Quote :

"throw out the analogy then... we are still right"

glad you recognize that the analogy only makes sense if considered subjectively

sad that you still don't get that your opinion is also subjective

2/7/2011 4:03:17 PM

quagmire02: you're wrong here. stop fighting it.

[Edited on February 7, 2011 at 4:04 PM. Reason : 02]

2/7/2011 4:04:19 PM

wait

did we somehow go from subpar pizza to the ford pinto?

edit: wow i was halfway joking but now see that we actually did go from pizza to the pinto

tww uncovered: from pizza to the pinto and back

[Edited on February 7, 2011 at 4:05 PM. Reason : .]

2/7/2011 4:04:49 PM

we've been quaqmired!!!

2/7/2011 4:05:22 PM

and mcdonalds coffee liability case...

which is one of products liability? (dunno entirely, haven't done that yet)

comparative jurisdictions ftw, btw this is a contributory state (NC), so if you're at fault at all (outside some narrow exceptions) you can't get shit usually.

2/7/2011 4:06:31 PM

Quote :

"btw this is a contributory state (NC)"

Thank you insurance industry lobbyists

2/7/2011 4:08:56 PM

good ol' contrib

its funny to see questions like that on the mbe

people in other states probably laugh and are like "what kind of dumbass would have put B (contributory neg) for that question"

2/7/2011 4:09:02 PM

coffee is always dangerous if you're an idiot. coffee is only dangerous when you're not an idiot when someone else causes it to be spilled on you. the idiot spilled it on her self thinking her thighs are cup holders.

2/7/2011 4:09:38 PM

so if i hand you a cold can of beer
but actually the can had been chilled in liquid nitrogen
and it makes your balls freeze and shatter into a million pieces
its your fault for holding it in your crotch

2/7/2011 4:16:38 PM

GeniuSxBoY:I was posting from my phone, trying to give you helpful advice to save your business you little shit. You managed to ignore every previous post I made where I spelled and linked your name correctly. Yes I've hired many people over the years with my own money. And yes, one well paid manager is worth 4 minimum wage flunkies.

To recap the advice I have given you:

Classic case of a really bright, hard working person who absolutely refuses to question the things he thinks he already knows. It's your way or no way.

GeniuSxBoY: Dude, the CoE has extremely high job placement rankings. You can check the numbers yourself. WolfAce is right. EVERYONE tells you to get internships and do COOPs as an engineer. You chose to ignore this advice.

Sounds like exactly the same thing has happened with the pizza place. Your pizza actually looks really damn good in the pictures and the place looks pretty cool too, but the more you talk about your experience, the more clear the picture is. You had imagined how things would work, and when things started deviating from your expectations, rather than adapting to reality, you instead started retreating into blaming the things that were different from your imagined experience.

Honestly I dont think you have to close your shop and give up. From the looks of it you have a pretty good product, a pretty nice looking place and have had at least enough business to keep you going for a few years. I think you just need to take a step back, look at yourself and make some personal changes, followed by making some professional changes.

Take an honest look at your expenses and business model. What can you change to start becoming profitable? That could mean you stepping aside as the day to day manager, or it could mean you just being the operational manager and getting someone else to keep the books and handle employee hiring and firing. But I have a feeling it's really just about you opening your eyes and taking an honest look at what needs to change to be successful

You are not your customer. You do not get to set the bar for "good" and "bad" pizza. If everyone likes thin slice new york style pizza with giant toppings, then that's "good" pizza. As a business owner, the first thing you throw out the fucking window is YOUR preferences, because they dont matter.

Wake up, figure out what the people want, figure out how you can make it for them at a profit, then make it. Over time you can slowly start integrating YOUR pizza style into the menu options and who knows, people might actually prefer it! But no one is every going to even try it unless you start off where people are today.

your list (of responsibilities) reads of a classic micro-manager. It's blatantly obvious that you chose to take on ALL responsibility for the business. And it sounds more and more like you should have been the kitchen manager, and hired someone else to handle the front office.

Not because you can't do it, but because it's obvious you cant handle all of it. The inability to delegate responsibility is the #1 reason that profitable small businesses fail to grow and succeed. You'd be better off hiring one person with a respectable wage to run the customer facing operations, and leave the kitchen for you to handle.

This is common in restaurants, and in business in general, especially successful ones.

2/7/2011 4:18:03 PM

tl;dr

2/7/2011 4:22:42 PM

quagmire, how about if the car explodes only if the people drive w/out changing the oil for, say, 3-4 times the recommended mileage. That would match scenarios. The product is nominally sfe, but if you are clumsy/irresponsible, the consequences are significantly past what could be expected in a similar situation.

2/7/2011 4:27:27 PM

^ you'd have a point were that realistic...but it's not

2/7/2011 4:28:52 PM

I don't think he actually graduated from school. I could swear he was like 3 credits short and had some elaborate story about how some professor fucked him in his last class.

2/7/2011 4:49:03 PM

Quote :

"you, unsurprisingly, have failed to recognize the fundamental difference between the two: ford's product is unsafe BY DEFAULT while mcdonald's is not...mcdonald's is ONLY unsafe when some idiot fucks up enough to make it so by that logic, knife companies should be sued for having knives that are TOO SHARP WHEN YOU SLIP AND CUT YOURSELF"

quagmire, you are a fucking retard. It said in that article that the coffee was too hot even to drink. So, by your standards the coffee actually was unsafe by default. Because if I were to get a coffee from McDonald's and then immediately drink it, it would scald the inside of my mouth and throat.

2/7/2011 4:50:43 PM

I've never been served a cup of coffee that was drinking temperature when handed to me, ever.

2/7/2011 4:56:48 PM

I'm not pointing out anything other than the fact that quagmire is fucking stupid.

[Edited on February 7, 2011 at 5:00 PM. Reason : ]

2/7/2011 4:59:59 PM

well sure, I'm just pointing out that your argument is equally stupid

2/7/2011 5:01:06 PM

Before you say TL;DR... I'm writing this for you.

In business, it's everyone for themselves. Distributors charge a minimum $500 for every truck. They only come once a week. I've asked other businesses if I could piggyback on their truck, meaning I'll tell him to order my product and I'll pick it up at their store. Sometimes customers order more than expected of one food item and you run out. I would do the same for him if he needed it. They didn't go for it. They felt like I was there to steal their lousy secrets lol. The only thing you can do is wait and wait and wait for your next truck to come. When you compensate by ordering more than you need people suddenly stop ordering the particular item and you have to throw most of it away! Then the minute you throw it away, they start ordering it again! Fuckers.

Business is not something you can predict. Not for at least 7 years since days are offset by +1 every year. That means if Christmas falls on a friday and friday is your busiest day, then your friday will be all fucked up, whereas next year christmas falls on a saturday, and then your saturday is fucked up. You have to worry about all holidays messing with your business and people's spending habits. The weather is different every day, every year. The economic state is different every day, every year. You never know.

Then you have to worry about payday. What day does payday fall on for military? It's the 1st and 15th. Is that a Friday or a Monday? Did you get the advertisement out on time? Can you even get it out? Are the weather conditions right? If it's raining, you don't want to put paper menus on doors or walk in the rain for two hours. If it's too windy, you're fucked, too. Is there snow on the ground? Can you deliver in the snow? Is it too hot and dehydrating to pass out fliers? Will a hurricane come and fuck up whether or not people leave their houses? Will my drivers risk being out in a hurricane for $2 tips? Will it flood in neighborhood? Will my power go out?
Are your menus still in date? Are the coupons in date?
Then you have to worry about competition.
Will my competitors come behind me and take my fliers off the doors and put theirs on it?
Fliers are not cheap, it's about $700 for 15,000. That's 4.6 cents per menu. Two people can put 400 menus on houses in 2 hours which is $18.66. $18.66 plus 2 hours of labor times 2 people at $10, yes $10! it's a lot more work than you think. That's $58.66 that you're competition causes you to lose per diem, plus the cost of the unknown business you COULD have generated. Now you have to sell $180 worth of product to make the $58.66 back.

Also, did Pizza Hut or Papa Johns just put out a new special to cut in their corporate competitors? They aren't even thinking about small businesses at that point. It's a competition in the big leagues now. The 3 pizza for $5 deals really has a huge impact on small pizza places. Cici's included.

IF you manage to answer all that correctly, then you have to ask:

Will my employee show up for work today?
Will my employee be in a good mood or bad mood today?
Will my employee be productive or lazy today?
Will my customers be annoyingly difficult or easy today?
Will I make enough money to pay for my employee today?
Will I make enough money to cover utilities and rent today?
Is all my food in date?
Vegetables only last 3-7 days uncut. Dough only lasts 36 hours.
Premade food only lasts 4 hours.
I can get a lot of stuff at Sam's club or Restaurant Depot, but it takes TIME. Not something I can do during business hours.
Will my equipment hold up? If one of the 17 refrigeration units that are made with 100s of breakable parts, I have to transfer everything to a different unit and block easy access to the other food, slowing us down.
The next day, I have to find a repair guy to come out, set an appoint for usually 3 days in advance. They come out to find out what's wrong then you have to wait another 7 days for the part to arrive, then they come back and fix it. That means you are without a working refrigerator with things out of place for at least 10 days! Same with plumbing and air conditioning repairs. Average repair cost for ANYTHING, you can expect a $320 bill. By law, I am not allowed to be sold parts I need without an HVAC license, so learning and doing repairs myself is out of the question right now. I don't have time nor money for school on HVAC to get a license.

During business hours I have to worry about:
Do people like the food?
Did the food come out right?
Are hairs and bugs and anything unwanted not in people's food?
Did the employee use the right ingredients?
Did the employee use the right measurements and specs?
Is everything sanitized?
Did the employee make each and every menu item EXACTLY how I make it?
If not, the customer WILL notice a difference. Must have consistency or else people will go to one of the 16000 other restaurants to choice from.
How many errors will be made that night?
How much money did the errors cost me?
Will the customer come back?
Did the employee eat food while I wasn't looking?
Did the employee steal from me while I wasn't looking?
Did the employee miss ringing up items a customer bought?
Did the employee drop pizzas or buckets full of toppings by accident? It happens.
Will I get robbed? Pizza places get knocked off all the time. No place is immune.
Will my customers steal? Customers do stupid shit like stealing Parmesan or Crushed Red Pepper containers or taking the entire napkin holder full of napkins or hot sauce bottles while you're not looking. Napkins run $60 a case, and the shakers are $2 a piece.

At the end of the day:
You have to enter in all the credit card tips into the system. Batch out.
Put the tickets in chronological order.
Are you missing any tickets? Yes? Try to think? Where is it? Did my employee lose the ticket and steal $40, $60, or possibly $80 for a big order?
Will the IRS look at the same tickets and accuse ME of being the one that stole tax money from the government if I'm audited and missing tickets?That means, I have to write a reason for each and every ticket that's missing.
I have to keep track of all the beer deliveries and write it in a report and send it to ABC monthly.
I have to keep track and inventory and stock 90 beers and over 228 food and packaging items including cleaning supplies.
I have to place all the food orders.
Trucks are allowed to show up anywhere between 9am aaaaaaaaand 7pm. Big fucking window. They won't come back if you're not there.
I have to keep track of all the beer I sold verses food I sold.
I have to make sure the entire store is clean. Paying employees to clean doesn't make me money. I do 90% the cleaning myself.
I have to keep track of payroll and labor.
I have to give my final numbers to my ACCOUNTANT ($175/month) to tell me how much I have to pay in taxes to the CITY, STATE, and FEDS.
Sales Tax, Withholding Tax, 940/941. Va employment commission/unemployment tax.
Did I pay rent?
Did I pay the water bill?
sewage bill?
telephone/cox/internet?
electric bill?
gas bill?
employees?
insurance?
fees?
licenses up to date?
How much money do I have left? OH less than 5%? Great!! That was worth it! Not.

After all that, you realize:
Did I even eat today?
When was the last time I took a shower?
How's my health?
Did I brush my teeth, see a dentist anytime soon? Nope.
Can I afford to sleep less tonight to do more work tomorrow?
Am I forced to sleep longer tonight because I'm exhausted and my body needs it?
Does my brain hurt? Do I have to meditate?
How are my muscles? Stretchmarks on my legs? Stress patterns on your ankles? Deteriorating joints?
Need new shoes? New pants?
Should I spend 15 minutes stretching in the morning? Will I even remember to do it when I wake up late tomorrow? Nope.

When was the last time I got laid? Oh yeh, that's right I have kids I haven't got to see in two weeks (which felt like only yesterday)! No time for my kids? then fun time for me. It's off limits until I have enough time to spend with them.
When was the last time I got a day off? Not this year, buddy. Unless you're willing to put yourself 10 days behind. Not worth it.

2/7/2011 5:02:10 PM

Thanks to geniusxbox360, I now feel pretty good about brushing my teeth everyday.

2/7/2011 5:07:53 PM

i think there's a difference between coffee that just burns your tastebuds and is a little painful

and coffee that actually scalds you and gives you blisters or burns off the skin in your mouth. like 2nd degree burns or something.

if that has ever happened, i mean. but i think that coffee *COULD* be too hot. when you drink coffee you might expect it to burn a little...even to burn your tastebuds off (or whatever that feeling is)...but you don't expect to get blisters or have burns that actually need attention.

i'm just saying, that IS possible. with drinking coffee anyway. if you're holding it in your thighs and it spills, well...yea, that is your own fault.

2/7/2011 5:08:06 PM

Quote :

"when you drink coffee you might expect it to burn a little...even to burn your tastebuds off "

wait

really?

burn your taste buds off?

2/7/2011 5:09:37 PM

Quote :

"(or whatever that feeling is)."

you missed kind of an imperative part of the sentence.

you know when your taste buds get burned and then you can't taste very well.

2/7/2011 5:11:04 PM

i don't ever expect to burn my taste buds off

2/7/2011 5:13:37 PM

1. sip coffee
too hot to drink?
yes: wait
no: drink coffee

2/7/2011 5:23:49 PM

We need to take stoves out of kitchens that boil water. It's Kenmore's fault for people spilling boiling water on themselves.

2/7/2011 5:32:33 PM

2/7/2011 5:48:01 PM

^haha, that was funny

2/7/2011 5:48:45 PM

Quote :

"your list (of responsibilities) reads of a classic micro-manager. It's blatantly obvious that you chose to take on ALL responsibility for the business. And it sounds more and more like you should have been the kitchen manager, and hired someone else to handle the front office."

This is the funniest advice of them all.

Let me do all the physical labor while someone else takes care of my bank account, bills, and taxes? Rather... while they pocket the tax and bill money and paycheck and say seeee yaaaah when you go down in flames.

You obviously don't watch forensic files. This kind of shit people kill and get killed over.

2/7/2011 5:49:41 PM

that much is obvious

2/7/2011 5:54:38 PM

^^ Yeah, you're right. Just keep on doing it your way. It seems to be working.

2/7/2011 6:04:47 PM

Your lack of trust and general disdain for humanity appears to be the source of your ultimate undoing.

Noen is right. You have no clue how to delegate and interact with people because it's pretty apparent you think everyone is a thief/liar/idiot.

You should have partnered up with someone you can trust instead of assuming everyone is out to fuck you. Believe it or not, there are people out there with good intentions that want to make an honest buck.

Stay in the kitchen so you don't have to interact with the general populace.

2/7/2011 6:05:46 PM

I too have been burned by the 1 out of 1000 dishonest people, and honestly, if people could fuck you over and get away with it, 70% of the time they will.

Partnering with a friend who knows business or an honest business man (could be an oxymoron) would be a good idea, or at least take some business classes and six sigma. There are plenty of small business organizations, clubs, associations that you can get involved with and I tell you, I've met people exactly like me in those types of community/social settings that are more than willing to help others who experience the same small business/entrepreneurship problems.

And if you are worried about someone in that position stealing money from you, hire a 3rd party accountant to check it out.

2/7/2011 6:13:42 PM

For the McDonald's coffee argument participants....both were found liable. Mickey D's 80%, the woman 20%. Shocker: all problems aren't black and white.

2/7/2011 6:17:22 PM

You saw what happened to Bush in the government when there was no oversight right? Everyone turned corrupt. The CIA... government contractors...congress...FEMA....wall street....

The sad reality is that most people are just not naturally honest. They need a reason to be honest.

Oversight is a full time job.

The time it takes me to perform oversight for my own business, I might as well do all the work myself saving myself a TON of stress, time, energy, trust issues, and money.

2/7/2011 6:18:27 PM

oversight is different from micro-managing

2/7/2011 6:24:12 PM

Quote :

"For the McDonald's coffee argument participants....both were found liable. Mickey D's 80%, the woman 20%. Shocker: all problems aren't black and white."

unless you are in NC. then if you are neg at all, you lose.

moral of the story: don't use thighs as cup holders.

i missed pages like 3 - 50 of this page though so i'm not even sure how we got on the pinto coffee topic. haha.

i DID just see the pic of the fry pizza though and it looked kinda good not gonna lie. i'd def try it. but sour cream to dip in i still say ew to. ranch, please.

[Edited on February 7, 2011 at 6:29 PM. Reason : .]

2/7/2011 6:28:52 PM

I know I'm pretty far away but doesn't anyone like to travel?

2/7/2011 6:35:38 PM

can you just mail me a french fry pizza instead?

k thx!

2/7/2011 6:44:58 PM

You should apply for Chef Ramsey's Kitchen Nightmares, I would so watch that episode! oh and send them links to these threads.

2/7/2011 6:47:58 PM

noncontributory states ftw

Quote :

"You have no clue how to delegate and interact with people because it's pretty apparent you think everyone is a thief/liar/idiot."

guys, dude has admitted to having expressive aphasia

2/7/2011 6:50:39 PM

aphasia: loss of language not intellect.

(that is what my TAP magnet on the fridge says anyway)

[Edited on February 7, 2011 at 6:52 PM. Reason : .]

2/7/2011 6:52:11 PM

this guy HAS to be fake, or at least trolling us some. i mean the fact that EMCE is his reference is suspicious by itself. but it is entertaining, so i'll play a bit.

Quote :

"Let me do all the physical labor while someone else takes care of my bank account, bills, and taxes? Rather... while they pocket the tax and bill money and paycheck and say seeee yaaaah when you go down in flames. "

wait, so you are saying that it would be a penalty to make you do the part of the job you actually seem to enjoy and be good at. and then your major concern isnt paying another person, but the worry that they will embezzle all your money?

It must be hard to run a business when you dont live in the real world.

2/7/2011 6:52:21 PM

kadwackle, it seems like it might make it harder for him to deal with people

2/7/2011 6:53:32 PM

Quote :

"i'm not even sure how we got on the pinto coffee topic"

Something about pizza and you crashing into a car, which happens to be a pinto transporting beans of coffee, which runs into a tanker truck full of boiling water in front of a McD...

2/7/2011 6:55:39 PM

numerous users of Campusblender and a few from TWW visited his pizza place

dude is real

2/7/2011 6:55:48 PM

Quote :

"kadwackle, it seems like it might make it harder for him to deal with people"

yea depending on how bad it is for sheezy

my dad has it. you can barely tell anymore though. just sounds like a normal forgetful old person to the average listener.

how do you get aphasia besides brain damage/disorders/injuries?? serious question. is it something people are born with? i know this is off topic but we DID talk about the ford pinto so i feel like its ok...

2/7/2011 7:01:11 PM

Quote :

"or at least trolling us some"

nobody can be this douchy, distrustful, etc. he posts this stuff then refuses to listen to anyone's input or even engage in a conversation and explain in a normal way why they are wrong. i mean, he has no requirement to do either, but if he isnt going to, why keep coming back and posting in this thread? just let it be b/c people obv arent going to say what you want to hear.


^and at the risk of sounding unsympathetic, if has a disorder that makes working w/ people difficult, isnt that one more thing that is going to make life difficult running a service based business that deals w/ low wage, umotivated people?

[Edited on February 7, 2011 at 7:05 PM. Reason : a]

2/7/2011 7:04:14 PM

Quote :

"This is the funniest advice of them all. Let me do all the physical labor while someone else takes care of my bank account, bills, and taxes? Rather... while they pocket the tax and bill money and paycheck and say seeee yaaaah when you go down in flames. You obviously don't watch forensic files. This kind of shit people kill and get killed over."

You said you enjoy the cooking. You obviously are damn talented at making pizza. So why not focus on that and let someone else focus on the rest?

This kind of shit is how EVERY FUCKING BUSINESS IN THE WORLD OPERATES. Look up CFO, COO. You need operations people and you need financial people. You're OBVIOUSLY not a financials guy in either interests or abilities, but it sounds like you are a picture perfect operations leader.

But this still boils down to a very simple principle: If you can't trust anyone else, you WILL NOT succeed in business, or in life. You must be able to share and delegate responsibility AND reward to be successful in the long term.

2/7/2011 7:09:12 PM

I haven't read all the shit in this thread, but honestly, what do you expect? people actually being respectful and accommodating to other user's feelings in a chit chat thread?

2/7/2011 7:10:03 PM