps their books. Don't know why Amazon still allows that to work.

11/28/2010 6:01:04 PM

^ multitude of warnings? I don't recall that. Regardless, charging something every 3-5 days is not the chore that you guys are making it out to be. Do none of you own a smartphone? Seriously, you plug it in one night when you o to bed and then take it off the next morning. I also subscribed to the Charlotte Observer and USA Today through it and wanted it waiting on me in the morning rather than taking the 10 minutes to get everything on and synced.

As for having the time to read, I work 50-60 hours a week on average. I usually read for 1/2-1 hour before work in the mornings. After work, I go out 3-5 times a week. When I get home, I only watch tv 2 days a week usually (actually cancelled my cable). When I'm home, I usually read, clean, work on the house/yard, etc. Not watching tv is where the majority of myreading time comes from. I also usually only sleep 4-6 hours a night so there's a lot of time there as well. Also, I think you misunderstood the 1-2 books/day thing. That's not an everyday occurrence. It's just not uncommon when the weather is bad, I'm out of town on business, or I just feel lazy. During the week, I tend to read more papers and magazines than books.

Apparently the kindle loaning thing hasn't started yet. I thought they introduced it earlier this month but apparently they only announced it as coming later this year: http://abcnews.go.com/Business/t/story?id=11950602

The account thing works? I thought it kept the books but wanted you to verify that you bought them somehow like the nook does (asks for the cc# used to buy them)

[Edited on November 28, 2010 at 7:26 PM. Reason : .]

11/28/2010 7:24:09 PM

Despite what pretty much everyone in this said thread, I asked for (and got) a Nook Color.

It's simply amazing.

Probably not going to root it for a while at least. I want to see the apps market they roll out next quarter (and the Android 2.2 upgrade) and see from there.

12/25/2010 2:18:31 PM

isn't the nook color just a big lcd screen (therefore defeating the purpose of an e-reader, imo at least)? if so, it's just a severely limited tablet computer then...

12/25/2010 2:33:27 PM

tag

looking for suggestions of websites that have free public domain .epub files

or just free .epub files

12/25/2010 2:44:38 PM

You need to read up on it, more innovation there than it sounds. Physically it's the best performing tablet under $500, and at a very reasonable price. With the developments that B&N has coming for it this quarter, it'll probably take off (less restraints on the Android software, which is being upgraded, and adding an apps makret).

Also, you mention the LCD being anti-ereader, which is kind of ridiculous to me. If you do a lot of reading in the broad daylight and outdoors than e-ink makes a lot of sense, but it's awful indoors at night. I (and I feel like most of my generation) definitely read more in dark, indoor environments, and at night. Plus, LCDs don't hurt my eyes at all. The screen has a great viewing radius too, no real distortion at all. I took it outside (bright sunny day right now) and it was fine. Even better indoors. So the whole "oh man e-ink is just such a leg-up" is kind of a really limited and hyped argument. If it makes more sense for you then that's one thing.

E-ink also takes a lot less power, but the Nook lasts a bit longer than the iPad (though I'll do some consumer tests with my Nook Color and my girlfriends iPad--maybe get my friend's Galaxy Tab) at least. For some people lasting a week is going to be a big draw to e-ink, and that's understandable. Personally it's not a huge deal to me, so I don't mind having to charge the Nook Color every now and then.


Either way we all know the advantages of e-ink, LCD, tablets and e-readers. I just wanted to post how much I'm enjoying it, especially compared to my Kindle (which is now my father's).

12/25/2010 2:45:32 PM

eh. i still prefer e-ink/digital paper a million times more than lcd for reading. i read a lot and especially after sitting at a computer all day my eyes hurt w/ lcd screens. the kindle's screen doesn't hurt me, & i can actually take my glasses off even though i'm farsighted. the whole omgihavetousealighttoseethescreenatnight argument doesn't really work for me. i don't have a problem reading my kindle (2nd gen) indoors at night. i need the same amount of light as i would for a book, and i don't expect any different. in bed i use a headlamp.


i'm glad you're happy with your gift, i would have just gotten a tablet computer if that's what i was after. i'm not trying to argue so i'm just gonna shut up now.



[Edited on December 25, 2010 at 3:21 PM. Reason : ]

12/25/2010 3:16:04 PM

I got a kindle 3 as a gift this year from mom, and gave my sister a nookcolor.

I've not done a whole lot with either other than some minor playing around. They both look cool, and I guess each has it advantages.

12/25/2010 7:35:28 PM

I got one too and I love it. I just didn't like the look and feel of the nook and then the other ereaders seemed like a pain in the ass to get books on there.

12/25/2010 8:38:08 PM

sister in law got a nook... tried it out, HATED it. Very slow response time, felt cheap/plasticy, took forever for shit to load etc

12/25/2010 8:46:01 PM

ok so:

Amazon = Kindle
Barnes & Noble = Nook
Sony = Sony E-Reader

the guy who sold me the Sony that I gave as a Christmas present said there were technically more titles available for the Sony than the others, since the Nook could only legally buy books that B&N offered, same for Kindle and Amazon. Is that true at all? Obviously anybody could torrent any ebook, but legally can you get more content on the Sony?

[Edited on December 26, 2010 at 2:06 AM. Reason : transposed]

12/26/2010 2:02:29 AM

Erh, it's not really a matter of legality. Now it used to be this way, I assume it still is--Sony can use any kind of ebook file because it's open software (unlike Nook and Kindle). But that applies to Sony and a ton of other random e-reader makers that you'll find on the shelf.

Quality of that software and the e-reader itself, well, there's a pretty obvious divide there.

12/26/2010 12:42:10 PM

Quote :

"the guy who sold me the Sony that I gave as a Christmas present said there were technically more titles available for the Sony than the others, since the Nook could only legally buy books that B&N offered, same for Kindle and Amazon."

The conclusion he came to doesn't even make sense. Nothing there really influences how many title are available. It has more to do with how many retailers sell the files that will work with your e-reader.

Plus... amazon is a book seller. Barnes and Noble is a book seller. Sony is a... right, they're dependent on other book sellers. The selection from amazon and barnes and noble is going to be extensive whether you're limited to those retailers or not. The nook supports epub, which you can buy all over, and is what libraries use. Both the kindle and the nook support PDF. And the kindle has a converter for e-pub files. You upload it and amazon emails you a converted file that will work.

I think you'd have a tough time finding a book, that you actually want to read, that would work on a sony that is not available for the nook or kindle, or could not be made to work with either.

12/26/2010 5:10:52 PM

Gotcha. ftr, the Sony will display PDFs also

12/26/2010 5:20:35 PM

today's woot is refurb sony PRS600 touch for $105

i couldn't use a device with such poor contrast after using a kindle, but it's not a bad price

1/2/2011 10:06:26 AM