cnn should spend more time educating people about a crazy person who has 2% in polls on a good day.

9/5/2016 10:22:46 PM

bernie only had 4% before people like me eventually spread word of mouth.

9/5/2016 10:26:35 PM

They've fallen a long way since the days of Nancy Grace.

9/6/2016 1:31:06 AM

Trump surging.

Why, I don't know? I suspect it has to do with white people feeling less bad about him now that he doesn't treat minorities like animals?

** lol, what is going on? CNN/ORC has Trump +2 on same morning Wash Post calls Texas a toss up? What is going on?

[Edited on September 6, 2016 at 7:51 AM. Reason : If Texas is a toss up (demo changes be damned) you expect to see a D+>10 nationally]

9/6/2016 7:45:36 AM

I'm sure Hillary's FBI crap doesn't help. And hell, even CNN had a headline last night about her coughing. And that's the Clinton News Network btw. Maybe all the rumors and conspiracies are starting to sink in.

9/6/2016 8:38:14 AM

CNN being Clinton biased is basically an outright lie (now MSNBC is different). They hired Trump's damn campaign manager to spout his nonsense. Yes, some commentators on there probably lean left, just like any other medium. But they barely prop Democrats or Clinton up. Just google Jeff Zucker and his relationship with Trump ffs.

(But I agree with the rest of the stuff).

9/6/2016 8:42:18 AM

I'm not saying any of this is true, but if you take the coughing, the right's constant insistence that she needs help walking up steps, and now the fact that they're making a big deal out of how many times she had to use the phrase "I don't recall" in her FBI questioning (shortly after her near concussion which was something that actually happened), it paints a somewhat ugly picture for the weak-minded.

And you can agree that there are a lot of weak minds in this country, on both sides of the aisle.

9/6/2016 8:48:52 AM

No, I agree with you. The sad thing is Trump said I don't recall dozens of times in his Trump U deposition. It's a tactic that everyone uses but as you said when it is set against the context of all her health conspiracy concerns it will stick.

If nothing else, the right wing is really good at social media and conspiracy. The left can learn. They try but it doesn't stick.

9/6/2016 8:54:10 AM

The left is great at social media, just not so great with conspiracies.

Except JFK - they got that one right.

9/6/2016 8:56:18 AM

Quote :

"The left is great at social media,"

if you consider labeling anyone who challenges your opinion a knuckle dragger then sure

9/6/2016 9:10:28 AM

Yawn, Hillary already has 273 EVs with states that are safe blue. That's her floor, nothing has changed. Her ceiling is Obama 2012 + NC and maybe Georgia or Arizona. Everything else is just noise. Remember there still hasn't been a single reputable poll showing Trump with a lead in Florida, without which he has no path to victory.

[Edited on September 6, 2016 at 9:12 AM. Reason : .]

9/6/2016 9:10:40 AM

https://www.washingtonpost.com/posteverything/wp/2016/09/06/why-hillary-clintons-perceived-corruption-seems-to-echo-louder-than-donald-trumps-actual-corruption/?utm_term=.3b9cef8613fb

This is a pretty good read. Makes sense and now that the race is tightening I suspect the Trump stories will make more headway in national and cable news media..

9/6/2016 9:12:37 AM

^^You know, you're no better than JCE when it comes to blind support of your candidate.

Hillary could perform a Scorpion style finishing move one somebody she doesn't like, hold up their still-beating, bloody pulp of a heart, and you'd find an excuse for it.

Do I think all this junk about Hillary is true? No. Do I feel like the sum of all of it adds up to at least something shady? Most definitely. We know Trump has issues, so we don't really have to argue about them.

If you support her because in your mind she's the lesser of two evils, fine I can buy that, otherwise, you must work for her campaign.

9/6/2016 9:29:21 AM

Really? I thought I supported her because she has a proven record of advancing a progressive agenda and being damn good at her job. And no, I'm not going to assume a bunch of bullshit adds up to anything other than bullshit. That's just stupid.

9/6/2016 9:39:02 AM

^^ that's not fair. Well some of it is not fair.

I think she is highly qualified and I think in aggregate her policies align more with my worldview; especially when lined up next to Trump.

I also think she has trust issues and judgment issues but not to the point I would vote for a guy who I legitimately think is a sociopath.

9/6/2016 9:42:57 AM

Quote :

"she has a proven record of advancing a progressive agenda"

hah

she is in back pocket of wall street and has never seen a war she didnt support

9/6/2016 9:43:50 AM

This is kind of crazy. What is the major draw for non-college educated whites? I assume it is them left behind with the decline in manufacturing and non-skilled jobs? How will Trump help them?

CNN/ORC poll

Whites w/ college degrees:
Now: Clinton +13
'12: Romney +12

Non-college whites:
Now: Trump +44
'12: Romney +26

9/6/2016 10:12:02 AM

Well, if you listen to everyone else on this board, the major draw for non-college ed. whites is the fact that Trump is a closet Grand Wizard and they're all flocking to him because they hate black people, Mexicans, and people of the Islamic faith.

But I think you are dead on - blue-collar white folk tend to gravitate toward him because he promises to bring their jobs back. My hometown, Belmont, and the county it's in, Gaston, has been irreparably decimated by the loss of textile jobs in the past 20-30 years. Gaston, Catawba and Lincoln counties were all hit very hard when the textiles left. Gaston is now looking at the loss of many jobs from Freightliner, among others. What do all these people do now? Some picked up new trades such as HVAC, like my uncle, but others just figured out a way to take disability, or took even lesser pay for lesser jobs than what their textile positions afforded. I'm putting the microscope on Gaston co because that's what I know, that's my little anecdote, but this is happening, has been happening, all over the country. These are the folks looking to Trump to make things better.

Sure, he's attracting the racists too, but too many people on the left are just assuming that most people supporting Trump are in some way a racist.

He's been able to craft this narrative of the broken American worker down in the trenches pounding the pavement not finding jobs, and he promises to fix it. Won't give specifics, he never does, but promises everything. Why not vote for him? These people ask themselves "What have Democrats brought me..NAFTA? Shit that's why I lost my job in the first place. What has Washington and its politicians in general brought me?" (DISCLAIMER - I don't support that NAFTA lost them their jobs, just throwing out their potential point of view). They see Trump as a non-politician Santa Claus with his bag full of jobs. They hear him talk about trade penalties, about tariffs, etc. They don't understand the workings of an economy, they don't understand how you could start a trade war.

So yea, it isn't rocket science that blue collar workers support Trump in droves.

[Edited on September 6, 2016 at 10:31 AM. Reason : dasf]

9/6/2016 10:28:40 AM

Clearly Trump is a man of the people living up in his golden tower

9/6/2016 10:28:54 AM

They don't see that though. They hear him...he talks like a man of the people.

9/6/2016 10:32:08 AM

Re: uneducated white voters, I'll just quote myself from the Donald Trump thread,

Quote :

"Well, you have to ask yourself, who is base? Sure, you've got the straight white male supremacists but that's a considerably smaller share of his supporters than you'd expect from watching his rallies. Nah, his real base are disaffected Republicans who have been tricked into voting against their own interests since the Reagan administration. These are people who've been told that if you let us cut taxes on the rich, pollute your environment, slash entitlements, deregulate everything, then we'll let you keep your guns and eventually prosperity will "trickle down". Well, they still have their guns, but they lost their houses, retirement and their jobs have been shipped to China. So they, rightfully, revolted against the Republican establishment and turned to Trump. The problem is, while they blamed the right people, they haven't yet figured out that it's supply-side economics that have been fucking them over, which Trump is planning on continuing."

It's not so much what they see in Trump, it's what they haven't seen from the establishment.

[Edited on September 6, 2016 at 10:41 AM. Reason : .]

9/6/2016 10:36:14 AM

Quote :

"These are people who've been told that if you let us cut taxes on the rich, pollute your environment, slash entitlements, deregulate everything, then we'll let you keep your guns and eventually prosperity will "trickle down". "

That's stupid. I guarantee you most of the people you grouped into that stereotype could care less about taxes on the rich people - they think CEO's pay should be capped and they think the big CEOs are criminals. Yes, they probably think government is too big, and they see people around them on disability for no seemingly good reason and figure entitlements are to blame. They don't want to pollute the environment, but they're too poor to care. Saving the environment is a middle class and up problem. Poor white people and inner city folk just don't have the time or resources to really care about the environment.

But again, I guarantee you, for the people I'm talking about, cutting taxes on the rich is the last thing that crosses their mind. Maybe cutting their taxes, yes, but they just don't care about rich people.

9/6/2016 10:45:52 AM

Quote :

" But again, I guarantee you, for the people I'm talking about, cutting taxes on the rich is the last thing that crosses their mind. Maybe cutting their taxes, yes, but they just don't care about rich people."

That's been the bargain though. Since roughly the 1970s, the Republican grand bargain with the working class has basically been "cut taxes on our rich donors and let them do whatever they want, in return we'll let you keep your guns and eventually you'll be rich too!". Sure, they think CEOs are criminals now, but it took the complete erosion of the middle class over the last 30 years and an economic crisis where they all lost their homes before they finally realized it.

9/6/2016 11:05:38 AM

https://theringer.com/how-the-far-right-media-controls-donald-trump-3d077ca46a21#.74pq57tbi

9/6/2016 11:46:30 AM

Quote :

"These outlets have long been labeled the “conservative media,” but they don’t spend much time discussing tax cuts, free trade, entitlement reform, or school choice. They’re not weighing market-based solutions to urban poverty or debating the future of neoconservative foreign policy.These outlets are a far cry from The Weekly Standard, the editorial page of The Wall Street Journal, or even some conservative Fox reporters like Megyn Kelly. They have a lot more in common with the National Enquirer than they do with the National Review."

I definitely agree.

I hate it that TSB ends up being a shouting match. I really wish we could come in here and discuss the things that my quote mentions.

9/6/2016 11:55:17 AM

I agree but there has been literally no talk about policy anywhere this cycle.

For fuck's sake, Clinton introduced a comprehensive mental health plan last week and the biggest story in the news right now is fucking coughing. COUGHING.

The article he linked to is biased but it does directionally speak to why conspiratorial type nonsense is what is moving the needle.

9/6/2016 11:59:07 AM

Well, part of that is that majority of Americans only care about mental health right after a mass shooting.

9/6/2016 12:03:56 PM

The Senate numbers are looking increasingly bad for Democrats.

This country is so fucked if it's loaded up on conservatives in the House, Senate, Executive and Judicial. Scary.

Even more imperative that Trump can't win..

[Edited on September 12, 2016 at 10:17 AM. Reason : Fwiw, I wouldn't want the left to hold all four either. Need balance.]

9/12/2016 10:14:17 AM

Chris Hedges wrote a blistering take on the current political climate:

http://www.truthdig.com/report/item/fooled_again_20160911

The naive hopes of Bernie Sanders’ supporters—to build a grass-roots political movement, change the Democratic Party from within and push Hillary Clinton to the left—have failed. Clinton, aware that the liberal class and the left are not going to mount genuine resistance, is running as Mitt Romney in drag. The corporate elites across the political spectrum, Republican and Democrat, have gleefully united to anoint her president. All that remains of Sanders’ “revolution” is a 501(c)(4) designed to raise money, including from wealthy, anonymous donors, to ensure that he will be a senator for life. Great historical events happen twice, as Karl Marx quipped, first as tragedy and then as farce.

The multibillion-dollar extravaganza of our electoral Circus Maximus is part of the smokescreen that covers the ongoing devastation of globalization, deindustrialization, trade deals such as the Trans-Pacific Partnership, endless war, climate change and the intrusion into every corner of our lives by the security and surveillance state. Our democracy is dead. Clinton and Donald Trump do not have the power or the interest to revive it. They kneel before the war machine, which consumes trillions of dollars to wage futile wars and bankroll a bloated military. To defy the fortress state is political suicide. Politicians are courtiers to Wall Street. The candidates mouth the clichés of justice, improvements in income equality and democratic choice, but it is a cynical game. Once it is over, the victors will go to Washington to work with the lobbyists and financial elites to carry out the real business of ruling.

While there is a difference in the temperament of the two major presidential candidates, that difference will play out only in how our poison will be delivered. Political personalities serve global corporate centers of power. They do not control them. Barack Obama illustrates this.....

9/12/2016 10:33:25 AM

how hard was that dude jacking off while typing that?

because jesus

9/12/2016 10:44:37 AM

http://www.esquire.com/news-politics/politics/news/a48506/basket-of-deplorables/

9/12/2016 11:21:31 AM

Sure, we're all grading Trump on a curve, but the media is giving up their integrity for viewership, or readership. They give him a pass because he adds an entertainment value that Hillary can't match. And people eat it up.

And can you blame America? America has been spoon-fed this Trump campaign ever since The Real World debuted on MTV. The millions of Americans that spend their evenings watching mindless reality tv drivel are loving this election. At least one-half of it.

9/12/2016 12:24:13 PM

hot take that isn't really backed up with facts

reality tv has next to nothing with the political rise of Donald Trump

9/12/2016 12:29:17 PM

rjrumfel is part of the problem but is lecturing us about it

9/12/2016 12:31:29 PM

Pedro didn't die of AIDS for all of this

9/12/2016 12:34:09 PM

I kinda agree that america's reality TV obsession is one reason why we've got a presidential candidate like trump. buncha morons.

9/12/2016 12:49:52 PM

1) you're assuming that the viewership for reality television is way higher than it actually is

and

2) you're assuming that the only people who watch reality tv aren't intelligent

9/12/2016 12:54:08 PM

It's a combination of the media, and a fucking idiotic voting populace. Watching presidential debates from 20+ years ago, this cycle is just embarrassing.

Quote :

"Fwiw, I wouldn't want the left to hold all four either. Need balance.] "

This

9/12/2016 1:14:16 PM

^^I'm saying america's obsession with fame and spectacles and trainwrecks is one reason why trump is doing so well. I'm not necessarily saying that it's the people who specifically watch reality tv shows are the the dummies who actually think trump would be a good president. You're assuming that.

9/12/2016 2:26:31 PM

when hasn't America had an obsession with fame?

9/12/2016 2:30:41 PM

I didn't say weren't always. You assumed that. It's just more prevalent now with the rise of the internet and social media, reality tv, and personalities who are famous for being famous.

9/12/2016 2:33:03 PM

the mechanisms have changed, making it cheaper/easier to become famous, but fame is fame. "famous for being famous" is a bit of a myth.

9/12/2016 2:36:52 PM

Quote :

"reality tv has next to nothing with the political rise of Donald Trump"

Well...yes and no

There are two parallel tracks here. One is the relationship reality TV has with Trump's perception of himself and his need for attention, which I've been saying for a while now is his primary motivation. I don't think this campaign is about money, and I certainly don't think it's about actual politics. Trump just has to have people talking about Trump and to Trump, and he has to have millions of people watch while he do so. His ego demands it. In that sense, I think reality TV was an unfortunate step in his "development." I don't think he makes the jump from rich guy tabloid mainstay straight to Republican candidate. The Apprentice helped make that jump possible, both in terms of keeping him in the public eye and heightening his addiction to attention. It effectively increased his tolerance, and running for president was the only way to keep chasing that dragon.

On the flip side, there's the relationship that the public has to reality TV and what reality TV represents, which is blurring the lines between "reality," entertainment, and information -- almost always to the detriment of the latter. Information has lost out on the old documentary channels (History and Discovery, both of which are now just series about pawn shops) and it has lost out in the news media, which has long since shifted its focus to entertaining rather than informing. And that is exactly how we got the rise of Donald Trump. Can we blame that on reality television? It's probably more a symptom of the same disease, rather than the disease itself. Talking heads that argue with each other are cheaper than real investigative journalism, and people eat it up.

9/12/2016 3:00:17 PM

Thanks, you said that much better than I could have.

9/12/2016 3:11:44 PM

I find Scott Adams's (creator of Dilbeet) take on this election very interesting. If you've been following him he's been dead on with a lot of stuff about how and why Trump is so successful.

9/12/2016 3:14:42 PM

reality tv didn't cause him to become a Birther

9/12/2016 3:15:29 PM

^^ He apparently can tell who got hired by what campaign based on their framing strategies. interesting how important key words are in portraying the opposition. Like Clinton switching to calling Trump's rhetoric "dark". Guy is smart

[Edited on September 12, 2016 at 3:31 PM. Reason : .]

9/12/2016 3:29:15 PM

^^"one reason" man, not THE reason

9/12/2016 3:30:49 PM

and I never said it wasn't a reason

just that some are giving reality tv far too much credit

9/12/2016 3:35:12 PM

I'm legitimately concerned Trump is going to win now. So much nonsense going on with Clinton and it simply doesn't matter that Trump says horrible things, has no real policy, doesn't have a clue about foreign policy and is just generally a buffoon. He has 40% no matter what.

If turnout sucks, he wins.

9/13/2016 8:44:38 AM