You grew up in an airport?

11/1/2010 12:40:17 AM

I grew up in CB where the vast majority is. Thats why I said New Hanover County, not Wilmington. And I would have to say that the front/market street area where this occurred is kept alive by college kids, tourists and party people.

11/1/2010 12:41:58 AM

Quote :

"I just want to say I grew up in ILM and the "vast majority" of the income is not students or tourists except from summer"

and that summer of tourists is prolly like 60% of wilmington's economy. throw in the students during the other 3 seasons and I am pretty sure that is the "vast majority" of ILM's income

11/1/2010 1:50:34 AM

I always got a bad vibe off of Wilmington

there's some neat stuff going on there
but I usually felt like the town would hurt me if it could

11/1/2010 3:09:57 AM

Quote :

"http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GOIH_mcMPy0 Another video was put up on youtube. This gives the best view of what really happened, even during the actual gassing. I hear that the local news has many accounts of this by now and will be running stories. Should be interesting to see what pans out."

the girl with the umbrella is on my facebook somehow. she was a jellyfish.

11/1/2010 7:28:45 AM

^^^yep, saying Wilmington doesnt bring in the majority of their income from tourists is like saying Myrtle Beach doesnt make money off of golf.

^^agreed, I grew up in Wilmington and loved every minute of it, but I'm glad I got out of there when I did.

also, I had a bunch of friends who were involved in the "gassing" incident, they posted about it pissed on facebook, etc. but its pretty much been dropped since then. I am surprised more of a story wasnt made about it though

11/1/2010 8:50:59 AM

trolls were out in force itt

11/1/2010 8:59:27 AM

Quote :

"why did everyone decide to start chanting USA, USA?"

Because they were drunk?

11/1/2010 9:22:51 AM

Quote :

"agreed, I grew up in Wilmington and loved every minute of it, but I'm glad I got out of there when I did."

Me too! My brother still lives down there and it's not awesome. Fun to visit sometimes, though.

11/1/2010 11:26:23 AM

Quote :

"so what happens when a riot breaks out because some drunk ninja turtle steps on the foot clan of "the situation"... will we complain that the cops didn't do enough?"

FTFY

11/1/2010 1:36:50 PM

Just FYI from a law enforcement perspective the Wilmington PD took the action that they took to prevent it from escalating into something far worse. Tear gas is a non lethal means of dispersing a mob (and in this situation with that many people it's a mob). When you have that many people that are under the influence of alcohol and who knows what other mind altering substances in a crowd like that it's just asking for a fight to break out. One person accidentally gets hit or bumped into and then they start fighting. Then what happens...someone else gets hit/bumped into/pushed and its just a chain reaction. Next thing you know you have a massive brawl which turns into a riot. In turn you have massive damage in the city. Look at the LA riots back in the 90's. The way I see it they were being proactive instead of sitting on there asses and waiting for this to happen. Be glad it was just CS Gas and not OC Spray. I would much rather get gassed.

[Edited on November 1, 2010 at 3:42 PM. Reason : .]

11/1/2010 3:40:02 PM

That's some Minority Report shit right there.

11/1/2010 3:44:17 PM

^^ So you're saying it's a good idea for the police to assault people to prevent people who are showing no signs of aggression from assaulting people? Great logic there.

[Edited on November 1, 2010 at 3:47 PM. Reason : l]

11/1/2010 3:45:06 PM

^^^ Definitely a good idea to incite panic/riot when it hasn't happened yet. Totally follow that logic.

11/1/2010 3:49:27 PM

no offense to skeeter or any other law enforcement with legitimate concerns for public safety

but that sounds like a load of crap and i don't think the public should stand for that kind of treatment

[Edited on November 1, 2010 at 3:50 PM. Reason : basically ^^]

11/1/2010 3:49:54 PM

I wasn't there and I do not work for Wilmington PD that being said I'm sure there are legitimate reasons as to why it went down the way it did. I'm also pretty sure that there will me an IA investigation. What you don't understand is the training we are required to go through yearly. There are countless times where law agency's just sit back and wait for shit to happen before they ever come up with a plan to prevent it from happening. As for the comment of causing panic and starting a riot CS gas that is deployed in an open environment will deplete in a matter of minutes. The effects of CS gas are some skin irritation, watering eyes, and drainage of the mucus membranes. Hardly enough to cause panic. Lets look at it this way. How do you think your parents or spouses would of felt if the police hadn't of stepped in and lets say a riot did break out? Within this riot your killed. Now your parents are going to be extremely pissed that the Wilmington Police didn't do anything but stand there and watch it happen. See it's really easy to make us look like the bad guys when in fact were doing our job.



[Edited on November 1, 2010 at 4:07 PM. Reason : .]

11/1/2010 4:03:18 PM

Quote :

""i was soooo PISSED! the cops didn 't need to do that! My fiancée had a BAD aasthma attack from the? gas! We had to run inside the stairwell of level 5. Some strangers helped me calm her down. Thanks ALot! Wilmington PD?""

Thanks,

11/1/2010 4:06:43 PM

yeah but now people are pissed cus they got tear gassed by THE MAN while they were just having a good time. so now they have another problem

[Edited on November 1, 2010 at 4:07 PM. Reason : sounds more like law enforcement thinking of their own interests than the publics]

11/1/2010 4:07:09 PM

Quote :

"The effects of CS gas are some skin irritation, watering eyes, and drainage of the mucus membranes. Hardly enough to cause panic."

You fire gas into a drunk crowd that causes the above reactions and you think people will just stand around acting rationally and go, "Gee, guess I'll walk back to my car now." Really?



[Edited on November 1, 2010 at 4:08 PM. Reason : verbs]

11/1/2010 4:07:13 PM

I like this theory

I'm going to break my daughter's legs so she can't go out and get raped

11/1/2010 4:07:53 PM

Quote :

"How do you think your parents or spouses would of felt "

Quote :

"Within this riot your killed. "

don't police these days need to have a four-year degree?

Quote :

"do not work for Wilmington PD"

so, which PD do you work for? Fuquay-Varina?

11/1/2010 4:16:38 PM

Quote :

" don't police these days need to have a four-year degree?"

No you do not need a four year degree don't know who told you that but they are wrong. Also sorry I am not an English major.

HAHA we can all sit back and laugh and have our own opinions of was it justifiable or not. As I stated before I am sure there was some means as to why it went down the way it did. Just cause you were there doesn't mean you were able to see every event that took place. From what I am gathering none of you have gone through the training that myself or any other LEO has gone through, that also being said there is always room for improvement on any training you go through. I know a lot of people think we are out to just make your life hell. It's also funny to me that people hate the police until they need us. Are we always right in the decisions we make in our line of work? Hell no. A routine call can quickly turn into a 10-33 (officer down) in a matter of seconds. So yes at times we do in fact screw up.



[Edited on November 1, 2010 at 4:21 PM. Reason : ]

11/1/2010 4:17:52 PM

"ATTN DRUNK PEOPLE, PLEASE DISPERSE OR WE WILL LOB TEAR GAS AT YOU"

If they said that, waited for reactions, and then gassed everyone, I don't have a problem.

11/1/2010 4:22:36 PM

they should require all badged law enforcement to have a four year degree.

would cut down on all this redneck cop bullshit

11/1/2010 4:23:05 PM

^ They'd have to start paying cops more as well.

11/1/2010 4:26:32 PM

OopsPowSrprs I agree with that 100% but do you not think that it is possible that with the noise of people yelling USA USA USA that the orders were ignored or not heard. I'm almost 100% sure there was more to it than...

Officer #1 "Oh look drunk people dancing in the street."
Officer #2 "You know we should lob tear gas into the crowd."
Officer #1 "Hell yea let's do it."

Either way as I stated in my previous post we are not right 100% of the time.

11/1/2010 4:27:12 PM

Sure that's possible. I wasn't there. I was just saying what I thought the right move would have been.

11/1/2010 4:29:49 PM

Quote :

"it's really easy to make us look like the bad guys when in fact were doing our job."

I'm thankful we have police to protect us from holiday revelers

using chemical weapons on a crowd of party-goers surely was the best way to control the situation

11/1/2010 5:15:43 PM

Quote :

"they should require all badged law enforcement to have a four year degree. would cut down on all this redneck cop bullshit"

I've been saying this since I was, like, highschool-age.

Fewer, better cops.

Quote :

"So you're saying it's a good idea for the police to assault people to prevent people who are showing no signs of aggression from assaulting people? Great logic there. "

Exactly.


not to mention:

Quote :

"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances."

Quote :

"that sounds like a load of crap and i don't think the public should stand for that kind of treatment "

True, which is why I'm dead serious when I say that someone should contact the ACLU. (http://www.aclu.org). While they're at it, maybe they can take a shot across the bow in Raleigh regarding the Nuisance Party Ordinance.

[Edited on November 1, 2010 at 5:35 PM. Reason : not trying to pass the buck...when I say "someone", it should be someone who was there.]

11/1/2010 5:34:54 PM

Ok so here we go, I wasn't there, so I don't have any facts except what is on here and what is in the paper...

Quote :

"§ 14-288.5. Failure to disperse when commanded a misdemeanor; prima facie evidence. (a) Any law-enforcement officer or public official responsible for keeping the peace may issue a command to disperse in accordance with this section if he reasonably believes that a riot, or disorderly conduct by an assemblage of three or more persons, is occurring. The command to disperse shall be given in a manner reasonably calculated to be communicated to the assemblage. (b) Any person who fails to comply with a lawful command to disperse is guilty of a Class 2 misdemeanor. (c) If any person remains at the scene of any riot, or disorderly conduct by an assemblage of three or more persons, following a command to disperse and after a reasonable time for dispersal has elapsed, it is prima facie evidence that the person so remaining is willfully engaging in the riot or disorderly conduct, as the case may be. (1969, c. 869, s. 1; 1993, c. 539, s. 190; 1994, Ex. Sess., c. 24, s. 14(c).)"

Quote :

"§ 14-288.4. Disorderly conduct. (a) Disorderly conduct is a public disturbance intentionally caused by any person who does any of the following: (1) Engages in fighting or other violent conduct or in conduct creating the threat of imminent fighting or other violence. (2) Makes or uses any utterance, gesture, display or abusive language which is intended and plainly likely to provoke violent retaliation and thereby cause a breach of the peace."

Quote :

"§ 14-444. Intoxicated and disruptive in public. (a) It shall be unlawful for any person in a public place to be intoxicated and disruptive in any of the following ways: (1) Blocking or otherwise interfering with traffic on a highway or public vehicular area, or (2) Blocking or lying across or otherwise preventing or interfering with access to or passage across a sidewalk or entrance to a building, or (3) Grabbing, shoving, pushing or fighting others or challenging others to fight, or (4) Cursing or shouting at or otherwise rudely insulting others, or (5) Begging for money or other property."

Not saying that the PD was right/wrong in this situation but as far as the law in this State goes, they have the green light. As far as if the crowd was peaceful or not, as outlined above, its only the imminent threat needed to meet disorderly conduct. I'm not sure that I&D qualifies as a disorderly offense but there is no drunk in public charge in this State.

An rest assured that the greater good of the community, read businesses, and public safety (to the articulable extent in this situation I don't know), is more heavily favored in the courts, laws ,etc than that of a Halloween gathers.

11/1/2010 6:21:08 PM

The story just ran on WECT, Wilmington's news channel. There's an interview and videos of several people who were there. They interviewed the chief of police, who basically said said "We've all seen youtube videos where college crowds go crazy and flip cars over. We didn't want that to happen so we gassed them." He also admits that it probably looks bad in the yes of the public, but since it was mostly young people in the crowd, their perceptions of the event were skewed and one-sided.

There are two videos on there done by WECTV. Watch them and form your own opinions.
http://www.wect.com/Global/story.asp?S=13423251#

[Edited on November 1, 2010 at 6:40 PM. Reason : .]

11/1/2010 6:37:55 PM

"we've all seen videos"



i like the way that is his justification. If i only could get through life saying "well i've seen videos so thats why I did it".

11/1/2010 6:59:56 PM

Quote :

"Makes or uses any utterance, gesture, display or abusive language which is intended and plainly likely to provoke violent retaliation and thereby cause a breach of the peace."

chanting "USA! USA!" surely qualifies as disorderly conduct

11/1/2010 8:52:26 PM

^^


It's coming right for us!

11/1/2010 9:02:15 PM

^^

Quote :

"officers used a loud speaker to warn to the crowd to leave but it didn't work, so they had to use the spray."

they failed to comply with an order. This can be charged as resist obstruct and delay along with

Quote :

"§ 14-288.5. Failure to disperse when commanded a misdemeanor"

[Edited on November 1, 2010 at 9:32 PM. Reason : ]

11/1/2010 9:31:25 PM

Police Chief:These kids are dancing and chanting their countries name. Not on my watch! OK I got this, lets stand at one end of 7,000 people with a single megaphone and tell them to leave. Oh look, they're not listening. Break out the new teargas guns boys, lets gas the mother fuckers!

Cop:But Chief, is that ok? I mean they're just dancing and no harm has been done......

Police Chief: No, these are those crazy young people. I saw a YouTube video once where they flipped cars over and shit. Release the gas and mount a cavalry charge on horseback through the crowds. That will shurely work, and it's gonna be fucking awesome!

Cop:Shit...........

[Edited on November 1, 2010 at 10:07 PM. Reason : .]

11/1/2010 10:06:59 PM

Shit. And I thought Chapel Hill offering less buses in and out was bad.

11/1/2010 10:11:48 PM

Quote :

"they failed to comply with an order. This can be charged as resist obstruct and delay along with"

There were 7000 people there on a CLOSED PUBLIC STREET which was designated as an area for the crowd to reside. The police stand on one of the street and use a megaphone to say "hey kids get outta here". Obviously that is not going to work and it is not the way to deal with a large crowd. 5 arrests were made that ENTIRE night, which further proves that it was a non-violent crowd.

Then to back up his actions, the officer quotes a youtube video where he saw young people riot and flip cars over. Hell I watch porn, but I don't expect every girl to fuck like Jaden James. What a freaking joke of a police force?

11/1/2010 10:13:23 PM

Quote :

"The effects of CS gas are some skin irritation, watering eyes, and drainage of the mucus membranes."

Well that doesn't sound bad at all.
Never mind the intense pain and vomiting. It's just a little skin irritation, watering eyes, and drainage of the mucus membranes.



The effects of water cannons are re-hydration, cleaner clearer skin, and removal of dangerous bacteria that can make a person ill.



Lt. Ed Pigford seems to have an irrational fear or disdain for "college type" crowds. Guess he's never been to a football game. He'd probably freak out and call the national guard for help.

11/1/2010 10:16:24 PM

When the heck did Wilmington start blocking the street off for anything fun? And no Azalea Festival and Riverfest don't count. Wilmington PD are the reason why I ever got in trouble in the first place for anything. Certified P words. I am glad I no longer live there. Great place to visit, not a great place to live.

11/1/2010 10:20:23 PM

Quote :

"5 arrests were made that ENTIRE night, which further proves that it was a non-violent crowd. "

FYI in crowd management the goal is not to arrest. The goal is to get the crowd to disperse...just saying

Quote :

"Well that doesn't sound bad at all. Never mind the intense pain and vomiting. It's just a little skin irritation, watering eyes, and drainage of the mucus membranes"

what are they supposed to do walk up to everyone out there and nicely say sir/mam we need you to leave the area your causing a disturbance? They got on the megaphone and gave the orders. Not the officers fault the people couldn't hear because they were being so loud nor was it the officers fault that the people were so drunk that they decided to not comply...also just saying



[Edited on November 1, 2010 at 10:50 PM. Reason : ]

11/1/2010 10:45:08 PM

^Next time you go out for halloween and get shot up in the streets with pepper spray grenades, come back and talk to me. Until then, I just don't think you'll get it.

11/1/2010 10:54:44 PM

Next time you see a large group of drunk people breaking laws and disobeying police orders, maybe walk the other direction

11/1/2010 10:56:13 PM

Quote :

"what are they supposed to do walk up to everyone out there and nicely say sir/mam we need you to leave the area your causing a disturbance? "

YEAH. ACTUALLY.

Quote :

"Not the officers fault the people couldn't hear because they were being so loud "

nope - it IS the officers' fault
they should have tried harder - maybe gotten a louder PA

11/1/2010 10:57:57 PM

Quote :

"Not the officers fault the people couldn't hear because they were being so loud"

Ho-ly shit.

11/1/2010 11:00:38 PM

the casual attitude that law enforcement shows regarding the use of less-than-lethals is disturbing

why talk to a person when you can gas or taze them and end the confrontation much faster?

the answer: you lose the moral high ground every time you use violence instead of reason

that's why so many people say "Fuck the police"

11/1/2010 11:04:06 PM

Snewf speaks da troof ITT

Quote :

"Next time you see a large group of drunk people breaking laws and disobeying police orders, maybe walk the other direction"

Perhaps I should just avoid NCSU tailgating, perhaps I should avoid Hillsborough hike, perhaps I should stay at home like a good little boy so I don't cause the police any trouble at all
Hell.... with this reasoning the police should just nuke every NASCAR race

11/1/2010 11:09:53 PM

I wouldn't classify CS or OC as less lethal; I can't recall any deaths being associated with either weapon. In fact, OC is made with food grade ingredients. Less lethal is taser, bean bag rounds, etc.

11/1/2010 11:11:51 PM

^^^ Yep, exactly. That's my problem with the TASER...cops are too trigger-happy with it.

The TASER is a great tool, but the attitude that LE has with it--at least unofficially--really fucks it up. I think it might be better if they didn't have stuff like that at all, since they can't seem to wrap their minds around how to use it.

[Edited on November 1, 2010 at 11:12 PM. Reason : ]

11/1/2010 11:12:30 PM

The fact that you can't seem to distinguish between sanctioned events (Chapel Hill Halloween earlier, the bullshit examples in your last post) and spontaneous unruly gatherings is congruent with the poor judgement you showed in hanging around to get gassed and trampled.

11/1/2010 11:13:07 PM