i say we really dive into this free market stuff

free market police departments? YES

free market judicial system? YES

free market fire fighting? YES

10/31/2012 3:01:56 PM

agreed...but i feel that there might be a middle ground and i, for one, am willing to contribute to it for the sake of others

10/31/2012 3:03:52 PM

privatization =/= free markets
privatization is what we have now and what Romney/Ryan wants more of with vouchers. vouchers is just more of what we have with the government having less ability to negotiate prices. price inflation would be even worse.

What we need is actual government run healthcare in addition to private healthcare

[Edited on October 31, 2012 at 3:04 PM. Reason : .]

10/31/2012 3:04:13 PM

Quote :

"you act like the free market, capitalist world is a wonderful one, but that's just not the case."

World history proves otherwise.

Video you should watch.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RWsx1X8PV_A

10/31/2012 3:05:17 PM

Quote :

"you act like the free market, capitalist world is a wonderful one, but that's just not the case. the evidence is bountiful. the global economy is collapsing thanks to bank regulators that didn't believe in regulation. we've markedly elongated and amplified the hurricane season, increased temperatures around the world and melted the arctic thanks to a total lack of respect for the environment (#sandy). we have some very serious problems, most of which have been caused by right wing, anti-government ideals. this is an unacceptable model for society."

Yes, if only we had the right people running government, this wouldn't have happened. Just get out the vote guys! We're going to change all of this at the polls.

Quote :

"privatization =/= free markets privatization is what we have now and what Romney/Ryan wants more of with vouchers. vouchers is just more of what we have with the government having less ability to negotiate prices. price inflation would be even worse."

A free market would be one with only a private sector. The public sector is violence; the private sector is the victim. The government doesn't negotiate prices because it has no reason to. People negotiate prices because this is naturally what happens in voluntary exchanges.

[Edited on October 31, 2012 at 3:08 PM. Reason : ]

10/31/2012 3:06:16 PM

Quote :

"free market police departments? YES free market judicial system? YES free market fire fighting? YES"

Do you get charged uber-huge sums of money when

- you get arrested
- you are taken to court (unless you lose of course)
- the fire department puts out a fire at your house
?

There are two separate conversations going on here:
a. government RUNNING health care
b. socialized health care

We have socialized police departments. We do not have socialized health care. Nor are you arguing for socialized health care.

You pay for health care with your insurance premiums, specific taxes on your paycheck, and when you go to the doctor. No one seems to be in favor of merging these with the general government balance sheet.

10/31/2012 3:10:52 PM

Quote :

"Video you should watch. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RWsx1X8PV_A"

that video said absolutely nothing.

10/31/2012 3:19:37 PM

Quote :

"A free market would be one with only a private sector."

so you agree with what i said. privatization is not a free market, privatization is what we have now. what we have now is not a free market and what is proposed by Romney/Ryan is not a free market.

10/31/2012 3:19:57 PM

ironically ^ is kind of like socialism

10/31/2012 3:25:13 PM

basically "you know who else gave out vouchers? communists."

10/31/2012 3:27:28 PM

Romney created a $10 fee for a “Certificate of Blindness” issued by the Massachusetts Commission for the Blind. [Source: 2003 Massachusetts Budget]

Increased the fee for a mammography facility x-ray machine license from $100 to $300. [Source: 2003 MA regulations]

10/31/2012 3:27:50 PM

correct dtown, once the govt starting getting involved it has become less of a free market.

^if you support big govt, you gotta find ways to pay for it right. (well at a state level)

[Edited on October 31, 2012 at 3:29 PM. Reason : .]

10/31/2012 3:28:15 PM

so instead of the Romney/Ryan communist privatization voucher plan, or the current ACA shovel money to private companies privatization plan, we need actual government healthcare in addition to run parallel to private industry.

10/31/2012 3:34:08 PM

Quote :

"we need actual government healthcare in addition to run parallel to private industry."

When the bill was under discussion I was crossing my fingers for the public option. I think it's a very good idea. I was also crossing my fingers that the individual mandate wouldn't pass.

...

I'm fucking bitter

10/31/2012 3:45:16 PM

Quote :

"so instead of the Romney/Ryan communist privatization voucher plan, or the current ACA shovel money to private companies privatization plan, we need actual government healthcare in addition to run parallel to private industry."

The Romney voucher plan is a change for medicare only. It is at least a move back to where we need to go. Getting the consumer more involved with thier health care.

The ACA is forcing everyone to buy a private product (that can afford to, whatever that means), giving it to others, and taxing most people. The worst parts of it set limits to what insurance companies can charge between its most expensive and its least expensive. So if you are healthy and buy your own insurance it will have to go up, a lot.

Less govt intervention is needed. It is the best way to reduce costs while still advancing health care. imo

10/31/2012 4:13:46 PM

ACA and nothing being proposed is less government intervention.

Having actual government healthcare would be complete no government intervention in private industry.

10/31/2012 4:22:17 PM

10/31/2012 4:29:35 PM

Jesus christ, stop posting videos. no one watches them or cares.

10/31/2012 4:35:44 PM

Quote :

"Having actual government healthcare would be complete no government intervention in private industry. "

lol, where does the funding come from?

10/31/2012 4:36:11 PM

taxes and other federal revenue sources

[Edited on October 31, 2012 at 4:46 PM. Reason : services=sources]

10/31/2012 4:45:50 PM

Quote :

"The worst parts of it set limits to what insurance companies can charge between its most expensive and its least expensive. So if you are healthy and buy your own insurance it will have to go up, a lot."

I think this is frankly absurd. I'm not fundamentally opposed to younger workers paying for health care of older workers... but not like this.

If I'm paying more than what the market value of my insurance should be, then I should be accumulating capital for later in my life. But that's not happening here. You have to pay more, and there's no guarantee that the same system will be in place when you're older. It's like your social security account... only less certain.

If they get rid of the system, they should owe the people who paid more while it was in place. After all, they will get old too.

10/31/2012 4:46:07 PM

10/31/2012 4:47:55 PM

just stop, no one will watch that

10/31/2012 4:49:20 PM

Look at you saying stop.

10/31/2012 4:50:03 PM

10/31/2012 4:56:36 PM

No, do it like this:

10/31/2012 5:20:05 PM

yo holmes to Bel-Air!

10/31/2012 6:22:29 PM

Quote :

"no more than everything else...we might disagree, but the vast majority of our government-given and government-protected rights rely heavily on semantics to define their limits (and these same semantics are argued and debated by the judicial branch with great regularity)...to write off an opposing view as "semantics" is to say that you disagree but are too lazy to defend your view and too unwilling to consider another"

not really. I'm saying that I agree with your overall point, just not with the terminology that you used. semantics.

10/31/2012 11:44:43 PM

Y'all Soap Boxers posting in a Chit Chat thread.

11/1/2012 1:50:28 PM

Y'all Soap Boxers posting in a BlackJesus Chit Chat thread.

11/1/2012 1:58:53 PM

11/1/2012 2:32:20 PM

lol @ #5.

11/1/2012 2:38:39 PM

i'm sincerely beginning to suspect that mitt romney is, in fact, a robot.

i mean, it wouldn't be the first time...

11/1/2012 2:41:17 PM

Quote :

"The rich should contribute to the public expense, not only in proportion to their revenue, but something more than in that proportion."

-Adam Smith

11/1/2012 4:39:28 PM

Like paying artists to write poetry? Might have worked 350 years ago.

Im krallum and i approved this message

11/1/2012 4:42:22 PM

i can think of other expenses...

11/1/2012 4:43:32 PM

If anyone thinks Romney is going to win when there is a 34 page thread of everyone, except for eaton bush, who hates him, is out of touch with reality.

If by the slight chance that Romney does win, you can pretty much guarantee that he didn't win because "the people" wanted him to win.

11/1/2012 5:00:40 PM

So you're saying that tww is microcosm of the country, and since only eaton bush like romney, he's gonna lose?

11/1/2012 5:02:50 PM

i mean, come on, it's not like his son owns a company that makes voting machines used in ohio...

i mean, it is exactly like that.

11/1/2012 5:04:54 PM

Are you saying that CBS can call an election for Gingrich with only 1% of the data coming in that places him in 2nd place, yet declare Gingrich the winner based on their own "exit polling" that consisted of a mere 2300 people out of 600,000?





Start at 1:00 mark

11/1/2012 5:05:28 PM

Are you saying that CBS can dog purple alien?

11/1/2012 5:52:44 PM

Trollbait taken and eaten. Please try again.

11/1/2012 5:55:17 PM

Why even vote? The elections are already determined.


Americans are so stupid to reelect people they don't approve?

11/1/2012 7:48:31 PM

11/1/2012 8:49:16 PM

Then who was phone? WHO WAS PHONE?

11/1/2012 8:49:35 PM

Quote :

"Mitt Romney had basically one laugh line in his speech... "President Obama promised to begin to slow the rise of the oceans and heal the planet. [Pause. Laughter.] MY promise … is to help you and your family.""

http://www.salon.com/2012/08/31/mitt_romney_makes_funny_joke_about_how_tampa_will_be_under_water_in_a_century/

11/1/2012 11:52:12 PM

^

11/2/2012 12:15:56 AM

he hates medical marijuana patients (See pg 1)

11/2/2012 12:44:19 AM

11/2/2012 6:48:15 AM

11/2/2012 8:34:24 AM