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1/10/2012 8:25:06 AM

so republicans are very quick to toss out the communist thing (most of their voter base just know commies = vietnam = bad) Why doesn't the other side through fascism around like a buzz term? Is it because their voter base tends to be more intelligent and can say... damn bush was bad but he's no Hitler/Mussolini. When all the repub voter demographic can do is be like damn... that guy with the mark on his head was one scary lookin mofo (Mikhail Gorbachev)

1/10/2012 11:42:56 AM

very interesting point

I'm Krallum and I approved this message.

1/10/2012 11:45:58 AM

To the people bringing up the gold standard, what do you see as the alternative? Do you prefer our current debt-based, perpetual bubble mentality economy? Does that seem like something that can be sustained long-term?

We don't need gold-backed currency, but we need currency backed by something. The full faith and credit of the U.S. government ain't gonna cut it forever, mainly because it has no actual value. Ron Paul has introduced legislation to allow competing currencies, which is much different than a true "gold standard". Currently, it's illegal to not accept U.S. dollars when doing business in the U.S., despite the fact that the dollar has been debased repeatedly and substantially.

The value of the gold standard in the past was that it prevented the government from printing up a bunch of money that they could then use to buy votes. Nixon removed that protection entirely in 1971. Since then, we've had an ever-expanding government that funnels wealth to the politically well-connected class at an increasing rate. One of the main drivers in the destruction of the middle class is the fact that politicians have a bunch of funny money at their disposal; they have no incentive whatsoever to create a balanced budget.

As far as Ron Paul's views on evolution goes, it's pretty inconsequential. I believe in evolution and I'm an atheist. I'm also a strong Ron Paul supporter. Why? Because I'm not voting for the man's religious beliefs, I'm voting for his view on governance. His goal is not to legislate "Christian morality" from the federal level, it's to get the federal government out of that business altogether. For the record, though, Ron Paul has stated that he doesn't believe creationism and evolution are mutually exclusive. I don't happen to agree, but that view is a far cry from "not believing in evolution".

1/10/2012 11:49:06 AM

Currency neednt be backed by anything

Herp derp who gives a shit about evolution. Lets make a deal. We can teach science in schools because churches don't pay taxes to contribute to education, and we can all go to hell when we die. You can't have this life AND the afterlife. gtfo


Here is why you should vote for ron paul
http://www.opensecrets.org/pres08/contrib.php?cycle=2008&cid=N00005906
(John McCain in contrast) http://www.opensecrets.org/politicians/contrib.php?cycle=2008&type=I&cid=N00006424&newMem=N&recs=20

Here is why you should not vote for obama
http://www.opensecrets.org/pres08/contrib.php?cid=N00009638
Goldman sachs? Citigroup? Jpmorgan chase? No thank you.

It has nothing to do with abortion or any of that bullshit. That is all there to distract you from the fact that our country is run 1% of the 1%. So keep fighting over whether or not gay people can get married while big bank uses the process of continual war to rob us and move our country into a police state. Read Chris Hedges

I'm Krallum and I approved this message.

1/10/2012 11:49:40 AM

^
It's currently backed by our faith in the government/regulators.

1/10/2012 11:54:09 AM

The point is whatever thing mass media is arguing about is irrelevant because all of that shit is controlled by the people who on the liens on all of the media circuits. Things like SOPA and NADA get no air time. Why? Distractions. Ask yourself why we have NADA, why do we have the patriot act? Who is our current enemy again? Name the last beneficial act that was passed in your favor. Healthcare? lol

I'm Krallum and I approved this message.

1/10/2012 12:01:49 PM

Quote :

"That tells you something. So-called conservatives will sooner vote for a big government, nanny state supporting Democrat that is likely to keep the wars going. Let's get real guys. What are you afraid of? Is it Israel? They said they don't need our help. Is it cutting a bunch of spending from the Executive Branch? Is it the potential of ending the Federal Reserve and eliminating the deficit? What makes Obama preferable to Ron Paul?"

Listen, his ideas sound good. They're revolutionary, they're new, they're bright, and I can understand why a bunch of people have got behind them. But they're risky and radical. I personally prefer more moderate republicans over the extreme right. What if these ideas don't work? Then we're really in for it. His foreign policy is fine, and no, Israel doesn't need our help. The bottom line is cutting spending, eliminating the federal reserve, etc. is not the golden solution to our economic problems, and no one has it. The economy is controlled by us, and the decisions we make, so overall there is only so much a president should do about it without making radical changes.

1/10/2012 12:02:25 PM

Quote :

"Things like SOPA and NADA get no air time. Why? Distractions."

That, and the incapability of people to keep track of more than a couple issues at a time.

1/10/2012 12:05:03 PM

In theory republicans should be in favor of

1) Reduced Spending
2) No war

the whole christian thing is a manipulation of the last 30 years



^What is a bigger threat to your personal liberty?
1) Nada
2) SOPA
3) Gay marriage

what has gotten more time on the air in the last 6 months? its all bullshit. they are abusing to the fact that people care more about their stupid religious preference than their own personal freedom.

I'm Krallum and I approved this message.

1/10/2012 12:05:41 PM

lol i'm sumfoo1 and i back ron paul...

but with some more industry regs because i don't trust rich people.

1/10/2012 12:08:59 PM

No you've got it backwards dude. Regulations are what keep smaller businesses from being able to enter the market.

I'm Krallum and I approved this message.

1/10/2012 12:10:32 PM

Maybe that's what's really important to them. It doesn't have to stuipd, it's just who they are.

1/10/2012 12:11:00 PM

Quote :

"They're revolutionary, they're new, they're bright, and I can understand why a bunch of people have got behind them. But they're risky and radical."

They are radical. Our current policies are risky as hell, though. If we don't deal with the economic issues facing this countries, there is a real possibility of a very sudden crash and a drop in the standard of living. It's not too late to avoid some of that. If we continue as if nothing is wrong, though, we're in for a pretty hellish depression.

Trust me, I get it. A lot of people, myself included at times, would rather maintain the status quo. It's predictable. Even if growth isn't strong, at least you have a rough idea of what's going to happen tomorrow. Start dismantling decades old institutions and things could get chaotic.

Personally, though, I think this country could do much greater things if so much money wasn't being diverted to unproductive (or even sinister) causes. What if we could have real economic growth again? What if people actually got jobs when they graduated, and they didn't have to become debt slaves to do it? What if we could allow health care to become affordable, rather than just accepting that it will go up in cost by 10-15% every year?

[Edited on January 10, 2012 at 12:16 PM. Reason : ]

1/10/2012 12:11:08 PM

Basically, small businesses need freedom, and large businesses need regulations. Seems like that would keep things in check.

1/10/2012 12:12:49 PM

whatever dudes educate yourselves. DOES THIS SOUND FAMILIAR? Ignore the john birch society shit i think they're misguided

I'm Krallum and I approved this message.

1/10/2012 12:14:41 PM

The economy is a cycle, and sometimes these recessions, and/or depressions are unavoidable. The government seems to function like a small rudder on a big ship. It tries to steer the economy in the right direction, but only has so much influence. The harder it tires, the more likely it is to break and lose control, but always with the chance that it can actually get it going in the right direction.

1/10/2012 12:16:30 PM

Quote :

"No you've got it backwards dude. Regulations are what keep smaller businesses from being able to enter the market. I'm Krallum and I approved this message. "

Some do which sucks, i agree.

i'm talking about food... things like having rat meat in ground beef are hard to prove/disprove as a consumer and need some sort of verification.

I guess there could be an independent rat-free food certification to make sure my ground beef isn't grosser then it was before.

1/10/2012 12:16:44 PM

Quote :

"Basically, small businesses need freedom, and large businesses need regulations. Seems like that would keep things in check."

Problem is, the large businesses are usually the ones crafting legislation. Their goal is to price out competition.

1/10/2012 12:20:19 PM

Quote :

"“We must go forward cautiously and consolidate each acquired position, because already the inferior social stratum of society is giving unceasing signs of agitation. ... Let us make use of the courts. Let us go forward as fast as possible at perceiving debts, at foreclosing (depriving of recourse to justice when a certain time limit has been transgressed) on debentures and mortgages. When, through the law's intervention, the common people shall have lost their homes, they will be more easy to control and more easy to govern, and they shall not be able to resist the strong hand of the Government acting in accordance with the orders of the central power of imperial wealth, under the control of the leaders of finance. ... Our top leaders are perfectly aware of the truth. They are presently working at establishing an imperialism of the capital to rule the world. But while they are implementing this plan, they must keep the people busy with political antagonisms. We'll therefore speed up the question of reform in the custom rates by the political organization called the Democratic Party; and we'll put the spotlight on the question of protection and of the reciprocity by the Republican Party. By dividing the electorate this way, we'll be able to have them spend their energies at struggling amongst themselves on questions that, for us, have no importance whatsoever"

United States Bankers' Magazine in 1892

Its all bullshit. Recessions are INTENTIONALLY caused by the 1% of the 1%

I'm Krallum and I approved this message.

1/10/2012 12:20:19 PM

So basically, you're saying that the government is using war as an excuse to do everything they want, including eventually taking away the majority of our freedom?

1/10/2012 12:21:09 PM

Quote :

"Problem is, the large businesses are usually the ones crafting legislation. Their goal is to price out competition."

Very true. So how do we stop this?

1/10/2012 12:22:03 PM

I gotta go to class. Nobody post till i get back

I'm Krallum and I approved this message.

[Edited on January 10, 2012 at 12:23 PM. Reason : ^^ read the quote]

1/10/2012 12:23:10 PM

the ultimate problem is no person in office right now is there for the right reason.

The positon does not pay enough money to warrant the funds required for the election process.

This is the main reason that our country sucks right now... every person in office has a corporate sponsorship whether it's their company or someone else's its the same affect. Making decisions that benefit big businesses instead of the little guy.

[Edited on January 10, 2012 at 12:24 PM. Reason : .]

1/10/2012 12:23:22 PM

any WOMAN

1/10/2012 12:25:39 PM

Quote :

"Very true. So how do we stop this?"

Well, the tough reality is that we would need to elect representatives across the board that would firmly take a stand against corporatism. I don't how likely that is.

Realistically, we'd reduce the power of the federal government to a level that is more in line with the Constitution. This would at least decentralize power. In the current system, regulatory capture applies to the entire United States, making it exceptionally hard to reverse.

The broader problem we face is that the profession of career politician is most attractive to individuals that already display sociopathic tendencies. Rarely does someone go into politics for truly altruistic reasons. More often, they see it as another way to manipulate and control people, only on a much larger scale than would have otherwise been possible.

Our only hope is to elect representatives that have firm principles and are dedicated to preserving individual liberty.

[Edited on January 10, 2012 at 1:28 PM. Reason : ]

1/10/2012 1:25:03 PM

I think Ron Paul would make a fine president

I'm basing this entirely on the historical record and Mr. Paul's rabid anti-semitism

1/10/2012 1:53:05 PM

Don't believe we should be giving money to Israel when Americans are dying due lack of medical care? You're anti-semitic.



[Edited on January 10, 2012 at 2:09 PM. Reason : ]

1/10/2012 2:09:13 PM

1/10/2012 2:24:11 PM

twhich candidate are thou voting in thy upcoming election good sirs, Clarence Darrow or Charles Darwin?

1/10/2012 2:29:18 PM

Quote :

"The full faith and credit of the U.S. government ain't gonna cut it forever, mainly because it has no actual value."

It would if we exercised some responsibility and everyone knew that the American dollar was indeed almighty and an ironclad guarantee of value, just because it's the official currency of the United fucking States of America.

1/10/2012 6:25:49 PM

How do you guys not get this... There is no such thing as the american dollar.

I'm Krallum and I approved this message.

1/10/2012 6:31:51 PM

I would vote for Ron Paul.

If Rick perry, Santorum were nominated, Obama gets my vote.

Romney and Gingrich would put me on the border. Gingrich because he embodies everything that is the typical Republican (pro-corporate, fuck everyone else) and Romney's campagn is "I can beat Obama".

1/10/2012 8:09:53 PM

The point is, if you aren't voting for a candidate who is not backed by the 1% of the 1% then it doesn't matter at all who you vote for. What that opposition candidate can even do however is up for debate.

Lets look at the facts.

JFK was assassinated 6 months after Executive Order 11110
Lincoln was assassinated immediately after the civil war because he was going to continue greenback legislation
Andrew Jackson's attempted assassin was employed by the contributers of the bank of the united states (which he opposed)



I'm Krallum and I approved this message.

1/10/2012 8:14:08 PM

great point, Krallum

1/10/2012 8:19:06 PM

thanks baby

I'm Krallum and I approved this message.

1/10/2012 8:20:56 PM

My picks

Ron Paul --> Gary Johnson (if he runs Libertarian) --> Obama

[Edited on January 10, 2012 at 8:24 PM. Reason : probably wouldn't bother voting if it came down to obama]

1/10/2012 8:24:01 PM

Fact is:

The former president of chase bank was appointed head of the warren commission. It all boils down to control of money. RON PAUL 2012

I'm Krallum and I approved this message.

1/10/2012 8:25:56 PM

You assholes preaching against our fiat currency should spend a little more time reviewing history, and why we went to it. You might, also, want to consider what the ramifications of a move from it would have on our economy.

1/10/2012 11:53:53 PM

TIL Krallum is a tinfoil hat wearing weirdo.

1/10/2012 11:58:44 PM

No president would make me consider leaving the country.

1/11/2012 12:01:38 AM

1/11/2012 12:24:06 AM

Quote :

"The broader problem we face is that the profession of career politician is most attractive to individuals that already display sociopathic tendencies. Rarely does someone go into politics for truly altruistic reasons."

That's because after God and Jesus they all worship Ayn Rand, who herself was a sociopath. It's not a Republican or Democrat problem. It is a widespread cultural problem. The United States of America has placed too high of a value on anti-intellectualism, complacency, and selfishness and that is leading to huge problems.

I might disagree with people who have different ideas than me, but if they're willing to objectively look at facts presented about the issue I can at least respect them. No one sees the same thing in exactly the same way and some people have a bit more cognitive dissonance than others. I don't think I love anything in the world more than when I can have a conversation with someone whom which I disagree with just about everything they say and the debate remains civil.

1/11/2012 1:11:24 AM

I think lobbying should be made illegal in the USA. Also, I think that conflicts of interest in government should also be illegal (for example, a CEO of a logging company should be barred from having a position in the Dept. of the Interior). I also believe that the current rules regarding term limits should be changed, and any one person in office should have the threat of being voted out as a constant instead of something every 4 years.

1/11/2012 1:20:35 AM

That's a very simplistic solution. Lobbying is kind of important because it does allow parties that have a vested interest in certain legislation to inform Congress on certain issues. The problem is the relationship lobbyists have with politicians. I imagine it's the same kind of relationship that a DA has with a public defender. Ethically, their relationship should have no influence on their individual job performances. But in reality, they're probably going out to dinner and buying each other drinks. We should find a way to keep a congressman and lobbyist's relationship strictly professional and it ends as soon as the lobbyist has been invited to make their point.

With regards to banning industry people from bureaucratic positions of power, you're really just removing people with the greatest knowledge of very specific issues from doing a job they are well qualified for. I don't know what the solution is here but it probably involves higher compensation and greater ethics regulation.

1/11/2012 1:46:52 AM

Quote :

"We got to roll with it.....whatever happens. Republican or Democrat. Fundamentalist wack-job or basketball-loving wanna-be celebrity. "

also, i believe someone said one time...

Fuck That, I just lih

1/11/2012 7:43:21 AM