Quote :

"RALEIGH The House voted Wednesday to outlaw smoking in most workplaces and restaurants in North Carolina, a move the ban's champion called a historic moment for a state built on tobacco. The bill, which still requires one more vote before it can clear the House, was less stringent than the original proposal, which sought a sweeping ban of nearly all public smoking. The current version would exempt most bars and it is unclear what effect that exemption would have on the bill's chances."

hahaha if you want to go to the bar you will have to deal with smoking you fucking self righteous alcoholic pussy motherfuckers

4/2/2009 10:01:23 AM

haha, fuckros

4/2/2009 10:04:33 AM

the new version exempts banning smoking at establishments that allow minors ... i see an opportunity for a huge loophole here

i love how people actually try to argue "if you're gonna ban smoking indoors then you should ban drinking and fast food too" ... comparing apples to apples

there was a collective bitching and moaning when they banned smoking indoors in NY at first ... but now people (smokers and non-smokers alike) have come to accept the fact that it's nice not smelling like a filthy ashtray every time you go out to the bar ... i'm confident it will pan out that way in NC when the ban is passed eventually

4/2/2009 10:15:25 AM

yeah cause NY's economy was built on tobacco

talk about bad comparisons

4/2/2009 10:16:52 AM

i dont understand ... so the public's health should continue to suffer as a result of NC's historical association with tobacco?

4/2/2009 10:30:15 AM

^^ It was also built on cotton and slavery. What's your point?

4/2/2009 10:34:15 AM

it's the only reason it's still legal. that, and money.

4/2/2009 10:34:24 AM

All of you anti-smoking, anti-liberty, anti-consensual behavior, nanny-state-supporting fuckwads will not win this war.
You honestly think that morality and justice are on your side, but you are 100% wrong. Enjoy your populist ban while it lasts.

4/2/2009 10:47:09 AM

Quote :

"that it's nice not smelling like a filthy ashtray every time you go out to the bar"

sound reasoning for law-making

4/2/2009 10:47:16 AM

^
Exactly. This bullshit ban has no legs to stand on. None.

4/2/2009 10:48:15 AM

i like smelling like a drunk more to be honest

4/2/2009 10:48:21 AM

Nobody's saying that you can't smoke in private places like your home and car. That's more than can be said for the legislation of other things.

4/2/2009 10:48:40 AM

Quote :

"so the public's health should continue to suffer as a result of NC's historical association with tobacco?"

NC's historical association with tobacco is obviously a large reason why 34 other states have implemented bans and NC has yet to officially

I like how people equate "public health" with "drinking at a bar"

If you were so worried about your health why are you currently going to bars that allow smoking?

4/2/2009 10:51:48 AM

^ Wouldn't the ban cover more places than just bars?

4/2/2009 10:54:03 AM

gh

[Edited on April 2, 2009 at 10:54 AM. Reason : ffg]

4/2/2009 10:54:17 AM

^^go over peoples reasons for supporting this ban in this thread alone...the majority of them are so they can go to bars and not have to smell like smoke

and the ban in its modified form would basically cover any place BUT bars

4/2/2009 10:55:06 AM

Quote :

"I like how people equate "public health" with "drinking at a bar""

Me drinking at the bar doesn't negatively affect the health of people surrounding me. Don't even try to pull the "oh you can drive home drunk and kill someone" card. That's not the point.

Quote :

"If you were so worried about your health why are you currently going to bars that allow smoking?"

I try to speak with my wallet by avoiding smoky bars, but sometimes my friends that I'm with want to go to a place that allows smoking (e.g. Sammy's) and I shouldn't have to turn around and go home because there's smoking in there.

[Edited on April 2, 2009 at 10:58 AM. Reason : -]

4/2/2009 10:55:14 AM

Go to a different bar then if you're so worried about your health...you're obviously not worried about the health of your liver, just your lungs

Besides, me driving down the street in an automobile negatively affects the pedestrians walking on the sidewalk

BAN EVERYTHING

[Edited on April 2, 2009 at 10:57 AM. Reason : .]

4/2/2009 10:56:36 AM

http://www.new.facebook.com/photo.php?pid=1634997&id=25997776519&ref=mf

4/2/2009 10:58:06 AM

Quote :

"go over peoples reasons for supporting this ban in this thread alone...the majority of them are so they can go to bars and not have to smell like smoke"

Exactly. There is absolutely no justification for such bans. None. NONE! (And before you start spewing bullshit about worker safety, understand that smoke is no where near as unsafe as exploding machinery, lead dust, or any of the other things that that law actually addresses. The idea that tobacco smoke amounts to such harms is 100% wrong. Suck it.)

Quote :

"Nobody's saying that you can't smoke in private places like your home and car."

Right. They're saying you can't smoke in ALL other private places -- which makes no sense. If I can smoke in my house, but not sell beer or burgers, while at the same time my restaurant can sell beer and burgers, but not allow smoking, then there is an obvious legal inconsistency that WILL NOT STAND. Private is private.

4/2/2009 10:59:56 AM

Quote :

"sometimes my friends that I'm with want to go to a place that allows smoking (e.g. Sammy's) and I shouldn't have to turn around and go home because there's smoking in there"

We should cater all the laws to you and your friends' choices in bars

4/2/2009 11:00:47 AM

Quote :

"All of you anti-smoking, anti-liberty, anti-consensual behavior, nanny-state-supporting fuckwads will not win this war. You honestly think that morality and justice are on your side, but you are 100% wrong. Enjoy your populist ban while it lasts."

The reason I disagree with you is 20% of the population smokes. So you have a lot more for the anti-smoking folks to pool from to get numbers on their side. I'm neither for, nor against this bill myself. On one hand I think it should be up to the establishment owner. On the other, I wouldn't mind not smelling like cig smoke when I left a place.

4/2/2009 11:02:21 AM

i think i'm speaking for a majority of people here with that example.

4/2/2009 11:02:33 AM

Why don't you do like people should do, and take it up with your friends first, before you take it up with the government

If you have a loud neighbor are you the type of person that calls the cops, or that first asks the neighbor to keep it down

I just don't think its any type of good justification to pass a law if your main reasoning is "i can't bar hop with my friends wherever i want"

[Edited on April 2, 2009 at 11:06 AM. Reason : .]

4/2/2009 11:03:36 AM

Quote :

"I try to speak with my wallet by avoiding smoky bars, but sometimes my friends that I'm with want to go to a place that allows smoking (e.g. Sammy's) and I shouldn't have to turn around and go home because there's smoking in there."

so you're saying you want the state to protect you from peer pressure?

4/2/2009 11:06:10 AM

^^ I would not call that his main reasoning from his statements. You're being a trolling doushe now.

[Edited on April 2, 2009 at 11:07 AM. Reason : df]

4/2/2009 11:07:29 AM

Quote :

"So you have a lot more for the anti-smoking folks to pool from to get numbers on their side."

What the fuck do you think democracy is?... a way to deny minority rights? That's what it sounds like you're saying. So what if some 51% gay city want to ban heterosexual sex? Majority rules, right?

Liberty and Justice for All >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Social Democracy

4/2/2009 11:07:32 AM

It's call reconcilliation. Has been going on forever. Since the beginning the majority has always wanted to take the rights from the minority.

4/2/2009 11:08:42 AM

It might be a bit easier to agree if

Quote :

"# Does exposure to secondhand smoke cause cancer? Yes. The U.S. Environmental Protection Agency (EPA), the U.S. National Toxicology Program (NTP), the U.S. Surgeon General, and the International Agency for Research on Cancer (IARC) have classified secondhand smoke as a known human carcinogen (cancer-causing agent) (1, 3, 5). Inhaling secondhand smoke causes lung cancer in nonsmoking adults (4). Approximately 3,000 lung cancer deaths occur each year among adult nonsmokers in the United States as a result of exposure to secondhand smoke (2). The Surgeon General estimates that living with a smoker increases a nonsmoker’s chances of developing lung cancer by 20 to 30 percent (4). "

http://www.cancer.gov/cancertopics/factsheet/Tobacco/ETS

weren't the case.

4/2/2009 11:08:51 AM

^^^^oh sorry, his main reason is his great concern for public health and national well-being...it has nothing to do with being able to go out and drink with his friends without smelling like smoke

who is the trolling douche?

[Edited on April 2, 2009 at 11:09 AM. Reason : .]

4/2/2009 11:09:16 AM

i'm not a smoker and i think this ban is wrong. i would think that the govt. has bigger problems than trying to keep people from smelling like smoke when they leave bars.

btw, this ban doesn't affect dippers, does it? does the ban say all tobacco products??

4/2/2009 11:09:36 AM

leave it up to the individual places themselves.

there will be places that ban it where non-smokers and smokers can go if they want, and there will be places that don't where non-smokers and smokers can go if they want.

why does the fucking government have to babysit us? jesus.

4/2/2009 11:10:15 AM

^^^ your bar hopping post made you a troll. it was inaccurate and meant to get an argument out of the guy. you fixed it though.



What are the thoughts that a ban on smoking would help small restaurant/bar business sales?


V but he was not calling for a law changed based on that inconvenience. his main argument was overall population health. this is off topic.


[Edited on April 2, 2009 at 11:14 AM. Reason : df]

4/2/2009 11:10:21 AM

it wasnt inaccurate

he said himself that he shouldnt have to turn around and go home when his friends want to go to a bar that allows smoking

4/2/2009 11:11:41 AM

Quote :

"What are the thoughts that a ban on smoking would help small restaurant/bar business sales? "

are you asking for our thoughts? i would think it wouldn't have much of an effect if all places were banning smoking.

4/2/2009 11:15:05 AM

Quote :

" What are the thoughts that a ban on smoking would help small restaurant/bar business sales? "

So you think business owners should take forced business advice from a state government?

[Edited on April 2, 2009 at 11:16 AM. Reason : ]

4/2/2009 11:16:27 AM

you're missing the point. i don't support the bill for the sole reason that it's convenient for me to not smell like smoke at the bar, but because secondhand smoke is a carcinogen and truly unhealthy for the public.

4/2/2009 11:17:35 AM

So is walking down a sidewalk next to a street that has cars driving on it

Is smoking unhealthy? Yes

Is anyone forcing you to go to certain bars that allow smoking? No

4/2/2009 11:19:01 AM

^^ so you don't accept that people should be responsible for themselves when choosing a place to go out?

[Edited on April 2, 2009 at 11:19 AM. Reason : ]

4/2/2009 11:19:25 AM

not to the magnitude of being in a smoky bar/restaurant

what's your point? ban cars?

4/2/2009 11:20:48 AM

My point is lots of things adversely affect public health

But mainly that nobody is forcing you to go to certain bars where bar owners choose to allow smoking

You want the government to ban the use of a legal substance on someone else's property

4/2/2009 11:22:01 AM

Twista, it's the magnitude, you don't understand

4/2/2009 11:22:51 AM

I'm a smoker and I don't like "smoky bars"

Hence why I don't go to them, because I have a choice

I choose to go places with good HVAC ventilation that aren't packed full of smokers

4/2/2009 11:23:33 AM

sometimes there isn't really a choice. what about younger children or babies whose irresponsible parents make the poor choice of taking them to a smoky restaurant?

4/2/2009 11:24:07 AM

Maybe we should ban cars...after all what about the irresponsible parents that get in wrecks while their children are in the car...

4/2/2009 11:25:09 AM

haha, wtf?

ok i'm not getting suckered into this trolling attempt any more. have fun!

4/2/2009 11:26:30 AM

Quote :

"So you think business owners should take forced business advice from a state government? "

I think an unaccounted for side effect of banning smoking in establishments with no non-smoking section would be a subtle increase in sales. Smokers are not going to quite going out if smoking is banned. A person who was previously unlikely to go to Sharky's because it is a smokey hole may be more apt to go if there is no smoking.

This would be more isolated to small business I think. Which is fortunate because they need the most help right now. Small businesses would also no longer need to incur the cost of smoke eaters or shortened equipment lifespan due to smoke. For example: I bartened at Sammy's for well over a year. A major problem he had was keeping those LCD's clean because the smoke coats the screens and gets inside the tv.

What I am getting at is I think it won't be hard for the anti smoking people to get enough bar owners on their side to put this into effect. Again, I am neutral on the topic and just thinking out loud. People smoke like trains at Sammy's. It didn't bother me while I bartended



[Edited on April 2, 2009 at 11:29 AM. Reason : df]

4/2/2009 11:26:34 AM

^^who's trolling? you're pulling the "sometimes you don't have a choice" card. There are always going to be irresponsible parents in the world...what is a ban going to do to prevent their kids from being exposed to smoke in their own house? Nothing but the parents themselves. You're trying to come up with different reasons and people like myself are shooting each one of them down, but if you don't like it, its cool

[Edited on April 2, 2009 at 11:28 AM. Reason : .]

4/2/2009 11:27:04 AM

Comparing the definite second hand smoke exposure to the improbable chance of getting into an accident. Nice.

4/2/2009 11:28:03 AM

1/2 of the population gets in car wrecks at some point in their life

SO IMPROBABLE

4/2/2009 11:29:08 AM