^they might do something like that

2/27/2006 11:35:57 PM

that would be incredibly cheesy.

2/28/2006 12:47:52 AM

yes...yes it would..infact the only thing cheesier would be Baltar waking up and this being a dream.

2/28/2006 1:06:33 AM

*sniff* I miss good scifi

2/28/2006 2:46:33 PM

I can see where people would think that Baltar died in his house, but I don't think that there's clear proof that he did. No, a person standing infront of you would not save you from a nuclear blast, but if they were far enough appart that they weren't instantly vaporized and the shockwave just knocked his house down, then it is possible that a person shielding you could save you. If Ron said he was thinking about shooting a scene with the rubble of Baltar's house, it's clear that it wasn't vaporized.

It also doesn't make sense to have one cylon seduce another. If Baltar had already gained such a high position in planetary defense, why couldn't he just make the switch? He could be a sleeper agent up until the very moment he turned off planetary defenses in the same way Sharon was a sleeper agent until she shot Adama.

2/28/2006 5:32:51 PM

^good point. why would 6 have needed to seduce him if he were a cylon?

also, it's not like his house was ground zero for the atomic blast... he lived out in the countryside, and it appeared as if a shockwave from a blast hit him from pretty far off.

2/28/2006 7:45:34 PM

I mean look how long it took the shockwave to get to the house. Makes perfect sense that is just knocked out the windows and did minor structural damage.

He was just cut from some glass when he got on the escape ship.

^^and yes good point

[Edited on February 28, 2006 at 7:50 PM. Reason : sdf]

2/28/2006 7:49:56 PM

bttt

3/1/2006 10:56:00 PM

Quote :

" It also doesn't make sense to have one cylon seduce another. If Baltar had already gained such a high position in planetary defense, why couldn't he just make the switch? He could be a sleeper agent up until the very moment he turned off planetary defenses in the same way Sharon was a sleeper agent until she shot Adama."

no shit. you didnt read.

Quote :

"Baltar as a human at some point helped the Cylons develop the human models using his vast expertise in genetics and electronics. The bio-cylons believe that he is God. Being an egomaniac, he cannot resist the temptation. He creates a single, genetically identical copy of himself, exactly like him except for his knowledge of the Cylons, to resume his life on Caprica. This cylon model has a mission and a "holy spirit" to guide him, the corporeal and imaginary versions or Six are sent to guide him and be his conscience. Baltar, the Cylon God, promises that his "son" will bring salvation to the Cylons by exacting revenge on their former masters and bring the Cylons "home". Some facts that support this idea: Baltar has been told by Six on numerous occastions that he is the Chosen One, the one destined to survive and usher in the new race of God's children. Baltar has endured several trials by fire in the episodes 33, Six degrees of Separation, and during the Kobol story arc. In all these he had to give himself over to the will of God. He has performed miracles-including the cure for cancer, using Cylon DNA. There are 12 models just like the 12 disciples. ..... "I think Gaius Baltar is the Cylon god, and the granddaddy of human-looking Cylon "cyberbiology". I speculate that he is much older than he appears today. That he did groundbreaking Cybernetic research before the end of the first Colonial/Cylon conflict. That he perfected 40 years ago the method of "wetware" imprinting and replication that is the basis for all Cylon organic technology and the basis for conciousness transfer. In doing this he threw in his lot with those of the Cylons by agreeing to a Faustian bargain: surrenderring his humanity to achieve virtual immortality by his methods of copying his conciousness and transferring it to an "limitless" number of succeeding generations of Cylons. I also speculate that he perfected some of the "grace notes" in Cylon organic mind control: selective memory erasure (the basis for "sleeper" agents, and his own present incarnation on Gallactica/Kobol), a reliable method of human cloning combined with embedded programmable conciousness. A way to "meld" or combine conciousness (which explains internal Six), although this is reserved for exceptional godlike personages, such as instances of himself. He's effectively transmuted himself into a parody of the Christian trinity being father, son, and guiding spirit of the newest and deadliest generation of Cylons. The biggest objection to this line of thinking is that Baltar's ego is so large, it's hard to imagine him tolerating multiple simultaneous instances or manifestations of himself. I would think he could tolerate only one version with full knowledge of "the way things really work". The "original" Baltar, an older man than the one we've met is who I think is the Cylon god, narcisisitic enough to allow other manifestations of himself to exist, but cautious and jealous enough to limit their knowledge, memories, and even the boundaries of their own conciousness."

you were too lazy to read the thoery. so your 'point' is completely invalid.

None of the other cylons would ever have a way to find out what Baltar is really is. Balter could be a human clone, perhaps with some cylon qualities, but nobody ever said he was just a normal cylon.

Quote :

"I mean look how long it took the shockwave to get to the house. Makes perfect sense that is just knocked out the windows and did minor structural damage."

that KILLED 6. if youre in a house that gets destoryed by a nuclear blast, and someone next to you is killed, youre dead.

[Edited on March 2, 2006 at 1:48 AM. Reason : -]

3/2/2006 1:37:23 AM

Quote :

"if youre in a house that gets destoryed by a nuclear blast, and someone next to you is killed, youre dead."

Umm... no. It could have easily been the shattering glass window that six was standing up right next to that killed her, slicing her pretty well.. This would support some people's assertion that she actually did sheild baltar somewhat. Hell, a ceiling beam could have simply landed on her and not baltar. The blast was quite a distance off and might not have vaporized the house or anything like that. If it was debris in the shockwave or debris from the house/window that killed six, it's perfectly reasonable to beleive that baltar might have survived. People survive in buildings demolished by explosives, houses crushed by tornados, etc. Besides, even in the area relatively close to ground zero, you're still not in some kind of magic "you are dead" zone. There's probabilities, even within half a mile of a nagasake sized blast, that people will survive uninjured. Even the exposure to massive radiation is not a guarantee of death. At various exposure levels, death and even most of the symptoms are only given by propabilities and are not certain. A 100-200 rem exposure will kill 10% of those exposed (within 30 days) and cause vommiting and or anastasis in 50% of cases at the high end of the exposure range. Compare this to a 1% mortality rate within 30 days for nagasake.

So, even if baltar was closer than he appeared to the blast (it seemed many miles off), and even if he were exposed to MASSIVE ammounts of radiation from the blast, and even though six was killed, it's still reasonable that he could survive. Add in the fact that this is fiction and the author is free to push the bounds of what's reasonable... it's kind of silly to say it's certain or even probable that he died. There's enough doubt that it could go either way, and really that's the point isn't it?

http://www.nukefix.org/weapon.html

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radiation_poisoning

[Edited on March 2, 2006 at 2:40 AM. Reason : ]

3/2/2006 2:31:24 AM

Quote :

"So, even if baltar was closer than he appeared to the blast (it seemed many miles off), and even if he were exposed to MASSIVE ammounts of radiation from the blast, and even though six was killed, it's still reasonable that he could survive. Add in the fact that this is fiction and the author is free to push the bounds of what's reasonable... it's kind of silly to say it's certain or even probable that he died. There's enough doubt that it could go either way,"

saying its reasonable or probable is a stretch. he SHOULD be dead, but one could argue he got LUCKY and lived. the only evidence we have is that he is that this unlikely case has happened is that he is alive, but thats not evidence bc his death could easily be explained via things we see every episode on BSG, namely the downloading of minds.

in the end, you have to weight the likelyhood of by chance surviving a horrifying blast, vs the odds of balter being something much more special then just a sceintists. i mean christ, all that God shit with him only fits if hes the Cylon God. He keeps doing the trials, and his inner 6 keeps putting all this God shit all over him.

[Edited on March 2, 2006 at 2:50 AM. Reason : -]

3/2/2006 2:48:55 AM

Doesnt explain the fact he didnt remember waking up and the time it takes to do that. And how he looks cut up like he survived the blast when he leaves the planet.

[Edited on March 2, 2006 at 11:20 AM. Reason : sdfsdf]

3/2/2006 11:19:45 AM

^ yes it does. the cylon god, (perhaps himself) removed those memories, and gave him a scratch. rebirth takes little time.

a cafe full of people takes 36 hrs, as said in 'downloaded'

[Edited on March 2, 2006 at 12:06 PM. Reason : -]

3/2/2006 12:05:50 PM

that's a stretch, and you know it. it is much more probable that baltar was shielded by 6 (AS IT SHOWED DURING THE MINISERIES, AND EVERY OPENING CREDITS SINCE THEN) and survived that way.

3/2/2006 1:41:57 PM

Yeah, I'm going with he was lucky and between the distance of the blast, and six taking the brunt of the debris. That just seems way more likely than him being the cylon god...

3/2/2006 1:43:41 PM

i don't think it was luck at all. 6 shielded him keeping him alive purposely.

3/2/2006 4:44:18 PM

Holy fucking faggots. ITS A FICTIONAL SHOW. Not only does the answer to this question not matter, it's clear as fucking day that the writers have not weighed in one way or the other.


Before you start to write that 500+ word post about the physics of a fake universe, think about how you can better spend that time. For example, you could get a life.

3/2/2006 6:47:15 PM

Quote :

"i don't think it was luck at all. 6 shielded him keeping him alive purposely. "

yet she was SHOCKED to find out he was alive

Quote :

"baltar was shielded by 6"

it was just a jesture, she felt sorry for him

Quote :

"six taking the brunt of the debris."

any debris would slice through her like and then kill baltar. shes skin and bones.



[Edited on March 2, 2006 at 7:14 PM. Reason : -]

3/2/2006 7:10:45 PM

^^ so says the man trolling the thread about the fictional universe...

3/2/2006 7:21:26 PM

Well if I was in a room with someone and I died because of debris, there is no way I would know that he didnt die. I would just assume that if I died, he had to have died. AND even IF I thought he survived the blast, he was still in the middle of a war zone! He could just have died from any threat afterward. I would never know a ship from a surviving battlestar would end up there to pick him up.

^^^if you dont want to read a discussion about a fictional reality, then I suggest you start a thread about your daily life.

[Edited on March 2, 2006 at 7:30 PM. Reason : dasd]

3/2/2006 7:28:51 PM

Quote :

"Well if I was in a room with someone and I died because of debris, there is no way I would know that he didnt die."

6 was sure he died

3/2/2006 7:30:16 PM

look, people throw themselves over other people to protect them from blasts all the time, especially on TV (which we are talking about) and they survive. Clearly Baltar has survived, and is not a cylon. just because someone is weird and has some weird stuff going on, it doesn't mean he is a fucking robot.

3/2/2006 7:42:35 PM

Quote :

"eople throw themselves over other people to protect them from blasts all the time"

like those duck and cover videos from the 60s THAT WE NOW LAUGH AT

^i know.....im not saying 6 in the brain is clear evidence. although, it seems quite odd that hes the only human with someone in his brain, and the only other time we see this happening is with a cylon.

[Edited on March 2, 2006 at 7:46 PM. Reason : -]

3/2/2006 7:45:00 PM

no.

3/2/2006 7:46:42 PM

we do laugh.

3/2/2006 7:47:11 PM

yes, but baltar was hardly at ground zero. he was MILES away from the center, and had a GOOD chance of survival, especially since 6 took the brunt of the flying glass, etc.

3/2/2006 7:53:18 PM

so then if we're miles away from ground zero, with little risk of death, why does six not take baltar to the basement, at least make an effort to save herself? she doesnt want to die. she stands infront of the windows, resigned to her death. she knows taking shelter wouldnt help.

[Edited on March 2, 2006 at 8:01 PM. Reason : 0]

3/2/2006 8:00:44 PM

^ she doesn't care about dying. she can't, her consciousness is just downloaded into a new body. that is the most frightening thing about the cylons. all your stuff is speculation so i really wouldn't try to disprove other peoples ideas with your own speclations.

3/2/2006 8:39:01 PM

6 CANNOT die. why would she be scared to be killed in the blast?

3/2/2006 9:07:13 PM

and if you watch it, the shockwave takes a good amount of time to reach Baltar's house after the initial blast.

3/2/2006 9:08:23 PM

Quote :

"^ she doesn't care about dying. "

i dont think you all have watched downloaded, if you did, you werent paying attention. they gave six the option of being put out of her misery after the cafe bomb blast. she wanted to live. death hurts. six doesnt want to die. if you havent figured out that cylon dislike being killed, then you havent been watching every episode so your points are invalid. just becuase she finds yourself in a new body doesnt mean she is keen on going thru death.

Quote :

"why would she be scared to be killed in the blast? "

where did i say she was scared of dying in the blast? if she thought she could have survived it, she would have tried to. cylons try to avoid death like humans do. if you havent observed this, you have missed many episodes. almost always, cylons will try and avoid death.





[Edited on March 2, 2006 at 10:26 PM. Reason : =]

3/2/2006 10:12:29 PM

I dont want baltar to be a cylon, therefor he wont be a cylon. There are enough loops wholes to make him one but that would be gay.

3/2/2006 11:04:20 PM

i never said he was a cylon. that wouldnt make any sense at all.

[Edited on March 2, 2006 at 11:07 PM. Reason : -]

3/2/2006 11:06:48 PM

what the fuck? of course you did. you said he died and was uploaded into a new body. that would make him a cylon.

3/3/2006 2:00:06 AM

Quote :

"of course you did."

o really? can you quote me?

just becuase your memories can be transfered to a cloned body doesnt make you a cylon.

you could be a human. who had his memories downloaded into a clone.

ive said this before 5 times.

biocylons are humans arent all that different, hell they can make babies.


[Edited on March 3, 2006 at 2:22 AM. Reason : -]

3/3/2006 2:21:05 AM

uhh... humans can't do that dude.

3/3/2006 2:21:53 AM

they could.

3/3/2006 2:22:56 AM

i see.

3/3/2006 2:23:22 AM

did you not know that humans and biocylons are said to be virtually identical?

[Edited on March 3, 2006 at 2:24 AM. Reason : -]

3/3/2006 2:24:41 AM

so you are saying that humans can be cloned, their memories transfered, wounds faked, all without the individual knowing about it, and all that is more probable than baltar simply surviving a broken window?

3/3/2006 2:25:10 AM

i've seen all of the episodes multiple times.

3/3/2006 2:25:31 AM

Quote :

"surviving broken window? the destruction of a house by a nuclear blast"

^^that plus all the stuff about balter being this god figure that 6 keeps talkin about.



[Edited on March 3, 2006 at 2:28 AM. Reason : -]

3/3/2006 2:27:06 AM

all it looked like to me is that the windows were blown out. it didn't appear that the entire structure of the house was destroyed.

yes, but she has never said HE IS GOD. she ALWAYS refers to god in a way that is separate from baltar...


(i'm going to bed... i'll respond tomorrow at some point)

3/3/2006 2:28:15 AM

Quote :

"did you not know that humans and biocylons are said to be virtually identical?"

what about that whole thing where the doctor was asking Sharon "why didnt the cylons finish off the reproductive tract" (or whatever it was he said) when she was giving birth.

3/3/2006 2:35:55 AM

^ he didn't say anything like that. He asked why the hell didn't they make improvements to it

3/3/2006 2:37:51 AM

it was something like, you went thru all the trouble of looking like humans but you didnt upgrade the plumbing.

3/3/2006 2:39:01 AM

^ ah that was it. but still, she couldnt give birth without help. if the humans and biocylons are supposed to be virtually identical shouldnt that have been taken care of.

3/3/2006 2:40:09 AM

she didnt need help, she just had a birthing mishap, a prolapsed cord or something. its a common problem among humans.

3/3/2006 2:41:35 AM

true, but the point was that the doctor could tell something was different.

3/3/2006 2:42:28 AM

NO! you are 100% wrong.

the point was that she had a common labor problem, and he remarked that they should have upgraded things so that these simple things wouldnt have to go wrong. they built new biocylons, yet made them so close to human that they suffer from the same type of biological flaws (having to eat, experiencing pain, depression, pregnancy mishaps.... its what we've seen since season 1)







[Edited on March 3, 2006 at 2:47 AM. Reason : =]

3/3/2006 2:43:23 AM