I don't go to nonsmoking places on the whole, so I have no idea.

3/24/2009 3:40:45 PM

.02

3/24/2009 3:41:03 PM

ah, well what are the half dozen places that are non smoking?

3/24/2009 3:43:33 PM

Quote :

"Oh I'll readily admit that my opinion on this matter is entirely self serving. I don't give a shit. If I can have ALL bars be smoke free, then great. I really don't care what reasons were used to make it happen"

I don't agree with it, but I can accept that reasoning more than any of the tools who try to cite the smell, or thier health concerns.

Problem is, way too many people think like that and they'd rather have their way on certain issues than be bothered with preserving property owner rights for example

3/24/2009 3:43:51 PM

alcohol + tobacco + ogling other women + talking shit about people who aren't there are VICES

VICES tend to come in groups, and people like to partake in several of them at once

Its why bars and strip clubs will always thrive...they let people do the things they like to do without being judged or discriminated against

Taking away smoking from these places is like taking ranch dressing off the salad bar

it just makes all the other aspects of the place a little less enjoyable

3/24/2009 3:44:27 PM

NOT THE RANCH, SON

3/24/2009 3:47:16 PM

Quote :

"And so that makes it right? I don't seem to recall such reserve when things and people you don't like control the agenda. "

Where in the world did I say that makes it right? What makes it right is that people deserve to work in a healthy environment.

And for the record, I don't "piss and moan to the government." I haven't been involved in these proceedings nor am I really worried about it - but what I'm pointing out is that if and when it passes, I'll enjoy the results, and smokers and bar owners will definitely survive.

3/24/2009 3:47:34 PM

^^IT'LL MAKE YOU FAT

3/24/2009 3:47:43 PM

hey hey hey... don't say that. ranch makes happy

3/24/2009 3:48:52 PM

thus my point

fat people like ranch...take it away and they're less likely to come to your place

skinny people like cigarettes...take them away and they're less likely to come to your place

3/24/2009 3:50:07 PM

touche...

3/24/2009 3:53:32 PM

Here's the thing too though, everybody says well you don't have to go there if you don't want to smell smoke, but it works the other way too. If this passes, you don't have to go there if you want to smoke.

It's been proven in NYC and other cities that it won't hurt the business. The smokers still come and drink just like the non-smokers still come and rink with the smoke. If there's healthy benefits for everyone and the ones that don't smoke will no longer have to bitch, then it's a win as far as I'm concerned.

But again, I just want to go to whaterver bar and not smell the shit because I don't like it. I am ok with that stance.

3/24/2009 3:54:41 PM

Lets get rid of the beer too.

I want to be able to take my kids into every bar in town to watch the basketball game I can't get with TWC and I don't want them learning bad habits from your drunkards.

3/24/2009 3:58:25 PM

Quote :

"What makes it right is that people deserve to work in a healthy environment. "

i was a bartender for 5 years...

breathing second hand smoke in a bar with little to no ventilation was one of the least unhealthy things about that environment

3/24/2009 3:59:11 PM

In terms of overall health risks

Replacing 85 percent of the menu at bars would be ten times more beneficial than getting rid of alcohol or cigarettes

wings and pastrami kill you a lot quicker than whiskey and parliments

but that will never happen, so we're left to bicker over the the little things

3/24/2009 4:00:35 PM

Oh yeah, lets get rid of the fatty foods too.

I want to be able to take my PETA activist vegan mother-in-law into every bar in town and not have her be inconvenienced by the sight of red meat.

3/24/2009 4:02:32 PM

Quote :

"Here's the thing too though, everybody says well you don't have to go there if you don't want to smell smoke, but it works the other way too. If this passes, you don't have to go there if you want to smoke."

what? as of now, you have alternatives that are non smoking, I don't think this bill would provide for pro-smoking exemptions.

Quote :

"i was a bartender for 5 years... breathing second hand smoke in a bar with little to no ventilation was one of the least unhealthy things about that environment"

3/24/2009 4:03:42 PM

Apples and oranges. You eating whatever menu item you like does not impact me in the least. It's not like a chicken tender rises up into the air and wafts into my mouth and down my throat.

PERHAPS, if one didn't like the smell of fried foods, it would be an argument, however there isn't any health concern over the smell of fried food, nor any large percentage of the public crying that they don't like that smell.

Same goes for the removing beer argument.

^ There is an alternative to the ban. Any establishment that would like to remain a smoke friendly place could become a private club with memberships.

I really don't care all that much. I'm going to go there regardless. I would probably go there more if it passes, therefore I'd like it if it does.

Plus some of you seem to really be getting up in a lather over it, so that's fun.

[Edited on March 24, 2009 at 4:07 PM. Reason : *]

3/24/2009 4:03:45 PM

^if that's the case and there's not some impossible standard to staying smoke friendly, it makes the bill much more reasonable.

3/24/2009 4:07:47 PM

my beliefs are that an establishment should be able to choose whether or not to allow smoking.

...but after living in a state where smoking has been banned for over a year, i absolutely love it. it just feels dirty going into a bar that allows smoking now.

3/24/2009 4:10:01 PM

I don't know that for sure, but from the wording of "The bill would ban smoking in bars, restaurants, office buildings and any other indoor place where the public is invited or where workers are employed" leads me to believe that would be at the very least a workable loophole. Employees might be a problem unless they sign some kind of waiver.

3/24/2009 4:10:08 PM

Noooooooo!


^Interesting, considering a lot of bars in Raleigh require "memberships".

[Edited on March 24, 2009 at 4:11 PM. Reason : +_]

3/24/2009 4:10:49 PM

THIS THREAD IS FULL OF FAIL

I AM TIRED OF THIS DEBATE

WORKERS DO NOT HAVE A RIGHT TO FORCE THEIR BOSS TO DISALLOW SMOKING. PERIOD. PERIOD.
PERIOD.

DirtyGreek, STFU. You are wrong. [/mad]

[Edited on March 24, 2009 at 4:18 PM. Reason : ]

3/24/2009 4:18:37 PM

Quote :

"Yo PM me or list in here a few of the non-smoking Charlotte bars pls."

here's over 1400 bars/restaurants that don't allow smoking

http://mecklenburg.digitalhealthdepartment.com/smokefree.cfm

is that enough? can non-smokers find one of those places that they enjoy? or are they gonna keep bitching about HAVING to be exposed to smoke at bars

3/24/2009 4:20:55 PM

Fuck the smokers I just do not like the government telling people what they can and cannot do with their properties and buisnesses. If there is a market for non smoking bars than make a good non smoking bar and corner the market. If there is a market for smoking bars the same should be applicable.


Don't expect the smokers to stand up for you when they go after drinking in public. Or prayer in public.

3/24/2009 4:21:28 PM

this will happen eventually whether you people want it to or not. so get used to it. HA!

here's a question:

what other "hobby" (cause that's basically what smoking cigs is) directly affects the well being, comfort, and happiness of others in a public setting?

3/24/2009 4:25:22 PM

<-- loves non-smoking establishments.

3/24/2009 4:25:27 PM

Quote :

"what other "hobby" (cause that's basically what smoking cigs is) directly affects the well being, comfort, and happiness of others in a public setting"

Automobile operation.



BAN CARS!!!!!!!!!!!!111

3/24/2009 4:27:01 PM

that analogy does not work...

quit being ridiculous

3/24/2009 4:27:49 PM

Quote :

"directly affects the well being, comfort, and happiness of others in a public setting?"

how about alcohol

maybe i want to be able to get drunk without people being loud and obnoxious

3/24/2009 4:28:01 PM

People with hazardous jobs get paid more to work them.
This is re equivilent of people getting a house for cheap cause it's by an airport then getting re airport closed down cause it disturbs thier sleep. If you don't like something that is ore existing it is your responsibility to avoid it and it can respond to your protest or tell you to screw off. That is how this should work.

3/24/2009 4:28:12 PM

Quote :

"this will happen eventually whether you people want it to or not"

And it will eventu be overturned in all 50 states by a supreme court decision whether you people want it to or not

3/24/2009 4:28:50 PM

When I go to a bar in NC I fully understand the "risk." I still go because a) I like to be social; and b) I like beer. I put up with the smoke, obviously and I'm not pushing for a ban to be passed.

That said, I won't shed a tear if this passes because I'm not a smoker and I don't like stinking like smoke after a night out! So if it happens, great!

3/24/2009 4:29:05 PM

not everyone who drinks is loud and obnoxious....

but everyone who smokes emits a cloud of gross smoke...even smokers don't like having someone else's smoke blown in their face

^^pretty sure the supreme court would side with the health of the nation, not smokers.

[Edited on March 24, 2009 at 4:30 PM. Reason : .]

3/24/2009 4:29:45 PM

Quote :

"not everyone who drinks is loud and obnoxious"

not everyone who smokes blows smoke in peoples faces

i seriously wonder how SOME of you are brave enough to leave your house, since theres so much big bad stuff in the world!

3/24/2009 4:30:28 PM

Quote :

"that analogy does not work... quit being ridiculous"

Why don't you go fuck your mom?
The analogy is completely apt
....until some douche suggests that a products' impact on the economy makes it a requirement, and not a choice.

3/24/2009 4:31:09 PM

but the smoke is still there, whether it is blown in my face or not.... shit just doesn't disappear magically.

^wow, panties in a bind, much? i dismantle your argument and you get pissy. don't be mad son, you can still smoke your ciggies on the street in a designated area. HA!

[Edited on March 24, 2009 at 4:32 PM. Reason : !]

3/24/2009 4:31:30 PM

W00t!

3/24/2009 4:32:08 PM

so lets ban it outside too

after all, its still there, it doesnt disappear magically

3/24/2009 4:32:10 PM

Quote :

"maybe soon they'll ban children under the age of 3 from restaurants"

hahahah I just now saw that.


While I would rather not have to breathe in second hand smoke, I agree that the government shouldn't be the one who decides. I hate the fact that I get sick nearly every time I go out due to my sensitivity to smoke. However, I could just stay in... but that's obviously not gonna happen so I suck it up.

More and more establishments are accommodating to both... with smoking and non-smoking rooms... which I like. The bars that I do deem as 'too smokey' I stay away from. No harm done.

3/24/2009 4:32:51 PM

^^but it doesn't hover in an enclosed space either.

I get that you are trying to troll and stick up for your ciggies...but your arguments are terrible.

[Edited on March 24, 2009 at 4:33 PM. Reason : ^]

3/24/2009 4:33:33 PM

Quote :

"with the health of the nation"

Oh, so we're gonna ban boxing, too?
Punches to the face are unhealthy.
And since you're so ready to completely ignore the principle of consent with smokers in privately-owned places, I guess you also ignore the principle of consent with boxers, right? They're hurting each other and should be arrested right? It doesn't matter that they consent to the harm, does it?

3/24/2009 4:33:41 PM

Quote :

"not everyone who drinks is loud and obnoxious.... but everyone who smokes emits a cloud of gross smoke"

yet you apparently still frequent these establishments despite your seemingly strong objections...amazing

3/24/2009 4:33:47 PM

you sir, have terrible analogies.

3/24/2009 4:34:22 PM

Quote :

"i dismantle your argument"

No, you didn't.

3/24/2009 4:34:35 PM

Quote :

"you sir, have terrible analogies."

You sir, eat shit from your dead grandmothers cunt.

3/24/2009 4:35:07 PM

Quote :

"not everyone who drinks is loud and obnoxious...."

once again...5 year bartender here...

yes...every one who drinks is loud and/or obnoxious...if you don't think so....spend 9 hours being the only remotely sober person in a bar...

i don't mean a casual drink or two...but anyone that consumes a measurable amount...

much the same way that one person smoking one or two cigarettes in a bar doesn't make much of a difference...it's several people smoking lots of cigarettes that make it gross...

3/24/2009 4:35:16 PM

Quote :

"but it doesn't hover in an enclosed space either. "

maybe you should try joining the 20th century and going to bars with HVAC

you make it sound like every bar is some back poker room with huge clouds of smoke

even I don't like bars like that, which is why I don't go to them, maybe you should try it

3/24/2009 4:35:36 PM

I really doubt most of you will give a shit after it actually passes and you aren't stuck being around smoke all the time. I don't like the gov't intervention either, but I highly doubt you'd want to go back to a smoke filled bar after you get used to it not being like that.

3/24/2009 4:35:44 PM

Quote :

"but I highly doubt you'd want to go back to a smoke filled bar"

I hate smoke-filled bars.

(YOU COMPLETELY MISS THE POINT)

3/24/2009 4:36:44 PM