im against all production subsidies myself but to claim oil subsidies are killing off innovation is retarded. The impact is relatively small and while im sure they love getting that money if you took it away there'd be almost no impact. prices would go up a bit, but their profits and motives would remain the same.

4/29/2011 11:14:00 AM

Quote :

"(Reuters) - Goldman Sachs (GS.N) rocked oil markets for a second day Tuesday by calling for a nearly $20 fall in Brent crude oil, saying speculators had pushed prices ahead of fundamentals. It was the second warning of a steep market reversal from the long-term commodity bull in as many days. On Monday, Goldman recommended clients close a trade heavily weighted toward U.S. crude futures. Oil prices have shed around $6 a barrel since Monday's open. Traders and analysts said Goldman can have an outsized influence on commodities, citing the insight and reach of its global trading arm J. Aron. Goldman was one of the first banks to predict $100 oil last decade, in March 2005 when prices were closer to $50 a barrel. On Tuesday, Goldman chief energy analyst David Greely said the recent run-up in prices, in which Brent rallied as much as 33 percent since the start of the year, looked overdone. "

http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/04/12/us-goldman-brent-recommendation-idUSTRE73B3EN20110412

4/29/2011 1:43:41 PM

Oil and natural gas aren't even close to the most profitable of companies operating in this country. Perhaps you people should voice outrage at how much your Coke, cigarettes or computer costs?



(the figure is profit earned (in cents) for every dollar of sale)

4/29/2011 3:42:07 PM

The prices of Coke, cigarettes, and computers all seem reasonable to me.

4/29/2011 3:46:39 PM

so basically my point went right over your head?

4/29/2011 3:56:07 PM

4/29/2011 11:33:09 PM

Quote :

"Oil and natural gas aren't even close to the most profitable of companies operating in this country."

that chart's for 2010. retail prices are 30-odd percent higher now; operating expenses are not 30% higher

[Edited on April 30, 2011 at 12:44 AM. Reason : i'm just sayin']

4/30/2011 12:42:51 AM

see

4/30/2011 12:43:31 AM

i want cheap gas

4/30/2011 1:58:53 AM

Quote :

"Oil and natural gas aren't even close to the most profitable of companies operating in this country. Perhaps you people should voice outrage at how much your Coke, cigarettes or computer costs? "

I would if Coke and computers were getting multi-billion dollar subsidies.

4/30/2011 11:23:51 AM

Do you have a list of the subsidies?

4/30/2011 1:56:19 PM

Quote :

"operating expenses are not 30% higher"

yes. because the actual price of purchasing oil hasn't gone up at all really, what would you have them do? Sell oil to us at $X a barrel when they can go over to China and sell it for $X+50 a barrel? really? fuck economics and business, yo!

[Edited on April 30, 2011 at 4:15 PM. Reason : ]

4/30/2011 4:14:54 PM

Quote :

"15 LARGEST SUBSIDIES TO OIL (sorted in descending order) Federal Subsidies to Oil Subsidy Amount Percent Share (Oil Share, $ Millions) Excluding Defense Including Defense Subsidy Low High Low High Low High Description 1. Oil Defense $10,459 $23,333 NA NA 66.8% 66.3% Defense operations to protect and secure Persian Gulf oil shipments and infrastructure. 2. Strategic Petroleum Reserve $1,560 $5,427 30.0% 45.8% 10.0% 15.4% Storage of crude oil to be sold during price shocks and supply disruptions to stabilize domestic supply. 3. Foreign Tax Credit $486 $1,057 9.3% 8.9% 3.1% 3.0% Allows a portion of foreign tax payments to be credited against, rather than deducted from, U.S. taxes due. 4. Accelerated depreciation of machinery and equipment $720 $976 13.9% 8.2% 4.6% 2.8% Allows machinery and equipment within the oil industry to be depreciated more quickly than their actual service lives. 5. Excess of percentage over cost depletion $335 $746 6.5% 6.3% 2.1% 2.1% Allows firms to deduct more than their investment in oil properties from their taxes. 6. Public liability for plugging, abandoning, and remediating onshore wells $119 $451 2.3% 3.8% 0.8% 1.3% Annualized shortfall in bonding levels needed to cover existing liabilities on on-going operations. 7. Accelerated depreciation of buildings other than rental housing $234 $355 4.5% 3.0% 1.5% 1.0% Allows buildings owned by the oil industry to be depreciated more quickly than their actual service lives. 8. U.S. Coast Guard $308 $308 5.9% 2.6% 2.0% 0.9% Water infrastructure (maintenance of coastal shipping; provision of navigational support; ice clearing). 9. Deferral of income from controlled foreign corporations $62 $303 1.2% 2.6% 0.4% 0.9% Allows oil companies to delay payment of U.S. taxes due on earnings from certain foreign corporations. 10. Low Income Home Energy Assistance Program $274 $274 5.3% 2.3% 1.8% 0.8% Assistance for low income energy consumers to buy oil. 11. U.S. Army Corps of Engineers $239 $259 4.6% 2.2% 1.5% 0.7% Maintenance of waterways heavily used by oil tankers and barges. 12. Expensing of exploration and development costs ($146) $243 -2.8% 2.0% -0.9% 0.7% Allows expenses related to multi-year oil well assets to be deducted from taxes in the current year rather than capitalized. 13. U.S. Export-Import Bank $197 $241 3.8% 2.0% 1.3% 0.7% Subsidized loans and insurance to support the sale of oil-related equipment and consulting services abroad by U.S. corporations. 14. Royalty Undercollection due to Artificially Low Posted Prices $31 $130 0.6% 1.1% 0.2% 0.4% Undercollection due to use of below-market prices in computation of production value by integrated companies. 15. Tax break from federal/state interaction $56 $119 1.1% 1.0% 0.4% 0.3% State revenue losses from federal tax breaks due to basing state taxable income calculations on federal tax returns. - All other subsidies $724 $970 13.9% 8.2% 4.6% 2.8% TOTAL VALUE OF TOP 15 SUBSIDIES Excluding Defense* $4,477 $10,889 86.1% 91.8% Including Defense* $14,936 $34,223 95.4% 97.2% TOTAL SUBSIDIES Excluding Defense $5,200 $11,859 100% 100% Including Defense $15,660 $35,192 100% 100% "

http://bit.ly/kuRFlO

4/30/2011 6:46:47 PM

FYI -- their profits are huge because their revenues are huge. People just like to make a stink about it because they have no frame of reference about how truly huge their finances are. They absolutely make a decent buck, but, as a percent of their expense/revenue, they're actually quite similar to other industries.

Their revenue:profit ratio is similar to every other major industry where there are a few major players (electronics, television, et al).

4/30/2011 6:59:28 PM