Quote :

"Lucky1 I am trying to think of a list of things that I have been given.... I went to public school and I drive on roads ( but I pay taxes for that), maybe once a years I will stop to piss at a rest stop funded by state or federal govornment. I am baffled by the idea that the govornment has given me anything. Please to enlighten me. 10/12/2013 9:53:25 AM "

Is this a joke?

Visit pretty much any other country, or even read about any other country, or just think deeply about American history and it's obvious how every facet of your life is shaped deeply by our government.

You're reading this even on a computer over the Internet, both technologies whose development initially and still are heavily reliant on tax dollars funneled through government channels.

It's hilarious that you think you pay for the roads you drive on. Even the tax dollars of an upper middle class person collected for their entire life wouldn't cover the costs to build and maintain the roads they drive on.

10/13/2013 12:07:28 PM

I pay for the roads I drive on and I know exactly how much.

10/13/2013 12:16:21 PM

Airports in the middle of nowhere.
Aviation tech.
Gasoline subsidies.
Nylon.
Velcro.
Mail service in BFE.
National parks.

10/13/2013 12:27:50 PM

Quote :

"slaves were expensive to purchase, and only the wealthiest members of society owned slaves. to act like all white people benefitted from slavery is nothing short of ignorant."

To act like the free (or just about free) labour of blacks in the US ended immediately after the passage of the 13th Amendment is nothing short of ignorant.

come on, I'm aaron-fucking-burro and even I recognize this fact

[Edited on October 13, 2013 at 4:28 PM. Reason : ]

10/13/2013 4:27:51 PM

are you trying to say that blacks were indentured servants to all white people after the civil war? or are you just rambling because your original statement was incorrect and you won't admit it?

10/13/2013 4:42:21 PM

why the fuck is this thread about slavery?

jesus christ, I'm so looking forward to getting my subsidized health insurance
and I hope the subsidies come out of the paychecks of YOU PEOPLE

10/13/2013 5:37:58 PM

I don't know anyone who has lowered their premiums. My little brother is 27 years old and is healthy. His premiums went from $150/month to $360/month. Thanks Obama, but you can keep the change.

How is it that when everyone is mandated to have health insurance coverage, hospitals are laying off staff in by the hundreds/thousands?

10/13/2013 5:46:19 PM

my sister will be paying half of what she was and my uncle will be paying nothing out of pocket

10/13/2013 5:47:43 PM

Quote :

"are you trying to say that blacks were indentured servants to all white people after the civil war? or are you just rambling because your original statement was incorrect and you won't admit it?"

I'm saying that blacks continued to work for damned near nothing, even after slavery ended, and the rest of country benefited from that, including white people. I didn't think this was a controversial statement to make...

10/13/2013 6:55:52 PM

^^ give us the details of your uncle and sisters lives to better enlighten us.i also know of no one that is saving money.

10/13/2013 7:26:55 PM

because they are receiving subsidies

i've explained this to you multiple times. i'm sorry that you are still having trouble understanding, but i'm not sure how else to explain it to you. not everyone is in the same position as you or I, different people make different amounts of money and have different insurance coverage options.

10/13/2013 7:29:15 PM

Have them send me a thank you note every month

10/13/2013 7:43:15 PM

will that make you stop bitching? because send me your address and they would probably be happy to.

10/13/2013 7:44:54 PM

Quote :

"I'm saying that blacks continued to work for damned near nothing, even after slavery ended, and the rest of country benefited from that, including white people. I didn't think this was a controversial statement to make... "

so I guess you think all white people are still benefitting from Mexicans coming to this country and displacing our labor forces.

10/13/2013 7:52:22 PM

I doubt it.

10/13/2013 7:52:49 PM

[Edited on October 13, 2013 at 7:57 PM. Reason : .]

10/13/2013 7:57:45 PM

10/13/2013 8:06:42 PM

you should stick to posting images from the Ted Cruz for president fan club page

10/13/2013 8:07:38 PM

Quote :

"so I guess you think all white people are still benefitting from Mexicans coming to this country and displacing our labor forces."

We're definitely benefiting from them coming here and working for $2/hr picking our crops...

10/14/2013 12:06:50 AM

and that offsets them taking our construction jobs too?

[Edited on October 14, 2013 at 9:04 AM. Reason : go spew that babble near a Perdue packaging plant and see if you don't get shot.]

10/14/2013 9:02:35 AM

they didn't take anyone's construction jobs, the economy and monetary policies did that

10/14/2013 9:10:44 AM

you mean immigration policies and lack of border control?

10/14/2013 9:24:58 AM

have you ever heard of something called the housing bubble or the economic "downturn", that's what stole construction jobs.

10/14/2013 9:26:21 AM

a downturn in construction is not responsible for a demographic shift that occurred BEFORE the housing bubble burst.

10/14/2013 9:37:17 AM

they filled a labor shortage, the demographic shifted on its own thanks to a strong economy at the time

(and are you saying that you hate free-market capitalism. what you are you, some kind of nationalist nazi?)

[Edited on October 14, 2013 at 9:41 AM. Reason : you know, since the number of jobs was increasing at that time]

10/14/2013 9:41:34 AM

Quote :

"I don't know anyone who has lowered their premiums."

my employer-sponsored health coverage went from ~$22/month to ~$64/month...but they now offer a $50 "wellness credit" or something similar, so it will be down to ~$14/month? i think i'll qualify as i'm only about 20lbs over my "ideal" weight, but i exercise regularly and don't smoke

in short, i suppose my premiums have gone up, but there are now incentives that reduce them so much as to make them less...i assume that they were going to implement that independent of the ACA, though

10/14/2013 9:57:11 AM

^
i have the wellness program thing also

but if they ever implement this: http://greatist.com/health/wme-health-and-wellness-tracker

i'm paying the extra $40. fuck that shit

10/14/2013 10:00:02 AM

^ hah, agreed...i realize folks could lie outright in the wellness assessment, but then if they made a claim and it was discovered they'd lied, i assume it would qualify for a breach of contract (or whatever) and the insurance wouldn't be required to cover your expenses...might as well pony up the extra $50/month if you're in good shape

in theory, a more precise health tracker is a great idea (and i'd totally use it for personal information that isn't shared with the insurance company), but heck if i'm going to give the insurance company that info...i have no doubt they'd use it to screw people constantly

[Edited on October 14, 2013 at 10:06 AM. Reason : .]

10/14/2013 10:06:32 AM

cool. still can't log in. was going to see what conventry had to offer, since their website doesn't display plans for me... guess I won't... BCBS it is.

10/14/2013 12:59:14 PM

i thought coventry backed out

10/14/2013 1:01:59 PM

since when? I thought it was only them and BCBS left.

10/14/2013 1:06:31 PM

nevermind, you're right

10/14/2013 1:07:36 PM

<--- would like to back out

10/14/2013 1:26:21 PM

i thought you already decided to

you're allowed to

10/14/2013 1:26:48 PM

I'm allowed but will be fined. Makes sense

10/14/2013 1:29:46 PM

taxed

10/14/2013 1:30:41 PM

so why are catastrophic plans not considered HDHPs? Because that's exactly what they are.

10/14/2013 2:15:26 PM

derp.

[Edited on October 14, 2013 at 2:30 PM. Reason : sdfsdf]

10/14/2013 2:17:03 PM

doesn't make sense, as there are still HDHPs available...

10/14/2013 2:18:13 PM

Hold on, nevermind, I misread your questions.

Yeah, I have no idea.

10/14/2013 2:29:51 PM

Keep a statement for the death panels in your living will so you can beg for your life (if unable to in person) when they are deciding whether you live or die.

10/14/2013 3:21:29 PM

Quote :

"they filled a labor shortage, the demographic shifted on its own thanks to a strong economy at the time (and are you saying that you hate free-market capitalism. what you are you, some kind of nationalist nazi?)"

I will volunteer to be the economics nazi, since I'm seeing hate toward the "free market" Republicans.

There is no such thing as a permanent shortage in a free market. There is a supply curve, a demand curve, and the market price. If the demand goes up due to a bubble, that increases price. There was no "labor shortage" that immigrants filled. Only consumers eating salads, complaining that vegetable prices are too damn high.

10/14/2013 4:44:41 PM

Quote :

"My little brother is 27 years old and is healthy. His premiums went from $150/month to $360/month."

feature, not a bug

10/14/2013 8:15:58 PM

Who the fuck pays $150 for insurance that isn't awful?

Seriously what did $150 get him?

I pay $184 a month and get one doctor visit a year and they cover some minor stuff. If something serious happens I'm fucked.

10/14/2013 8:25:49 PM

^^^there was a labor shortage, there were not enough laborers. It doesn't matter that this is not true permanently, we are talking about a discreet period of time.
If the economy hadn't collapsed more people would have moved into the segment like you said, but that doesn't make a difference for the 5 or 10 year period we are talking about. Labor couldn't move into the segment quickly enough

free markets require free borders so that labor can move, labor should be able to move easier than capital.

[Edited on October 14, 2013 at 8:26 PM. Reason : .]

10/14/2013 8:26:03 PM

I pay $145/month right now and it's pretty good insurance for a HDHP. I've had to pay very little for my few doctor visits and prescriptions this year. And my ER visit last year was somehow mostly covered as well.

ended up having to create a new account for healthcare.gov and it finally worked. conventry plans were certainly no better than BCBS.

[Edited on October 15, 2013 at 12:47 PM. Reason : .]

10/15/2013 12:46:30 PM

Quote :

"It doesn't matter that this is not true permanently, we are talking about a discreet period of time. If the economy hadn't collapsed more people would have moved into the segment like you said, but that doesn't make a difference for the 5 or 10 year period we are talking about. Labor couldn't move into the segment quickly enough free markets require free borders so that labor can move, labor should be able to move easier than capital."

For construction in the housing boom, the capital investment rate went up.

Labor should be able to respond quickly, sure, particularly low-wage labor (which we are). If you have a low-wage job, then you snipe people working other low-wage jobs. It's not hard. They're not making much, just offer them slightly more.

But with construction I think that people lament that they need good quality low-wage labor. Not everyone will last working those jobs. But if we're talking about high quality low-wage labor... why are they still low wage?

10/17/2013 10:05:22 AM

skilled construction labor is not low-wage

[Edited on October 17, 2013 at 10:07 AM. Reason : .]

10/17/2013 10:07:19 AM

it took me a little bit, but I got this thread off-fucking-track, damnit!

[Edited on October 17, 2013 at 10:24 PM. Reason : heh]

10/17/2013 10:23:40 PM

This is a cartoon by Jen Sorensen defending Obamacare shortly before the Supreme Court ruled on the constitutionality of the mandate: http://www.kaiserhealthnews.org/Cartoons/2012/June/Open-Letter-To-Supreme-Court-Cartoon.aspx

This is her follow-up, about what it was like to actually sign up on the exchange and the underhanded tactics of her and her husband's old ensurers to try to get them to think worse of the PPACA than they should: http://www.liberalamerica.org/2014/04/05/a-freelancer-in-texas-shares-her-experience-with-obamacare-comic/

4/6/2014 6:23:46 AM