^which i completely understand. i'm not trying to convince anybody to eat anything they don't feel comfortable eating. but, and i'm not referring to anybody in particular, often times i think there's misinformation about this kind of stuff and it's easy to wind up with an ill-informed view of the subject - and that goes for both sides, of course.

8/11/2015 1:58:11 PM

i can agree with that!

8/11/2015 2:01:23 PM

Quote :

"yeah, if it makes the chickens healthier, it should do the same for me right"

you don't give chickens antibiotics to make humans healthy. you give them antibiotics to keep them from getting diseased. the odds of a chicken getting sick in the conditions they are grown in are close to 100% if they are not given antibiotics to prevent it. It's really gross/sad that's the way it is, but it is.

but if you want to eat diseased meat that's on you.

as for whoever said that their home grown organic vegetables didn't have pesticides and shit, good for you. I wasn't talking about home grown produce. Shit you buy at a grocery story labeled "organic" uses pesticides.

8/11/2015 2:24:36 PM

I only eat chicken raised in a field of poppys.

8/11/2015 2:37:39 PM

i only eat free range, grass fed chicken that has been lovingly read bedtime stories every night and has died of natural causes

8/11/2015 2:39:51 PM

I only eat chicken that commit suicide.

8/11/2015 2:53:14 PM

Quote :

"as someone who works in the poultry/meat industry, anyone who eats meat that was never given antibiotics is a fucking moron the nth degree. you couldn't pay me to eat antibiotic free meat. especially poultry."

you sound like an industry implant... you are saying if i gave you Trader Joe's chicken for free (or with a $10 bill), you would turn it down?

if yes, either that's a lie, or *you* are the "fucking moron to the nth degree".

poultry/meat industry is mostly a monolith, but you know, there *are* other ways some companies raise animals, as close as possible to nature, without treating them in ways that essentially amount to torture.

you should get out a bit more.

8/11/2015 2:58:57 PM

If it was an antibiotic free chicken that massed produced, I would absolutely turn it down

and I'm not a plant. I work on the side of the industry that actually does try to make the industry healthier with green alternatives, but that means I've seen how bad it can be and it's bad.

of course there are places where you can pay $25 a chicken for a free-range local farm whatever chicken. that's not the kind I'm talking about.

but people are marketing massed produced antibiotic free chickens like they're somehow better for you than their antibiotic counterparts and it's not true.

8/11/2015 3:09:47 PM

you didn't answer about TJ's chicken... it is not $25 a chicken (only about 10-20% more expensive than normal grocery store chicken), and it kind of mass-produced, but don't know how "mass"-produced it is.

would you eat it or not?

8/11/2015 3:35:24 PM

I'd assume they lived and died in a cage

8/11/2015 3:47:22 PM

I haven't done research specifically for trader joes chickens so I can't say, but it's probably from a cage.

The only places I have found the chickens I was describing are actual farms or specialty butchers who get their meat from the farms. They definitely do exist but you will pay a premium.

8/11/2015 4:01:44 PM

Tens of thousands of people eat TJ's chicken daily, and yet, I have not heard of any outbreak yet!

8/11/2015 4:03:52 PM

fair enough, though that probably because they are allowed to use parasite prevention and also because quality control is a thing.

I wonder how much diseased meat is thrown away when it would have been viable had consumers not been demanding antibiotic free meat.

8/11/2015 4:14:21 PM

Quote :

"massed produced"

I wonder if ddk has raised any cocks in her life..

Also, TJ's sells Free Range Organic Chicken..

8/11/2015 5:41:40 PM

*^^ the chronic reference dose is based on what we knew over 20 years ago about the toxicolgy and I don't buy enough produce to worry about the insignificant-for-me cost difference to buy organic, so I'l continue to buy organic produce

[Edited on August 11, 2015 at 7:48 PM. Reason : ^ to somewhere on the last page]

8/11/2015 7:45:37 PM

Quote :

"and I don't buy enough produce to worry about the insignificant-for-me cost difference to buy organic, so I'l continue to buy organic produce"

which is exactly why i followed that post up by saying that everybody should eat whatever they want - i'm not gonna try to convince anybody to eat something that don't feel comfortable eating or drinking.

8/11/2015 8:32:06 PM

Quote :

" Shit you buy at a grocery story labeled "organic" uses pesticides."

indeed.

and often organic pesticides are more toxic than synthetic counterparts. But because they're "organic" they're presumed safe, and have little to no scientific research on long term effects.

8/12/2015 12:42:31 AM

Vitamin D3 is like the most toxic thing in the world according to that chart, even though there is a recommended daily dosage for humans, unlike things like nicotine and Roundup. I'm suspicious.

8/12/2015 12:56:56 AM

I think the cure for vitamin D3 toxicity is to stop scarfing down bottles of it at a time.

8/12/2015 1:06:04 AM

^^, ^,

the point is that the fear around anything Monsanto and the assumption of safety given to anything tagged "organic" is not grounded in fact.

8/12/2015 9:25:48 AM

Rotenone is already not really used anymore, and has already been recommended to be not allowed under the national organic program

8/12/2015 10:16:53 AM

it has been a month

i hope you got a full blood work done before you started?

9/11/2015 10:59:45 AM

Wow its scary that people out there like dropdead think disgusting factory farms are the only way to produce meat. They really do have mond control.

9/11/2015 5:18:26 PM

people that don't work in agriculture know more about the subject than people who work in agriculture. right.


if everybody had 10 chickens and several pigs at their house, then yes, we could do away with factory farming. but then we'd be exposing ourselves to disease vectors, just like they do in the areas where new strains of influenza develop. And it would smell like shit everywhere, which a lot of people like to complain about.

9/12/2015 10:55:10 AM

http://www.cnn.com/2015/09/15/health/fast-food-meat-antibiotics-grades/index.html

9/16/2015 9:07:00 AM

Quote :

"A good rule of thumb is to avoid eating foods that contain ingredients you can't pronounce," says Dr. Sanjay Gupta, CNN's chief medical correspondent."

Sanjay Gupta co-opting an untrained dipshit's words as medical advice, what a fucking surprise. Ask the average American to pronounce cholcalciferol, cyanocobalamin, or pyridoxine... which are essential in their diet.

9/17/2015 8:09:06 AM

Vitamins are naturally found in foods, so they aren't listed separately. If they are added to the food, some manufacturers list them as "Vitamin A/B/C", while some list them by their chemical names.

Barring added vitamins, the advice is sound.

And you know what, you shouldn't be consuming fortified foods anyway. Added vitamins haven't been proven to be healthful, and if you are eating a healthy diet -- the kind which doesn't have 'unpronounceable' ingredients -- you definitely don't need added vitamins/minerals.

9/17/2015 8:53:11 AM

Quote :

""A good rule of thumb is to avoid eating foods that contain ingredients you can't pronounce," says Dr. Sanjay Gupta, CNN's chief medical correspondent.""

this is some pretty huge bullshit

9/17/2015 9:14:43 AM

Care to explain why?

9/17/2015 9:25:54 AM

Regardless of your opinion that all nutrients should be naturally occuring in the food consumed, the government MANDATES that certain foods be fortified with certain vitamins/essential nutrients in the US. And people who are scared of the word 'riboflavin' probably don't know which foods are naturally rich in that vitamin anyway. America has many laws to protect dumb people. We can't have 'former surgeon generals' telling people who are nutritionally ignorant to be scared of food that is required to be fortified by law.

9/17/2015 9:46:42 AM

IODIZED SALT CAUSES AUTISM

9/17/2015 9:47:49 AM

Quote :

"Care to explain why?"

because chemical compounds are in everything and just because you can't pronounce them doesn't mean they are bad.

and it speaks more to people being ignorant than it does any bad health concerns.

[Edited on September 17, 2015 at 1:50 PM. Reason : f]

9/17/2015 1:48:52 PM

^ We are talking about listed ingredients on food packages, not chemical composition of food items.

See my post above in reply to Green Jay.

9/17/2015 2:40:03 PM

it breeds a fear of science as opposed to actually educating folks as to what is and isn't healthy.

9/17/2015 2:56:06 PM

i can read more chemical names, so that means i can eat more packaged food, then?





so you have a child, math whiz. did your wife eschew the standard pre-natal recommendation to take a (2S)-2-[[4-[(2-amino-4-oxo-1H-pteridin-6-yl)methylamino]benzoyl]amino]pentanedioic acid supplement, and decided to eat organ meat every day instead? ick. must have been real fun with having to fly to another country at the 11th hour to give birth and all.

The other issue with this stupid adage is it is, like much of the garbage you spew, a one-size-fits-all approach to nutrition, while human nutritional needs are no monolith. Just for one small example, I have a condition that is requiring me to take a fucking gram of ferrous fumarate per day currently. If I was to take your approach, and avoid fortified foods and supplements, I would have to eat 40 cups of white kidney beans or 112 ounces of oysters per day to get the same amount of iron, which is just fucking impossible. I WOULD LITERALLY DIE trying to recover from my condition following your "rules for healthy living".

9/17/2015 3:00:38 PM

Quote :

"And you know what, you shouldn't be consuming fortified foods anyway. Added vitamins haven't been proven to be healthful"

dead wrong. Iodized Salt, flour/bread fortified with B vitamins, and Vitamin D to milk are three off the top of my head that virtually eliminated diseases driven by nutrient deficiencies.

9/17/2015 3:01:01 PM

http://www.newsweek.com/dirty-truth-about-organic-produce-379464

Quote :

"What, then, is the purpose of USDA-mandated organic standards and certification? “Let me be clear about one thing,” Secretary of Agriculture Dan Glickman said when organic certification was being considered: “The organic label is a marketing tool. It is not a statement about food safety. Nor is ‘organic’ a value judgment about nutrition or quality.”"

10/8/2015 12:21:38 PM

Is nicotine still permitted as a natural organic pesticide?

5/20/2016 12:16:05 AM

no but MDMA is

5/20/2016 12:19:09 AM

I came into this thread to mock whoever the OP was, but I see that I already accomplished that by being the original reply

5/20/2016 12:29:04 AM

I remember the good old days when "organic" just meant like, from plants or animals, ie not rocks and stuff. Like, organic vs. inorganic.

5/20/2016 12:31:47 AM

Why did you put "as" in quotation marks?

5/20/2016 7:35:00 AM

I just finished the Whole30, which calls for all organic meat and fruit/vegetables and very little else for one month. My skin is more clear than it's ever been, I've lost weight, and my systems are all functioning better than ever. It's worked so well that I'm giving myself a day or two to add a little dairy/sugar to my diet and then going back on the strict program this weekend.

Did the straight use of organic products have anything to do with the effects I've seen? Hard to say. This time around, I'll probably forego most organic items to save money, so it will be interesting to see if can tell a difference.

5/20/2016 9:04:06 AM

Do you guys remember for like five seconds in 1997 when "organic" was code for marijuana?

5/20/2016 9:12:26 AM

everything is organic you dipshits because its all from the earth :^)

5/20/2016 10:42:15 AM

^^^no, the fact that your food was organic had nothing to do with it. it had everything to do with the fact that you most likely cut out all kinds of shit food from your diet. If you switch from the average american diet to a strict lean meats, fruit, and vegetable diet, you are going to see some changes, organic or not.

It's similar to people that switch to a gluten free diet, see amazing results, and then claim gluten is bad and removing it from their diet did wonders for them. Hmm, yeah, it probably wasn't the fact that you removed Little Caesar's Hot N' Ready pizza, Burger King, fried jalapeno poppers, and gallons of craft beer from your weekly rotation. Must've been the gluten!!!

I'm pretty sure I learned that correlation =/= causation in 4th grade science class yet this concept still eludes otherwise bright people, especially when it comes to what they eat.

[Edited on May 20, 2016 at 11:22 AM. Reason : ]

5/20/2016 11:22:41 AM

No need to be a raging asshole.

I know it wasn't the REASON things went well.

I was just wondering if the organic had any impact.

You're a douche.

5/20/2016 12:09:44 PM

^ tbh, I think his post was perfect. just the right mix of condescension and truth. stop being so sensitive to reality.

5/20/2016 12:11:48 PM

TBH, I'm not being sensitive. It really doesn't matter to me one way or the other; what matters to me is I made changes that my body agreed with. I don't really care what either of you think; the response just seemed a little unnecessary. But carry on.

[Edited on May 20, 2016 at 12:14 PM. Reason : sss]

5/20/2016 12:14:24 PM

The first paragraph was directed at you. The second about gluten free diets was just me on a soap box, but I guess I didn't make that clear. I'm glad you found something that works for you though, regardless.

5/20/2016 2:09:18 PM