^ he spoke at NCSU about 2 weeks ago.

3/21/2010 7:29:47 PM

Quote :

"they made a deal to take federal funding of abortions."

Oh, you must be talking about the executive order Obama made to bar federal funding from abortions from the bill that we were told time and again didnt have federal funding for abortions? LOL

Not so much. Once this bill, which he is basically admitting contains fed funding for them, is signed it becomes law. An executive order cannot override law. Thus its not worth a damn in this case. Its just away of shifting blame. The prolife dems can claim they were told it wouldnt be in there by the president, the president can say he signed the executive order....but those damn judges overruled it. CHANGE

3/21/2010 7:36:05 PM

^ if ifs and buts were candy and nuts…

I don’t see any reason why a legal procedure shouldn’t be able to be federally funded anyway. They should have made abortion illegal at some point in the 6 years they held congress and executive branch, if they really cared.

And an executive order isn’t a tacit admission that it was there anyway, it’s just a catch-all statement people can point to when someone complains about something that someone else told them to complain about.

[Edited on March 21, 2010 at 7:41 PM. Reason : ]

3/21/2010 7:39:55 PM

Quote :

"An executive order cannot override law."

1. Pertaining to this scenario in particular, it can clarify how laws will be executed, which is sufficient in this case to ensure that federal funding won't go to abortions.

2. If only they couldn't. Talk to Mr. Signing Statements, GW Bush.

3/21/2010 8:11:40 PM

even though I oppose this bill wholeheartedly, at least it won't be the end of the world if it passes. The USA are going bankrupt with or without it

at least now the insurance companies won't be able to practice rescission anymore. Right? Or do I have to wait until they pass it before I can find this out?

3/21/2010 8:34:53 PM

Quote :

"The USA are going bankrupt with or without it"

3/21/2010 8:51:55 PM

true story, bro.

p.s. the grammatical number was deliberate

3/21/2010 8:55:29 PM

^bullshit, nice try though, bro.

3/21/2010 9:03:50 PM

Quote :

"Republican Rep. John Linder, also from Georgia, said he feels "rude trying to inject some fact into this Kabuki Theatre but I'm going to try." "This has never been about health care. This is about government," he said, arguing that the proposed legislation would destroy health care for those who are happy with the coverage they have."

i completely agree - i'm happy with my coverage and what i pay for it - there are some things that need to change but it looks like we're going to have to hit the bottom first

i'm not excited about having to pay for the "rights" we are about to be guaranteed

3/21/2010 9:17:23 PM

^exactly bro. fuck everyone else. i got mine.

3/21/2010 9:21:17 PM

^ same can be said for the lazy fucking bastards who are rooting for this nightmare

3/21/2010 9:23:26 PM

I fail to see how people with preconditions are lazy. Did all the hard work you did avoiding cancer pay off?

3/21/2010 9:25:30 PM

I fail to see why this entire bill can be summarized by you as a simple ban on precondition exclusions.

3/21/2010 9:27:57 PM

well coverage has to be pooled to bring costs down and pay for the people that will be sick all the time.

its like if you're ordering pizza and have a kid that will eat like half a pizza. you need to get enough people together where you can order like 20 pizzas so he can eat his half and there can still be plenty of pieces. The more people you pool the cheaper and more available the pizza is.

3/21/2010 9:30:15 PM

I'm glad that you found a single paragraph that you liked in those 3000 pages and decided to stop reading.

3/21/2010 9:33:28 PM

Just let the one fat kid eat the whole pizza and thus clog his arteries and the other kids can eat healthy!

3/21/2010 9:34:39 PM

republicans acting like pouting children in the house right now.

[Edited on March 21, 2010 at 9:47 PM. Reason : .]

3/21/2010 9:47:12 PM

I aint pouting (of course, I am not a republican)... I've been looking towards the silver lining since I made my prediction on Thursday that this was a done deal.

Now, although I will have much worse health care, at least I won't lose it entirely if I lose my job

[Edited on March 21, 2010 at 9:54 PM. Reason : s]

3/21/2010 9:54:26 PM

The USA was a plural noun up until a certain point in our history. Then it became a singular noun - quite intentionally.

If someone says "the USA are...", you can be well assured that they're being snarky.

3/21/2010 9:55:07 PM

Fuck. We're stuck with this shit forever, now.

3/21/2010 10:07:41 PM

i love these quotes

Quote :

"Democratic Rep. Allen Boyd, a member of the fiscally conservative Blue Dog Democrats, said that while the health care bill is not perfect, "the other side has brought us no viable alternatives." "If not this, then what? If not now, then when?" the Florida lawmaker asked."

we have no great option that we can vote for right now so let's just vote for this sub par alternative

3/21/2010 10:08:16 PM

its just a power grab.

now the dems have another entitlement to use to force people to vote for liberals.

3/21/2010 10:08:35 PM

Quote :

"Fuck. We're stuck with this shit forever, now."

aren't you currently on the receiving end of a fully subsidized government health care system?

3/21/2010 10:12:53 PM

^ In fact, that might explain his introduction, "fuck."

3/21/2010 10:18:50 PM

question. when it passes do we storm the E.R.?

3/21/2010 10:22:22 PM

ummm... hopefully the E.R. will see less usage (haha yea right) as a result of this godforsaken bill.

3/21/2010 10:26:20 PM

The big vote is happening right now.

3/21/2010 10:32:36 PM

^4, 5

I have no problems with my healthcare. Now, granted, I kind of get the rockstar treatment due to the fact that I wear wings, and it doesn't hurt that the flight doc is a personal friend, and I've never really gotten sick beyond anything needing just a course of antibiotics and calling it good.

I will tell you that neither of the flight docs I've had in the squadron were super knowledgeable--they're fresh out of school and very inexperienced. At least the one we have now is self-aware of that...the girl we had before spouted off all kinds of silly shit, and wouldn't listen to a goddamn thing from anyone (I'M A DOCTOR, I KNOW ALL OF THIS STUFF, I'M SMARTER THAN ALL OF YOU AND I KNOW EVERYTHING..." --she ACTUALLY SAID the "I'm smarter than all of you part, to a bunch of military officers who fly attack jets and do electronic warfare)

I wasn't overly impressed with the OB when my ex was pregnant with my daughter, but we got her declared to be a "high-risk" pregnancy, and went to a civilian doc out in town.



but regardless, that's all irrelevant:

(A) The military is not a population even remotely comparable to the population at large. It's a comparatively homogeneous group of young, healthy males.

(B) Military healthcare is not a business.

(C) They have the luxury of outsourcing you to the private sector if it's something that, say, requires a specialist that they don't have. This is routine.

[Edited on March 21, 2010 at 10:33 PM. Reason : ]

3/21/2010 10:33:06 PM

It passed

3/21/2010 10:45:21 PM

cue to parades! we did it! hope. change.

3/21/2010 10:47:39 PM

congrats on fucking the nation over. and you had to pull every card out of Rahm Emmanuel's dirty-ass Chicago politics to do it. FDR would be proud. Now, just create 4 more justices on the SC, and you'll be golden!

I laughed at all of the dems pointing to the fantastic successes of SS, medicare and medicaid. It's like they don't get it.

3/21/2010 10:47:45 PM

In Before The "But but but it only passed by 3 votes!!!1"

3/21/2010 10:48:16 PM

and look how bipartisan it was!

3/21/2010 10:49:17 PM

well, shit...

3/21/2010 10:52:23 PM

Republicans chose to be that way. They wanted to be the Party of "No" and now they have it. Congrats!

3/21/2010 10:53:11 PM

Sad night for our country.

Huge tax increase. The main program doesn't kick in for 4 years. What are they going to do with all that new tax money in the meantime? Put it in a lock box? It will be gone..spent on new pork projects.

November.

3/21/2010 10:57:31 PM

I think its funny that the vote AGAINST the bill was bipartisan :-)

3/21/2010 10:59:53 PM

fear is a powerful motivator

3/21/2010 11:01:24 PM

Quote :

"November."

Can't get here soon enough!!! Damn democrats...yet again, ruining the country...

3/21/2010 11:02:32 PM

a lot of dems voted no knowing it would pass just positioning themselves for november.

3/21/2010 11:03:04 PM

Quote :

"the fantastic successes of SS, medicare and medicaid. "

haha, on the short list of biggest examples of FAIL in the federal government, which is a pretty stunning accomplishment.

Quote :

"Republicans chose to be that way. They wanted to be the Party of "No" "

Well shit, as opposed to doing what?



^^^^^ When does the 3.8 tax on investments begin, and what exactly does it entail?

I wonder if there's any chance that the GOP could vote to rescind this bill if they take power before 2014 when it really gets going in earnest? That's the only way we'll ever be rid of it. Entitlement programs are forever.

[Edited on March 21, 2010 at 11:03 PM. Reason : ^^^^^]

3/21/2010 11:03:28 PM

omg, they took a vote of acclamation for the crazy whatever thing they're doing and the dems were all like "yes" in a normal voice and then the repubs were shouted at the top of their lungs "NO", and then the nos had it.

I lol'ed so fregin hard.

3/21/2010 11:05:23 PM

Quote :

"Conservatives and Republicans today suffered their most crushing legislative defeat since the 1960s. It’s hard to exaggerate the magnitude of the disaster. Conservatives may cheer themselves that they’ll compensate for today’s expected vote with a big win in the November 2010 elections. But: (1) It’s a good bet that conservatives are over-optimistic about November – by then the economy will have improved and the immediate goodies in the healthcare bill will be reaching key voting blocs. (2) So what? Legislative majorities come and go. This healthcare bill is forever. A win in November is very poor compensation for this debacle now. So far, I think a lot of conservatives will agree with me. Now comes the hard lesson: A huge part of the blame for today’s disaster attaches to conservatives and Republicans ourselves. At the beginning of this process we made a strategic decision: unlike, say, Democrats in 2001 when President Bush proposed his first tax cut, we would make no deal with the administration. No negotiations, no compromise, nothing. We were going for all the marbles. This would be Obama’s Waterloo – just as healthcare was Clinton’s in 1994. Only, the hardliners overlooked a few key facts: Obama was elected with 53% of the vote, not Clinton’s 42%. The liberal block within the Democratic congressional caucus is bigger and stronger than it was in 1993-94. And of course the Democrats also remember their history, and also remember the consequences of their 1994 failure. This time, when we went for all the marbles, we ended with none. Could a deal have been reached? Who knows? But we do know that the gap between this plan and traditional Republican ideas is not very big. The Obama plan has a broad family resemblance to Mitt Romney’s Massachusetts plan. It builds on ideas developed at the Heritage Foundation in the early 1990s that formed the basis for Republican counter-proposals to Clintoncare in 1993-1994. Barack Obama badly wanted Republican votes for his plan. Could we have leveraged his desire to align the plan more closely with conservative views? To finance it without redistributive taxes on productive enterprise – without weighing so heavily on small business – without expanding Medicaid? Too late now. They are all the law. No illusions please: This bill will not be repealed. Even if Republicans scored a 1994 style landslide in November, how many votes could we muster to re-open the “doughnut hole” and charge seniors more for prescription drugs? How many votes to re-allow insurers to rescind policies when they discover a pre-existing condition? How many votes to banish 25 year olds from their parents’ insurance coverage? And even if the votes were there – would President Obama sign such a repeal? We followed the most radical voices in the party and the movement, and they led us to abject and irreversible defeat. There were leaders who knew better, who would have liked to deal. But they were trapped. Conservative talkers on Fox and talk radio had whipped the Republican voting base into such a frenzy that deal-making was rendered impossible. How do you negotiate with somebody who wants to murder your grandmother? Or – more exactly – with somebody whom your voters have been persuaded to believe wants to murder their grandmother? I’ve been on a soapbox for months now about the harm that our overheated talk is doing to us. Yes it mobilizes supporters – but by mobilizing them with hysterical accusations and pseudo-information, overheated talk has made it impossible for representatives to represent and elected leaders to lead. The real leaders are on TV and radio, and they have very different imperatives from people in government. Talk radio thrives on confrontation and recrimination. When Rush Limbaugh said that he wanted President Obama to fail, he was intelligently explaining his own interests. What he omitted to say – but what is equally true – is that he also wants Republicans to fail. If Republicans succeed – if they govern successfully in office and negotiate attractive compromises out of office – Rush’s listeners get less angry. And if they are less angry, they listen to the radio less, and hear fewer ads for Sleepnumber beds. So today’s defeat for free-market economics and Republican values is a huge win for the conservative entertainment industry. Their listeners and viewers will now be even more enraged, even more frustrated, even more disappointed in everybody except the responsibility-free talkers on television and radio. For them, it’s mission accomplished. For the cause they purport to represent, it’s Waterloo all right: ours."

http://www.frumforum.com/waterloo

3/21/2010 11:06:33 PM

actually, the republicans were voting yes for that bill.

3/21/2010 11:06:47 PM

To be fair, we were already fucked before the bill passed. I think the fact that this did pass goes to show that we're beyond the point of no return. I have no doubt that this bill will make things substantially worse than they already are.

3/21/2010 11:07:48 PM

oh, nm, they were loud and annoying so I mistook those people for republicans

3/21/2010 11:08:00 PM

^^Can we get a timeline?

3/21/2010 11:14:10 PM

From another thread that I just locked:

Quote :

"If it turns out to be as bad as some people think, then when there is a different majority in power, they'll repeal it and the people will love them for it."

AHHH HAHAHAHA

That's not how programs like this work, dude. They are forever, no matter how fucked up they are.

3/21/2010 11:15:45 PM

Big tax increase.

The main program doesn't kick in for 4 years. What are they going to do with all this new tax money?
Put it into a lock box? hah! That money will be long gone by then..spent on new pork projects.

We Conservatives have to move on. There are more battles to fight this year.. immigration, cap n tax. etc. And through-out we must keep working on getting rid of these democrats in November.

3/21/2010 11:16:02 PM

Quote :

"spent on new pork projects"

where is this coming from?

rural states typically get more money per capita than higher population states like NY.

3/21/2010 11:17:13 PM