Quote :

"Wow. How is this a liberal/conservative issue? How is stalking a buzzword. "

how about "following"? is that too tame?

Quote :

"stalk2 /st?k/ Show Spelled[stawk] Show IPA verb (used without object) 1. to pursue or approach prey, quarry, etc., stealthily. 2. to walk with measured, stiff, or haughty strides: He was so angry he stalked away without saying goodbye. 3. to proceed in a steady, deliberate, or sinister manner: Famine stalked through the nation. "

no, it's probably better to use language to imply whitey was hunting, creeping, and stealthily persuing his prey

3/25/2012 1:38:46 PM

So when Zimmerman says "they always get away" and calls Martin a "fucking punk" for just walking down the street, how should we assume he views him...?

Not mention, you know, he ended up murdering him...

[Edited on March 25, 2012 at 1:41 PM. Reason : ]

3/25/2012 1:39:53 PM

Time to tear down that racist neighborhood and put up a memorial for the kid.

3/25/2012 1:41:24 PM

why are you assuming anything?

3/25/2012 1:42:42 PM

^^^^
2. To follow or observe (a person) persistently, especially out of obsession or derangement

[Edited on March 25, 2012 at 1:43 PM. Reason : .]

3/25/2012 1:43:02 PM

i'm not making any claims about his guilt or innocence. but to claim the word "stalking" isn't being used to put a more sinister perspective on what happened, you're only kidding yourself

3/25/2012 1:45:11 PM

nah, it's pretty consistent with what he did when you consider the known facts and his history of derangement

3/25/2012 1:48:58 PM

and why would "stalk" be more appropriate than "follow", in this case?

and once you get through this example, i've only got a few hundred more for you

3/25/2012 1:52:07 PM

Well, this is a really hard case, because I think people are afraid of letting a possible hate crime go unpunished. And he is a child, 17 yes, but still a minor. A man with a history of calling police because of suspicious looking black people is only highlighting that our country is so easily unraveled. I can only imagine how the family feels, that they were robbed because a man was singling him out, and from their point of view, how could it not feel race motivated. This case has brought a lot of racist people, bleeding hearts, super conservatives defending gun laws, and liberals looking get out their own agendas out from the wood works... it is hostile right now, and from an outside perspective, I don't see how you could view this discourse as progress.

3/25/2012 1:52:51 PM

[Edited on March 25, 2012 at 2:02 PM. Reason : .]

3/25/2012 1:56:47 PM

Quote :

"and why would "stalk" be more appropriate than "follow", in this case?"

this part:

Quote :

"especially out of obsession or derangement"

he followed and called 911 on a person for no reason, then continued to follow that person even after being advised that he should stop.

Quote :

"I don't see how you could view this discourse as progress."

welcome to TWW

[Edited on March 25, 2012 at 1:57 PM. Reason : .]

3/25/2012 1:57:18 PM

Quote :

"welcome to TWW "

well I meant nationwide, this discussion has gotten pretty toxic no matter where you are or what site you post on.

3/25/2012 1:59:18 PM

you're the one calling him obsessed and deranged...which, regardless of the circumstance, are opinions. thanks for proving my point.

regardless, adultswim, you revealed your lack of intelligence/troll status a few weeks back when you tried to claim people could embarass their pets

[Edited on March 25, 2012 at 2:04 PM. Reason : hope just trolling, for your sake]

3/25/2012 2:00:52 PM

Quote :

"you're the one calling him obsessed and deranged...which, regardless of the circumstance, are opinions."

someone who called 911 46+ times in a year isn't obsessed and deranged? alright.

Quote :

"regardless, adultswim, you revealed your lack of intelligence/troll status a few weeks back when you tried to claim people could embarass their pets"

i'm not sure if they feel embarrassment, but they definitely feel shame. obviously not on the same level as humans.

[Edited on March 25, 2012 at 2:07 PM. Reason : .]

3/25/2012 2:04:45 PM

It's stalking and not following because zimmerman assumed martin was a punk up to no good as he was following him, which is stalking.

Following someone for irrational reasons, then shooting them is definitely more than following, it's stalking. Not sure how this isn't obvious.

It's almost at the point now where the people defending zimmerman are taking the position that Martin WAS a criminal... Sheesh...

3/25/2012 2:09:20 PM

Quote :

"It's stalking and not following because zimmerman assumed martin was a punk up to no good as he was following him, which is stalking. it helps my case and makes him sound more guilty if i call it stalking"

ftfy

3/25/2012 2:11:17 PM

It became premeditated murder, the minute that racist jumped out of his vehicle. The cops told him not to pursue the kid.

3/25/2012 2:16:30 PM

^the dispatcher told him not to...not the cops.

besides, stalking is a crime. if he was legitly stalking him, he should have been arrested, right?

3/25/2012 2:17:57 PM

Lock this shit no one cares

I'm Krallum and I approved this message.

[Edited on March 25, 2012 at 2:20 PM. Reason : this is so last week]

3/25/2012 2:20:19 PM

Quote :

"It became premeditated murder, the minute that racist jumped out of his vehicle. The cops told him not to pursue the kid. "

You certainly made a point here, but not the one you were hoping to.

3/25/2012 2:20:42 PM

Get me a pack of skittles they said

I'm Krallum and I approved this message.

3/25/2012 2:22:06 PM

I'm not saying I agree with everything in this article, nor am I familiar with the source, but I think it's an interesting read:

http://www.americanthinker.com/2012/03/what_if_trayvon_had_been_white_and_the_shooter_black.html

Trying to find articles about the Roderick Scott case is surprisingly difficult, but it is an interesting comparison. Not a direct comparison, since there were 3 teens in the Scott case, and different state laws, etc, but still interesting. Note that I have no opinion one way or another about the Scott case's verdict, it's just interesting to compare the presentation by the media.

I'm not even going to get into the argument about the case itself, but the sudden declaration of this as a racial issue is complete bullshit. It may or may not be, let's let the courts figure that out, not the media. Where the fuck are they going to get unbiased jurors at this point, either way?

3/25/2012 2:28:52 PM

Quote :

"Quote : "It's stalking and not following because zimmerman assumed martin was a punk up to no good as he was following him, which is stalking. it helps my case and makes him sound more guilty if i call it stalking" ftfy "

So Zimmerman didn't call him a fucking punk? He didn't say "they alwAys get away" referring to someone walking back from a store? What exactly do you take people's words to mean if not an expression of their thoughts and feelings?

It's pretty obvious based on zimmermans words and actions that he was stalking him. No rational person would deny this.

An innocent kid is dead. There's no ambiguity on what's right/wrong I this situation and what's just and unjust. We know martins death was unjust.

The only controversy is why the cops handled it the way they did. This is why the state and fed are investigating, this is why the chief stepped down, this is why there is outrage.

Most people recognize that you can't shoot a kid walking back from the store and not expect to go to jail.

^ that article completely misses the point. I zimmerman were arrested and tried no one here would have ever heard about this case. The author of that article is particularly dumb if he thought his comparison was valid.

[Edited on March 25, 2012 at 2:36 PM. Reason : ]

3/25/2012 2:32:08 PM

Leaving out details to support your case!~

3/25/2012 2:35:37 PM

Quote :

"Zimmerman is the one with a history of violence and overreacting documented in his past. Martin has no such history. "

This is:
a) admissible in a jury trial
b) very damaging to the defense's case
c) admissible in the obtaining of an arrest warrant

So tell me why they haven't taken him in and followed the proper legal process?

3/25/2012 2:37:58 PM

^^ innocent person is dead. His killer, the aggressor, was never charged.

These are the facts. What's right/wrong is crystal clear.

What's muddy is why the cops handled it the way they did. This information hasn't been divulged, probably because there are state and federal investigations pending.

3/25/2012 2:40:45 PM

Quote :

"Most people recognize that you can't shoot a kid walking back from the store and not expect to go to jail. "

So if his plan was to just shoot a kid walking back from the store why not shoot from the car? Much easier to get away that way. Also you probably wouldnt want to call the police before you planned to kill someone to give them a heads up.

The entire police report will be released soon, just wait on it before commenting anymore.

3/25/2012 2:42:31 PM

^you're not really making a point there.

anyways, it's easier to blame the guy with the gun. owning a gun is a major responsibility, not meant to be pulled out when u see a kid with skittles.

3/25/2012 2:45:04 PM

^^Because as he was on the phone martin got too far away, he had to chase him first to shoot him, which is what happened.

LOL, i'm not saying he went out that night to kill someone (that's absurd, not sure why you'd even think this). He went looking for trouble, and when he couldn't find it, he made some, and Martin paid the price.

^ I think that's a big part of why some people want to view Martin as a criminal. It means gun owners don't have to think twice before shooting someone, they can use their guns like they can use their fists, when this isn't the case.

[Edited on March 25, 2012 at 2:48 PM. Reason : ]

3/25/2012 2:47:36 PM

Do you regret picking 'moron'?

I'm Krallum and I approved this message.

3/25/2012 2:48:55 PM

ha not really.

3/25/2012 2:50:21 PM

Quote :

"LOL, i'm not saying he went out that night to kill someone (that's absurd, not sure why you'd even think this). He went looking for trouble, and when he couldn't find it, he made some, and Martin paid the price."

I don't even necessarily think he went looking for trouble. I think he went out on his "patrol" thinking he's some big shot safety person, and he's gonna catch himself a real criminal. He got carried away, caught up in his old fantasy of getting the bad guys, and went too far. That's not self defense. That's a delusion.

3/25/2012 2:52:36 PM

Quote :

"Because as he was on the phone martin got too far away, he had to chase him first to shoot him"

with who?

3/25/2012 2:53:39 PM

The police.

Who told him not to follow, but he did anyway. Why?

3/25/2012 3:05:16 PM

3/25/2012 3:06:28 PM

zimmerman before the shooting:




zimmerman after the shooting:

3/25/2012 3:13:15 PM

Quote :

"The police. "

yep. called them to tell him he saw a kid with skittles and he planned on killing him...hold on a sec I gotta run after him now.

Seems logical. going to take you far in life.

mnfares, I think the media has just decided to use 4 yr old photos for consistancy.

3/25/2012 3:19:01 PM

^ actually, i dont think you would want to show a picture of a guy smiling when talking about this sad incident.

[Edited on March 25, 2012 at 3:26 PM. Reason : they need a neutral picture of him not smiling or looking guilty]

3/25/2012 3:25:30 PM

my fellow people of color...... if you get questioned at all.. just shoot the motherfucker like this guy did yesterday...


http://www.suntimes.com/news/crime/11466068-418/no-bond-for-man-charged-with-shooting-chicago-cop-in-the-chest.html

FUCK THEM UP. more dead whiteys. problem solved. everybody is happier



if somebody came up to me for no reason i'd draw my pistol in no time and tell em to back the fuck up..... unless i was acting shady and didn't try to use human civilized manners to respond to his inquires about my presence. (completely destroying the need for escalation to begin with)



[Edited on March 25, 2012 at 3:42 PM. Reason : .]

3/25/2012 3:37:56 PM

Quote :

"The entire police report will be released soon, just wait on it before commenting anymore."

Will this report also ignore witnesses?

3/25/2012 4:42:14 PM

All arguing and bullshit aside, here is one legitimate thing that I thought of earlier.

In the 911 call, Zimmerman states that Trayvon has taken off running away from him. Which nobody here I think will disagree with.

He had what we can deduce as a pretty good head start on Zimmerman.

Zimmerman states that he has no clue where Martin is after a few minutes of trying to find him so its safe to say he is nowhere close to Zimmerman.

Trayvon was 6'3" give or take and roughly 150lbs and played football.

Safe to say, he is light years faster than some 5'9" 240lb guy who is obviously well out of shape. He would have no problem avoiding this guy it would seem.


If Trayvons goal was to run away from Zimmerman, wouldn't it be safe to say that he could have easily done so? It's not like Zimmerman shot him in the back as he ran or anything.

At some point Zimmerman and Trayvon were close enough to each other to start fighting, so unless Zimmerman somehow snuck up on a stationary Martin, how did this happen? Also, where the incident occurred was no where near Trayvons dad's apartment. So its not like he had stopped and reached his destination and just couldnt get in the house or anything.

His dad called the cops to report his son missing well after the shooting. So we can assume he wasn't near his dads place.


So I guess that Trayvon might have been confused of the location of his dads apartment since he was visiting and got lost, and Zimmerman somehow got the jump on him, but that still wouldn't explain why he wasn't able to easily flee Zimmerman considering he is going to be way faster on his feet than Zimmerman is.

3/25/2012 5:48:30 PM

Quote :

"If Trayvons goal was to run away from Zimmerman, wouldn't it be safe to say that he could have easily done so? It's not like Zimmerman shot him in the back as he ran or anything."

Good point. Trayvon had the duty to retreat because he had no gun.

3/25/2012 5:51:53 PM

Maybe he pulled the gun and said FREEZE and Trayvon thought he was obligated to stop, then later discovered that Zimmerman was nothing more than a disgruntled wannabe neighborhood watchman?

[Edited on March 25, 2012 at 5:55 PM. Reason : /]

3/25/2012 5:55:14 PM

I'm not even saying that or anything, I'm just wondering why he wasn't able to avoid Zimmerman if his goal was to run away.

I don't think anyone will disagree that there is basically no scenario really where he can't avoid Zimmerman in a foot pursuit if his goal is to get away.

I'm not saying really that Trayvon got the jump on Zimmerman and started the fight, but something obviously happened other than Trayvon just running away from Zimmerman which seems would be no hard task for him.

Quote :

"Maybe he pulled the gun and said FREEZE and Trayvon thought he was obligated to stop, then later discovered that Zimmerman was nothing more than a disgruntled wannabe neighborhood watchman?"

A good possibility, but judging by him running initially it would be safe to assume that he knew that the person was not the cops and was running from someone who he thought to be enough of a threat that he chose to flee them initially.

[Edited on March 25, 2012 at 5:58 PM. Reason : .]

3/25/2012 5:56:52 PM

Maybe Trayvon was Standing his Ground

3/25/2012 5:58:41 PM

The young boy could have been frightened by being chased and just flat out stop to defend himself out of reaction because he thought Zimmerman was closer to him that he has suspected. Its clear that Zimmerman chased him, for 100% fact.

3/25/2012 5:59:58 PM

I love how you are referring to him as "the young boy"

Do you work for the mainstream media?

3/25/2012 6:11:21 PM

Yeah, I work for your mom's main stream media.

3/25/2012 6:12:15 PM

Quote :

"yep. called them to tell him he saw a kid with skittles and he planned on killing him...hold on a sec I gotta run after him now. Seems logical. going to take you far in life."

That's not far off. He called to tell them he's found a "fucking punk" who was about to "get away" with something because he was... walking down the street, with skittles and tea.

3/25/2012 7:42:28 PM

3/25/2012 7:48:41 PM