^^^

I was just debunking the argument that Raleigh is some how good for culture, beach, and mountains by using an example that has those things as strengths.

Raleigh has advantages for living there, but culture and nature are not in the Pros column.

[Edited on May 31, 2013 at 12:58 PM. Reason : a]

5/31/2013 12:58:34 PM

yes, cali is cooler than raleigh when it comes to mountains and beaches, but raleigh is cooler than a lot of other cities in the u.s. when it comes to proximity to mountains and beaches.

5/31/2013 1:01:21 PM

^ Way to shoot for the middle dad.</tosh>

[Edited on May 31, 2013 at 1:02 PM. Reason : a]

5/31/2013 1:02:40 PM

You know where is better than any of these places?

Vegas

5/31/2013 1:05:06 PM

For pure unabashed debauchery...

I ate dinner in Vegas on Monday night... BECAUSE IT'S CLOSE TO LA

5/31/2013 1:06:49 PM

Raleigh is a decent place to live if you work in tech or NC gov't, but this whole "it's an AMAZING city" crap is ridiculous. It's not a world class city by any stretch of the imagination and it never will be.

NYC, Boston, Chicago, SF, Seattle, LA, Miami, and New Orleans are "Amazing" cities. They have international clout and booming tourism industries.

5/31/2013 1:07:30 PM

Quote :

"Miami, and New Orleans"

fucking dropped

I'm Krallum and I approved this message.

5/31/2013 1:08:38 PM

^^that's already been covered. yes, those are better cities. but for the size of raleigh, it doesn't get much better.

[Edited on May 31, 2013 at 1:08 PM. Reason : ]

5/31/2013 1:08:38 PM

Vegas is about the size of Raleigh.

Way better

5/31/2013 1:11:03 PM

I'd much rather live in Oakland (crime and all) or Portland than Raleigh and they are similar in size/population.

5/31/2013 1:12:06 PM

there' probably several dozen places in the u.s. i'd rather go to than go back to vegas.

5/31/2013 1:12:37 PM

Well then your love for Raleigh is not all that surprising I guess

5/31/2013 1:13:50 PM

Vegas is NOT a great place to live. Anyone who thinks they could live there for any serious length of time is as nutty as the locals who live there...

^ I don't see what Raleigh has to offer over cities like Nashville, Indianapolis,Memphis, Louisville, Charleston, etc. Throw in other cities like Austin, Denver, Pittsburgh, etc that are outside of the South and I'm really not seeing the draw.

[Edited on May 31, 2013 at 1:16 PM. Reason : .]

5/31/2013 1:14:01 PM

I didn't say I could live there, I just said it was better

5/31/2013 1:15:10 PM

anyone who thinks Vegas rules has obviously never left the strip

that place is a shithole

just the drive between the strip and Fremont St is embarrassing

5/31/2013 1:16:38 PM

I think it rules and I've left the strip so there goes that theory

5/31/2013 1:18:43 PM

omg guys but cali is so great

EDIT: Has nature/arts/culture/food hit the east coast yet? Probably not, it's relatively exclusive.

[Edited on May 31, 2013 at 1:19 PM. Reason : f]

5/31/2013 1:18:46 PM

to be fair, Summerlin and Henderson are actually quite nice- much nicer than parts of Phoenix.

In fact, I'd actually rather live in Vegas than Phoenix- even Scottsdale...

And California IS great. I've lived in both SoCal/NorCal and I'm from NC and it's not even debatable unless you are a bible thumping racist.

[Edited on May 31, 2013 at 1:20 PM. Reason : .]

5/31/2013 1:19:19 PM

I've only been to San Diego (which I loved) and LA (wasn't crazy but I was younger and probably didn't appreciate it). I think I'm more tempted by the PNW personally. Looking to leave NC for a while, but have to consider a city I love + cost of living and what not. Have some friends that moved to Bay Area but they're trust fund kids, and I don't make a ton of money, so I don't see that happening. My fiance would NOT do LA, maybe San Diego, and we aren't familiar with cities past that.

EDIT: (I should probably visit San Fran too).

[Edited on May 31, 2013 at 1:25 PM. Reason : f]

5/31/2013 1:25:11 PM

i'll agree that lots of california is better than raleigh. i also realize that that's my OPINION, and others may have differing OPINiONS on the subject, and that doesn't necessarily make them a bible-thumper or racist.

[Edited on May 31, 2013 at 1:27 PM. Reason : ]

5/31/2013 1:25:57 PM

^^^^

I paraglide, ski and BASE jump. The mountains in NC, for different reasons are not good for any of those, whereas the west coast mountains are. In Mammoth this year there was 5 feet of snow after Thanksgiving. It was also still open last weekend.

NC Food is great and better in pockets than some places in Cali. I'm not aware of any world class media/art/culture companies in NC. In fact I bet Viacom, a single company, makes more money than all of marketing/media in NC.



[Edited on May 31, 2013 at 1:37 PM. Reason : a]

5/31/2013 1:26:01 PM

SF and the Bay Area are the nicest parts of CA- although they are insanely expensive. Portland Oregon and Seattle are great cities too, if you are progressive/liberal, but the weather for most of the year is a major bummer.

Quote :

"i'll agree that lots of california is better than raleigh. i also realize that that's my OPINION, and others may have differing OPINiONS on the subject, and that doesn't necessarily make them a bible-thumper or racist."

sure. most people that talk about how much California sucks on this forum have never even visited it though, much less left the state of NC...

It certainly isn't for everyone, and the state has a host of problems, but as for nature and a variety of things to do? NC and Raleigh don't really pose much competition.

[Edited on May 31, 2013 at 1:31 PM. Reason : .]

5/31/2013 1:27:08 PM

Quote :

"I've only been to San Diego (which I loved) and LA (wasn't crazy but I was younger and probably didn't appreciate it). I think I'm more tempted by the PNW personally. Looking to leave NC for a while, but have to consider a city I love + cost of living and what not. Have some friends that moved to Bay Area but they're trust fund kids, and I don't make a ton of money, so I don't see that happening. My fiance would NOT do LA, maybe San Diego, and we aren't familiar with cities past that. EDIT: (I should probably visit San Fran too)."

I lived in the city in SF. It's a shit hole. Bums shit in front of your garage, there are needles and crack pipes in "nice" neighborhoods and it's a mother fucker to get around and do even simple things like buy groceries. Granted I liked it, I work in tech, and it's one of the only places you can get in arguments at a bar about functional vs OO programming. Hipsters and multi-millionaire trust fund kids that pretend to be hipsters also seem to love it. A friend lived in a warehouse without power with a girl that went to MIT and played for the symphony, a former vet, and some homeless dude that was from a wealthy family--that kind of quirkiness is why people like it. Oakland/Berkeley is much closer to the reasons you'd want to live in California. LA is cleaner and has much nicer weather, but the traffic sucks. Why wouldn't you're fiance live there?

5/31/2013 1:36:06 PM

Because LA sucks?

Not sure how long you lived in SF or what part of the city you were in, but I don't see any selling points LA has over SF besides weather. LA has horrendous traffic, crime, plastic culture, that make it a shithole compared to SD (lived there for 2 years) I actually prefer Oakland to SF, but the Bay Area>>>LA

5/31/2013 1:46:15 PM

I lived in Russian Hill and both my wife and I worked in SOMA.

The Marina/Russian Hill people are very plastic too. I generally agree with the bay area being better, but LA isn't as bad as people up there make it out to be. And it's way better than living in SF proper

[Edited on May 31, 2013 at 1:48 PM. Reason : -]

5/31/2013 1:48:31 PM

All depends on what part of SF/LA you're talking about. The super wealthy/exclusive enclaves in both places are a lot more similar than people care to admit.

I like Venice a lot and parts of East LA remind me of Oakland, so I could probably live there.

If I were to live in the city, I would probably live in SOMA or Hayes Valley, but since I'm not made of money, I keep my broke ass in the East Bay

I just think the thing that sucks about LA is that you are sort of quarantined off into specific neighborhoods because of the traffic. It's much easier to get around the Bay Area imo.

5/31/2013 1:55:51 PM

My fiance is a little on the sheltered side, and while LA doesn't so much "scare her" it's just not what she digs. "Plastic culture" got mentioned a few posts up, but there was plenty of that in places we liked (San Diego) too, at least I thought. Crime + traffic is not a great combination to her. I only went to LA when I was younger so I will reserve too much judgment, but she's been there maybe twice and not all that long ago, and it just didn't click with her like San Diego did.

I keep coming back to San Diego but only because it's my only other comparison. A homeless guy still shit in front of us on the boardwalk there so whatever.

I might try to go and get thoughts on Bay Area but I don't really know where to start. I have a friend that lives in San Manteo.

5/31/2013 3:02:25 PM

Despite what the scare-stream media tells you it's not that dangerous. There are neighborhoods with bars on the windows and those are unbelievably cheap even by Raleigh standards.

Crime rate of 16 per 100,000: 90% of being a victim of a crime in 10 years.
Crime rate of 8 per 100,000: 90% of being a victim in 20 years.

I had a break in in my car in Raleigh and a bike stolen in 12 years.

5/31/2013 3:12:06 PM

^^ San Mateo is pretty nice, but it's also suburban and kinda quiet- as is the rest of the peninsula.

I can't stress enough how nice the urbanized East Bay (Oakland/Berkeley) is if you're looking for a vibrant city experience without the hefty price tag.

5/31/2013 3:22:41 PM

Seattle is great overall but the weather sucks ass. ]

San Diego is a little inferior as a city but I would rather live there because of the weather. It has all of the benefits of a big and small city so is probably the best place in the country.

Portland is like San Diego with more hipsters and less weather. Still great

SF is a little too rushed nyc-y for me but the bay area is great and expensive

Central coast/Santa Barbara is truly perfect in most senses but doesn't have the benefits of a huge city.


LA would be the best city in the world if traffic/transportation times weren't an issue but it is so bad that it almost erases all of the greatness of la. It really means driving 10 miles is really equivalent to driving 60 miles. When you think about it like that. LA doesn't have everything in the city if you have to drive 2 horus to cross town.

Quote :

"I don't see what Raleigh has to offer over cities like Nashville, Indianapolis,Memphis, Louisville, Charleston, etc. Throw in other cities like Austin, Denver, Pittsburgh, etc that are outside of the South and I'm really not seeing the draw. "

minneapolis
madison
milwaukee
orlando

5/31/2013 3:36:13 PM

shit weather 75% of the year
shit weather 75% of the year
shit weather 75% of the year
orlando

5/31/2013 3:39:07 PM

What? The weather is better than Raleigh for 75% of the year. You call 80 in the summer shit weather?

5/31/2013 3:50:04 PM

Quote :

"You know where is better than any of these places? Vegas"

hahaha

5/31/2013 3:50:13 PM

Orlando is a shithole.

5/31/2013 3:51:41 PM

pretty sure The E Man is just throwing out the names of commonly known big cities that he's obviously never set foot in

5/31/2013 3:54:42 PM

I want everyone to pay attention to the fact that no one even gives a shit about the charlotte thread anymore. Proof is in the pudding.

I'm Krallum and I approved this message.

5/31/2013 3:59:40 PM

Orlando is a shithole but its more like a carnival shithole than a Schindler shithole.

[Edited on May 31, 2013 at 4:01 PM. Reason : ^^I'VE BEEN EVERYWHERE MAN. (even though i was only in milwaukee a few hours)]

5/31/2013 4:01:02 PM

http://brentroad.com/message_topic.aspx?topic=616721&page=3

E man is trollin' y'all per usual

5/31/2013 4:02:51 PM

Charlotte is all the negatives of a vivacious, large city with none of the positives.

5/31/2013 4:23:17 PM

5/31/2013 4:26:24 PM

damn some of y'all had fun with my post.

Raleigh is an amazing city for what it is. Obviously it's not fucking Paris, NYC, etc. It is what it is - a nice medium sized Southern city. I never said it was the greatest city in the world or even the US. I'm arguing why Raleigh doesn't "suck" not trying to compare it to random cities across the country.

What I was trying to convey is that dollar per dollar, it is an excellent place to live and it has a solid blend of everything you could want, without the inconveniences (cost, traffic, crime, pollution) of larger cities. This relationship becomes more apparent as you get older, buy property, and start a family.

Yes, you can drive to the beach or mountains in a day trip. Who gives a shit if you can't do both in the same day - that's a feature of California that is nice but it's incomparable to most states. At least you could do it if you wanted to badly enough.

Quote :

" Don't get me started on having busses downtown. You can walk from one side to another in less time than it takes to ride the bus; that was clearly a scam to line someone's pockets"

Believe it or not, Raleigh =/= downtown alone.

Quote :

"Even in Raleigh it's hard to go to the trendy spots. Ever try to eat at Poole's at 7 PM?"

You could call ahead by a few hours for Poole's, if it was even necessary. Popular places in NYC are booked well ahead of time. Also, you don't have to be a billionaire to eat at one of NYC's best. I've booked the #25 restaurant in the world for my trip there in two weeks. $133 for a three course meal paired with wine at a NYT 4-star and Michelin 3-star restaurant.

5/31/2013 4:36:02 PM

Quote :

"You could call ahead by a few hours for Poole's, if it was even necessary."

Poole's does not take reservations.

5/31/2013 4:48:44 PM

Quote :

"Raleigh is an amazing city for what it is. Obviously it's not fucking Paris, NYC, etc. It is what it is - a nice medium sized Southern city. I never said it was the greatest city in the world or even the US. I'm arguing why Raleigh doesn't "suck" not trying to compare it to random cities across the country. "

you keep using that word "amazing"

i do not think it means what you think it means

5/31/2013 4:55:46 PM

i love california but the "surf and ski in the same afternoon" argument is pretty silly and i don't care.

^nice argument, the overused internet phrase means you win.

[Edited on May 31, 2013 at 4:58 PM. Reason : .]

5/31/2013 4:57:42 PM

Quote :

"You could call ahead by a few hours for Poole's, if it was even necessary. Popular places in NYC are booked well ahead of time. Also, you don't have to be a billionaire to eat at one of NYC's best. I've booked the #25 restaurant in the world for my trip there in two weeks. $133 for a three course meal paired with wine at a NYT 4-star and Michelin 3-star restaurant."

You can't make a reservation at Poole's and it is that busy; as are a lot of restaurants that are hot in Raleigh. I've eaten at Daniel, Gramercy Tavern, and Momofuku Ko and have never gotten out of there for under $500 when alcohol was not involved and in my opinion that is not affordable for anyone making under 7 figures. I also have tremendous luck eating at the bar at busy places.

The Michelin Guide will never go to Raleigh and review restaurants. Comparing a 1,2, or 3-Michelin star restaurant to ANY restaurant in Raleigh is disingenuous at best. The top NY restaurants are booked by people all over the world, so of course they are busy. You need a fairer comparison: Something like Watt's Grocery to whatever is hip in the recommended, but not starred section of the Michelin Guide.

Quote :

"i love california but the "surf and ski in the same afternoon" argument is pretty silly and i don't care. "

The argument was surf in the morning and ski later. I live on the beach and Big Bear is 2 hours away.


[Edited on May 31, 2013 at 5:07 PM. Reason : a]

5/31/2013 5:00:09 PM

seriously who the fuck cares about michelin restaurants. you guys have your heads up your ass.

5/31/2013 5:04:14 PM

Charleston

5/31/2013 5:05:02 PM

What about beasleys?

I'm Krallum and I approved this message.

5/31/2013 5:05:21 PM

Quote :

"nice argument, the overused internet phrase means you win."

It's not my fault he keeps using the word 'amazing' incorrectly. There is nothing exceptional about Raleigh- it's a perfectly fine medium sized Southern city, but calm down.

5/31/2013 5:05:54 PM

Quote :

"seriously who the fuck cares about michelin restaurants. you guys have your heads up your ass. "

Indeed. That is what I LIKE about Raleigh.

Quote :

" Charleston"

One Southern City the NYT does care about

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/02/09/dining/09notebook.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0

[Edited on May 31, 2013 at 5:09 PM. Reason : a]

5/31/2013 5:07:49 PM