Quote :

"The Republican party and popular Libertarian voices need to do more to quell the growing rise of right-wing radicalism."

The most notable rise in "right-wing radicalism" is mostly in response to what they see as runaway leftism. The right, in general, can't do anything about radicals; radicals just call them cuckservatives/RINOs/lolbertarians. The alt-right considers libertarians to be naive and idealistic; they don't respect them at all.

The left could do a lot more to stop radicalism and reactionaries. All you have to do is jettison all the batshit crazy ideological stuff, but unfortunately Democrats are embracing the idpol stuff as gospel. Quick list:

- Stop trying to undermine markets. It's the only thing that works (that we know of) and no one wants to shovel shit in worker's communes. People do not want socialism or communism, they want capitalism with some safety guards built in.
- Stop making everything about race. If you constantly berate people for being white, or demand that they pay for things they aren't responsible for, some of them might say "fuck it, guess it's white people against the non-whites." It's a completely predictable response when you shame people for what they are, which the left does constantly. Sometimes it almost seems like the left wanted to create a reactionary movement. Ideas like reparations are deeply unpopular with Americans, so building it into a political platform is a horrible move.

There's a lot of other nonsense in left-wing ideologies that could never work (and never has worked, under any circumstance), but Americans may buy those things anyway if they're presented in the right package.

Of course, it's not as if the left has control over their radicals either, and you can see that on this very message board. It's definitely a circular firing squad situation. In a way it seems like radical leftists hate the center left more than the right, maybe because they see them as traitors to the cause.

10/30/2019 1:07:30 PM

Quote :

"The most notable rise in "right-wing radicalism" is mostly in response to what they see as runaway leftism."

Ah yes, no agency Nazis. This shit is as trite as the “this is how you got Trump” bullshit supposed “never Trump” ex-GOP grifters yell whenever the left doesn’t immediately move center-right.

The other points, especially the market one (considering the story Trump is literally wanting to tell companies where they can product cars) I’m not even going to touch. It’s so far gone from today’s reality.

10/30/2019 1:21:04 PM

TIL that we have Nazis and White Supremacists in the country because the left wants Medicare for All and an end to dependency on fossil fuels.

10/30/2019 1:24:15 PM

Quote :

"Ah yes, no agency Nazis. This shit is as trite as the “this is how you got Trump” bullshit supposed “never Trump” ex-GOP grifters yell whenever the left doesn’t immediately move center-right."

Yeah, and this is how you're going to get Trump for 4 more years - because you never actually understand how your opponents think.

That's a difference between us. I can actually make the case for your side of the argument. You can't make the case for a right-wing argument. In your mind, conservatives and the right, in general, are just people with an insatiable lust for dominating women and minorities. That's all they care about. They just wake up and say, "hmm, how can I make the lives of black people a little harder today?"

I don't think that the left wakes up and asks how they can turn the United States into Soviet Russia, outside of maybe some kids on Reddit and mentally ill people. I think they actually believe that their plans will make the world a better place. It won't, but they think it will. But, if you were honest with yourself, do you believe that people on the right are fundamentally good people, or do you think they're some combination of stupid and evil?

Quote :

"TIL that we have Nazis and White Supremacists in the country because the left wants Medicare for All and an end to dependency on fossil fuels."

I mean, the absolute number of "Nazis" and supremacists are vanishly small. But let's pretend that it's actually a significant movement.

Go back to my post. You can keep Medicare for All (you know - for the 1.5 years it operates before the rationing starts) and renewable energy. People are, or can be, down with that. They're not down with reparations and abolishing private health insurance. And they definitely aren't down with giving free health care to illegal immigrants.

[Edited on October 30, 2019 at 1:46 PM. Reason : ]

10/30/2019 1:43:22 PM

Quote :

" In your mind, conservatives and the right, in general, are just people with an insatiable lust for dominating women and minorities. That's all they care about. They just wake up and say, "hmm, how can I make the lives of black people a little harder today?""

My point, which should have been obvious is that the idealistic view of the GOP as some beacon of conservatism is simply not reality. Not under Trump at least. He is as controlling of the marketplace as any president in recent history (maybe ever?). A central tenet of conservatism, at least to me, was in favor of open trade and free markets — and I understood and was sympathetic to that viewpoint. I’m a CFA, I tend to subscribe to open global markets. You are lying to yourself if you think the current American right actually believes that...

Best I can tell the American right cares about one thing — making Libs mad. At any cost.

[Edited on October 30, 2019 at 1:48 PM. Reason : C]

10/30/2019 1:47:58 PM

I don't think that most on the right wake up and say, "How can I make the lives of black people a little harder today," but I think that a large number of them are blind to their white privilege by their white privilege, and this blindness causes them to resent the accusation and view race relations through a skewed perspective.

10/30/2019 1:52:35 PM

Quote :

"You can keep Medicare for All (you know - for the 1.5 years it operates before the rationing starts)"

Where is the US on this list and how many countries above us have some form of nationalized healthcare?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_life_expectancy#List_by_the_CIA_(2017)

(also endlessly hilarious that we've dropped below Cuba)

[Edited on October 30, 2019 at 1:55 PM. Reason : .]

10/30/2019 1:55:25 PM

There's definitely some cognitive dissonance going on between market-oriented people on the right and Trump's mercantilist nature. I guess they're willing to look over that because they feel it's outweighed by other factors. Or, maybe, China has become such a threat that it's worth abandoning so-called "free market" principles.

Your Sean Hannitys of the world are going to fall in line almost regardless of what a Republican president does. They have no core tenets, they are just minions more or less. They will never criticize their side.

I think left-wing and right-wing love to dunk on the other side, so that's just part of the political game.

There isn't really anyone going for the independents right now. Maybe your Andrew Yang types could get there, but even he doesn't think he has a chance.

Quote :

"Where is the US on this list and how many countries above us have some form of nationalized healthcare?"

We're not comparing apples to apples here. Medicare is a poorly thought out and horribly executed concept. Expanding this awful bureaucracy just makes the problem worse.

There are better, less expensive models that could be used, but they don't look like Medicare.

Quote :

"I don't think that most on the right wake up and say, "How can I make the lives of black people a little harder today," but I think that a large number of them are blind to their white privilege by their white privilege, and this blindness causes them to resent the accusation and view race relations through a skewed perspective."

That's a fine perspective, but it hasn't been effectively sold to the American people. If you simply talk past the sale and start demanding reparations, most people still see that as completely radical. This just emboldens radicals; they now have a thing to point to - "see, the Democrats want to take our money and give it to the blacks".

[Edited on October 30, 2019 at 2:03 PM. Reason : ]

10/30/2019 1:56:28 PM

you guys are arguing with one of the incels who was manipulated

10/30/2019 2:24:19 PM

If I'm married, is it really involuntary? :gottem:

10/30/2019 2:52:11 PM

Quote :

"My point, which should have been obvious is that the idealistic view of the GOP as some beacon of conservatism is simply not reality. Not under Trump at least. He is as controlling of the marketplace as any president in recent history (maybe ever?)."

Completely agree. And this is covered in chapter 7 of my book called "Trump is actually a Democrat".

10/30/2019 2:54:15 PM

he has 95% approval

he's a republican, republicans just aren't what you pretend they are

10/30/2019 2:55:21 PM

Lol, we're not even through Trump's first term and the talking point is already "Trump isn't a real Republican. In fact, he's a Democrat!"

10/30/2019 3:44:07 PM

Eastwood's latest movie is on point here. He documents a case of right-wing radicalism from back in the 90's.

https://youtu.be/gSMxBLlA8qY

10/31/2019 4:44:37 AM

huh?

10/31/2019 8:29:02 AM

FAKE NEWS

10/31/2019 10:31:38 AM

^^ You all remember that time in the 90's our investigative agencies nailed the famous right-wing extremist Richard Jewell. Those alphabet agency folks are never wrong.

10/31/2019 1:24:36 PM

so because of that, you don’t think right-wing radicalism exists?

even though the actual Olympic bomber was a right-wing extremist?

10/31/2019 2:20:20 PM

he probably thinks thats when left wing (CNN) character assassination started. but hes also dumb.

10/31/2019 3:33:34 PM

Richard Spencer ranting after the Charlottesville tragedy:

https://twitter.com/atheist_cvnt/status/1191157832546041856

11/5/2019 9:11:04 AM

his voice is cracking like a prepubescent little twerp. he wouldnt know what to do in a real fight. disgusting.

11/5/2019 9:38:21 AM

That's why the knuckle draggers do the actual shooting/blowing shit up.

11/5/2019 9:49:06 AM

^^^ WTF did I just hear?

That is so surreal, it sounds like lines from some movie showing enslavement and genocides

What a horrible non-human.

11/5/2019 12:58:56 PM

https://www.npr.org/2019/11/19/780552636/stephen-miller-and-the-camp-of-the-saints-a-white-nationalist-reference

Quote :

"Senior White House adviser Stephen Miller is an immigration hard-liner. He engineered the Trump administration's family-separation policy and its travel ban on people from some Muslim-majority countries. But last week, the Southern Poverty Law Center detailed leaked emails in which it says Miller encouraged far-right website Breitbart to promote white supremacist ideas. In one message, Miller references a book of fiction: "Someone should point out the parallels to Camp of the Saints." 'That's Stephen': White House Adviser's Controversial Style Dates Back To His Youth Politics 'That's Stephen': White House Adviser's Controversial Style Dates Back To His Youth The Camp of the Saints is a 1973 French novel by Jean Raspail that has become a key inspiration within white nationalist circles. It portrays a dystopia, or perhaps an apocalypse: a flotilla of South Asian people who invade France and effectively overthrow Western society. "The key themes are actually white supremacy and the end of white civilization as the West knows it — infestation, invasion, hordes of nameless, faceless migrants who come to indeed invade the West and bring about its end," says Chelsea Stieber, professor of French and Francophone studies at Catholic University of America. ... ... ... "

11/19/2019 12:41:46 PM

not sure if this is the right place to put it, guess it could be gun control or the red flag thread i cant find, but did anyone see the situation in NY the other day?

the live tweeting, instagram, 4chan / shitfest that culminated in a small militia being arrested in a cemetary about to boogaloo over a high cap mag?

looks like it ended peacefully but i hope a lot of charges are coming today (even if they promised no charges to defuse it).

11/25/2019 8:33:11 AM

I'm waiting for hell to break loose when RBG is out sick, and Kavanaugh votes to undermine checks and balances in the constitution...

11/25/2019 7:38:15 PM

Even before the N.C. Sons of Confederate Veterans sued the UNC System to take ownership of the Silent Sam Confederate monument and gain access to $2.5 million from the university, the settlement terms had already been agreed upon.

The lawsuit was filed in Orange County Superior Court on Nov. 27, at 11:10 a.m. — the day before Thanksgiving. It outlined a number of allegations against the UNC System related to the Confederate monument and sought declaratory and injunctive relief and monetary damages.

Less than 10 minutes later, a judge declared that an agreement about Silent Sam was lawful and turned over ownership of the statue to the North Carolina chapter of the Sons of Confederate Veterans. The agreement also said the organization can use the money from the university system to transport and preserve the monument, as well as build a facility to display the statue.

12/4/2019 7:39:08 PM

https://www.wvgazettemail.com/news/legal_affairs/wv-employees-suspended-after-photo-emerges-of-correctional-officers-nazi/article_fb446f32-31c5-5b46-9977-5854937697a7.html

12/5/2019 6:44:16 PM

Some high quality nazi salutes in that photo.

12/5/2019 8:18:10 PM

https://www.wral.com/military-investigating-suspected-white-power-hand-gestures-flashed-at-game/18835505/

12/16/2019 10:24:32 AM

Was at a Christmas party over the weekend... with close friends, so we jumped right into politics.

Once a Republican, the past 15 years I've gradually become more liberal and finally changed my party affiliation to Independent a few weeks ago. One "friend" (more of an acquaintance) is the biggest Trump supporter I know. He's so right that he thinks FOX News has become too liberal. He's an idiot, so I'm not really surprised that all he spews are talking points he hears from Hannity and Co.

But what really disturbed me was what my other friend- who I could say was my best friend for years. We used to be roommates out of college. Bought property together. I love the guy. I've always admired his work ethic and approach to life. Until now.

He's not religious, but now calls himself "spiritual". He said God made Trump POTUS for a reason. Said it with a straight face. I thought he fucking with me, but was dead serious (even though he can admit Trump is a fucking idiot).

I was dumbfounded that two adults that I've known for decades believe the bullshit that FOX feeds them. Their response to anything I said about Trump was "look at the economy"... when I rebutted "Do you think Clinton was the result of the 90s boom??!?!" And they quickly pointed out that it was a tech boom, not Clinton (which I agree with). But you can't play that card half the time.

I'm just ranting, but I'm really really really worried Trump is gonna have 2 terms to wreck this country.

One last thing- you can't bitch about the "Deep State" when for the past 20 years you've made a shitload of money and have never once had to squeeze. I've been very fortunate with where I am today and if the Deep State is/was the Clinton/Bush/Obama era, then let's keep it up.

12/16/2019 3:08:43 PM

I'd bet money they were also morons through the Bush/Clinton/Obama years, but you probably were too and didn't notice. None of this shit with Trump is new, its decades in the making.

12/16/2019 3:43:16 PM

but why would white supremacists sign up to kill poor black and brown people for a living?

12/16/2019 9:13:36 PM

i've posted about this guy before:

Washington Legislator Matt Shea Accused Of 'Domestic Terrorism,' Report Finds
https://www.npr.org/2019/12/20/790192972/washington-legislator-matt-shear-accused-of-domestic-terrorism-report-finds

Quote :

"Independent investigators commissioned by the Washington State House of Representatives found that Shea, as a leader of the Patriot Movement, "planned, engaged in, and promoted a total of three armed conflicts of political violence against the United States government" between 2014 and 2016. The report also concluded Shea was involved in training young people to fight a "holy war." He created a pamphlet called Biblical Basis for War and advocated replacing the government with a theocracy and "the killing of all males who do not agree.""

12/21/2019 11:26:17 AM

ex-Cambridge Analytica employee turned whistleblower Brittany Kaiser begins release of 100,000 documents relating to work manipulating elections in 68 countries

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2020/jan/04/cambridge-analytica-data-leak-global-election-manipulation

1/6/2020 1:51:47 PM

https://www.vice.com/en_us/article/y3mg9x/ice-detention-center-captain-was-on-a-neo-nazi-website-and-wanted-to-start-a-white-nationalist-group

Quote :

" A senior employee at a for-profit immigrant detention center in Nevada was active on the neo-Nazi site Iron March and aspired to establish a white nationalist chapter in his area. Travis Frey, 31, is currently employed as a captain at the Nevada Southern Detention Center, which is run by private prison behemoth CoreCivic and contracted with ICE. Frey joined Iron March in 2013, and posted at least a dozen times between 2016 and 2017 while he was working as head of security at a CoreCivic jail in Indianapolis, which was also authorized to house detainees on behalf of ICE. "

1/6/2020 4:10:32 PM

Death Threats Will Force Virginia Lawmaker To A Safe House During Pro-Gun Rally
https://dcist.com/story/20/01/16/death-threats-will-force-virginia-lawmaker-to-a-safe-house-during-pro-gun-rally/

Carter is even pretty pro-gun

1/17/2020 11:21:43 AM

^still think American gun culture isn't inherently right-wing, reactionary, and openly in support of white-supremacy?


They intentionally had their little gun party on Martin Luther King Day and are threatening violence on liberal and left leaning politicians.



It's time for people to see the connection between American gun fetishism and the fervent right-wing nationalism that underwrites it.

1/21/2020 1:59:10 AM

still? i've never thought it's not those things

1/21/2020 8:48:30 AM

https://www.nationalreview.com/news/white-nationalists-arrested-ahead-of-richmond-rally-planned-to-kill-gun-rights-demonstrators-to-spark-civil-war/

Quote :

"'We can't let Virginia go to waste, we just can't,' said Patrik J. Mathews, one member of the hate group 'the Base' that promotes violence against African-Americans and Jews. According to authorities, the 27-year-old former Canadian Armed Forces reservist also discussed creating 'instability' in Virginia by killing people, derailing trains, poisoning water, and shutting down highways in order to 'kick off the economic collapse' and possibly start a 'full blown civil war.' Mathews also discussed the possibility of 'executing' police officers and stealing their belongings and remarked that, 'We could essentially be like literally hunting people.' 'Virginia will be our day,' said 33-year-old Brian M. Lemley Jr., adding, 'I need to claim my first victim.'"

1/22/2020 2:28:39 PM

https://thehill.com/homenews/administration/480039-trumps-spiritual-adviser-responds-to-backlash-after-sermon

1/27/2020 1:26:43 PM

It looks like the pro-life stance has evolved to: "We don't want to abort all the babies, just the Satanic ones".

1/27/2020 2:13:01 PM

https://twitter.com/sbanypd/status/1226622830244171781?s=21

I’m not sure if this is the best place for this but we have a massive problem in law enforcement in this country.

This ostensibly non-partisan organization is basically full on MAGA now. If they are openly threatening the mayor of NYC just imagine what the people cheering them on are doing to the minority areas they patrol.

2/10/2020 9:54:51 AM

Quote :

"But, if you were honest with yourself, do you believe that people on the right are fundamentally good people, or do you think they're some combination of stupid and evil?"

It's clearly "some combination of stupid and evil"; I mean, I can definitely make the case for right-wing policies as long as I start off by detesting individual liberty and equality under the law for out-groups.

[Edited on February 24, 2020 at 8:41 PM. Reason : Then again, I also don't think aversion to economic redistribution is really a core right-wing idea.]

2/24/2020 8:39:12 PM

welcome back?

2/25/2020 9:52:54 AM

2/27/2020 8:24:33 AM

not sure if best place but:

https://www.newsweek.com/four-federal-lawmakers-vote-against-bill-outlaw-lynching-cite-government-overreach-1489313

2/27/2020 8:50:32 AM

Sean Hannity is trying to equate Trump's glorious response to COVID-19 to Obama's "failed" H1N1 response.

3/9/2020 4:00:09 PM

stop listening to conservative talk radio

3/9/2020 4:33:31 PM

set em up

3/25/2020 5:54:54 PM