Yeah...I had to be careful working there or I would turn into a roly poly. Closest I've got to great bbq in SC. Chill place to work as well.

12/17/2011 2:33:33 PM

Quote :

"I stopped reading your post after this because it's false. I don't know where you eat and drink in the States, but I've traveled over most of Europe and the service pales in comparison to the places I frequent here."

The service in Europe is different than it is in the US, and to me, this difference makes the service better.

In the US, the waiter is always bugging the shit out of you, asking if we want another drink, asking us if we want dessert. You don't have that in Europe, because they're not trying to push their food and drinks on you like they are in the US. The allow you to eat and drink without being hassled or interrupted. If you want another drink, you signal them to come to your table and you ask them for another drink. This is all done without the expectation of a tip as well.

In China, my friends and I frequented some of the same restaurants almost daily and never tipped a yuan and received excellent service.

Sorry, but service in the US consists of a waiter bugging the shit out of you asking if you want to buy more shit so they can get a bigger raise. It's the same reason why some waiters view people who order waiter instead of an actual drink as being "cheap." Waiters/Waitresses in the US are more interested in trying to shovel more food and drinks down your throat and then get you the fuck out of there. This obnoxiousness is branded by people in the service industry as being "attentive."

Quote :

"And if you want them to be paid salaried, then you are going to pay more for your meals and get worse service on average. Restaurants don't make enough money to have that many people on a decent salary. And if they pay a shitty salary (which is probably what you think they should get because you don't think they are skilled workers), then you are going to get dumb employees who give you crappy service. "

Wut?

I never said anything about a salary. I was speaking more about the minimum wage for the service industry where tips are "expected" to make up for the loss of hourly wage. I was speaking more about increasing the minimum wage of waiters/waitresses up to $7.50/hr and drop the exemption they are accustomed to.

Right now people who go to restaurants are expected to contribute at least 15% to the waiter. To say that I would have to "pay more for my meal" is laughable. I'm already "paying more." It's just not up front. And some places add a 15% gratuity onto the bill anyway, thus causing me to "pay more." Though this is usually on larger groups of people.

And the service wouldn't necessarily have to be worse. It would mean that managers would have to ensure their employees are providing good service. Like I said, I always felt that countries where tipping was not the norm the service was actually better.

Again. I'm not against tipping. It's just stupid that it is expected. It's no longer "tipping" when it's expected.

12/17/2011 2:35:15 PM

^He mentioned salaried service workers because that's what they do in Europe. It's why if you've been to the UK they REFUSE tips of any kind as a bartender or a waiter, because they're straight-up told not to take them. Tipping is just not part of their service culture.

And I fucking agree with you on the service being better abroad. I spent a long time in Europe (mostly the UK) and just loved being able to 1) pay for my food up front, 2) not have to tip, 3) still receive good service. They get you drinks, they bring you your food, they don't nag the shit out of you and whine about how awful their job is.

So whatever, sympathy for service industry, but don't be so damn smug about the "rules".

12/17/2011 2:40:12 PM

Quote :

"You don't have that in Europe, because they're not trying to push their food and drinks on you like they are in the US. The allow you to eat and drink without being hassled or interrupted. If you want another drink, you signal them to come to your table and you ask them for another drink."

99% of the complaints about service in these threads is waiting forever for food and drinks. You seem to have a different mindset (than most Americans I would assume...the majority of us are lazy and like being waited hand and foot). I actually agree with the kind of service you are talking about and that's also what I prefer...but that service just won't fly here.

Quote :

"I'm already "paying more." It's just not up front."

I meant to mention that you will essentially be paying the same for a meal. If restaurants have to pay their servers more, they will charge youmore. You want tip as much...but it will probably the same price as you get in the other system.

And you WILL get shitty service if you have servers working at minimum wage or somewhere around that. Think of the rest of the jobs where employees get paid minimum wage...those will be the people waiting on you. I don't care how good the managers are...they can't help stupid. The salary method might work, but restaurants are struggling enough as it is. There is no way they could survive having that many employees on salary.

[Edited on December 17, 2011 at 2:44 PM. Reason : .]

12/17/2011 2:42:32 PM

Quote :

"Your theory makes a little sense...but overall is very impractical."

Yea, the U.S.'s way of doing it is the only way the makes sense, the rest of the world is senseless and impractical. Now if only we could get them to see the light on the uselessness of the metric system...

[Edited on December 17, 2011 at 2:44 PM. Reason : fffffuuuu]

12/17/2011 2:43:41 PM

NM, waste of time.

[Edited on December 17, 2011 at 2:45 PM. Reason : f]

12/17/2011 2:44:08 PM

Quote :

"i disagree with most of what you said, especially the notion that waiters are trying to push food on you to get a bigger bill."

I disagree with this as well.

Specials are pushed...but they are usually the same price as entrees and are pushed because the kitchen went to the market and got a special cut of meat/fish that they want to try or run out of so it doesn't spoil.

I rarely have servers push expensive bottles of wine or higher priced liquors.

12/17/2011 2:47:38 PM

Quote :

"Us idiot drunks are paying your bills. Hows about you assholes show a positive attitude? If not we will go to another friendlier bar and you'll be out of a job. People with no people skills trying to have jobs interacting with people."

shut up and go piss in a sink, and then claim youre a lawyer when you get tossed out.

12/17/2011 2:48:49 PM

Quote :

"Yea, the U.S.'s way of doing it is the only way the makes sense, the rest of the world is senseless and impractical. Now if only we could get them to see the light on the uselessness of the metric system..."

What a perfect analogy...


Just to add another point to the European/US service argument...

I have a good friend who lives in Santorini, Greece for 6 months out of every year and then travels for the rest of the 6 months. He has been doing this for the past 19 years of his life. He bartends and waits tables for while in Greece, then travels around the world the rest.

He's been coming back to Charleston for the last two years to live with another friend of mine. He's also lived in NYC and DC a couple times as well.

From a guy who has lived and worked in another country in the service industry, eaten and drank all over the world, he is still in awe when he goes out to eat and drink in the States. Says he's gotten the best service and consistently best food in Charleston the last couple years.

[Edited on December 17, 2011 at 2:53 PM. Reason : .]

12/17/2011 2:52:38 PM

Quote :

"How much money do you make a year? This is some ignorant shit. "

a fuckload more than any bartender, along with paid vacation, healh insurance, 401k, and stock options. What's your point?

12/17/2011 2:55:13 PM

charleston's food is amazing

12/17/2011 3:02:25 PM

http://nymag.com/nymetro/news/bizfinance/finance/features/4086/

Quote :

"Bartenders The tipping point Bartenders have a high burnout rate. It isn't only the odd hours. At a downtown watering hole, a night's shift will put $200 to $250 (minimum wage plus tips) in your pocket, but you might have to slide patrons a few free drinks to get the tips rolling. At some of the hotter clubs where there's music, you don't get to build a clientele, but the volume of customers can yield $300 to $400 a night. Barkeeps at a fashionable spot like Asia de Cuba rake in $500 to $600 in an evening. Still, these guys rarely work more than three nights a week. If you want steady money serving drinks, a hotel is the place to be. Hotel bartenders are union members; they make $17 an hour plus tips -- and benefits. A good bartender at the Plaza's Oak Bar can make $50,000 to $70,000 per year including tips; $100,000 isn't unheard of."

12/17/2011 3:04:16 PM

my statement still stands.

[Edited on December 17, 2011 at 3:12 PM. Reason : seriously though, you're trying to use an article about NYC and their overinflated salaries in NC?]

12/17/2011 3:07:17 PM

i got choked out in my last fight.

I still won.

[Edited on December 17, 2011 at 3:10 PM. Reason : e]

12/17/2011 3:10:10 PM

You're definitely not going to be rich with a career as a bartender. And the ones that do make good money usually burn out in 10 years at the most.

The good/responsible bartenders I knew in Charleston bartended for 7-10 years...made 60 to 80K a year...saved and invested it, and are now doing something different or they have their own restaurants/bars. But those people are few and far between.

I did have a friend that was making 200k+ bartending in Vegas...but he was a big time gambler/drinker/partier...and left Vegas with maybe 5K to his name after 4 years.

[Edited on December 17, 2011 at 3:13 PM. Reason : .]

12/17/2011 3:12:01 PM

bartending is like working the door is like waiting tables

you advance to ownership, you dont stay there if you actually intend on making a living and accrueing wealth

12/17/2011 3:15:10 PM

Quote :

"seriously though, you're trying to use an article about NYC and their overinflated salaries in NC"

I was not aware this thread was about local bars in North Carolina only. Sorry.

12/17/2011 3:17:55 PM

ITT people who are not bartenders assume they are idiots and bartenders assume customers are idiots. /thread


the original post had some strange points, but where it was absolutely 100% right was where it commented on the micro-economy of the service industry. Money is just a borrowed form of currency. If your buddy drops big cash in your bar, it is almost understood that one day you will go to their bar and return the favor.

12/17/2011 3:25:27 PM

Quote :

"And you WILL get shitty service if you have servers working at minimum wage or somewhere around that. Think of the rest of the jobs where employees get paid minimum wage...those will be the people waiting on you. I don't care how good the managers are...they can't help stupid. The salary method might work, but restaurants are struggling enough as it is. There is no way they could survive having that many employees on salary."

You might be right at shittier restaurants. But do you think a restaurant will pay a waiter/waitress minimum wage at a high end restaurant? They will still get tips, but just not as much as they do now. However, that will be balanced out by a higher wage.

And like anywhere else, there will still be a supply and demand for servers. The good ones would end up at good restaurants like they do now, and the bad ones will end up at lower end restaurants where they are now.

Quote :

"I disagree with this as well. Specials are pushed...but they are usually the same price as entrees and are pushed because the kitchen went to the market and got a special cut of meat/fish that they want to try or run out of so it doesn't spoil. I rarely have servers push expensive bottles of wine or higher priced liquors."

Sorry, that's not what I was exactly talking about.

I was specifically talking more about waiters coming around asking if you want another beer (and at 2-3 dollars a beer depending on the restaurant and beer, it could end up as another dollar in the tip if a table wants another drink with little effort by the waiter). The big thing I always find them trying to push is dessert and coffee. I just don't like shit being shoved in my face and a waitress asking me if I want to purchase more food and drinks. My attitude is if I want more, I will ask for more.

But it's all cultural unfortunately.

12/17/2011 4:08:20 PM

Quote :

"I was not aware this thread was about local bars in North Carolina only. Sorry. "

it's really stupid to post an article about how the best bartenders in NYC could possibly make $100k in a year when the cost of living in that area routinely doubles salaries. I know linemen in those areas that make well over 100k a year, where they'd make less than half that in NC. And unlike a bartender, they work in a profession where they'll still be able to progress and have a job past the age of 40.

12/17/2011 5:43:06 PM

I had one of the worst nights at the bar that I have ever had. This group were complete assholes to the floor staff, the bartender (who is also one of my bosses) and me for over 5 hours, drinking and taking up the majority of my section at work. And when it came time to pay the bill they stiffed me on $150 tab.

How in the hell do you see that as a viable option??

/rant.

1/29/2012 3:32:26 AM

A little off topic...

I've been working in a bar for a number of years. I've noticed that when we're slammin' busy, cash tips tend to be larger even though people are waiting longer. As opposed to when its slow and people can just walk up to the bar and be served immediately. I've always found this interesting...

Does the value of the service go up when there's a legitimate wait... What say you bartenders?

1/29/2012 5:01:29 AM

Quote :

"the service industry crowd on here will pretty much agree with this word for word "

I HATE shit like this. Your job is to server the customer. Shut the fuck up and do it. Don't give me a fucking list to follow like you're some fucking king.

[Edited on January 29, 2012 at 8:06 AM. Reason : ]

1/29/2012 8:01:41 AM

Quote :

"Your job is to server the customer"

you sure told them

1/29/2012 9:13:29 AM

Sure did since every bartender reads this.

1/29/2012 9:21:42 AM

Quote :

"#3 get out of the service industry"

I'm totally find with robots / self-checkout taking my money and serving me drinks.

Just sayin.

1/29/2012 9:24:50 AM

ITT: OP, an obvious "service industry" snob, doesn't understand service, and is currently jaded by customers that don't subscribe to an arbitrary system of politeness that someone else posted somewhere else.

Did I miss anything?

1/29/2012 10:01:08 AM

Quote :

"Does the value of the service go up when there's a legitimate wait... What say you bartenders?"

Two reasons for bigger tips on busy nights:

(1) The customer finally sees you "putting in work", respects that, and tips you accordingly. This can also be seen as a customer feeling sorry for your ass getting handed to you and bumps up the tip.

(2) They tip you extra, hoping that you remember and get to their order first next time.


I think it's about 70% for #2, 30% for #1.

[Edited on January 29, 2012 at 10:21 AM. Reason : .]

1/29/2012 10:21:13 AM

Quote :

"I had one of the worst nights at the bar that I have ever had. This group were complete assholes to the floor staff, the bartender (who is also one of my bosses) and me for over 5 hours, drinking and taking up the majority of my section at work. And when it came time to pay the bill they stiffed me on $150 tab. "

that's why you hold an ID or a credit card for tabs

1/29/2012 10:46:40 AM

You're a bartender. Shut the fuck up and get me my drink

1/29/2012 10:54:14 AM

I do it, but I've never really understood the purpose of tipping bartenders. To me as the customer standing at the bar, they have one purpose - get me my drink. I realize they have other things they are responsible for, but for me right there - get me my drink. That is their job. That is what they're paid for. I don't really see varying levels of service for bartenders - just getting me my drink. Just from a cost perspective, why tip someone several dollars for reaching down, opening, and handing me an overpriced beer. I just don't see my several dollars worth in that action.

Maybe for the folks that ask for complicated drinks, but still - to me as the customer, the bartenders one function is to get me that drink.

I don't tip my pharmacist for reaching behind the counter to hand me my medicine - why should a beer be any different?

[Edited on January 29, 2012 at 11:03 AM. Reason : The argument then is "Don't go to bars to drink." And I usually don't.]

1/29/2012 11:01:41 AM

you are also paying the bartender for their competence in drink-making. Yeah, if they just reach down and hand you a bottle of cuuuurs laaaat, they didn't do that much. Then again, you're gonna pay out the ass for that bottle, too. Or, you ask them to pour you one. They can give you a shit-ton of head and no beer, or they can give you little head and lots of beer. Thus, the tip. Or, if you are asking for a mixed drink, you are paying extra for their knowledge of said drinks. The bar gets the money for the alcohol, the bartender gets the money for knowing what the fuck to do with the alcohol.

1/29/2012 4:23:20 PM

Anyone with an ounce of decency tips at the bar. Its the standard and the right thing to do.

[Edited on January 30, 2012 at 4:01 AM. Reason : .]

1/30/2012 3:59:41 AM

There are some high horse motherfuckers in this thread. Good grief.

Quote :

"When are bartenders going to finally be replaced by vending machines?"

agree

Quote :

"I always leave a hefty tip of 10-15%."

this struck me as funny because i think he is serious(using the word hefty)

Quote :

"After reading this thread, I feel that bartenders are over-entitled douchebags if they all really think like this."

After reading this thread, as someone that works in the service industry, I feel like you are an over-entitled douchebag if you really think like that.

Quote :

"People with no people skills trying to have jobs interacting with people."

You say it like there are an abundance of job opportunities out there.

Quote :

"And if they pay a shitty salary (which is probably what you think they should get because you don't think they are skilled workers), then you are going to get dumb employees who give you crappy service"

I guess this last quote is what makes me hate the service industry the most. That elitest mindset some customers get, that we are just lapdogs that are too stupid to realize. That sentiment is evident in posts in this thread. It's like you are a substandard human if you work in the service industry now. And to top it all off, you have to work with "dumb employees".

1/30/2012 4:44:55 AM

Normally I wouldn't post in a thread like this, because I really don't care all that much. Also, I haven't read past the first few posts, so I apologize if the conversation has drifted elsewhere.

Let me preface by saying that I am unequivocally against rudeness of all forms towards those working in the service industry, at least without cause. I rarely (if ever) tip less than 20 percent, and am always gracious and polite toward anyone that is serving me.

That being said, I sometimes wonder what makes bartenders think they are different from any other sector of the service industry where the customer comes first. What, do you think you are playing God back there, deciding who will and won't get drinks in a timely fashion? Example: I was at a bar downtown on New Years Eve, drinking merrily and having a good time with my compadres. I imagine that I had racked up somewhere near a $150 bar tab by this point in the evening. I decided to order 4 drinks for my friends and I and politely requested them from the bartender. There seemed to be a misunderstanding, as he thought I had ordered a drink that sounded similar to the drink that I in fact ordered, though it was actually a completely different drink. Upon receiving the drinks, I noticed that it was not at all what I ordered. Truth be told, I probably would have just sucked it up and drank them if they weren't completely disgusting. I told the bartender that these drinks are not what I had ordered. He immediately goyt defensive and told me that there was "nothing that he could do, he already made the drinks." Really, there is nothing you can do? Actually, there is something you can do. You can get off your fucking high horse and get me what I ordered. Since when is it OK for someone in the service industry to bring someone the wrong order and then essentially tell them to fuck off? Fuck you, Mr. Bartender. I am paying you, you condescending douchebag. I ended up getting into it pretty good with this guy before the manager came over and apologized (with the correct drinks in hand).

I'm sure this isn't the particular situation the OP was originally talking about in this thread, and I'm sure customers are complete douchebags sometimes. However, I have noticed a strange propensity for bartenders and/or waiters/waitresses to put themselves up on some high horse, bitching and complaining about every little thing...shit's annoying.

1/30/2012 7:18:10 AM

^ Response:

First...I'm not saying this is what happened in your situation. You probably ran into a bartender having a shitty night, you guys had a misunderstanding, and he was in the wrong. I'm on your side in this situation. He shouldn't have had that type of reaction, the manager came and corrected it, and hopefully he got disciplined accordingly.

However, a lot of time this is how this situation usually plays out (how it has played out HUNDREDS OF TIMES in my experience)....

- Intoxicated customer goes to bartender (in your situation you had $150 bar tab...I can imagine you had a few of those drinks) and orders drinks...maybe slurring some words, possibly not saying it loud enough...either way it can be a little distorted.

[this is a step that is often skipped, but because this situations occurs so often, it's a step I never miss]

- Bartender repeats the drink order he/she THINKS she hears. I've worked in bars with bands, DJs, and just overall loud-ass music playing with hundreds of people in there. My hearing has definitely suffered and you pretty much have to be a lip reader to be a decent bartender (and have a good memory of remembering drinks). But I've thought I heard "Miller Lite" a million times, repeated to the customer, yelling back to them, "MILLER LITE??"...come back with a Miller Lite, get a funny look, and they say, "I ordered Bud Light." You have people who order a Vodka and Tonic Water as a "Tonic and Vodka" or a "VT"....or a Vodka Soda as an "Absolut [insert type of Vodka here] and Seltzer". And these are just the basics. I don't have problems with those drinks...but it's just the tip of the iceberg in the 8 million different ways to order drinks in a bar (add wine options, drink menus with dozens of drinks, and then the customer's own personal drink menu in their brain with special shots and drinks they've gotten at other bars in their lifetime).

So I always repeat the order, even if I'm 99% sure I got the order right. And this STILL doesn't always work. The customer usually isn't paying attention when you repeat the order back, and that's why they get the wrong order a lot of times.

- Bartender goes and makes the drinks that he THOUGHT he heard

- Bartender comes back with incorrect drinks, you say, "this is not what I ordered." I'm going to assume you replied in a polite manner, but I'd say 80% of the time it's a very condescending "this isn't what I ordered", while looking at the bartender like he/she is a complete idiot...all the while the customer is usually quite intoxicated probably the one acting like an idiot.

- Now the bartender has to go back and make your correct drinks, probably go back and change your tab (which can take a long time depending on the POS system and whether or not he had closed out your tab, so he might have to re-open/close your tab again)...taking him further away from serving the other customers and getting further in the weeds. And then he might have to put the incorrect drinks on the spill tab...which in this economy, is sometimes heavily scrutinized by management.


So I'm just giving you an example of what usually happens. I don't know many times I've repeated what I thought the order was, the customer gives the "okay", and then they get the wrong drinks. Its always nice when you put their drinks on the bar, they look at them, and then realize that (a) they should have been louder with their order and/or (b) they should have listened when the bartender attempted to "confirm" their drink order...then they apologize. But there are still the douchebags who act like elitist pricks when something is wrong with their order.

Oh, and...

Quote :

"Just from a cost perspective, why tip someone several dollars for reaching down, opening, and handing me an overpriced beer. I just don't see my several dollars worth in that action."

Then just stay at home and do it yourself.

[Edited on January 30, 2012 at 7:41 AM. Reason : .]

[Edited on January 30, 2012 at 7:48 AM. Reason : .]

1/30/2012 7:37:09 AM

@rjrumfel

There's a lot of cleaning and other shit bar tenders do. Also they're not paid to get your drinks for you, they make less than $2/hr, that's what the tip pays for.

1/30/2012 7:43:18 AM

^^I realize the point you're trying to make, jbrick83, but hear me out - maybe I can offer some insight.

I am in outside sales, which is currently salary+commission, but will move into straight commission starting at the beginning of July 2010. I have been in this position since July 2009. I have competition from several direct manufacturing sales reps, large distributors, and local distributors. Here are the advantages and disadvantages of each:

Direct Advantages: Immediate knowledge of new technology, no middle man mark up, one shipping bill (paid by manufacturer or buyer of goods), access to larger range of non-commodity items, control inventory, have access to many distributors that can effectively sell their goods which increases market share, and set prices of commodity they manufacture.

Direct disadvantages: Typically have 1-3 sales reps per region (i.e. southeast, mid-atlantic, northeast, etc.) limiting the number of accounts they can successfully manage/cold-call, lack physical customer service or physical technical service available to or affordable for smaller users or altogether, are sometimes not trustworthy because they will go in behind their distributors that sell their commodity to one account in large quantities (i.e. they missed a big account, and have found out about it through a distributor selling their particular product) which leads to the distributor not selling their product anymore, have too many distributors selling the product ultimately driving the set price down through deviations, possibly rely on distributors to actually sell the product, and competition from other direct sources.

Large distributor advantages: have access to other commodities that go hand in hand with other manufacturers (poor example- grocery stores sell milk as well as cereal), get direct pricing, many locations regionally or nationally easing the shipping burden of buyers with multiple locations, personal service either customer or technical, many sales reps that are able to cover a broader territory, access to multiple manufacturers of the same commodity allowing to keep prices in check, service programs that smaller companies can't offer and direct providers can't match in price or value, and experts of many many commodities as opposed to one or a few.

Large distributor disadvantages: smaller local distributors creating price wars (think Michael Scott Paper Co vs Dunder-Mifflin), direct mfg's going in behind and stealing business, limited access to all of the mfg's (you won't find Harris Teeter name brands in Food Lion and visa versa), can't truly set prices because it's based on both supply and demand, territory management, and tough growth prospects in slower economies (this is true for direct as well really)

Local distributor advantages: Typically a good ol' boy setting where the seller and the buyer know each other for years (this does happen at all levels, but mostly at the local level), local folks are right down the street and can be used in emergencies, if the local guy buys at high enough volumes then there is no shipping charge to the end user, and access to both direct mfg's and large distributors.

Local distributor disadvantages: easily beaten in price, array of commodities, array of technology, lack of trained staff, low cash flow, etc etc etc.

This is what I have noticed in my six months, I am sure there are plenty more that need mentioning. The way I am setting myself apart as a sales person is this: I go after the big accounts right now while I am new. The big accounts, if I land them, will take care of me while I am new and building a customer base. The money made off of those allows me to focus free time on smaller accounts that get me higher margins. I build up big accounts, I would like to have 5-10 of these, then get 20-30 medium accounts. If I lose 1 or 2 big accounts, the 20-30 medium accounts keep me afloat while I go after new big accounts. I don't really waste time on small accounts simply because they basically pay for breakfast or something really small.

I will say this, if you can't get a big account in the first 6-8 months (assuming you have cash flow that you can ride this long) you could be in a world of trouble. If you can get one, it will really make going after the others a lot more enjoyable and less stressful. It's simply just very exhausting wasting any time on anything other than big accounts in the very beginning. You work just as hard on the medium sized accounts and see 1/3 to 1/36 of the money in my situation.

If you have any other questions, you can PM me. I hope this helps in the slightest!

1/30/2012 7:47:04 AM

You gotta at least change the "inside sales" part.

1/30/2012 7:50:28 AM

One thing I want to know: How come there are never more than like 2 bartenders ever? Even if it's a holiday Saturday and the place is packed? Everyone has to wait 10 minutes and order with no questions or special requests. Then we need to tip heavily because the bartender graced us with his attention? Can't the bar just add another guy at $2/hour?

1/30/2012 10:01:40 AM

you people bitch a lot

1/30/2012 10:03:16 AM

Quote :

"that's why you hold an ID or a credit card for tabs"

That is our policy and I did that. They said they wanted to close out, so I gave them the check with their credit card. The guy signed it, right below the "0" he put on the tip line.

The group of them didn't just walk out without paying the bill. They consciously signed the bill.

1/30/2012 10:05:20 AM

Quote :

"One thing I want to know: How come there are never more than like 2 bartenders ever? Even if it's a holiday Saturday and the place is packed? Everyone has to wait 10 minutes and order with no questions or special requests. Then we need to tip heavily because the bartender graced us with his attention? Can't the bar just add another guy at $2/hour?"

Probably because 2 bartenders typically work said night of the week & would bitch incessantly about another person joining them that night & cutting into some of their $$

1/30/2012 10:18:08 AM

Quote :

"One thing I want to know: How come there are never more than like 2 bartenders ever?"

There are plenty of places that have more than two bartenders.

At the same time, more bartenders won't always help the situation. If it's a small bar, when it's packed, that third bartender won't add enough to make the difference. They can't serve the person that's three deep in the back..and it's not going to help at the computer screen that's already being used.

And yes, bartenders don't want that extra person taking their cut. But I always look at it as a, "I'm going to bartend my ass off so the manager doesn't see the need for the extra bartender and I can keep my money." I got hired to work at a bar that started off with 4 bartenders and a barback on the weekends. People struggled to get drinks. I became bar manager, fired half the staff, and started running 2 bartenders and a barback on the weekends. The two bartenders were bad-ass, made a shit-ton of money, and everybody got their drinks on time.

Also...don't go to busy bars on the weekends if you don't expect to wait for a drink.

1/30/2012 10:24:06 AM

IMO there are larger problems at work here.

There is no sign on the door that says how much the bartender gets paid per hour. You can argue the $2/hour until you're blue in the face, but no one posting in this thread knows what the distribution of bartender wages actually is. Aside from even that fact, a single institution doesn't have much leeway to change the system because paying them more won't change the perceived tip premium on the prices.

SUMMARY: economics fails b/c people act out of obligation and have incomplete information.

But to our larger problem, why the hell are all you idiots all crowding into the same bar at the same time in order to all get crappy service? If you can't move and have to push people to get to the exit you're not having a good time. And this problem isn't because they don't make the bars big enough, it's because it's fucking high-value real estate that has 3 big nights out of the entire week, sitting there useless for the majority of the 24/7 time that it continues to exist. There is a premium you pay to drink at high-demand times and you pay that premium in the form of shitty service, and the possible lack of discounts they would otherwise give on other nights of the week.

SUMMARY: everyone piles downtown at the same time so of course it's a shitty pigsty.

The role of the bartender, though, is particularly confusing. They have accepted a particularly high risk compensation package for work that is, naturally, loud and filled with dealing with drunk people. Does it take particular skill? Sure, absolutely, but it's not a transportable skill to other lines of work. Dealing with drunk people isn't the same as dealing with generally disabled people. Plus, it's hectic, you need to know a huge number of drink recipes, and you have to be okay with being a dick. I dunno, maybe some people will argue these are skills you need for any job, but there's obviously a more effective way of handing people alcohol, mixing and occasionally adding ice or an umbrella. I mean, you can stay home and get the same effect aside from being around other drunk people you don't know and might be afraid of. Wait, you can get that at home, but not in the same volume as you can downtown. I mean, if people could, plenty of profiteers would routinely re-purpose houses, random buildings, and empty fields in order to make money. They might even limit the alcohol selection to 1 or 5 things, which would not keep very many people from coming. Hell, maybe it'd even come with a ride home. The real crux of the issue is government's stick up their arse and our overbearing and arbitrary alcohol rules.

SUMMARY: it's all the government's fault (as usual)

1/30/2012 9:14:32 PM

Quote :

""Just from a cost perspective, why tip someone several dollars for reaching down, opening, and handing me an overpriced beer. I just don't see my several dollars worth in that action." Then just stay at home and do it yourself. "

Or, find another job.

1/30/2012 9:18:52 PM

If a bartender expects me to give him a dollar for twisting off a PBR cap, he's going to be sorely disappointed.

1/30/2012 9:25:42 PM