Quote :

"Yeah, and Amazing Tales in Mission Valley. We're down three comic book stores in South West Raleigh, goddamn."

Well damn good thing I didn't try to go there last week I figured that place would stick it out forever.

8/23/2011 11:27:02 AM

I wonder what's going to happen with Maiden when this hotel goes up? The area the BT Mart and Sadlacks is in isn't near big enough for a hotel and if it stretches to that parking lot that the article medntioned then it runs straight across Maiden Lane.

8/23/2011 11:53:39 AM

Quote :

"The headshop Kitsch that replaced the comic book (the one between Amore's and FreshBerry) store sucks."

I'm pretty sure that comic book store was on the opposite side of Amore's and was not replaced by Kitsch. It's been open within the last few months. It's quite possible they are closed now though.

8/23/2011 12:26:52 PM

^ you are correct. That's why I was a bit confused.

8/23/2011 12:46:12 PM

Quote :

"Ernest Says: August 23rd, 2011 at 1:57 pm Not much of a skyline item, but today there are two articles regarding the property across from the NCSU Bell Tower: * NCSU picks team to develop new Hillsborough Street hotel (Triangle Business Journal) * Hotel slated near NCSU’s Bell Tower (WRAL-5) If I got it right, it will be the parcel where Sadlack’s used to be (it’s closed now, if I am not mistaken) and will feature a premium 125-room hotel, on a 1.3 acre area. There will be retail and a signature restaurant at the street level, so let’s hope it will have a true urban form. My guess, something between 4 and 6 floors is the best we can hope for, although I would not say no to something taller It should be the same in size with the proposed Hampton Inn (Glenwood South)."

From Ernest on http://www.raleighskyline.com Nothing new in this post, but the dude knows his shit.

Although he is a bit older, and seems to be confused as to whether Sadlak's is closed, b/c unless I missed something recently, its still alive and kicking.

[Edited on August 23, 2011 at 2:40 PM. Reason : .]

8/23/2011 2:39:43 PM

Sadlack's is closed?

[Edited on August 23, 2011 at 2:41 PM. Reason : so basically its another North Hall?]

8/23/2011 2:40:41 PM

last time i went to sadlacks it was open.

8/23/2011 3:42:18 PM

It was open when I had lunch there an hour ago.

8/23/2011 3:42:47 PM

Sadlack's was not closed last I saw (passed by it last week).

There's a lot of confusing in that article...
-As TallyHo pointed out, "David's Dumplings" is the same thing as "former location of Darryl's". Also attached to the PR. Is that being replaced by the project? According to the tax records they don't own it, first of all. Second of all, I'd be shocked if they took that building down as it's over 100 years old and the location of two successful businesses.

-What exactly are they planning on doing with the parking lot behind DD/PR? It's not very large, having been mostly eaten by the roundabout, and it's not even contiguous with the rest of the project. Unless...

-Is the development going to stretch all the way from the Bell Tower Mart parcel to the Hillsborough Square lot? If so, it would close Maiden lane, which has no other access. So unless they're going to tear down every house on that block, or punch a new entrance through off Oberlin (they have room but they would need to take away a parking lot), not terribly feasible. Also, they would need to purchase the buildings containing Wing Zone, Scooterz, and the Wardlaw building. Unless they already have. According to the tax records, no.

-Do NCSU/Bell Tower Holdings own Sadlack's, or don't they? I've heard several opinions on this one. Again, tax records say they don't.

8/23/2011 4:01:05 PM

It's weird because Sadlack's is basically listed as being part of this property, which is owned by NCSU: http://services.wakegov.com/realestate/Account.asp?id=0038585

8/23/2011 4:16:44 PM

So the way I read it Bell Tower Holdings owns the property, but not the building. Odd. Sadlack's has its own entry:
http://services.wakegov.com/realestate/Account.asp?id=0005121&stype=addr&stnum=2000&stname=hillsborough&locidList=1320&spg=1&cd=01&loc=2116++HILLSBOROUGH+ST&des=BLD+ON+LEASED+LAND+%282116+HILLSBOROUGH%29&pin=0794917521
but it's listed as "Building on Leased Land".

Guess that means the university can have it removed if they want whenever the lease expires, but when does the lease expire? Yearly renewal or was it a long term lease? I can't imagine the owners of Sadlack's would have put that much money into essentially having the entire place rebuilt a few years ago if it was only on a year-to-year lease.

8/24/2011 8:36:02 AM

http://www.newsobserver.com/2011/08/24/1431877/hotel-to-go-up-across-from-ncsu.html

Quote :

"RALEIGH -- A group of Raleigh developers and a Washington real estate firm have been selected to build a 125-room hotel on Hillsborough Street across from the N.C. State University Bell Tower. The hotel will replace a Raleigh landmark."

Quote :

"The project would occupy the stretch of Hillsborough between Enterprise Street and Maiden Lane, replacing both Sadlack's Heroes and a retail center that is home to Schoolkids Records"

8/24/2011 9:08:19 AM

Ah, an article written by someone who can actually put an idea across clearly. Farewell, Sadlack's, but the PR lives on...

8/24/2011 9:15:03 AM

that sucks, I think schoolkids will be able to find a new location but Im not sure Sadlacks will be able to survive a move.




[Edited on August 24, 2011 at 9:18 AM. Reason : I wonder if I can get dibs on their sign]

8/24/2011 9:17:04 AM

Im sure you would be fist on the list of people they would give the sign to

8/24/2011 9:40:19 AM

I mean he called dibs

8/24/2011 9:42:29 AM

Let's see, this piece of shit will be built right next to North Hall (former failed hotel). Located 2 blocks from the Brownstone (barely hanging on, managed by Holiday Inn for now) and the Velvet Cloak Inn (failing). To do this, NCSU is going to replace several businesses that have been on that block for YEARS, even while Hillsborough was struggling in a big way, all because some lazy-ass alums and helicopter parents are too damn sorry to walk an extra block down the street.

8/24/2011 9:49:19 AM

^ To be honest, who the hell wants to stay at Brownstone?

And to the commenter way on the top of the page, Amazing Tales has been gone for like, 4 years...

8/24/2011 9:58:52 AM

^ Bigger point being, I wonder how many faculty positions, research grants, ag research, scholarships, etc (you know, things that a Land Grant institution is SUPPOSED TO BE DOING!!) could be funded with the $$ pissed away for this piece of shit?

Failure for this development is eminent. Hell, I'd be far less pissed if they actually just put a dorm there instead of this speculative real estate ponzi scheme.

[Edited on August 24, 2011 at 10:12 AM. Reason : .]

8/24/2011 10:08:49 AM

Schoolkids will be fine, since they have moved 9230423 times in the last decade.

However, the Schoolkids in Athens just recently closed, so they probably have a bigger monkey on their back.

8/24/2011 10:12:18 AM

so what will be the places you can go see music at on Hillsborough now?

-Sadlacks
-Shakedown street - I've only been to one show here so far. It was good and I like the place but its small and only draws small local stuff for the most part I think
-Farmhouse - do they still have music here? I saw a few back when I was in undergrad, they always had a cover though
-Melvins - I know they have had music here before but I think it was mostly just "that guy at the bar" type stuff.

???

8/24/2011 10:12:28 AM

Shakedown just did a mild renovation over the summer to open the place up some and is on the Homegrown Network to pull in some outside bands now, but yeah, it'll still be tight. John (the owner) is a good dude though.

8/24/2011 10:15:16 AM

Yeah I really like it too. I need to pay attention to what they bring in and make another visit.

but it seems like Sadlacks was about the right size to pull in some of the mid-sized regional stuff. It would be crowded but not slammed. I didn't go a whole lot, but the music is why I will mostly miss it.

8/24/2011 10:20:59 AM

You're not going to have a decent venue around NC State, because even the more well-known local bands are drawn to venues and paid by alcohol sales. Pretty sure a bunch of 19 year-olds can't foot the bill on even the Tomahawks.

Hell, look at how bad the Brewery was and how many people talked shit about it.

8/24/2011 10:21:10 AM

Quote :

"Velvet Cloak Inn (failing)"

The Velvet Cloak Inn is now condos. I guess it failed as a hotel but it's doing fine as a condo.

8/24/2011 10:44:36 AM

Quote :

"-Farmhouse - do they still have music here? I saw a few back when I was in undergrad, they always had a cover though"

Farmhouse is no longer there. It came down before The Brewery.

8/24/2011 11:32:53 AM

It's not a foregone conclusion that the developers will tear down Sadlack's.

Though they clearly want a 125 room hotel. This might be (for example) a 5 story building if it took up the whole block. It might also be a 7 story building if they left Sadlack's standing.

Normally, the University Park neighborhood would fight anything tall, but given the choice between "tear down sadlack's, build 5 story hotel" and "keep sadlack's, build 7 story hotel" they might choose the latter.

8/24/2011 12:34:15 PM

The University Park Homeowner Association can lick my taint. Any homeowner that bought property prior to March 7, 1887, has a right to bitch about noise, traffic, students, etc. Otherwise, they should STFU.

NCSU is going to spend tejas on this piece of shit and lose their asses, students are going to lose even more shopping/service/entertainment near campus, and we're all going to be stuck with some eyesore stucco'd crap. All because some Admin/Alum with a stick up their ass to build a motel nearer to campus. Screw em.

8/24/2011 2:37:51 PM

PAVED PARADISE

PUT UP PARKING LOT

8/24/2011 2:57:27 PM

Quote :

"NCSU is going to spend tejas on this piece of shit and lose their asses, students are going to lose even more shopping/service/entertainment near campus, and we're all going to be stuck with some eyesore stucco'd crap. All because some Admin/Alum with a stick up their ass to build a motel nearer to campus. Screw em."

I like Sadlack's as much as the next guy, but hell if the rest of what they are tearing down isn't a total shitpile. Plus they can add 3-4 stores and a restaurant on the ground floor. This is a huge positive for the school. Sometimes I really think people in and around NCSU don't want to see any advancement. Imagine parents staying here for a football game weekend, visiting professors having an awesome hotel room looking out over the belltower. Students coming in for a school visit, etc. Nothing but good things. I am sure whomever they partner with will take on plenty of risk also, so its not like NCSU is left holding the bag.

The urban form of Hillsborough street could truly rival and surpass Franklin one day if these type of projects continue to push ahead. The 2 major development areas at either end, the Holiday Inn becoming a doubletree, this project, the new Kerr Drugs building. Tons of positive changes for the street. New residents that can walk to all the establishments will do wonders for the shop owners and street level experience. Much more positive than the 13 stoners that go to Budha's belly every night, buy 2 blunts and a gatorade from the wolfmart and drive home.

[Edited on August 24, 2011 at 3:43 PM. Reason : .]

8/24/2011 3:42:00 PM

This motel will be dorm rooms within 10 years. Mark it down. Frankly I can live with the new motel if they leave Sadlacks alone. Have you been to Franklin Street lately? Nothing but generic chains of crap. Overall, I think they've done a swell job renovating Hillsbourgh St, but you have to leave the cool stuff alone unless you think students and alums will get nostalgic for fucking Jimmy John's 10-20 years from now.

[Edited on August 24, 2011 at 4:09 PM. Reason : .]

8/24/2011 3:53:35 PM

Its the people, and the gathering...not the place. Look at all of the people that complained about Kings closing. Many are as happy if not happier with the new location. What are you sentimental about on this property other than Sadlacks? The 11th location for schoolkids? The closed down "left wings right", the WolfMart? I mean really, what is so hard to lose on this block.

What makes you think it will be dorms? If a major national chain is involved, they aren't likely to give up. Raleigh is growing, the university is almost 35k in size, you don't think 120 room boutique style hotel is sustainable? I truly think local people and NCSU people suffer from small mindedness much of the time. Have you been to many college campuses. Even smaller, crappier schools usually have Hotels (I like how you keep using Motel). Much like our sports facilities, NCSU lived in the dark ages for far too long. Rumplestilskin had to wake up at some point. Same reason they built the new alumni club, same reason for the golf course, Hunt Library, Chancellor's new house. Its all about credibility, respect, and fund raising in the modern world of Universities. Just sit back and enjoy the positive progress instead of lamenting shitty storefronts gone by.

8/24/2011 4:30:10 PM

Quote :

"Its the people, and the gathering...not the place"

Exactly my point. They're going to piss away millions on this generic piece of shit, and take away yet another place for students to hang. Do you honestly think kids are going to go to a high-end restaurant and/or boutique shops on Hillsborough St?

I think there's more than enough reason to give pause given the string of failed hotels on Hillsborough St. Alums coming in for 5 home football games aren't going to be enough to sustain this if that's what you're planning on. If your vision of a motel at 80% occupancy comes through, great. I'd bet otherwise though, and it's going to be at the detriment of what the purpose of what a land grant institution should be all about per their charter. Let's compare notes in 10 years.

8/24/2011 5:08:12 PM

Yeah, well, that's just, like, your opinion, man. Someone with a lot of cash has a different opinion.

People will miss Sadlack's, and some people probably miss the historic Gumby's that got torn down.

Nothing about this is clear yet. Who will benefit and how, what the retail will be, etc. The article says "The hotel would include ground floor retail and a restaurant." You seem to be privy to a lot of details about how generic it will be, and that the retail will be a boutique, and that the restaurant will be expensive. It can benefit the university, as I don't believe that PRT has a specific "campus" hotel that they can work with.

I wouldn't put it past NC State to screw this up, but the plans haven't even been made yet.

[Edited on August 24, 2011 at 5:27 PM. Reason : -]

8/24/2011 5:20:10 PM

Shit, let's just tear down Mitch's, Two Guys, etc while we're at it. I'm sure folks will pine for the days of yore for a BadaWing next time they're in town. Let's make things as generic as possible for everyone!

People with lots of cash make dumbass decisions all the time. See also: all the high-end condos downtown with 15% occupancy rates going to the auction house.

8/24/2011 5:27:14 PM

Other than Sadlacks most of that stuff needs to go asap, the only thing it does is attract homeless people. I just don't think a hotel is the best thing to put there.

8/24/2011 5:47:40 PM

If they put a rooftop bar overlooking the belltower on the hotel it would kick a lot of ass.

8/24/2011 5:53:38 PM

^^^ LOL at this guy being all butt hurt about someone tearing down a bunch of shit holes and putting up a new hotel (which he refuses to call a hotel, instead calling it a motel, as if some developer is going to spend $texas to build a fucking motel).

Sorry shitty old Sad Sacks is going to be leveled. Do you own the place or something? It's just another bar, find a new one and meet a new crowd. Sounds like it would do your pessimistic ass some good.



[Edited on August 24, 2011 at 5:55 PM. Reason : rt]

8/24/2011 5:55:08 PM

^I wouldn't necessarily put it past a developer to put up a $texas motel. I hope that's not what happens here, but there are a lot of other supposed-to-be-grand hotel projects that have ended up a lot more limited in scope. The saga of the McPherson Hospital redevelopment in Durham is a good example of this (though that one's not even under construction yet so it could change again).

Regardless I'm cautiously optimistic. I hate losing campus places with value and history, and Sadlack's has both of those. So it's a legitimate loss, and worthy of lamentation. However, given the monumental shittiness of the Bell Tower Mart block, I still think this is going to be a good thing. Especially if some of the retail or the restaurant cater not only to wealthy alumni but to students and local people.

(And yes, a rooftop bar overlooking the bell tower would kick ass. Take that, Top o' the Hill.)

8/25/2011 8:51:45 AM

This:

Quote :

"So it's a legitimate loss, and worthy of lamentation. However, given the monumental shittiness of the Bell Tower Mart block, I still think this is going to be a good thing. "

and This:

Quote :

"You seem to be privy to a lot of details about how generic it will be, and that the retail will be a boutique, and that the restaurant will be expensive. It can benefit the university, as I don't believe that PRT has a specific "campus" hotel that they can work with. "

and This:

Quote :

"If they put a rooftop bar overlooking the belltower on the hotel it would kick a lot of ass."

and This too:

Quote :

"LOL at this guy being all butt hurt about someone tearing down a bunch of shit holes and putting up a new hotel (which he refuses to call a hotel, instead calling it a motel, as if some developer is going to spend $texas to build a fucking motel). Sorry shitty old Sad Sacks is going to be leveled. Do you own the place or something? It's just another bar, find a new one and meet a new crowd. Sounds like it would do your pessimistic ass some good."

8/25/2011 8:55:16 AM

Quote :

"If they put a rooftop bar overlooking the belltower on the hotel it would kick a lot of ass."

This would be epic. Who do we contact to lobby for this addition to the project?

8/25/2011 9:20:07 AM

Just got this in an email.

Quote :

"Red Hat to move HQ to Progress Energy building Triangle Business Journal - by Amanda Jones Hoyle and Chris Baysden Date: Thursday, August 25, 2011, 2:55pm EDT - Last Modified: Thursday, August 25, 2011, 2:59pm ED Red Hat plans to move its headquarters to downtown Raleigh into the Two Progress Plaza building currently occupied by Progress Energy , according to Red Hat spokeswoman Leigh Day. Day couldn’t say how much space the company would take, and says there isn’t a set time line for the move. But the plan would be to relocate all 600 of Red Hat’s Raleigh workers into the facility. “It’s appropriate for the needs of our employee base,” she says of the building at 100 East Davie Street. Red Hat will get its name on the building, Day says. Progress Energy will sublease to Red Hat space in the 365,000-square-foot building located at the corner of Wilmington and Davie streets through the end of Progress Energy’s lease term. Progress Energy signed a lease with a 30-year term when the building opened in 2004. Red Hat’s headquarters is currently located at N.C. State University ’s Centennial Campus. Red Hat (Nasdaq: RHT) announced in January that it would keep its headquarters in Raleigh after also considering sites in Georgia and in Texas, but the company had not yet chosen a location in Wake County for its expansion. The company committed to adding 540 jobs and investing $109 million in a new Raleigh headquarters facility after securing agreements for two state economic development incentives grants worth up to $15 million over 12 years. Red Hat employs more than 700 people in North Carolina."

8/25/2011 3:39:48 PM

Huh, some of us speculated Red Hat would do that when Progress Energy announced they were leaving but I didn't think they actually would. Sucks for Centennial to lose that tenant.

8/25/2011 3:43:15 PM

Great for downtown though.

8/25/2011 3:47:28 PM

^^It does say all in the article, but it seems like red hat would keep some presence on Centennial, especially with its huge need for space. I am guessing someday they will have a major presence in downtown, with a smaller office/building on Cent. campus.

8/25/2011 3:56:32 PM

message_topic.aspx?topic=617439

8/26/2011 11:49:11 AM

Sadlack's isn't closed and won't close for at least a year. Talked to the guy behind the bar today. He said they don't know any kind of plan of action from the new land-owners in terms of tearing the place up, and they haven't even once discussed how much Sadlack's is going to be paid, and they have to be paid.

The story he told me is that the land they're on used to be owned by some old guy that would never sell the land to them, even though they tried to buy it many times. When he passed away, his widow was pressed by large land-owners (the development company) to sell the land to them, and he said she basically had no choice.

So we'll see.

8/26/2011 12:00:14 PM

Quote :

"Rumplestilskin had to wake up at some point."

lololol i think you mean rip van winkle

8/26/2011 12:20:58 PM

Quote :

"When he passed away, his widow was pressed by large land-owners (the development company) to sell the land to them, and he said she basically had no choice. "

In other words, the development company offered her more money than Sadlack's.

8/26/2011 12:26:39 PM

^^thanks bonerjamz....had my fables mixed up!

8/26/2011 1:21:37 PM