Arizona's in New Mexico right?

4/6/2009 1:10:04 PM

you're thinking of Utah

4/6/2009 1:15:34 PM

Miller has accepted the Zona job

http://msn.foxsports.com/cbk/story/9423060/Miller-changes-mind,-will-leave-Xavier-for-Arizona

4/6/2009 1:18:32 PM

NC State fan self-loathing begins here:

4/6/2009 1:19:38 PM

heh, that will make that Arizona-ASU rivalry even more intriguing with Miller vs. his former head coach.

Also, not that 40 is particularly old, but I would have guessed that he would have been younger.

4/6/2009 1:26:19 PM

I'm just amazed by the number of schools that have both fired a coach better than Lowe, and hired one better then him as well. Yet somehow, firing him would make us look bad and it would be impossible to find a replacement. Hell, fucking UVA did it.

4/6/2009 2:13:28 PM

Here comes the you hate NCSU and give Lowe more time posts....

4/6/2009 2:15:04 PM

great hire for UofA, at least one of my teams scooped him up, I'm pretty sure ncstatetke is going to kill himself when Miller starts beating the shit out of Herb in a couple years.

4/6/2009 2:15:10 PM

Quote :

"I'm just amazed by the number of schools that have both fired a coach better than Lowe, and hired one better then him as well. Yet somehow, firing him would make us look bad and it would be impossible to find a replacement. Hell, fucking UVA did it."

yeah i'd hate to have that top 20 recruiting class decommit and the others get out of their LOIs and watch us really tank next year

Washington State is trying to think outside the box by looking at former Kentucky coach Billy Gillispie and interviewing UAB's Mike Davis for the opening to replace Tony Bennett.

4/6/2009 2:23:55 PM

Quote :

"I'm just amazed by the number of schools that have both fired a coach better than Lowe, and hired one better then him as well."

Like who?

Quote :

"Yet somehow, firing him would make us look bad"

Yeah, he's only been here three years. You don't do that sort of thing.

Quote :

"and it would be impossible to find a replacement."

Do you remember the last coaching search? As long as Fowler is at the helm, it will be impossible to find a decent coach.

Quote :

"Hell, fucking UVA did it."

Leitao wasn't fired, he resigned. Virginia has zero basketball history outside of the Sampson years. It doesn't really matter what they do, they have no where to go but up.

Tony Bennett is still a fairly unproven coach. Could you imagine if a guy like that were hired here? He'd make the Sendek offense look like the Globetrotters.

4/6/2009 2:25:19 PM

Quote :

"Leitao wasn't fired, he resigned. "

Come on, it was a forced resignation. If he didn't do it, then they WERE going to fire him.

4/6/2009 2:30:45 PM

Quote :

" Like who?"

dude are you serious? Gottfried, Felton, Gillespie and Leitao have all made it to the tournament before and all of them were fired this year. You could certainly argue that they aren't good coaches but I don't see how you can argue that Lowe is better at this point in time.

Quote :

"As long as Fowler is at the helm, it will be impossible to find a decent coach."

Clearly we have to get rid of Fowler before firing Lowe, I don't think anyone is saying differently

Quote :

"Leitao wasn't fired, he resigned."

come on man, you're better than that...clearly it was a forced resignation and they paid him handsomely for going along with it.

4/6/2009 2:34:06 PM

Quote :

"Like who?"

UVA, Kentucky, Alabama...all schools with proven head coaches who got shit canned and replaced with proven head coaches.

Quote :

"Yeah, he's only been here three years. You don't do that sort of thing."

Kentucky did it. UVA did it after 4 years.

Quote :

"Do you remember the last coaching search? As long as Fowler is at the helm, it will be impossible to find a decent coach."

About the only thing you said that I'll agree with.

Quote :

"Tony Bennett is still a fairly unproven coach. Could you imagine if a guy like that were hired here? He'd make the Sendek offense look like the Globetrotters."

Uh, compared to our guy, he may as well be Phil Jackson. He's actually taken a team to the NCAA tournament (twice).

4/6/2009 2:36:06 PM

Quote :

"Tony Bennett is still a fairly unproven coach. Could you imagine if a guy like that were hired here? He'd make the Sendek offense look like the Globetrotters."

I also have to disagree with this, he took Wazzou to the sweet sixteen, Wazzou, they are arguable one of the worst BCS conference teams over their history

4/6/2009 2:41:38 PM

I don't get why one would ever use "BCS" when describing basketball...

not picking on you, but it seems i've seen this a lot lately.

4/6/2009 3:13:52 PM

^^ How the fuck are you gonna compare NC State to Kentucky?

My bringing up Herb was only in regards to his style of play while he was here. Bennett plays one of the slowest offenses in the country. And the teams that Bennett took to the tourney were teams that he inherited. He's unproven because he hasn't done much on his own yet.

^ People use the BCS term in regards to basketball because those are the major conferences, the ones with the most resources, largest budgets, most success.

[Edited on April 6, 2009 at 3:19 PM. Reason : ]

4/6/2009 3:18:35 PM

Quote :

"And the teams that Bennett took to the tourney were teams that he inherited. He's unproven because he hasn't done much on his own yet."

while it's true that he inherited his team at Wazzou, the team he inherited had gone 13-16, 12-16 and 11-17 the previous three years. So let's not pretend like he inherited a bunch of all-americans. 11-17 to 26-8 is pretty fucking impressive no matter what the circumstances.

4/6/2009 3:30:53 PM

I never said it wasn't impressive. The guy is obviously a good coach, but you can't think that Virginia pulled off some great coup by landing Tony Bennett.

Is he a better coach than Lowe? Sure, maybe, I don't know. If he is it's only by a slim margin. Both only have three years of experience. That's nowhere near enough time to make that sort of analysis.

4/6/2009 3:38:25 PM

Just for the sake of argument, how many teams have contacted Lowe to see if he's available to fill their vacancy?

4/6/2009 3:43:05 PM

Quote :

"but you can't think that Virginia pulled off some great coup by landing Tony Bennett."

who said it was a great coup? it was a good hire, probably about as good as they could have done

Quote :

"Is he a better coach than Lowe? Sure, maybe, I don't know. If he is it's only by a slim margin. Both only have three years of experience. That's nowhere near enough time to make that sort of analysis."

There's really no question about it at this point, one coach has gone to the tournament twice (with a sweet sixteen appearance) and the other hasn't even gone once. It's not even close. They both inherited shitty situations but one of them won regardless.

4/6/2009 3:49:19 PM

Quote :

"There's really no question about it at this point"

There is a question about it because we're talking about such a short time period. You can't make those kind of calls with such a small sample size. We had a better winning percentage than WSU this year, does that mean Lowe is the better coach?

Too much short-sighted analysis in this thread. Just like the credibility watch, so I guess it should be a surprise.

4/6/2009 3:54:07 PM

Quote :

"it was a good hire"

lol, maybe for our sake. who knows at this point.

4/6/2009 4:01:46 PM

Quote :

"We had a better winning percentage than WSU this year, does that mean Lowe is the better coach?"

this is possibly one of the dumbest things you've ever posted in sports talk...16-14 is alot better than 17-16 If they hadn't gone to the NIT they would have been 17-15.

Quote :

"There is a question about it because we're talking about such a short time period. You can't make those kind of calls with such a small sample size."

so we can't analyze, criticize or compare our basketball program to others because Lowe has only coached here 3 years? come on man, you can make that same argument after years 5, 10, etc...when does it stop?

4/6/2009 4:04:43 PM

jesus strawman christ

4/6/2009 4:07:12 PM

Quote :

"this is possibly one of the dumbest things you've ever posted in sports talk"

Are you familiar with sarcasm?

Quote :

"come on man, you can make that same argument after years 5, 10, etc..."

No, you can't. That's my point. Three years is nothing, you can't really prove yourself one way or the other, unless you win it all or go 0-30. Neither coach has had time to build a program, both have been working primarily with someone else's recruits. You can't glean much from a coach when he's not coaching his own team.

Bennett did a good job at WSU. But that doesn't necessarily make him a good coach in the long term. The same goes for Lowe. You have to look at what these guys do in the long term before you make any assumptions about who's the better coach.

Quote :

"so we can't analyze, criticize or compare our basketball program to others because Lowe has only coached here 3 years? "

Yeah, you can. You just can't make definitive statements like "Lowe is a bad coach" or "Bennett is a better coach" and expect to be taken seriously.

[Edited on April 6, 2009 at 4:12 PM. Reason : ]

4/6/2009 4:09:18 PM

Well Bennett wasn't exactly playing with another coach's players. He recruited all of those guys and coached them before his father handed over the executive duties. I think Bennett is a fantastic coach. I expect his UVA teams to be very fundamentally sound and look similar to Wisconsin's teams. Now I don't know how well that will translate to the ACC though. I don't think you can say he will be a success at UVA or not, b/c it's a different league and there are different circumstances. I also don't think you can completely evaluate Coach Lowe yet. Next year may be a better indicator of what his teams will look like for the rest of his tenure, and I like the fact that we were a few points here and there from making the postseason. That was much better than all of the blowouts that we suffered the year before. We did see some improvement this year. We got the most ACC wins in a season in the Lowe era. I think we can be an improved team next year provided the players have the right mentality coming into the season. We may be losing 5 players, but the ones that will be replacing them will fit more into what Lowe wants to do here.

4/6/2009 4:18:48 PM

Quote :

"Are you familiar with sarcasm?"

oh I knew you were being sarcastic but it was stupid all the same

Quote :

"Three years is nothing, you can't really prove yourself one way or the other"

ok, so what is the magical number then? 4 years? 5? Any number you pick could be called arbitrary.

Quote :

"Neither coach has had time to build a program, both have been working primarily with someone else's recruits. You can't glean much from a coach when he's not coaching his own team."

you realize Bennett was an assistant coach at Wazzou for 3 years before he became head coach right? It's possible and even likely that he recruited many of the players on their roster when he became head coach so I think that's a pretty ignorant statement to make.

Quote :

"Bennett did a good job at WSU. But that doesn't necessarily make him a good coach in the long term. The same goes for Lowe. You have to look at what these guys do in the long term before you make any assumptions about who's the better coach."

If you can win at Wazzou, you can win anywhere...it's probably the most difficult job in a BCS conference and you continually downplay his accomplishments there while the fact that Lowe hasn't done a god damn thing here means nothing right?

[Edited on April 6, 2009 at 4:24 PM. Reason : .]

4/6/2009 4:22:00 PM

Quote :

"If you can win at Wazzou, you can win anywhere."

and you're lecturing someone else on arbitrary unprovable claims?

4/6/2009 4:23:59 PM

Quote :

"ok, so what is the magical number then? 4 years? 5? Any number you pick could be called arbitrary. "

The magic number is four or five years, depending on who you ask. Neither is arbitrary. It should take that long to get your recruits, establish your system, and start producing results. This is a fundamental difference between the people who want Sid gone now and the people who understand that programs aren't rebuilt overnight.

Quote :

"If you can win at Wazzou, you can win anywhere"

What was that about being arbitrary? Who knows if Bennett will succeed for sure in the ACC? You act like the guy has already done it.

On the list of hardest major conference jobs, I'd put Northwestern, Baylor, the bottom four or five Big East teams, and Vanderbilt above a large state university on the west coast.

4/6/2009 4:28:21 PM

Bruce says "it only take 1 good hire to turn a program around"




then its fun in the sun time

4/6/2009 4:33:51 PM

Quote :

"The magic number is four or five years, depending on who you ask. Neither is arbitrary. It should take that long to get your recruits, establish your system, and start producing results. This is a fundamental difference between the people who want Sid gone now and the people who understand that programs aren't rebuilt overnight. "

I think 4 or 5 years (or maybe more) is fine if you are showing steady improvement, but that's not really what Lowe has done so far, and frankly next year is looking scary. I'm not saying we should fire Lowe now, as I think the recruiting class we have coming in is pivotal but saying you have to give every coach in every situation 4 or 5 years to produce on the court is silly. There's plenty of examples of coaches turning around moribund programs in less than 4 years (take Bennett for instance).

Quote :

"Who knows if Bennett will succeed for sure in the ACC? You act like the guy has already done it."

all you can do is judge a guy by his track record, and Bennett's is pretty fucking good so far.

Quote :

"On the list of hardest major conference jobs, I'd put Northwestern, Baylor, the bottom four or five Big East teams, and Vanderbilt above a large state university on the west coast."

this is obviously an opinion question, but I don't see what being on the west coast has to do with anything...Pullman, Washington has like 25,000 residents let's not act like it's LA or Tucson. There are also plenty of other big time basketball programs recruiting in the area which makes it even more difficult.

4/6/2009 4:45:57 PM

Quote :

"saying you have to give every coach in every situation 4 or 5 years to produce on the court is silly"

Never said that

4/6/2009 4:47:17 PM

IM really glad that Mark Few is staying at Gonzaga so he can continue building my Zags into a powerhouse!! GO ZAGS!

4/6/2009 4:54:11 PM

Woo hoo powerhouse! The most overrated mid-major playing in a shitty conference! Good Job!

Of course you are the same guy wanting us to get a crappy point from TTech with baggage.

4/6/2009 4:56:29 PM

Quote :

"Never said that"

then what does

Quote :

"The magic number is four or five years"

mean then? The point I'm trying to make is that you have to take into account things like the talent already there, what state the program was in before they got there, facilities (I can't believe I actually just said that), resources for recruiting, etc. when determining how long a coach should get. Lowe inherited a good program, albeit with some roster issues because of a lost recruiting class, but a good program nonetheless...it shouldn't take him as long as it took Sendek to get back to the tourney.

4/6/2009 5:13:57 PM

Quote :

"There's plenty of examples of coaches turning around moribund programs in less than 4 years (take Bennett for instance)."

how can you say this after trying to bring up the point about him being with the program 3 years before he was named the head coach. that's hardly the same thing as coming into a program and turning it around in a short period of time.

4/6/2009 5:21:12 PM

^fair enough, so take Bruce Pearl going 22-8 his first year,Tennessee went 14-17 the year before...there are numerous other examples

4/6/2009 5:40:15 PM

I'm disappointed that Miller is going to Arizona. My ideal situation would have been for Fowler to go after this guy THIS YEAR and have Lowe respectably step down and get back to the NBA as an assistant where he seemed to excel. If our administration was somewhat competent they could have spun it as Lowe really bailing out the school by coming here 3 years ago after Fowler fucked everything up.

Another question.. here is a quote from Lee Fowler on April 3rd, THREE DAYS AGO:

Quote :

"“I have interviewed Stephanie and interviewed some other candidates,” Fowler said. “The process has begun.”"

Why is the process just now starting??? Coach Yow, bless her soul, died in January. What in the fuck has Fowler been doing for the past 3 months???? Yow was one of the modern faces of NC State and one of her dying wishes was for Stephanie Glance to succeed her. Is it too much to ask for Fowler to pick up the phone and give Glance a call asking her if she wants the job? This kind of ineptitude demonstrated by our AD once again is un-fucking-real.

[Edited on April 6, 2009 at 5:56 PM. Reason : []

4/6/2009 5:52:57 PM

FIRE HERB

4/6/2009 7:12:54 PM

lol memphis promotes an assistant coach. what happened to their homerun hire??

4/7/2009 10:27:16 AM

Isn't it generally considered off limits for coaches to take recruits and/or transfers with them after leaving a school?

4/8/2009 8:36:34 PM

^ I think it's up to the recruits, which it should be.

4/8/2009 9:26:10 PM

The whole argument of superstar athletes picking a school rather than a coach is borderline retarded.

They want to play for the coach who happens to coach at a particular school. Why would they stick around with a coach that didn't recruit them, and might not utilize them in the best manner possible? Let the recruits decide. The only thing that needs to happen is for Kentucky to accept that Calipari may one day leave their job and take his superstar recruits with him.

If it happens to KY, it's karma. But more than likely Calipari will win 3-5 national championships there and Kentucky will unseat UNC as the premier college basketball program.

4/8/2009 9:54:59 PM

^^I'm not saying the recruits shouldn't be able to leave Memphis. Just that a coach with any integrity wouldn't let them come to Kentucky when he recruited them to Memphis.

4/9/2009 3:32:31 AM

why is espn grilling isaiah thomas right now?

4/15/2009 6:31:48 PM

FIU


Fire Isiah University.


ahahahaha

4/15/2009 6:58:45 PM

^^ I thought it was a little classless of them to get into his personal life. He may very well succeed at FIU. Ask him some basketball questions and Andy Katz was an idiot. He asked him how he was going to start and Isiah said well the first thing we've got to do is get players, and Katz quipped well how are you going to do that. The way everyone does it you fucking idiot, recruit! And that was obviously what Isiah was referring to.

4/15/2009 7:03:12 PM

it was very classless.

4/15/2009 7:41:43 PM

Fuck him... deserves everything he gets if you ask me.

He fucking ruined an organization I grew up living and dying with...he was the reason Marv Albert got canned even. They fucking fired Marv Albert because Isiah couldn't do his job worth a damn.

4/15/2009 7:44:52 PM

Marv raped people with his chompers

Knicks suck

4/15/2009 7:46:31 PM