I was going to say, I don't really recall the "media" calling this a hate crime. I have seen them quote citizens who are saying that it's one. Of course, I haven't looked at all the "media" stories about it, i'm sure some of them are saying that.

2/13/2015 11:06:27 AM

Here's your media that exploits the hate crime aspect, but it goes without saying...

http://www.msnbc.com/msnbc/dad-north-carolina-muslim-shooting-victims-hate-crime

2/13/2015 11:13:02 AM

Well, that's the media quoting the dad of the victim, (and yeah, blowing it up into a headline).

2/13/2015 11:16:32 AM

Quote :

"Dad of NC shooting victims: ‘Hate crime written all over it’"

2/13/2015 11:17:27 AM

I hate that news organization as much as I do Fox.

2/13/2015 11:33:16 AM

How can I not refer to it as the media, even if they are passing along quotes from someone else? Hell even the feds are going to look into the possibility that it is a hate crime.

2/13/2015 12:20:10 PM

Quote :

"Hell even the feds are going to look into the possibility that it is a hate crime."

You seriously can't complain about that. The authorities should always investigate all reasonable motives.

2/13/2015 12:23:35 PM

Because it's not the media that saying it's a hate crime, it's them just reporting and quoting the father of one of the victims.... but yeah, putting it in the headline is over-the-top sensationalizing

2/13/2015 12:25:07 PM

honestly i don't get the point of the debate on whether it's a hate crime or not in this case.

Even if it is a hate crime, he's truly a lone gunman, and there's no evidence of him being linked to a hate group.

He murdered three innocent people in cold blood, and he should either be executed or do life without parole. the hate crime label doesn't do anything more to serve justice here.

More importantly, it's going to be very difficult to prove beyond a reasonable doubt that anti-muslim sentiment was the primary motivator here. Conversely, 1st degree murder should be pretty straightforward to convict.

2/13/2015 1:34:23 PM

^true

But of course they'd investigate this as a hate crime. Just as I would think they'd do the same if the shooter was a muslim and the 3 victims were jews or hindus

2/13/2015 1:47:02 PM

Fucking radical atheists.

2/13/2015 1:51:51 PM

Quote :

"the hate crime label doesn't do anything more to serve justice here. "

does a crime being labeled as a hate crime mean more severe punishment? if not, what exactly does it serve in terms of justice? is it just a label, or does the judge have discretion to award a more severe punishment if the police classifies it as a hate crime?

(i am assuming there is an official "hate crime" classification in the police/justice system... there, is, right?)

2/13/2015 1:55:43 PM

Quote :

"honestly i don't get the point of the debate on whether it's a hate crime or not in this case. Even if it is a hate crime, he's truly a lone gunman, and there's no evidence of him being linked to a hate group. "

I agree. It's highly annoying. I just know that no one is going to change their minds. They don't trust cops, and they get off on these divisive situations and telling people they're wrong.

2/13/2015 1:56:48 PM

^^hate crimes are federal jurisdiction. The only thing it means is more of a chance he would be executed if convicted.

Otherwise, it's people trying to get leverage over the right-wingers is basically how I see it.

2/13/2015 1:58:47 PM

I'm all for due process of law, but in cases like this, can we just all agree to return the favor and put a bullet in his head?

There is zero argument to his innocence. He 100% did this. He's never going to be a free man again, he's never going to be rehabilitated.

Why waste hundreds of thousands of dollars prolonging the inevitable.

2/13/2015 2:16:46 PM

Arguments for crazy guy with mental issues:

1. Mid 40s (?), unemployed and going to community college, wife about to divorce him
2. History with parking anger/banned from calling tow company
3. Past altercations involving these people
4. They lived right beside him, making it easier to believe parking spaces could be shared in such a way

Arguments for hate crime:

1. They were practicing Muslims; he was white


Did I miss anything?

2/13/2015 2:23:15 PM

^ Yup

2/13/2015 2:34:14 PM

why exactly does it matter why he killed them?

2/13/2015 2:36:53 PM

You're saying I DID miss something? I kept all the hearsay stuff out; including that PR stunt his wife pulled. I wasn't being sarcastic when asking if I missed anything.

2/13/2015 2:44:11 PM

Death penalty if its a hate crime.

2/13/2015 2:44:21 PM

Quote :

"Arguments for crazy guy with mental issues: 1. Mid 40s (?), unemployed and going to community college, wife about to divorce him 2. History with parking anger/banned from calling tow company 3. Past altercations involving these people 4. They lived right beside him, making it easier to believe parking spaces could be shared in such a way"

when a white person kills someone we explain it away by saying they obviously had mental problems, but when a black person or muslim does something we never blame it on mental illness

2/13/2015 2:50:44 PM

Maria ?@MariaAliaa Feb 11
This is absolutely disgusting and honestly makes me so scared. #ChapelHillShooting

2/13/2015 2:51:18 PM

Quote :

"Arguments for hate crime: 1. They were practicing Muslims; he was white Did I miss anything?"

Yes, he was a vocal basher of religions on social media.

2/13/2015 2:54:29 PM

Quote :

"but when a black person or muslim does something we never blame it on mental illness"

We also never call it a hate crime.

Obama has come out and said "No person should be targeted because of who they are"

Way to go Mr. Pres - speak out about an issue you no nothing about, before the investigation has really even started.

2/13/2015 2:55:43 PM

...but not specifically Islam from what I've read

[Edited on February 13, 2015 at 2:56 PM. Reason : ^^]

2/13/2015 2:55:54 PM

islam is a religion

2/13/2015 2:58:05 PM

Quote :

"Obama has come out and said "No person should be targeted because of who they are" Way to go Mr. Pres - speak out about an issue you no nothing about, before the investigation has really even started."

perfection.

2/13/2015 2:58:37 PM

http://fortressamerica.gawker.com/its-really-hard-to-stop-a-bad-guy-with-a-gun-license-1685457651

2/13/2015 2:59:50 PM

The investigation is barely what, 2 days old? Why is he talking about it? Stay out of it!!

2/13/2015 3:01:32 PM

Does that really bother you? It sounds like a non-combative truth that someone would say as a response to a question.

2/13/2015 3:03:53 PM

barely 2-days old and some of you are already sure that it was only about parking and race or religion had nothing to do with it

[Edited on February 13, 2015 at 3:06 PM. Reason : ^ fox news told him not to like it]

2/13/2015 3:05:43 PM

It sounds like somebody stoking a goddamned fire is what it sounds like.

Sure, nobody should be targeted because of who they are. That's a given. These folks were targeted because they had an unfortunate meeting with a crazy man with a gun.

2/13/2015 3:06:09 PM

No, that's fair. He was a vocal basher of religions on social media. However, if you put that in there, you have to put in the quip he posted saying he "prefers Muslims over Christians." I didn't really want to mention that, because it could be interpreted as one of those "I have black friends" remarks.

Anyway, this:

Quote :

"when a white person kills someone we explain it away by saying they obviously had mental problems, but when a black person or muslim does something we never blame it on mental illness"

I don't feel like that's true. Remember, this wasn't called terrorism.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2009_Fort_Hood_shooting#Possible_motives

2/13/2015 3:07:53 PM

Just wrong place, wrong time.

If they were armed maybe this unfortunate incident could have been prevented. They really should have been sitting in their house with an AR15 pointed at the door like real Americans.

2/13/2015 3:08:43 PM

^^that was called terrorism



[Edited on February 13, 2015 at 3:10 PM. Reason : it literally makes that point in the link you posted]

2/13/2015 3:09:11 PM

I am NOT a democrat but I find the rights fascination with labeling events and groups interesting to say the least..

2/13/2015 3:11:06 PM

"the Golden Rule is a pretty great way of going about life on a daily basis" -President Obama

"you don't no what your talking about, Barry. stay out of this. gotta here both sides" -the Echo Chamber

2/13/2015 3:11:53 PM

^^the right has to make every issue two sided, they can't comprehend complex issues or see humanity in people who are different than them

[Edited on February 13, 2015 at 3:12 PM. Reason : .]

2/13/2015 3:12:22 PM

Quote :

"It sounds like somebody stoking a goddamned fire is what it sounds like. Sure, nobody should be targeted because of who they are. That's a given. These folks were targeted because they had an unfortunate meeting with a crazy man with a gun."

is it really that difficult to comprehend that there could be more to it than that? you seem pretty sure and are almost cheering for that to be the only reason he murdered three people. it's odd.

2/13/2015 3:16:04 PM

You don't think Muslim communities across the world aren't paying attention to this issue? Do you think it is in our best interest to push a narrative that we haven't even started to investigate? Here our president is already teeing up an apology to the world for these three students.

2/13/2015 3:17:33 PM

the fact that muslim communities around the world are watching this makes obama's statement even more appropriate and important

[Edited on February 13, 2015 at 3:20 PM. Reason : across the world including here in the US]

2/13/2015 3:19:39 PM

What the hell should he have said? He was already being criticized by Muslim allies (turkey) for being silent. And as part of his statement he said an investigation will be started so he in no way endorsed the hate crime thing.

And for fucks sake do you even realize how insulting it is for the defense to say it was a case of wrong place, wrong time when they were in their house? If Obama said something like that I'd be Pissed..

2/13/2015 3:22:34 PM

Yeah, it doesn't really sound like an apology. But are you worried that if he does "apologize", it makes america look weak and like like a muslim apologists?

Quote :

"it was a case of wrong place, wrong time"

ha, i just saw some guy make that exact comment on facebook on a Indy Weekly story about it.

[Edited on February 13, 2015 at 3:27 PM. Reason : ]

2/13/2015 3:25:49 PM

That wasn't officially classified as terrorism...

Quote :

"The United States Department of Defense and federal law enforcement agencies have classified the shootings as an act of workplace violence.[10]"

2/13/2015 3:28:14 PM

No, not weak or anything like that. I just don't think it needs to get to that point yet, until we've determined that it was a hate crime. That these people were killed because of their religion and nothing else.

2/13/2015 3:32:43 PM

^^ we are not talking about official classification, we are talking about public discussion, perceptions, and media coverage.

(also, see if you can figure out why that quote still supports my statement if you insist on being very pedantic about it)

Quote :

"I just don't think it needs to get to that point yet, until we've determined that it was a hate crime. That these people were killed because of their religion and nothing else."

why? why is it bad for the president to make that statement? what is wrong with that statement? why do you feel so strongly about it?

recognize your own prejudice

[Edited on February 13, 2015 at 3:37 PM. Reason : /]

2/13/2015 3:34:58 PM

I thought we were talking about official classifications. I thought that was the point in even arguing if this current event is a hate crime or not. Otherwise, what's the point of arguing on the internet about it? It goes back to what I said about no one's mind being changed, I guess...

2/13/2015 3:39:39 PM

no

2/13/2015 3:40:34 PM

Pedantic? You don't think workplace violence is a symptom of mental illness, dude?

2/13/2015 3:41:39 PM

no

2/13/2015 3:43:22 PM