Page 4

^ha, some guy on Fox was saying that if the man died, Cheney could face criminally neglegent homicide charges.

Quote :

"the guy's alive. the birds aren't, and they are hunted en masse for no explainable reason. it's not even sportsmanlike "

I'm sure those birds that were saved by Whittington's face survived.

[Edited on February 14, 2006 at 2:34 PM. Reason : 4]

2/14/2006 2:33:36 PM

that would be unreal

2/14/2006 2:34:58 PM

^^ that's highly doubtful. even the victim and his wife have admitted that fault lies with the victim.

you can dispute that personally, but good luck getting a jury to buy it

2/14/2006 2:36:24 PM

just saying what the guy said on tv.

2/14/2006 2:37:44 PM

its technically true, he "could" face charges.

but would he? no.

2/14/2006 2:38:53 PM

Quote :

"even the victim and his wife have admitted that fault lies with the victim."

she wont be so keen on the cover story if her husband dies

2/14/2006 2:40:43 PM

well she's already gone on record, so... tough shit

2/14/2006 2:42:56 PM

Quote :

"you can dispute that personally"

Sure. Or you could use the record, which unequivocally puts the blame on Cheney (Section VII of the report, if you care for fact-checking).

Quote :

"well she's already gone on record, so... tough shit"

Funny you should mention that. She's the only witness mentioned in the Texas Parks & Wildlife report on the incident cited above...which wholly blames Cheney.

---

From Atrios' things we've learned from this incident by listening to Republicans:

Quote :

" - Every conservative on the internet is an avid hunter and they've all been shot multiple times. - Shotguns aren't really guns, just toys. You can't really hurt people with them, only animals. - It's standard hunter etiquette to yell and scream at your fellow hunters as they're stalking their prey. - The most dangerous place to be is behind the people with the guns."

[Edited on February 14, 2006 at 2:55 PM. Reason : ...]

2/14/2006 2:45:09 PM

1. outing a secret agent
2. involuntary manslaughter
3. ______________

Three strikes and you're in federal pound me in the ass prison.

2/14/2006 2:59:35 PM

hahahah gamecat, I was so about to post that list from atrios

2/14/2006 3:15:59 PM

1. outing a secret agent
2. involuntary manslaughter
3. saying "go fuck yousef" on the senate floor
4. making up WMD
5. ______________

2/14/2006 3:18:21 PM

1. outing a secret agent
2. involuntary manslaughter
3. saying "go fuck yousef" on the senate floor
4. making up WMD
5. convening secret energy task force
6. ______________

2/14/2006 3:38:01 PM

1. outing a secret agent
2. involuntary manslaughter
3. saying "go fuck yousef" on the senate floor
4. making up WMD
5. convening secret energy task force
6. being more machine than man
7. ______________

2/14/2006 3:50:39 PM

and this took place in texas

and you know what they do to killers in texas

2/14/2006 3:52:43 PM

This reminds me of the Family Guy where the tobacco exec says "We're not really bad guys" then grabs a shotgun, yells "pull", and someone throws a puppy in the air for him to shoot.

Just because its Dick Cheney.

2/14/2006 4:06:00 PM

2/14/2006 6:43:43 PM

You know what would be just about the funniest thing a VP staffer could do?

Show up to work tomorrow wearing all bright orange.

2/14/2006 8:13:36 PM

Dick Cheney doesn't kill people, dangerous minorities do.

2/14/2006 9:39:50 PM

BOOM, HEADSHOT

2/14/2006 9:52:01 PM

It's a good thing he's never going to run for president.



[Edited on February 15, 2006 at 4:06 AM. Reason : priceless]

2/15/2006 3:56:21 AM

yawn.

2/15/2006 4:48:22 AM

YAWN!!!!!!!!!

THIS IS NO BIG DEAL

2/15/2006 6:37:04 AM

When first posted, NBC news quoted Katharine Armstrong as saying:

"There may be a beer or two in there," she said, "but remember not everyone in the party was shooting.".


heh.

[Edited on February 15, 2006 at 8:46 AM. Reason : l]

2/15/2006 8:44:49 AM

interview w/ dick on faux news at 6pm today.

2/15/2006 12:48:44 PM

Dear Sen. Specter,

Deputy Leader Cheney is in trouble for shooting an old man with a shotgun. Questions are being raised because his excuses don't fit the facts of the case. As the inventor of the Warren Commission's Magic Bullet Theory, you're the only person who can help him build a scenario where his excuses make sense.

The police report says that Whittington was 30 yards away when Dick shot him. It also notes that the elderly gentleman was hit in the face, chest and neck. Agents of the Ministry of Truth characterize the shooting as a "peppering." Taken all together, these things would suggest that the shot was fairly well dispersed.

Unfortunately, a more detailed look at the facts reveals something else. Our Deputy Leader was using 28 gauge shotgun shells loaded with 3/4 oz of #7-1/2 shot. That particular load carries approximately 262 BBs. The doctor caring for the wounded man said that he removed about 200 BBs. That means about 4/5ths of the shot in the load struck the man in an area no larger than about 18 inches in diameter.

That seems like an awfully tight pattern at 30 yards. It can only be explained by the existence of a magic BB that would ride herd on the other BBs, keeping them as bunched up as possible.



Yesterday, we learned that one of the BBs penetrated the elderly gentleman's hunting vest, shirt, skin, muscle, rib cartilage, and possibly bone, coming to rest in his heart. I'm no physicist, but that seems like a lot of energy to expend for a .095" BB weighing 1/345th of an ounce. I suggest that a better explanation would be that once the bb hit the skin, it began burrowing into the elderly gentleman's body. Since regular shot doesn't have claws for burrowing, a magic BB is the only possible explanation.



Well, that's all I have right now, but it's a start. You're the expert when it comes to mystical projectiles, so I'll let you take it from here.

Heterosexually yours,

Gen. JC Christian patriot
http://patriotboy.blogspot.com/2006_02_12_patriotboy_archive.html#113998442413821344

[Edited on February 15, 2006 at 2:12 PM. Reason : k]

2/15/2006 2:12:16 PM

^^ What the deuce is a "tight hole operation"?

2/15/2006 2:35:53 PM

hehe - Hunting Crashers
http://onegoodmove.org/1gm/1gmarchive/2006/02/hunting_crasher.html

2/15/2006 4:10:40 PM

Quote :

" That seems like an awfully tight pattern at 30 yards. "

ditto

2/15/2006 4:45:51 PM

http://www.cnn.com/2006/POLITICS/02/15/cheney/index.html

Quote :

"Cheney: 'It's a day I'll never forget' Vice president talks publicly about hunting accident WASHINGTON (CNN) -- Four days after shooting and wounding a friend during a hunting trip, Vice President Dick Cheney publicly addressed the incident for the first time Wednesday in an interview with a cable network. "Ultimately, I'm the guy who pulled the trigger that fired the round that hit Harry [Whittington]," Cheney said in an interview with Fox News, adding that Saturday was "one of the worst days of my life." "You can talk about all of the other conditions that existed at the time, but that's the bottom line. (Watch why secrecy has been Cheney's modus operandi -- 1:43) "It was not Harry's fault. You can't blame anybody else. I'm the guy who pulled the trigger and shot my friend. It's a day I'll never forget." The vice president said he ran over to the 78-year-old Whittington, who was bleeding, and Cheney's own medical team -- which always travels with him -- administered first aid. "I said, 'Harry, I had no idea you were there,'" Cheney recounted. "He didn't respond." The vice president added, "The image of him falling is something I'll never be able to get out of my mind. I fired and there's Harry falling." After the shooting, ranch owner Katharine Armstrong had told reporters that Whittington had just shot a quail and dropped back to retrieve it. He was hit upon rejoining the group and "apparently came up unannounced" as Cheney prepared to fire. Cheney stood by his decision not to tell the national media directly of the incident, instead allowing Armstrong to tell a Corpus Christi newspaper about the shooting the next morning. (Timeline) "I thought that made good sense because you can get as accurate a story as possible from somebody who knew and understood hunting, and then it would immediately go up to the wires and be posted on the Web site, which is the way it went out," Cheney said. "And I thought that was the right call." Since the first day, many of President Bush's aides, according to senior officials, thought the vice president did not handle the situation correctly. That frustration mounted, and in private conversations Bush aides had become more open about saying they were trying to find a way to persuade the vice president to speak out, rather than letting the issue linger. Cheney's office did not disclose the matter until Sunday afternoon, prompting an outcry from the media and some politicians on why it took so long for the incident to be made public. Several Cheney associates, old friends and staffers have also expressed frustration and concern over the way information about the incident has been managed, but most say they are not surprised because it is Cheney's standard method of operation. The situation has been worsened, some said, by the fact that Steve Schmidt, who was Cheney's senior counselor and was in charge of media strategy, left last week to manage California Gov. Arnold Schwarz's election campaign. Meanwhile, Whittington, a lawyer from Austin, was in a Corpus Christi hospital recovering from a minor heart attack he suffered Tuesday after one of the pieces of birdshot that hit him lodged in or near his heart, his doctors said Wednesday. Armstrong told CNN she had talked to Whittington on Wednesday and he is "up and walking around." Cheney said he drank a beer with lunch the day of the shooting, according to his interview. The shooting took place about 5:50 p.m. Armstrong had previously told CNN that she never saw Cheney or Whittington "drink at all on the day of the shooting until after the accident occurred, when the vice president fixed himself a cocktail back at the house." Lee Anne McBride of Cheney's office referred CNN to a statement from the Kenedy County Sheriff's Office Monday, which said that the investigation "reveals that there was no alcohol or misconduct involved in the incident." A state game warden gave Cheney a warning for hunting without a required stamp on his license, for which the vice president's office later submitted payment. Whittington 'sitting up' Peter Banko, a spokesman for Christus Spohn Memorial Hospital, told reporters Wednesday that Whittington is doing well after the heart attack. He is "sitting up in a chair, eating regular food and actually plans on doing some of his attorney work in his room today," Banko said. He said Whittington will probably stay in the hospital another six days, and explained that he is still in the facility's intensive care unit for "personal privacy reasons." Dr. David Blanchard, the hospital's emergency room chief, explained Tuesday that Whittington had suffered an "asymptomatic" heart attack without typical signs such as chest pains or breathing difficulty. Blanchard said a 5 mm pellet had "migrated" to become lodged in or alongside Whittington's heart muscle, irritating the tissue and causing the organ's upper two chambers to beat irregularly. The doctor said Wednesday he believes the shot will stay where it is. "We're 100 percent satisfied that where the BB is; it will remain," he said. Banko said he had spoken with Whittington about the uproar surrounding the incident, and his reaction was that it was "much ado about nothing." The vice president's office said Cheney called Whittington on Tuesday afternoon to offer his "thoughts and prayers." Whittington is a longtime activist in state Republican politics. (Whittington profile) Blanchard estimated earlier this week that the number of shot pellets Whittington had been hit by at more than 10 but fewer than 150 or 200 -- the number of pellets that are usually in one shot. Monday, he had said most of the wounds were "superficial at best." CNN's Dana Bash, Suzanne Malveaux and Tim McCaughan contributed to this report."

Basically, Cheney completely accepted responsibility, admitted to drinking one beer about 6 hours prior to the incident (i.e. no effect on incident), and the guy is recovering well and expected to be fine. All in all, not a bad handling of an awful situation.

2/15/2006 5:20:33 PM

admitted to drinking?

2/15/2006 6:14:30 PM

Cheney's slipping. First it was the old dude's fault for jumping in front of the shotgun. Next it's Cheney's fault for pulling the trigger. Now he's fessing up to (one) beer.

There's no fucking way that a 28 guage load is not going to spread more at "30 yards". I give it 35 feet at the most to still have enough energy to cause that kind of damage and stay within 6" or so.

Somebody's going to roll on him being shitfaced. He's gone within a month.

2/15/2006 8:21:46 PM

that would be awesome, but i don't really see it happening

Quote :

"Banko said he had spoken with Whittington about the uproar surrounding the incident, and his reaction was that it was "much ado about nothing.""

if the victim himself understands it was an accident, then wtf - how can this issue possibly gain enough traction to force cheney out of office

[Edited on February 15, 2006 at 9:14 PM. Reason : s]

2/15/2006 9:12:22 PM

Quote :

"That seems like an awfully tight pattern at 30 yards."

You guys havn't shot bird-shot recently, have you? The spread is very small compared to what you are evidently expecting. Out of my 20 gauge at a good 15 yards the spread is a little over five inches. When you are shooting at a bird potentially 50 to 70 yards away you want to hit it with more than just one pellet.

2/15/2006 9:41:27 PM

^ your opinion doesn't count because you don't hate Bush. Anyway, from what I've heard on the radio and seen on my free TV ( I don't have the benefit of the fascinating 24 hour news networks) it seems like Cheney's main sin was not sucking up to the media immediately after the incident. I say more power to him, as long as the MSM are going to treat the administration like garbage they ought not get what they want. Stupid media garbage, it was a hunting accident. Get over it already.

2/16/2006 12:10:26 AM

.

[Edited on February 16, 2006 at 12:27 AM. Reason : .]

2/16/2006 12:27:17 AM

kinda stupid, but funny:

http://dickcheneyquailhunt.cf.huffingtonpost.com/

2/16/2006 12:37:38 AM

Quote :

"You guys havn't shot bird-shot recently, have you? "

personally, I know nothing about it, but an avid hunter friend told me before I even saw this that there was no way he was 30 yards away when he shot the guy, THEN i saw these details.

magic pellet.

2/16/2006 8:28:10 AM

So the future of the Democratic Party hinges on this non-issue?

2/16/2006 9:12:17 AM

no, but nice strawman.

and it seriously isn't a nonissue, much as you'd like it to be. if the vp shot a man, and it was an accident, and that's the end of the story, then I don't really care. If the vp shot a man, and we're being lied to about the details, then I care. Being lied to by your government is NEVER a non-issue, no matter how often it happens.

2/16/2006 9:32:04 AM

DirtyGreek, where were ya when Clinton lied about his hummer in the Oval Office on national television?

The guy was accidently shot with FUCKING BIRD SHOT. The pellets are the size of a lead piece from the tip of a pencil. The only way anyone could do serious damage with bird shot is if Cheney shot the guy at point blank range.

This is the biggest non-issue of all time. The fact that some are obsessed with the story reveals a true sense of pettiness and real hatred for no other reason than the fact that the VP is involved.

2/16/2006 9:41:49 AM

Where was this media attention when Ted Kennedy walked away from an accident that killed a woman and didn't call ANYONE until the next day???

Where was this media attention when a Clinton White House staffer committed suicide and the FBI was denied entry to the residence to investigate until Clinton aides had gone through and removed documents.

Where was this media attention when Sandy Burger walked into the National Archives and stuffed papers down his pants, walked out with them, and shredded them at home.

Where was it?????? IN THE LEFT's BACK POCKET! WANT TO TALK ABOUT BEING LIED TO.... We were really lied to for 8 years between '92 and 2000. We are lied to any time a Democrat politician opens their mouth.

"Would you rather go hunting with Cheney, or riding in a car with Ted Kennedy?"

2/16/2006 10:03:32 AM

neither, if I can avoid them. I don't like kennedy either.

Quote :

"DirtyGreek, where were ya when Clinton lied about his hummer in the Oval Office on national television?"

High school, not caring about politics. Trust me, had I been into politics, I would have been all over him when I found out he lied. Again, you're confusing me for a partisan democrat of some sort. I am not that. You people are so black-and-white that you think everyone else is like that, too. It just isn't the case. When the government lies (which yes, both parties have always done), It pisses me off. It just so happens that the government lying to us right now is conservative.

Quote :

"The guy was accidently shot with FUCKING BIRD SHOT. The pellets are the size of a lead piece from the tip of a pencil. The only way anyone could do serious damage with bird shot is if Cheney shot the guy at point blank range."

the man has been in ICU the entire time and has suffered a mild heart attack. you don't consider this serious damage?

[Edited on February 16, 2006 at 10:06 AM. Reason : .]

2/16/2006 10:04:54 AM

Quote :

"DirtyGreek, where were ya when Clinton lied about his hummer in the Oval Office on national television?"

nice red herring

Quote :

"The guy was accidently shot with FUCKING BIRD SHOT. The pellets are the size of a lead piece from the tip of a pencil. The only way anyone could do serious damage with bird shot is if Cheney shot the guy at point blank range."

and the guy did have some serious damage, so it should kinda make you wonder about the story he told the press

2/16/2006 11:17:29 AM

i mean, one pellet went INTO HIS HEART. the doctors said it was unlikely that it traveled through the bloodstream to get there.

2/16/2006 11:19:14 AM

THROUGH A SHIRT AND VEST

IT DOESN'T ADD UP JERRY

2/16/2006 11:20:15 AM

I think this bears repeating:

Quote :

"Where was this media attention when Ted Kennedy walked away from an accident that killed a woman and didn't call ANYONE until the next day??? Where was this media attention when a Clinton White House staffer committed suicide and the FBI was denied entry to the residence to investigate until Clinton aides had gone through and removed documents. Where was this media attention when Sandy Burger walked into the National Archives and stuffed papers down his pants, walked out with them, and shredded them at home. Where was it?????? IN THE LEFT's BACK POCKET! WANT TO TALK ABOUT BEING LIED TO.... We were really lied to for 8 years between '92 and 2000. We are lied to any time a Democrat politician opens their mouth. "

2/16/2006 11:28:12 AM

i dont think it does, all of those things did spawn a lot of outrage and did get attention

2/16/2006 11:32:38 AM

just so yall know, the magic bullet of the keneddy thing has been disproven

2/16/2006 12:04:06 PM

Quote :

"i dont think it does, all of those things did spawn a lot of outrage and did get attention"

Quote :

"i dont think it does, all of those things did spawn a lot of outrage and did get attention"

Quote :

"i dont think it does, all of those things did spawn a lot of outrage and did get attention"

Quote :

"i dont think it does, all of those things did spawn a lot of outrage and did get attention"

Quote :

"i dont think it does, all of those things did spawn a lot of outrage and did get attention"

BUT WHAT IS IMPORTANT NOW IS THAT THEY GET ATTENTION NOW, 1 TO 4 DECADES AFTER THE FACT

[Edited on February 16, 2006 at 12:18 PM. Reason : .]

2/16/2006 12:17:23 PM

and its kinda hard to look at things from before the takeoff of 24hr news and the internet to see how fast information was released

2/16/2006 12:46:50 PM